Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Bradli Wartooth]

Ironically, a Ridley deconfirmation in the big reveal trailer would probably kill the hype for a lot of people.

I want it to end as soon as possible, but I also don't want it to ruin my enjoyment of E3.

Well I anticipate we'll get an event of some kind before E3 so it can just kill that event for you instead

 

[Knight Dude]

Sylux hasn't even shown up yet. Maybe he could be late DLC after Prime 4 releases. But base game would be really weird and honestly I would be really disappointed. Wait for Prime 4 to actually release to flesh him out more than "character that teases future games." Throwing him in right now would feel like "well I want to rep Metroid" and repping for the sake of repping is dumb as hell.


As for funky I really can't imagine him as a clone. He is generally displayed as bipedal. Him being hunched over all the time instead of upright just seems really weird to me.

Honestly, just give us Funky's theme from DKC2 and I'm good.

As for Sylux, I do think he's unlikely, maybe even less so than Ridley or Dark Samus. I've already mentioned a few times how I think he could be interesting, and that I like the character(and Weavel, who's even less likely), so its sort of a pipe dream choice. I'd rather have a new character from the series because I actually like them, not for some short-sighted arbitrary fulfillment.

I care a lot less about the "reps" thing than I did back in the day. But I am a fan of Metroid in general. I mean it's my second favorite Nintendo series after Mario, so of course I like the characters(however few they'd be). But I also want them to be interesting to play too. Like, I personally wouldn't want someone like Kanden or Anthony "Remember Me?" Higgs to get in, since they have less gimmicks that I think translate into a fighting game properly.

 

[Morbi]

After making Ridley a boss character in two consecutive Smash games, there's not much more Sakurai can do to "compensate" for Ridley's absence at this point. Honestly, Ridley's status as a boss is already the next best thing to being playable.



Ironically, a Ridley deconfirmation in the big reveal trailer would probably kill the hype for a lot of people.

I want it to end as soon as possible, but I also don't want it to ruin my enjoyment of E3.

In that event, I suppose Pyrosphere returns? Or they remake the boss fight on a Prime 4 stage, at least? I do not know, most Ridley fans I have read ****ing HATE him as a boss. I enjoyed it myself though, so I would not mind too much. Hard to expect anything from Sakurai other than his spurts of genius now and again. Otherwise, his decisions mostly fall flat for me.

Totally correct me if I'm wrong never played a Donkey Kong game, but there is no cohesive story across the Donkey Kong games where as there is in the Metroid games, thus that isn't really a fair comparison.

Metroid has actual spin off titles, Metroid Prime Pinball, and hell even Federation Force is more a spin off than Hunters.

Also wanna totally agree with everyone that adding Sylux to appease Ridley fans, hell even Metroid fans, would be a mistake. I think that's a big reason we didn't get a Metroid rep last game. Well that and there aren't many choices.

Kingdom Hearts story is still ongoing within spin-off titles, but they are still spin-off titles, fam.

 

[Pacack]

A genuine question for you all, given the criticism of Sylux on my roster.

Do you think Ridley is going to be reconsidered? Maybe Dark Samus as a clone/semiclone? No new Metroid rep at all? Why?

I just want to know what everyone's reasonings are. (I was under the impression that Ridley is never happening in particular.)

 

[StormC]

A genuine question for you all, given the criticism of Sylux on my roster.

Do you think Ridley is going to be reconsidered? Maybe Dark Samus as a clone/semiclone? No new Metroid rep at all? Why?

I just want to know what everyone's reasonings are; I was under the impression that Ridley is never happening.

We get Ridley or we get nothing. Sakurai could change his mind or someone at Nintendo might “suggest” him. Those are the only options. Dark Samus’s games have long since passed and fan demand is small. Metroid is just not a character heavy series.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

A genuine question for you all, given the criticism of Sylux on my roster.

Do you think Ridley is going to be reconsidered? Maybe Dark Samus as a clone/semiclone? No new Metroid rep at all? Why?

I just want to know what everyone's reasonings are; I was under the impression that Ridley is never happening.

My expectation is no Metroid character at all. I don't foresee Sakurai changing his stance on the Ridley thing, and Metroid hasn't developed a second character who is significant enough to warrant inclusion in Smash Switch considering no characters were important enough in Smash 4 where some of the options were at least slightly more relevant.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Kingdom Hearts story is still ongoing within spin-off titles, but they are still spin-off titles, fam.

Okay, I get that. And while not a Kingdom Hearts fan, I've never understood why people got so thrown off by those spin off titles, I mean they were still games within the same story.

I guess when Nintendo is known for spinoffs that are completely unrelated to the core mechanics of the series (everything Mario spin off related, Pokemon Spin offs, even Zelda spin offs) it's weird to call Hunters a spin off. But I get that.

As for Ridley, I think he's one of Smash Switch's best hype characters and I really hope Sakurai considers this. There are other hype characters that are more likely though :/

 

[A Distant Demon]

A genuine question for you all, given the criticism of Sylux on my roster.

Do you think Ridley is going to be reconsidered? Maybe Dark Samus as a clone/semiclone? No new Metroid rep at all? Why?

I just want to know what everyone's reasonings are. (I was under the impression that Ridley is never happening in particular.)

Ridley will 100% be considered like he has been before. Whether he is actually made or not is another matter.

Dark Samus will probably stick as an AT and not go anywhere else.

In the end im expecting Ridley or nothing for Metroid. No one else is relevant, popular, important, or fleshed out enough.

 

[MrReyes96]

Dark Samus would make sense, being the only one to have an assist trophy. Plus it would be fitting to have the two sister series have a dark counterpart of their protagonist. But either way people want Ridley and won’t be satisfied until they have him, and maybe this will be the game for it to happen

 

[Morbi]

A genuine question for you all, given the criticism of Sylux on my roster.

Do you think Ridley is going to be reconsidered? Maybe Dark Samus as a clone/semiclone? No new Metroid rep at all? Why?

I just want to know what everyone's reasonings are. (I was under the impression that Ridley is never happening in particular.)

I absolutely believe Ridley will be reconsidered. The ballot was probably a BIG reason; however, the backlash to the inclusion as a stage element might also contribute to his decision to make Ridley happen. Perhaps some mods have given him inspiration? It is irrelevant, honestly, the only important aspect of this discussion is that he has changed his mind before and there are not many marketable characters left. His fan demand is HUGE.

Dark Samus, no fam. No. Her time has passed. Unless she is somehow the relevant figure in Metroid Prime 4, she is going to remain an assist trophy. Again, he could change his mind. But we still have yet to see if Little Mac's upgrade was a rule, or an exception to the rule. So I am not entirely confident of that and if ANY assist trophy is going to get the transition, it is Takamaru.

Again, as I already made clear, Sylux is likely. I do not care about how these people "feel." Facts are facts. He is going to be considered, at least for DLC, if Ridley does not make his playable debut. Simple as that. History has proven bias to be the number one cause of people missing really obvious viable candidates. Time and time again, and yet they never learn. It would be sad if it were not so funny.

 

[StormC]

There is nothing obvious or viable about Sylux. What facts make such a D-lister so likely?

 

[Starcutter]

Th funniest thing about smash speculation imo is that anything could happen.

There are valid arguments for about 30-40 different characters. literally anything could happen in this next game.

 

[Cosmic77]

A genuine question for you all, given the criticism of Sylux on my roster.

Do you think Ridley is going to be reconsidered? Maybe Dark Samus as a clone/semiclone? No new Metroid rep at all? Why?

I just want to know what everyone's reasonings are. (I was under the impression that Ridley is never happening in particular.)

If Sakurai wants to another Metroid character, he's gonna have to reconsider Ridley. As of right now, I don't think he'd be able to get away with adding any other character. Dark Samus's time has passed, and while Sylux definitely has the potential to be considered down the road, we don't even know to what extent he'll be used in Prime 4. Saying he's extremely likely right now is jumping the gun a bit.

 

[Morbi]

There is nothing obvious or viable about Sylux. What facts make such a D-lister so likely?

No point in listing them as your mind is already made up and I have already done so. However, I never really stated that he was obvious per se. Merely that he was a viable choice based on key precedence. He only becomes obvious once Ridley is confirmed to not be playable as far as I am concerned. It is that simple.

Every character is either going to happen, or they are not going to happen. What we have to look at his what could constitute as a reason for or against such an inclusion. The fact of the matter is, there is no reason against including him (other than the fee fees), if, and only if, he does end up playing a relevant part in Metroid Prime 4. Conversely, you could argue there is, in fact, a reason to include him. Therefore, he is more likely than not under the circumstances described. If those conditions are not met, I agree with the sentiment that he has a substantially lower, almost non-existent chance of being included.

The lens I am using is obviously one that is forward. He is a d-lister, at the moment (arguably a c-lister relative to his series, but I digress), that is subject to change and I am open to that possibility. I do not believe it is proper to discount something just because.

 

[ColietheGoalie]

A genuine question for you all, given the criticism of Sylux on my roster.

Do you think Ridley is going to be reconsidered? Maybe Dark Samus as a clone/semiclone? No new Metroid rep at all? Why?

I just want to know what everyone's reasonings are. (I was under the impression that Ridley is never happening in particular.)

Ridley (50% chance) - He’s huge, and the demand is known. I 100% believe he gives him another shot, but whether he can figure it out this time remains to be seen.

Dark Samus (25% chance) - One of the only major, recurring characters who could easily provide a moveset. Was an assist trophy as well. Still, it’s biggest chance would have been in 4, so I find it less likely to happen this time.

Sylux (5% chance) - He’s just not that big yet, and if Dark Samus can’t get in after headlining a trilogy, then cameos and promises won’t be enough to seal the deal for him.

Other (5% chance) - I could see Sakurai pulling a fast one and adding someone totally unexpected. A Metroid Queen? The Baby? Scaled down Mother Brain? He could go for WTF territory, as unlikely as that is.

 

[Pallex]

Please don't bring up skin color my friend at least when it comes to video games....
This has no benefit of explaining her possibility to be in Smash....
Still um... what about the Inklings? Maybe they will have palette swaps where they not only change their ink color but also their skin color.... but still... you know what I mean.

Elma can change her skin color as well.

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[Bowserlick]

I already accepted rumors about Ridley in Smash as fact. What can go wrong?

 

[MasterOfKnees]

I just don't see Sylux happening, at least not for launch. Obviously his presence in future games has been hyped up to no end, but as of this moment he's still a minor character, even within the Metroid franchise, and Prime 4 won't come out in time to change that before Smash 5. Sylux is but a promise at the moment, let's wait until it's fulfilled before talking about his potential inclusion, the only reason he's ever brought up is because fans are desperate for a Metroid inclusion, even if it doesn't make sense.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

I had Crash in my roster instead of Steve for awhile, but I'm not super confident on him. If we got four third parties, I would be extremely likely to include him. That said, I could see him getting in and not Bomberman.

Could I ask why you see Rayman as unlikely? I can understand Steve and Sora, but what about Rayman?

Sylux is an admittedly off-the-wall pick from me. I just think he's more likely than Ridley, but still think Sakurai will want to include another Metroid character. Dark Samus is one I've considered as well.

My roster is actually sorted almost entirely by series debut, and Takamaru's game was made with the Zelda engine in the same year as Zelda, Metroid, and Kid Icarus.

It's not a personal want roster, actually. This is my prediction roster, ie, what I see as the most likely outcome. I'm asking for critiques based on likelihood, not want.


Waluigi is actually a character I considered strongly. He's heavily requested and could easily be the representative of the Mario spinoff titles...however, I don't think he'll make it before Captain Toad, and I'm a little wary of predicting a second Mario character while also predicting two DK characters.

I considered Dark Samus as a clone, actually. The clones I can see happening are Funky, Dixie (though I expect at least a semi-clone from her), Dark Samus, Impa, Isabelle, Tom Nook, Alph, Octolings, and Ribbon Girl.

I compare it to Dr. Mario. He didn't steal a spot from any Mario characters, but was simply a bonus inclusion after the game was finished.

That said, I could see K. Rool in place of Dixie or even alongside her. I just don't think either of those is the most likely outcome.

If we get a Zelda newcomer, then who? Impa? I'd consider it, but I don't really see a strong contender in the series, and I want to add a character on their own merits, on not because of fulfilling representation quotas.

Sheriff is a historical character like Mr. Game and Watch, R.O.B., and Duck Hunt; Takamaru is a retro like Ice Climbers, (Brawl) Pit, and Little Mac (Sakurai treats him as a arcade/famicom character in interviews). I have no reason to believe Sakurai will suddenly stop adding historical characters this time around. Regarding Sheriff's potential, did you read what I put in my reasoning? If so, do you not think a coherent moveset can be made out of what I mentioned? If so, why?

In Smash 4, we got Mega Man, Pac-Man, Ryu, Cloud, and Bayonetta. Even if three were DLC, Smash has been consistently including more and more third parties. How is three third parties unreasonable? (This isn't a sarcastic question, I just genuinely don't understand the reasoning.)

I just don't see any reason why they'd pick Rayman over any other third party series. There's quite a lot of IPs to choose from.

 

[Morbi]

I just don't see any reason why they'd pick Rayman over any other third party series. There's quite a lot of IPs to choose from.

You do not see any reason? Just so that you know, Rayman did appear in Smash for Wii U as a trophy and Nintendo had a partnership with Ubisoft to develop the Rabbids and Mario cross-over. That seems like a pretty decent reason, even if I hate the idea myself.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

That said, we've had inclusions before that were upsetting to fans of particular characters.

Zero Suit Samus instead of Ridley or Dark Samus
Snake before Sonic
Wolf instead of Krystal
Lucario "replacing" Mewtwo
Robin instead of Chrom
Rosalina and Bowser Hr. instead of Toad or Waluigi
Duck Hunt/R.O.B. instead of X
Corrin and Roy as DLC
Greninja before Mewtwo
Wii Fit Trainer in general

There's always fans that are going to get upset. Because they have completely unreasonable and irrational expectations. Especially when it comes to "This character before that character."

 

[Jubileus57]

Oh boy I wouldn't like one bit to have to bear Rayman's godawful design in Smash. I'd hope (rather selfishly I admit) that his abysmal sales in Japan will prevent such a catastrophe to happen.

And yes, I'd MUCH rather have the Rabbids (especially Rabbid Peach). Shoot me.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I remember there being an actually decent amount of support for Anthony Higgs back in the pre-Smash 4 days. I don't see that anymore. I don't know if anybody around here would actually support him, but either way, it's well past his time anyway.

I suspect that Ridley will be reconsidered, but I don't think it's going to go much differently than it did for the last game.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

There's always fans that are going to get upset. Because they have completely unreasonable and irrational expectations. Especially when it comes to "This character before that character."

This brings up an interesting question

When looking at a roster, do people expect every little thing to be perfect, or are certain elements like, say, the clones or third parties just that offensive to them that it undermines everything else the roster has to offer?

 

[Hinata]

I remember there being an actually decent amount of support for Anthony Higgs back in the pre-Smash 4 days. I don't see that anymore. I don't know if anybody around here would actually support him, but either way, it's well past his time anyway.

I suspect that Ridley will be reconsidered, but I don't think it's going to go much differently than it did for the last game.

At this point, I'm almost convinced that Sakurai is blueballing Ridley fans on purpose.

 

[MrReyes96]

I remember there being an actually decent amount of support for Anthony Higgs back in the pre-Smash 4 days. I don't see that anymore. I don't know if anybody around here would actually support him, but either way, it's well past his time anyway.

I suspect that Ridley will be reconsidered, but I don't think it's going to go much differently than it did for the last game.

If he wasn’t there with all the other m represention in smash i’d say his chances are dead

 

[TheLastJinjo]

This brings up an interesting question

When looking at a roster, do people expect every little thing to be perfect, or are certain elements like, say, the clones or third parties just that offensive to them that it undermines everything else the roster has to offer?

Yes. Oh, god, yes.

 

[StormC]

This brings up an interesting question

When looking at a roster, do people expect every little thing to be perfect, or are certain elements like, say, the clones or third parties just that offensive to them that it undermines everything else the roster has to offer?

Personally, outside of Corrin, I don’t think any of the Smash 4 additions are bad choices. It’s just that overall it makes up a roster that feels less exciting than say, the Brawl one.

 

[TumblrFamous]

A genuine question for you all, given the criticism of Sylux on my roster.

Do you think Ridley is going to be reconsidered? Maybe Dark Samus as a clone/semiclone? No new Metroid rep at all? Why?

I just want to know what everyone's reasonings are. (I was under the impression that Ridley is never happening in particular.)

I doubt anything will change. But I could see Sakurai at the very least entertain the idea again. But he seems pretty set on how he views Ridley and his viability. I don't think anything will change.

 

[Morbi]

Oh boy I wouldn't like one bit to have to bear Rayman's godawful design in Smash. I'd hope (rather selfishly I admit) that his abysmal sales in Japan will prevent such a catastrophe to happen.

And yes, I'd MUCH rather have the Rabbids (especially Rabbid Peach). Shoot me.

Rabbids Peach is actually my top pick for a likely 3rd party character, unironically. The only problem is Nintendo does not have the balls to just include only Rabbids Peach. We would be stuck with the lame ones too, or if they did, her personality would be muted.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

A genuine question for you all, given the criticism of Sylux on my roster.

Do you think Ridley is going to be reconsidered? Maybe Dark Samus as a clone/semiclone? No new Metroid rep at all? Why?

I just want to know what everyone's reasonings are. (I was under the impression that Ridley is never happening in particular.)

Only way I can see Ridley making the cut is if we have a new director who has different viewpoints towards the Ridley situation.

As it stands, with Sakurai behind the wheel he's deconfirmed as far as I'm concerned.

 

[MrReyes96]

Only way I can see Ridley making the cut is if we have a new director who has different viewpoints towards the Ridley situation.

As it stands, with Sakurai behind the wheel he's deconfirmed as far as I'm concerned.

You’re right, that’s why villager didn’t make it into smash 4, because he said they wouldn’t work as a character during brawl.

 

[Cosmic77]

Personally, outside of Corrin, I don’t think any of the Smash 4 additions are bad choices. It’s just that overall it makes up a roster that feels less exciting than say, the Brawl one.

Pretty much the same with me. I like the additions we got in Smash 4, but they didn't excite me nearly as much as the ones we got in Brawl.

Granted, that shouldn't come as a shock to me. Brawl added most of the remaining "all-star" Nintendo characters.

 

[Gumzilla]

What if we got the tuxedo Toon Link wore once as an alt?

 

[RodNutTakin]

Oh boy I wouldn't like one bit to have to bear Rayman's godawful design in Smash. I'd hope (rather selfishly I admit) that his abysmal sales in Japan will prevent such a catastrophe to happen.

And yes, I'd MUCH rather have the Rabbids (especially Rabbid Peach). Shoot me.

This but with Crash instead of Rabbid Peach

 

[Jubileus57]

You’re right, that’s why villager didn’t make it into smash 4, because he said they wouldn’t work as a character during brawl.

I think he never said he wouldn't work but rather that he was not a character he saw fit to fight. It is entirely different than the problem with Ridley which if I understand things well is too massive to be functional.

 

[Wyoming]

After E3, going back to the Dojo way of revealing characters would suit me fine. Setting my alarm for 3am as a teen to see what was news (or to go to bed disappointingly to see it was about Widescreen) was such a fun time. The "Warning! Challenge Approaching!" tag before a newcomer revealed was amazing.

Pokemon Trainer in particular shattered a lot of pre-game ideologies. No way would such a character be predicted if it was now, for example.

 

[MrReyes96]

I think he never said he wouldn't work but rather that he was not a character he saw fit to fight. It is entirely different than the problem with Ridley which if I understand things well is too massive to be functional.

I always thought the problem was more about him not fitting in with the rest of the cast, I mean it is harder to see Ridley wearing bunny ears fighting on yoshi’s island but I never understood why they wouldn’t just make him the biggest character and balance him around that.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I remember Sonic was revealed the day after my 22nd birthday for Brawl.

That was a wild thing to wake up to after a night of drinking.

Have you ever gave yourself a hang over headache from being too loud your damn self?

That was me.

 

[Dastardly Ridleylash]

Oh boy I wouldn't like one bit to have to bear Rayman's godawful design in Smash. I'd hope (rather selfishly I admit) that his abysmal sales in Japan will prevent such a catastrophe to happen.

And yes, I'd MUCH rather have the Rabbids (especially Rabbid Peach). Shoot me.

Sakurai added Rayman to Smash 4 as a trophy. He didn't add the Rabbids as a trophy.

And I sincerely doubt one crossover game will suddenly make Sakurai not consider the possibility of Rayman in Smash before adding Rabbids.