The Armory: Using G&W's arsenal to the fullest extent (8-13-08) Now on: Usmash

[cutter]

Another move, another update.

Chef is next.

 

[Debonu]

chef is a great edgegaurding tool and can also stop many approaches in their tracks and its great for taunting ppl

 

[_Phloat_]

Isn't as laggy as it seems, can be often used to bait an approach or a hasty move.

 

[In2D]

A great move to use with chef is for edgeguarding. Toss out some breakfast over the side, then jump out and Fair them. Works very often.

 

[Neb]

Personal List_
+Good Edgeguard
+Backs-up approaches
+Pan Spike does good damage
+Pan Spike can Stage Spike
+Set-up. Forces projectiles, which leads to bucketing,
which leads to Oil Panic.
+Many find it useless because its random, which leads to
opponents thinking its not hard to defend against.
+Good out of non-tech'd dthrow.
+Ledge Boosted Pan Spike can grill recovering foes into KO zone with speed.
+Nets a good section of the stage, which widens your range, and defeats your foes defensive options.
+Food has fair priority.
+Can be spammed.
+Good Taunt

 

[Debonu]

hey neb how do you do a ledge boosted pan spike?

 

[Neb]

When your about to run off the ledge, right before you leave it, you press either chef, bucket, or Judge, if performed with precision, you'll get a hefty boost as you leave the edge. Go to Mr. Esc's Oil Panic guide, there's a a section for Ledge Boosting, and a link to the OP.

 

[Voxx]

Do fairs have the same ledge boost as chef or judgement?

 

[Neb]

Fair can't Ledge Boost, only some b-specials.

 

[Ruuku]

When your about to run off the ledge, right before you leave it, you press either chef, bucket, or Judge, if performed with precision, you'll get a hefty boost as you leave the edge. Go to Mr. Esc's Oil Panic guide, there's a a section for Ledge Boosting, and a link to the OP.

Then you can do sexy things like the Chef ledge boost->Dair spike or Fair->Fair I've done on one of my teammates.

 

[Neb]

Then you can do sexy things like the Chef ledge boost->Dair spike or Fair->Fair I've done on one of my teammates.

Yeah, you got the idea.
*is blinded by the rave emoticon!*

 

[Ruuku]

Yeah, you got the idea.
*is blinded by the rave emoticon!*

It's a celebration!

By the way, your sig is made of awesome.

 

[Voxx]

That sig is great :]

 

[Neb]

Gagh! I would've pressed quote, but that would equal more rave.

And thank you, .

Edit:
I think Chef can lock people against walls, like an Infinite; haven't looked deeper into it, though I've pulled it off for a short period. The food and the pan-spike kinda work in harmony, keeping your foe down and cookin'.

 

[Hawks go Caw]

When recovering from up high, it's okay to use it to cover your landing.

 

[Neb]

When recovering from up high, it's okay to use it to cover your landing.

I do that too, really does assist in returning to the ledge, or softening a high recovery.

 

[cutter]

What is your avatar now Neb? I liked the old one with the soldiers.

 

[Neb]

Egh, I usually like to switch avatars and sometimes my sig when I get another 100 post count, I get bored of looking at it sometimes, lol. But this particular one is a cybernetic soldier, with a big nasty rocket launcher, haha. I decided I'd only do machine-related avatars.

Fancied the other one better too, .

 

[Ruuku]

I think Chef can lock people against walls, like an Infinite; haven't looked deeper into it, though I've pulled it off for a short period. The food and the pan-spike kinda work in harmony, keeping your foe down and cookin'.

I think I was trying something like that on Corneria's wall but my opponent was able to smash DI through it. Then again I haven't played this game in almost a month and I'm starting to forget things.

 

[_Phloat_]

Yea, we might need to move on lest this thread die...

Judgement discussion.. please =D

 

[Voxx]

Im not sure if im saying this right but here it goes..

The only time i use judgement is when i think i keep attking in a pattern.
One good way is a d-throw, to the other guy rolling out and predicting the roll and judgement.
Ive gotten a few 8's which i combo'd off but never a 9....

im still waiting on it xP

 

[_Phloat_]

Sorry, one last thing on Chef.

It can really hurt opponents that need a bair to approach, as it turns them around. DK is an example, and Ike loses speed when he is facing you so that could be an advantage.

We need NoJ or Lovage or someone else with good tournament experience to talk about the judgement. It is decently fast with good range and good priority, but I don't know how well it does against good players =[.

 

[Debonu]

you can run off the platform on battlefield at the beginning of the match and you ledgeboost and could get a 9 in the very beginning =D

 

[_Phloat_]

So what we have now is the fact that if you do manage to get a hit there is an ~11% chance you will get a free kill..

And the other options aren't bad.

Good move on paper...

 

[cutter]

Ok then, update for Chef is up. Since discussion of Judgment is already underway, we'll move onto Judgment.

 

[Hawks go Caw]

If someone's on the ledge: run off > backwards judgement > hope for a 9

 

[Zephramrill]

A combo I have been using is a B-air to Up-B to key. if they sheild the key either grab and juggle, throw the manhole cover, or charge the upsmash. If they roll away, roll with them and drop a judgement.

EDIT: Also concerning judgement, its really great the first time you use it, because it can't be a 1 or a 2 I believe. Anything 3 and above is helpful So in reality its a 66 percent chance of a success (barring a hit of course) a 22 percent chance of mediocrity, or a 11 percent chance of aww **** I rolled a one XD

 

[Neb]

A combo I have been using is a B-air to Up-B to key. if they sheild the key either grab and juggle, throw the manhole cover, or charge the upsmash. If they roll away, roll with them and drop a judgement.

You're off topic.
-_-, read the OP.

 

[Zephramrill]

Hence the edit. Sorry about that.
P.S.
"You're"

 

[ADMJP]

So what we have now is the fact that if you do manage to get a hit there is an ~11% chance you will get a free kill..

And the other options aren't bad.

Good move on paper...

9s dont kill at 0% if im not mistaken. But its worth a try i suppose

 

[Voxx]

I did my first roll out 9, it was great! last stock, wario didnt see that coming...

 

[Voxx]

Been practicing the rollout move to judgement all day today....i successfully made it hit 6 times! It felt so great<3 i even made it hit 2 times on one match

 

[_Phloat_]

Hmm, I have to eat but I could do damage %s and knockback on each number, if it isn't around here somewhere...

 

[Neb]

Say, whats the best ways to pull of Judge, besides out of dthrow. Roll out Judgment doesn't sound full proof since his roll is so slow and punishable, :/.

 

[Voxx]

I think its been done on the guide but i decided to do it too :]

This is at zero percent fighting Jigglypuff

1: 2% and 12 dmg to gw
2: 4% and sometimes causes tripping
3: 6% and is much like jp pound, its good to combo off
4 8% nothing else i noticed
5: 6% three hits each being 2%
6: 12% and okay knockback
7: 14% and apple droped recovers 4%
8: 9% and frezes, great to combo off
9: 32% doesnt always kill (exp on Fd stage "__":floor "<":arrow where hammer is aiming "o":Jp "x":Gw

________________o<x_

 

[Voxx]

Now Jigglypuffs knockback at 50 percent

1: Stays the same
2: Same
3: Behind you with one gw distance
4: 1/4 of final destination
5: Stays the same
6: 1/2 of Fd stage
7: 1/4 or a little more
8: same
9: a sure kill

Now at 100 percent

4: still 1/4
6: The whole fd stage, can be a kill depending on stage
7: moved up to 1/4

This is kinda sorta useless info but eh xP

 

[Ruuku]

Say, whats the best ways to pull of Judge, besides out of dthrow. Roll out Judgment doesn't sound full proof since his roll is so slow and punishable, :/.

Spot dodge->Judgment. Also, I've done Nair->Judgment on a Wolf from 0%.

 

[Zephramrill]

Nair-Judge can kill 3/10ish (on a lighter guy) from 0% if the opponent doesnt use DI and its s smaller stage.

 

[Neb]

Oh yeah, I use nair to judgment sometimes, but its really dependent on you and your opponents DI. I've never done spot-dodge > Judge though. Anything else you guys do?

 

[_Phloat_]

If you do manage to get a 9 on the shield, it is hard to punish because, like Zelda's bair and fair, the game freezes for like half a second...

And the 5 often throws opponents off with its multiple hits, shieldgrabbing isnt easy.

With the 9 and 5 in the mixup, I find opponents prefer to roll to safety instead of trying to punish, its an interesting move that can really be used to condition opponents. They are a lot more dodgy knowing that one misstep = Kill

Kinda like how the second you get a full oil spill the opponent is a lot more defensive.