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Squirtle Squad (General Disc.)

_Pixel_

Pink Squirtle is best Squirtle.
Joined
Mar 31, 2006
Messages
35
Location
Auburn AL
If we added you to the chat and you didn't see it pop up, you need to accept the invite. If you would like to be added PM any one of us your email or reply with it. We'll add you to the Squirtley discussion.

Quick tutorial:
http://imgur.com/a/bOANG
 

Daftatt

"float like a puffball, sting like a knee"
Joined
Mar 16, 2013
Messages
1,219
Location
Olympia, WA
NNID
Daftatt
Everytime I see someone pick squirtle on stream a little bubble of hope starts to form inside me, then when I see that they are an amish squirtle, refusing to use technology, the bubble pops and becomes a tear.
 
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PlateProp

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 15, 2014
Messages
4,149
Location
San Antonio
NNID
Genericality
3DS FC
3823-8710-2486
Everytime I see someone pick squirtle on stream a little bubble of hope starts to form inside me, then when I see that they are an amish squirtle, refusing to use technology, the bubble pops and becomes a tear.
Amish Squirtle alt PMBR

Make it happen
 

Daftatt

"float like a puffball, sting like a knee"
Joined
Mar 16, 2013
Messages
1,219
Location
Olympia, WA
NNID
Daftatt
Amish Squirtle alt PMBR

Make it happen
lol, that's riotous. Amish squirtle with the black hat and beard, instead of shellshift he just skids to a stop and turns around.

Seriously though, it's such a bummer to see someone play squirtle, and barely move as they bubble and withdraw everywhere. Then when I spread the good word of shellshifting in chat, they're like "Nah man, I don't want to dedicate any time to squirtle because I don't think he is really that good, I can't seem to find any good matchups with him". Then I want to say "Wait, STOP, it's only because you aren't playing him correctly! It's like playing fox but never jumping out of his shine!" But then again, it's like trying to tempt the amish to use a flashlight...

"Nah man, why would I go out in the dark when it's hard to see? Doesn't seem worth it", if only they would embrace technology.
 
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PlateProp

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 15, 2014
Messages
4,149
Location
San Antonio
NNID
Genericality
3DS FC
3823-8710-2486
lol, that's riotous. Amish squirtle with the black hat and beard, instead of shellshift he just skids to a stop and turns around.

Seriously though, it's such a bummer to see someone play squirtle, and barely move as they bubble and withdraw everywhere. Then when I spread the good word of shellshifting in chat, they're like "Nah man, I don't want to dedicate any time to squirtle because I don't think he is really that good, I can't seem to find any good matchups with him". Then I want to say "Wait, STOP, it's only because you aren't playing him correctly! It's like playing fox but never jumping out of his shine!" But then again, it's like trying to tempt the amish to use a flashlight...

"Nah man, why would I go out in the dark when it's hard to see? Doesn't seem worth it", if only they would embrace technology.
I proposed it in the alt costume thread to see opinions

also I made a gmail just for you guys :c

plateprop@gmail.com
 

Daftatt

"float like a puffball, sting like a knee"
Joined
Mar 16, 2013
Messages
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Location
Olympia, WA
NNID
Daftatt
was making footage for Tech Tree video, then I accidentally...

Hydroplane taunt, everyone use this please, it's so beautiful.
 
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PlateProp

Smash Master
Joined
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was making footage for Tech Tree video, then I accidentally...

Hydroplane taunt, everyone use this please, it's so beautiful.
I was thinking about that last night, but when I tried I failed

Give us the imputs Daft
 

_Pixel_

Pink Squirtle is best Squirtle.
Joined
Mar 31, 2006
Messages
35
Location
Auburn AL
Now the most important part, can he shellshift shades?
But of course.

Also has inputs for those who are curious. Daft explained it as SS, when coming out smash the stick in the opposite direction of your momentum coming out of shell, and then taunt.
 
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Daftatt

"float like a puffball, sting like a knee"
Joined
Mar 16, 2013
Messages
1,219
Location
Olympia, WA
NNID
Daftatt
After deliberation with many of you in our squirtle squad hangout, I have finished the first taxonomic and terminology guide to squirtle, the squirtle "Tech Tree", complete with a unified order of categorization and naming conventions, let it be know that nothing is final, but this is currently the best organization we have, voice your criticisms and opinions so that we may make finishing touches and continue onto the real task of an official guide to playing squirtle (by the way, @ _Pixel_ _Pixel_ those gyfys are so amazing, we must make one for everything!). This is a prototype only to serve as outline for the final tech tree infographic-whatever that will also incorporate input instructions.

EDIT: In this current diagram the term "Soft Reversal" was substituted for the actual term "B Turnaround" (since I couldn't think of the actual term), I'll update it in the next revision to the correct term, "B Turnaround".

Burnsy mentioned that we wanted no overlap with possible abbreviations, so these are my proposals, if ever we start speaking 20XX and actually using them I don't know, but they are simply there to prevent the formation of other abbreviations from being used which may conflict with each other, they also have internally consistent logic in their structure
As for now... Tah dahhhhh...

also shuriken is misspelled
 
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Daftatt

"float like a puffball, sting like a knee"
Joined
Mar 16, 2013
Messages
1,219
Location
Olympia, WA
NNID
Daftatt
I'd argue that Railgun should be in the green, but this is actually a really good chart. Congrats on the first draft!
I was thinking that too upon deliberation, you can shoot off the stage and watergun gimp a recovering an opponent, then withdrawl/waterfall back to the stage (also you have a jump left). I'd need to be successful with it in a match, or see someone else have success with it before we can be sure it's viable, but in theory it could be very good.
 

Burnsy

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 4, 2012
Messages
1,167
Location
Phoenix, AZ
Tech tree looks great, but I'm just putting it out there that if someone talks to me and uses the nicknames like gunslinger and cannonball for his aerials instead of technical terms, I'm not going to understand you. Lol.
 

Daftatt

"float like a puffball, sting like a knee"
Joined
Mar 16, 2013
Messages
1,219
Location
Olympia, WA
NNID
Daftatt
Tech tree looks great, but I'm just putting it out there that if someone talks to me and uses the nicknames like gunslinger and cannonball for his aerials instead of technical terms, I'm not going to understand you. Lol.
Yeah, I'm iffy on those nicknames too. We may just get rid of them all.
 

Daftatt

"float like a puffball, sting like a knee"
Joined
Mar 16, 2013
Messages
1,219
Location
Olympia, WA
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Daftatt
Does this mean it's possible to ledge cancel the UpTaunt right after putting on the shades?

Dude, new meta.
If you go fast enough you can hydrotaunt into shades (while facing backwards) then slide off the stage into an edgehog (hit shield when you get to the edge). Whoever does this first in an actual match is officially king of this subforum
 
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Burnsy

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 4, 2012
Messages
1,167
Location
Phoenix, AZ
Is the tech tree missing sling jump jc grab? That should be possible and I dont see it where it should be.
 
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Daftatt

"float like a puffball, sting like a knee"
Joined
Mar 16, 2013
Messages
1,219
Location
Olympia, WA
NNID
Daftatt
Is the tech tree missing sling jump jc grab? That should be possible and I dont see it where it should be.
is it useful though? Couldn't you just wavedash pivot grab? I dunno, I haven't used slingjupm jc grab
 

Burnsy

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 4, 2012
Messages
1,167
Location
Phoenix, AZ
I thought you were really stressing completeness, and then labeling with what you assume their usefulness is afterward. I'm not sure how useful it is either.

Also, does anyone have any Link advice? I got spanked pretty bad by one tonight who I usually beat, lol. Not a good feeling.
 
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Hinichii.ez.™

insincere personality
Joined
Nov 2, 2013
Messages
4,290
NNID
hinichii
3DS FC
2423-5382-7542
I saw a real player play this character last night (burnsy.) bout to be Virgil up in this *****.
 
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Chesstiger2612

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 1, 2013
Messages
1,753
Location
Bonn, Germany
A few technology things with Squirtle:
Every Squirtle has to empty pivot much more, I mean, much much more. It is by far the most efficient way to stop your momentum and you have plenty of options out of it:
- jump, shield any attack in your new direction, f-smash in the reverse direction or crouch immediately
- any dashs/walks/another empty pivot/attacks in the other direction after the animation
Squirtle's run starts at frame 10, so you have to do it either before or you have to do it a bit more complicated, but still very practical if you are good enough:
Run -> crouch to cancel the run (just rotate the stick as much downward as you need) -> dash (stick back to the previous position) -> empty pivot.

You can cancel a WDs momentum by dashing in the opposing direction (one frame is enough) and then performing an empty pivot. Deciding in which direction you want to dash also gives you control over the direction you are facing at the end. That makes the one-frame-dash (if optimized of course) also interesting for cancelling other momentum (like shield pushback) because you might wanna keep the direction you are facing and one-frame-dash-back -> empty pivot is optimized for this.

Dropcancel: Drop through a platform and instantly do an aerial that hits the player instantly so you can land on the same platform again (don't forget to L-cancel). Only 17 moves are able to do that in the game and Squirtle's up-air is one of them.
Combos into anything basically (grab or up-smash being the most notable ones) and it is pretty easy to setup (except on FD lol) because you can use every kind of platform drop. Here a few setups:
dair -> dropcancel up-air
nair -> dropcancel up-air (at lower %s)
platform techchase -> dropcancel up-air (you can only drop from run animation, otherwise pivot drop after you go behind your opponent cause you have to hit with the frontside)
dropcancel up-air as shield pressure (hitting shields also counts): implement this sometimes to be even more unpredictable, not always your main option but Squirtle's shield pressure is movement and mixups so it is reliable if used correctly

If you want to dash forwards after a WD back, normally the speed is reduced significantly at the beginning but if you start with walking backwards (one frame is enough) and then dash forwards it has full dash speed (credit goes to @ T tauKhan for this one). Get fast with it and your maneouvreability after WDing will increase by a lot.

Most of this is somewhat technical but I'm sure Squirtle players welcome the challenge
@ D Daftatt Gotta update the list and think of names? :)
 
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tauKhan

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 9, 2014
Messages
1,349
If you want to dash forwards after a WD back, normally the speed is reduced significantly at the beginning but if you start with walking backwards (one frame is enough) and then dash forwards it has full dash speed (credit goes to @ T tauKhan for this one). Get fast with it and your maneouvreability after WDing will increase by a lot.
No, you need to walk in the same direction you want to dash in to cancel the wd momentum. It's kind of difficult input to do, as holding too much forward before the dash means you can't dash anymore.
 

Chesstiger2612

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 1, 2013
Messages
1,753
Location
Bonn, Germany
No, you need to walk in the same direction you want to dash in to cancel the wd momentum. It's kind of difficult input to do, as holding too much forward before the dash means you can't dash anymore.
You are right. I was wrongly assuming it depends on the WD direction, not on the dash direction. Dashing back first also works though. Thank you for correcting me.
 

tauKhan

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 9, 2014
Messages
1,349
Dashing back is the melee strat, but it's usually quite a bit slower to execute. Usually you dash back for few frames, then you turn and dash again, and that probably usually takes you 6-8 frames to get back where you wd'd.
 

PlateProp

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 15, 2014
Messages
4,149
Location
San Antonio
NNID
Genericality
3DS FC
3823-8710-2486
A few technology things with Squirtle:
Every Squirtle has to empty pivot much more, I mean, much much more. It is by far the most efficient way to stop your momentum and you have plenty of options out of it:
- jump, shield any attack in your new direction, f-smash in the reverse direction or crouch immediately
- any dashs/walks/another empty pivot/attacks in the other direction after the animation
Squirtle's run starts at frame 10, so you have to do it either before or you have to do it a bit more complicated, but still very practical if you are good enough:
Run -> crouch to cancel the run (just rotate the stick as much downward as you need) -> dash (stick back to the previous position) -> empty pivot.

You can cancel a WDs momentum by dashing in the opposing direction (one frame is enough) and then performing an empty pivot. Deciding in which direction you want to dash also gives you control over the direction you are facing at the end. That makes the one-frame-dash (if optimized of course) also interesting for cancelling other momentum (like shield pushback) because you might wanna keep the direction you are facing and one-frame-dash-back -> empty pivot is optimized for this.

Dropcancel: Drop through a platform and instantly do an aerial that hits the player instantly so you can land on the same platform again (don't forget to L-cancel). Only 17 moves are able to do that in the game and Squirtle's up-air is one of them.
Combos into anything basically (grab or up-smash being the most notable ones) and it is pretty easy to setup (except on FD lol) because you can use every kind of platform drop. Here a few setups:
dair -> dropcancel up-air
nair -> dropcancel up-air (at lower %s)
platform techchase -> dropcancel up-air (you can only drop from run animation, otherwise pivot drop after you go behind your opponent cause you have to hit with the frontside)
dropcancel up-air as shield pressure (hitting shields also counts): implement this sometimes to be even more unpredictable, not always your main option but Squirtle's shield pressure is movement and mixups so it is reliable if used correctly

If you want to dash forwards after a WD back, normally the speed is reduced significantly at the beginning but if you start with walking backwards (one frame is enough) and then dash forwards it has full dash speed (credit goes to @ T tauKhan for this one). Get fast with it and your maneouvreability after WDing will increase by a lot.

Most of this is somewhat technical but I'm sure Squirtle players welcome the challenge
@ D Daftatt Gotta update the list and think of names? :)
Stopping with Squritle is bad.
Reduces Slipperiness
Gotta go fast always
Sanik Fast

Realtalk though, I dont see anything here that wouldnt be better if you acted out of a ShellShift. Other than this "Drop Cancel", which you can't hydroplane for obvious reasons, you get much more milage out of Hydroplanes, which allows you to do pretty much anything while in motion.
 

Chesstiger2612

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 1, 2013
Messages
1,753
Location
Bonn, Germany
Sometimes you have to stop though, there are lots of moments where motion can also be harming.
For example a character with a lasting grab throwing out a grabbox and you have time to react but are moving towards him...
If you do a slippery backwards motion you are probably not there to punish.
Same if you lose centerstage because of shield pushback etc etc...
 

PlateProp

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 15, 2014
Messages
4,149
Location
San Antonio
NNID
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3DS FC
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Sometimes you have to stop though, there are lots of moments where motion can also be harming.
For example a character with a lasting grab throwing out a grabbox and you have time to react but are moving towards him...
If you do a slippery backwards motion you are probably not there to punish.
Same if you lose centerstage because of shield pushback etc etc...
Or you could just jump.

Squirtle Fundamentals 101: The ShellSling
 
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