Sunrise, Sunset - Isaac for Smash Ultimate #GoldenSunday

True Blue Warrior · Aug 12, 2018

That Ratholos picture definitely makes you think?

Lynn Eslie said:
Pardon the interruption. I would like to voice my support for Isaac's inclusion as well. Though I have only personally completed the original Golden Sun, I remember it fondly, and still immediately recognize the melodies that make up its soundtrack. Even were it not for that, however, I have a great deal of respect for this movement, and wish to see its dream realized.

If I may: Given the trappings I come presented in, it should come as no surprise that Xenosaga's KOS-MOS is the first among my wants for inclusion. Yet in spite of her clinging to relevance through cameos as something of a Bandai-Namco/Monolith Darling, and in spite of also belonging to a well-loved cult classic... this sense of community has not formed in the same way. There are of course advantages Isaac enjoys, as a representative of the Gameboy Advanced, while Xenosaga's DS remake never made it out of Japan, but with Ultimate being developed by Bandai-Namco yet again, one might equate their overall circumstances... yet the difference in their support is unquestionable.

Much time and effort has been devoted to growing Isaac's support, to taking something a few hold with deep affection and convincing the greater whole of its worth. Not as a group of overbearing zealots, nor as a meme. Despite my jaded nature, I don't question how much of Isaac's support is ironic or otherwise disingenuous. He's not "the next on the checklist for a popular franchise." He's not "A villain and/or woman" to fill an arbitrary quota. He's a Male, Sword-wielding protagonist, and in a time where animosity towards swords is beginning to reach a fever pitch.

Yet here we are, and support, rather than dwindling, has instead continued to swell. For myself, I know not how to describe it short of awe-inspiring. Would that I could do the same.

The sun will rise again. Gaia has been dark long enough.

My apologies, but as a bit of due diligence, anyone kind enough to show support for KOS-MOS can find her thread in my signature. Please, thank you, and again, sorry.

Frosty Pops said:
Hey, I have been a longtime isaac supporter. He was my choice in the ballot. So add me on your list. I have so much hope for him right now. It looks like he and Geno are the most supported non-echo characters left.

Saer2k said:
Golden Sun was my first rpg game I ever played, Isaac is my most requested character before the release of Smash 4.
I hope King K. Rool is a sign that Sakurai is giving fans what they want.

I would gladly be on support of our golden boy!

Updated. Anyone else I missed?

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Pwnapplez · Aug 12, 2018

We still don't know what the side menu is.
I am going to assume it's a shop menu for characters, skins etc etc

Base game or not, I have hopes for DLC. 3-5 Characters max. Popular demands.

The front-runners are Geno, Skull Kid, Isaac. It's nothing crazy. 2 out of the 3 are Nintendo owned.

It's not like GS did anything bad for Nintendo.
Isaac is an ICONIC fighter. AT or not.

I just feel like if they were going to AT him, we would have seen it already.

Waliugi took care of the Mario Tenis rep

Now we need the Golden Sun rep.

isaac3000 · Aug 12, 2018

Oh there was an answer already I see.

If this is all they have to say about Golden Sun, then I won't lie, I am a bit disappointed but on the bright side, last time Golden Sun got mentioned was in that interview with one of the Takahashi brothers who said if enough fans ask for gs4 then it will happen. So something is better than nothing!

Ryuji · Aug 12, 2018

I haven't logged into this site for awhile. But after getting the character I most wanted in Smash(King K.Rool) confirmed, I want to profess my support for Isaac, who is next on my list next to Shantae. Here's hoping we get our beloved Venus adept into Smash as a playable character!

True Blue Warrior

Oniric Spriter · Aug 12, 2018

This kinda blew up. But hey, if people predict the roster for ultimate is based off of mii costumes even though it's been proven wrong or a generic looking pose for DK watching TV means "it's clearly a karate joe reference", this makes equal or more sense so rejoice while you can.

At the end of the day, don't get your hopes too high, you're setting yourselves to disappointment. Unlike many people seem to think, being an AT isn't a bad position to be in.

Tiymako · Aug 12, 2018

Oniric Spriter said:
This kinda blew up. But hey, if people predict the roster for ultimate is based off of mii costumes even though it's been proven wrong or a generic looking pose for DK watching TV means "it's clearly a karate joe reference", this makes equal or more sense so rejoice while you can.

At the end of the day, don't get your hopes too high, you're setting yourselves to disappointment. Unlike many people seem to think, being an AT isn't a bad position to be in.

I certainly don't think that Isaac being an AT would be bad at all, I think it is an honor just to be in smash in general. I may be disappointed at first, but I will be extremely satisfied with Smash Ultimate one way or another. This is still good for us Golden Sun Fans because even if Isaac doesn't become a playable rep, we can still support the series and hope for a new Golden Sun some time soon.

As long as we keep the thought of honoring Isaac as an AT first and a Playable Rep second than we will be sure to be happy either way. It's all speculation and that is the part that is the most fun about it. I seriously do think that Golden Sun needs to be treated better and deserves a chance to show it's shining glory that it deserves.

We still have a chance, better than ever before and we finally have that sliver of hope and light that we all have been craving for. Now, let's see how far we can go to support our favourite game.

JaidynReiman · Aug 12, 2018

Oniric Spriter said:
This kinda blew up. But hey, if people predict the roster for ultimate is based off of mii costumes even though it's been proven wrong or a generic looking pose for DK watching TV means "it's clearly a karate joe reference", this makes equal or more sense so rejoice while you can.

At the end of the day, don't get your hopes too high, you're setting yourselves to disappointment. Unlike many people seem to think, being an AT isn't a bad position to be in.

I think any of us here would take an AT over what happened last time.

Tetiro · Aug 12, 2018

Tiymako said:
I certainly don't think that Isaac being an AT would be bad at all, I think it is an honor just to be in smash in general. I may be disappointed at first, but I will be extremely satisfied with Smash Ultimate one way or another. This is still good for us Golden Sun Fans because even if Isaac doesn't become a playable rep, we can still support the series and hope for a new Golden Sun some time soon.

As long as we keep the thought of honoring Isaac as an AT first and a Playable Rep second than we will be sure to be happy either way. It's all speculation and that is the part the is the most fun about it. I seriously do think that Golden Sun needs to be treated better and deserves a chance to show it's shining glory that it deserves.

We still have a chance, better than ever before and we finally have that sliver of hope and light that we all have been craving for. Now, let's see how far we can go to support our favourite game.

I'm with you there. If we all stick together and make our voice heard, even if Isaac remains an AT this time, we can surely make our voice heard loud enough that he gets in for the next Smash. I'd be happy with any Golden Sun representation in Smash. Heck at this point even a trophy is enough

_Sheik · Aug 12, 2018

Oniric Spriter said:
This kinda blew up. But hey, if people predict the roster for ultimate is based off of mii costumes even though it's been proven wrong or a generic looking pose for DK watching TV means "it's clearly a karate joe reference", this makes equal or more sense so rejoice while you can.

At the end of the day, don't get your hopes too high, you're setting yourselves to disappointment. Unlike many people seem to think, being an AT isn't a bad position to be in.

I mean... we've been aware for years? But thank you I guess

Isaac: Venus Adept · Aug 12, 2018

Tetiro said:
I'm with you there. If we all stick together and make our voice heard, even if Isaac remains an AT this time, we can surely make our voice heard loud enough that he gets in for the next Smash. I'd be happy with any Golden Sun representation in Smash. Heck at this point even a trophy is enough

That's the spirit. We shouldn't give up, I honestly thought that Ridley would never be in Smash and have his status forever cemented as a stage boss and I though King K.Rool would be ignored until he got another DK game but the constant support from their fanbases is what kept them from being recurring names in the community until Ultimate happened

Pwnapplez · Aug 12, 2018

Oniric Spriter said:
This kinda blew up. But hey, if people predict the roster for ultimate is based off of mii costumes even though it's been proven wrong or a generic looking pose for DK watching TV means "it's clearly a karate joe reference", this makes equal or more sense so rejoice while you can.

At the end of the day, don't get your hopes too high, you're setting yourselves to disappointment. Unlike many people seem to think, being an AT isn't a bad position to be in.

JaidynReiman said:
I think any of us here would take an AT over what happened last time.

Tetiro said:
I'm with you there. If we all stick together and make our voice heard, even if Isaac remains an AT this time, we can surely make our voice heard loud enough that he gets in for the next Smash. I'd be happy with any Golden Sun representation in Smash. Heck at this point even a trophy is enough

No, an AT would not be bad. Honestly to just see Isaac back in smash is more than enough. (Hopefully if he is just an AT I would like to see something more then move) Would get people talking about future GS games. We got music in the last smash, I am hoping for something more. I am extremely grateful for what we have right now. This is truly an ultimate smash bros game.

I am just glad to see all this GS talk.

From high hopes, to "leaks" to a "tease" the sun has not set in our hearts yet. We still love this series.

No AT yet, still gives me hope. DLC maybe, idk about base game.

I can't take any leak seriously.

Saer2k · Aug 12, 2018

I would prefer having Isaac be playable, but assist trophy wouldn't be bad either.
It would suck if he was absent again... (but I think he has a really good chance)

Tetiro · Aug 12, 2018

I wouldn't trust any leaks. No-one leaked Richter despite people knowing Simon would be in. Surely knowledge of both would be joined at the hips?

No news is good news right now. As long as Isaac doesn't show up as an Assist Trophy we still have a chance

jweb23 · Aug 12, 2018

It has been a very long time since I've been here but with the reveal of Simon Belmont and King K Rool, I feel like this is truly the best chance Isaac has ever had to be playable. Hopefully this 17 year journey of begging for his addition comes to an end.

Tetiro · Aug 12, 2018

There's a part of me that wants to see Master Hand thrashing a lot of characters in the next Character Reveal just so Isaac's Move ability can stop his Punch Attack only for Isaac to appear with the words "Isaac Lends a Hand"

...Sigh...I got myself too hyped.

Isaac: Venus Adept · Aug 12, 2018

Tetiro said:
There's a part of me that wants to see Master Hand thrashing a lot of characters in the next Character Reveal just so Isaac's Move ability can stop his Punch Attack only for Isaac to appear with the words "Isaac Lends a Hand"

...Sigh...I got myself too hyped.

I could just see Master Hand just doing that open palm rush attack before Isaac's move psynergy stops him. The camera pans to the source of the mysterious magic hand before boom Isaac reveals himself from the shadows and lets out Ragnarok as it reveals his tagline 'ISAAC MAKES HIS MOVE' or whatever you want the tagline to be. Then cue gameplay and Felix echo fighter is revealed in the middle of the trailer like Richter or at the end

Saer2k · Aug 12, 2018

Isaac: Venus Adept said:
I could just see Master Hand just doing that open palm rush attack before Isaac's move psynergy stops him. The camera pans to the source of the mysterious magic hand before boom Isaac reveals himself from the shadows and lets out Ragnarok as it reveals his tagline 'ISAAC MAKES HIS MOVE' or whatever you want the tagline to be. Then cue gameplay and Felix echo fighter is revealed in the middle of the trailer like Richter or at the end

Man, how awesome would it be to have Golden Sun Reps like they did with Castlevania!
Maybe while Isaac and Felix are playable, Matthew can become the replacement for Isaac assist trophy.
That would be a great way to represent all the protags from each of their games.

Deleted member · Aug 12, 2018

IS THAT RATHALOS SCREENSHOT A MOTHER****ING GOLDEN SUN REFERENCE?!/joke

The Lamakan Desert might be hot, but it sure smells freakin’ delicious.

Organization XIII · Aug 12, 2018

You know what I'm going to say that after going through all of Smash 4's speculation only to see Isaac have him lose his representation and then go through all of the DLC period without seeing him get anything and then get absolutely no word on why GS lost the AT, that getting the AT isn't enough. It's only good enough if we see our Golden Boy back in action. Now don't get me wrong I'll take the AT over nothing everytime, nothing's worse then nothing of course, but we suffered enough for our favorite character it's time Sakurai let's him join the roster.

Tetiro · Aug 12, 2018

Isaac: Venus Adept said:
I could just see Master Hand just doing that open palm rush attack before Isaac's move psynergy stops him. The camera pans to the source of the mysterious magic hand before boom Isaac reveals himself from the shadows and lets out Ragnarok as it reveals his tagline 'ISAAC MAKES HIS MOVE' or whatever you want the tagline to be. Then cue gameplay and Felix echo fighter is revealed in the middle of the trailer like Richter or at the end

Man I would freak out if between us we nailed what Isaac's reveal trailer would be

Bootortle · Aug 12, 2018

hopefully he can show up, I love how many elemental moves he could potentially use, I think it would make for a great moveset

?!?!?! · Aug 12, 2018

Bootortle said:
hopefully he can show up, I love how many elemental moves he could potentially use, I think it would make for a great moveset

Agreed, I think out of all the popular potential remaining newcomers Isaac and geno would have the most interesting and flashy movesets

Kirbyfan391 · Aug 12, 2018

I'm convinced so far the 103 stage list is final(bar DLC), and while that does seem bad for any new franchise getting a playable rep into the base game, I can actually see it make sense for Golden Sun. GS is essentially a "dead" franchise but unlike something like Punch Out, doesn't have the whole arcade/nes legacy, a pretty bad position admittedly, main thing it has going for it now is the great fan demand for Isaac which without this would be all be a pipe dream, so I can see Sakurai throwing a half bone by putting in Isaac but no GS stage.

Of course, if you believe the 103 stage list isn't final(technically off-topic to this thread so I won't go too into it), there isn't much to worry about imo, but just saying even if it is, I believe there's still hope, even for the base game at least, for playable Isaac. And if Isaac were to have a "home stage" borrowing from another franchise, like how R.O.B's is Mario Bros., the Great Plateu could work. Incidentally another Zelda stage, Pirate Ship, seems to fit with K Rool(the character that gave us renewed hope recently) better than any other DK stage.

JaidynReiman · Aug 12, 2018

Kirbyfan391 said:
I'm convinced so far the 103 stage list is final(bar DLC), and while that does seem bad for any new franchise getting a playable rep into the base game, I can actually see it make sense for Golden Sun. GS is essentially a "dead" franchise but unlike something like Punch Out, doesn't have the whole arcade/nes legacy, a pretty bad position admittedly, main thing it has going for it now is the great fan demand for Isaac which without this would be all be a pipe dream, so I can see Sakurai throwing a half bone by putting in Isaac but no GS stage.

Of course, if you believe the 103 stage list isn't final(technically off-topic to this thread so I won't go too into it), there isn't much to worry about imo, but just saying even if it is, I believe there's still hope, even for the base game at least, for playable Isaac. And if Isaac were to have a "home stage" borrowing from another franchise, like how R.O.B's is Mario Bros., the Great Plateu could work. Incidentally another Zelda stage, Pirate Ship, seems to fit with K Rool(the character that gave us renewed hope recently) better than any other DK stage.

Honestly, IMO, Battlefield looks like a freaking Golden Sun stage. Its got that aesthetic. Though I've heard others saying maybe it resembles Kid Icarus.

I'm completely convinced we're not done with stages, though.

Organization XIII · Aug 12, 2018

Until I get Pokefloats confirmed we aren't allowed to be done with stages

Tetiro · Aug 12, 2018

Kirbyfan391 said:
I'm convinced so far the 103 stage list is final(bar DLC), and while that does seem bad for any new franchise getting a playable rep into the base game, I can actually see it make sense for Golden Sun. GS is essentially a "dead" franchise but unlike something like Punch Out, doesn't have the whole arcade/nes legacy, a pretty bad position admittedly, main thing it has going for it now is the great fan demand for Isaac which without this would be all be a pipe dream, so I can see Sakurai throwing a half bone by putting in Isaac but no GS stage.

Of course, if you believe the 103 stage list isn't final(technically off-topic to this thread so I won't go too into it), there isn't much to worry about imo, but just saying even if it is, I believe there's still hope, even for the base game at least, for playable Isaac. And if Isaac were to have a "home stage" borrowing from another franchise, like how R.O.B's is Mario Bros., the Great Plateu could work. Incidentally another Zelda stage, Pirate Ship, seems to fit with K Rool(the character that gave us renewed hope recently) better than any other DK stage.

You know this "103 is the total" bugged me so I decided to read-between-the-lines like I did back when Labo was teased to figure out what was going on (yes I actually realized Labo was going to be controller craft related.).

And that I did this time around and if anything, it hints at MORE stages. Look at what Sakurai says

"The stage total IS TURNING out to be pretty impressive"
"Let's compare it to the TOTALS of the previous games"
"NOW the total number of stages is... voila!"
"103! We must be crazy"

I CAPS'd the important parts. Now you think. Why do this? Well look at it. NONE of them are PAST-TENSE. If it was, it would say "Has Turned Out", "Final Totals", and "Finally"

It is using PRESENT tense in everything he says. This is crucial as it states Sakurai is not done yet.

Frosty Pops · Aug 12, 2018

Isaac would not have to be another sword user, he could main an axe. Basic combo and tilts could be axe moves. Forward smash could be ragnarok, down smash could be briars or wild growth, up smash could be spire. B attacks could be: B could be gaia or avalanche, Up B could be lift, side B could be force or move, down B quake sphere or earthquake. Air attacks could be a mix of axe and thorn and rockslide. Grabs could be: down growth grabs enemy and slams them on the ground, forward is force or move (whichever wasnt used for side B) back could be standard, up could be quake knocking them up into an axe chop. Final smash could be any of the earth dijinn summons. A few of them could change where they are on his moveset. (Ragnarok could be standard B) I noticed no one mentioned using growth, briars or the other plant based moves (if they have and i missed them i apologize) but they could greatly enhance his uniqueness and moveset.

Organization XIII · Aug 12, 2018

He could main an axe but see the real thing is why should he main an axe? Guys we don't have to be afraid of swords we know Isaac will be unique no matter what so why go out of our way to try and force him to not use the weapon most associated with him? When Isaac gets in I'd rather him be as "Isaac" as possible rather than try and appease people who will complain anyway.

Malkior7 · Aug 12, 2018

Isaac is just more synonymous with the sword it would be weird if he didn't use a sword imo.

JaidynReiman · Aug 12, 2018

Organization XIII said:
He could main an axe but see the real thing is why should he main an axe? Guys we don't have to be afraid of swords we know Isaac will be unique no matter what so why go out of our way to try and force him to not use the weapon most associated with him? When Isaac gets in I'd rather him be as "Isaac" as possible rather than try and appease people who will complain anyway.

My preference is to just have him with an attack that let's him switch the weapon each time he uses it. Like maybe if he's got Flint as a side special, he'll first use a sword, then an Axe, then a Mace, and that remains on any other attack that uses a physical weapon. But that might be hard to pull off...

I don't mind if he uses a sword, I'd just like a bit of variety. Another option is to just have a set weapon for specific attacks. But I realize he'll probably just use a sword.

True Blue Warrior · Aug 12, 2018

Updated.

_Sheik
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XenoWarriorX · Aug 12, 2018

Mr Gentleman said:
Quick question. How does Golden Sun stack up to the other classic JRPGs?
I love a good JRPG. And have mostly played through the big name classics. Earthbound, final fantasy 7, chrono trigger, Mario RPG. As well as loved the more recent Xenoblade chronicles. Which was like a perfect game to me.

Curious if it's something worth my time. Like what are it's big selling points that make it stand out among other JRPGs?
If Isaac gets in I'll probably play it just to learn about him as I have done with most smash characters.
But otherwise I don't know.

1. It's really polished for a GBA RPG. It had a long development cycle.
2. Music is done by the man that writes music for the "Tales of" games.
3. Great worldbuilding.
4. Interesting characters.

Is the story good? That's a bit subjective. . .Perhaps you can judge for yourselves.

SonicLink125 · Aug 12, 2018

JaidynReiman said:
My preference is to just have him with an attack that let's him switch the weapon each time he uses it. Like maybe if he's got Flint as a side special, he'll first use a sword, then an Axe, then a Mace, and that remains on any other attack that uses a physical weapon. But that might be hard to pull off...

I don't mind if he uses a sword, I'd just like a bit of variety. Another option is to just have a set weapon for specific attacks. But I realize he'll probably just use a sword.

So like, his FSmash is a sword, USmash is an axe, and DSmash is a mace. That would be sweet!

Sabrewulf238 · Aug 12, 2018

Organization XIII said:
You know what I'm going to say that after going through all of Smash 4's speculation only to see Isaac have him lose his representation and then go through all of the DLC period without seeing him get anything and then get absolutely no word on why GS lost the AT, that getting the AT isn't enough. It's only good enough if we see our Golden Boy back in action. Now don't get me wrong I'll take the AT over nothing everytime, nothing's worse then nothing of course, but we suffered enough for our favorite character it's time Sakurai let's him join the roster.

If Isaac comes back as an assist, I don't think it'll feel like enough....but it'll have to be enough.

I'll still feel sad and disappointed, that's just a given I think....but it's not like I'll cause a fuss over it either. That's disrespectful. (and not a good use of time...)

Organization XIII said:
Until I get Pokefloats confirmed we aren't allowed to be done with stages

I don't think we're done with stages, but unfortunately I don't think we'll be getting anymore old stages. Though I would really love Pokefloats to return.

XenoWarriorX · Aug 12, 2018

Found this on Smash Bros Reddit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/96ofya/sakurai/

Someone in the comments legit says it's the "camelot angle"

THANK GOD I'M NOT CRAZY.

EclipseSmash · Aug 12, 2018

It's gaining major traction on Reddit which is great!

Tetiro · Aug 12, 2018

XenoWarriorX said:
Found this on Smash Bros Reddit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/96ofya/sakurai/

Someone in the comments legit says it's the "camelot angle"

THANK GOD I'M NOT CRAZY.

My breathing just hastened rapidly

QcSlayer · Aug 12, 2018

https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1027234926167388160

Btw an user named Model_SX29 on Gamespot just post this:

Side note, the Golden Sun games had a little-used feature called Arena Battles that let you use your save data (even cleared game saves) to fight in a colosseum against other players, or regular monsters (including bosses) if you were by yourself. However, players were limited to three party members instead of the usual 4.

The screnshot behing a reference seems more and more likely.

I don't remember reading someone saying it here so I will post it. I actually did not know because I've never played far in GS...

So why am I here you might ask? While I hate playing GBA games on emulator or Wii U (whit isn't GS on 3DS)....

My favorite game of all time is Kid Icarus Uprising, and it was brought by Pit inclusion in Smash, just like Fire Emblem was brought to the west by Sakurai (I'm a huge fan).

I did not really have a perticuliar wish for anyone in Smash as long as the character reprensented gaming.
But I was convince to vote for Isaac, simply because Smash is Golden Sun last chance to see a revival, just like 2 of my favorite franchise!

XenoWarriorX · Aug 12, 2018

QcSlayer said:
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1027234926167388160

Btw an user named Model_SX29 on Gamespot just post this:

Side note, the Golden Sun games had a little-used feature called Arena Battles that let you use your save data (even cleared game saves) to fight in a colosseum against other players, or regular monsters (including bosses) if you were by yourself. However, players were limited to three party members instead of the usual 4.

Wait, do you think this is a reference to Battle Arena?

Because it seems way too perfect in this instance.

Malkior7 · Aug 12, 2018

If Isaac is to get in I really hope they are as generous with the music as they were with Castlevania because Golden Sun as so much great music it would be a crime to only include 1 or 2.

Sunrise, Sunset - Isaac for Smash Ultimate #GoldenSunday

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