Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[AlphaSSB]

whatever Wolf is

"Inspired" or "Derivative" may fit the description.

Although "Whatever Wolf is" does have a nice ring to it.

 

[N3ON]

Who else is there left to add in the current mainstream? Or who else is there left to add who is Iconic and Relevant?

WAAAA

Though he's only relevant if you mean recent. If when you say relevant, you mean relevant, then no, he's not relevant.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

Niche SoV character? The character that was the top FE's second Choose your Legend poll, only behind Hector by a bit if you combine the male and females? Plus, remakes hardly ever do as well as well as a new game would, so thinking it would sell as much as Awakening and Fates is foolish, especially when its a remake of the black sheep of FE. That would be like comparing a remake of Zelda 2 and saying Zelda's not a major IP since it didn't do as well as BotW.

To be fair, the roster was decided a while ago and there's no way CYL2 had any impact when the roster was being created. The roster was probably mostly decided some time before even CYL1 where Celica didn't place well at all. In fact I don't even think her SoV artwork was on the CYL1 website because it hadn't been released yet. CYL1 may have had some impact as a potential late addition to the roster, but even that could have been to late.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

For the love of God, people do not want another FE character and AW isn't on Sakurai's mind anymore.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

In regards to King K. Rool his Melee trophy mentions how he has gained fans over the years, and his Smash for 3DS/Wii U trophy mentions how he's the Bowser of the Donkey Kong series.

So they've acknowledged his importance and popularity if that helps.

 

[Deleted member]

Well, to me...

King K. Rool still counts as one of Nintendo's best and most recurring villains to NOT already be playable in Smash Bros. I'll agree that's debatable (since he actually hasn't "recurred" in a long time...), but the only other one I see that way is Ridley. I'd love to eventually see all the big, all-star villains.

Well...there's also Andross. But I'm fine with Wolf instead of Andross. He might ACTUALLY be too big..

You see, the thing is that people literally just want more villains for the sake of villains despite it not having any significance whatsoever.
I agree that K. Rool is one of Nintendo's recurring villains, and THAT should be the arguement they're using. "We need more villains" doesn't cut it.

Who else is there left to add in the current mainstream? Or who else is there left to add who is Iconic and Relevant?

Bandana Dee.

 

[Camc10]

Good ol' time constraints. Angering FE fans in both Smash AND Fire Emblem one step at a time.

FEW didn't have time constraints as far as i know. Clones were completely on purpose.

 

[masterluigi1]

Not the point I was arguing.
My point was that franchises don't "need" more reps for the sake of increasing numbers.

I can only agree with that if the series in question doesn't have many relevant fighters that FIT in smash. But if the series has plenty of relevant characters that do fit in than the need "rep" argument is still pretty valid if series have or are gaining popularity.

For example... there is an obvious reason why mario or pokemon has and NEEDs to have more reps than a series like earthbound or f zero.

 

[Amazon Pandora]

Thanks for the link, but I didn't see the quote as I remembered it after a quick skim.

I probably misremembered it. Oh well. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Late but, I think you were thinking of this interview and not the warriors one.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

Mainstream characters?
HELLO I'M THIS YOUNG GENERATION'S JIGGLYPUFF

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Who else is there left to add in the current mainstream? Or who else is there left to add who is Iconic and Relevant?

Iconic and relevant? Well, those are vague terms depend on who you're asking. I'm going to interpret it as characters that have had notable roles in the past 5 years and more popular than most Nintendo characters.

This would include

• Captain Toad
• Isabelle
• Dixie Kong
• Cranky Kong
• Inkling
  
• Rhythm Heaven

(Post 2016)

• Rex & Pyra
• Spring Man
• Ribbon Girl
• Pauline

 

[Deleted member]

I can only agree with that if the series in question doesn't have many relevant fighters that FIT in smash. But if the series has plenty of relevant characters that do fit in than the need "rep" argument is still pretty valid if series have or are gaining popularity.

For example... there is an obvious reason why mario or pokemon has and NEEDs to have more reps than a series like earthbound or f zero.

I don't think "need" is a good arguement though. Nothing is "needed".

 

[Camc10]

WAAAA

Though he's only relevant if you mean recent. If when you say relevant, you mean relevant, then no, he's not relevant.

I do mean relevant in this case. But im mostly just asking cause it feels like Smash Popularity is the only thing that should matter know when it comes to adding characters.

 

[Ura]

In regards to King K. Rool his Melee trophy mentions how he has gained fans over the years, and his Smash for 3DS/Wii U trophy mentions how he's the Bowser of the Donkey Kong series.

So they've acknowledged his importance and popularity if that helps.

Yeah. Some people try to argue he has no relevance anymore but that straight up disproves it.

AW isn't on Sakurai's mind anymore.

Wasn't even arguing that but whatever.

 

[Danpal65]

I just thought if something. If pyrosphere returns as a stage then we'll have to confirm that Ridley isn't playable.

Possibly, but also possibly not. The stage could return but without Ridley as a stage boss and instead just have hazards (would probably need to be a bit smaller as well then), or, the Ridley that would be playable would be different to the one on Pyrosphere, as that was Other M Ridley who was a clone and not the original.

Honestly I do not think Pyrosphere will return regardless as it was not exactly the best stage, plenty of other Metroid stages are fun (Brinstar, Brinstar Depths, Frigate Orpheon, etc.).

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Late but, I think you were thinking of this interview and not the warriors one.

Thanks, nice to know I'm not losing my marbles yet.

Gonna save this for future reference.

 

[Opossum]

For the love of God, people do not want another FE character and AW isn't on Sakurai's mind anymore.

Protip: You don't speak for everyone, so don't pretend to.

#1 was supposed to be the fact that people mispell AW and you took it seriously so that's on you.

#2 FE fatigue is a very real thing and was even addressed by Sakurai himself in his Famitsu article. Don't go throwing around things like close circles because that's a friggin copout. I see this sentiment just about everywhere outside Smashboards. Nintendo can say all the things they want but the sales units for the game says otherwise in comparison to it's predecessors While it doesn't eliminate the possibility of additional FE characters (the FE16 example as I mentioned before), it sure as hell would warrant some niche FE game not needing to continue the overrepresntation of the franchise

#3 Still no excuse from the supposed "major Nintendo IP". He brought it up so I threw it right back. Plain and simple.


They might as well be because said game is a remake. Why a small part of the franchise deserves representation is beyond me.

Zelda remakes pull in units in the millions. Bad comparisons.

Being popular within the FE fanbase doesn't warrant inclusion.

That's where your issue is: it isn't A small part of the franchise anymore.

And don't become to Andy what "he who shall not be named because the mods will yell at me" is to Daisy.

 

[Fenriraga]

That brings up a good point actually. We haven't really talked Stages much. Any stages you guys want to see in?

 

[Arklos]

To be fair, the roster was decided a while ago and there's no way CYL2 had any impact when the roster was being created. The roster was probably mostly decided some time before even CYL1 where Celica didn't place well at all. In fact I don't even think her SoV artwork was on the CYL1 website because it hadn't been released yet. CYL1 may have had some impact as a potential late addition to the roster, but even that could have been to late.

Oh don't get me wrong, I was more arguing against Ura calling her a niche character than saying that it's a reason that she should/could be included.

 

[?????????????]

That brings up a good point actually. We haven't really talked Stages much. Any stages you guys want to see in?

Snake Park.

 

[Deleted member]

That brings up a good point actually. We haven't really talked Stages much. Any stages you guys want to see in?

Ultra Space with summons.

 

[Camc10]

Iconic and relevant? Well, those are vague terms depend on who you're asking. I'm going to interpret it as characters that have had notable roles in the past 5 years and more popular than most Nintendo characters.

This would include

• Captain Toad
• Isabelle
• Dixie Kong
• Cranky Kong
• Inkling
  
• Rhythm Heaven

(Post 2016)

• Rex & Pyra
• Spring Man
• Ribbon Girl
• Pauline

I would not separate Spring Man and Ribbon Girl nor the Kong. But on my point. This list looks like a good list of newcomers, but it doesn't look like enough honestly.

 

[Danpal65]

That brings up a good point actually. We haven't really talked Stages much. Any stages you guys want to see in?

I'd like to see the OG Pokémon Stadium from Melee and Saffron City from 64 return. Definitely Fountain of Dreams as well. I would say Miiverse as I loved all the goof pictures in the background as you played, but unfortunately that just is not possible anymore...

I would like a new stage based on Xenoblade Chronicles 2 as well, maybe Gormott or the Argentum Trade Guild or something?

 

[N3ON]

That brings up a good point actually. We haven't really talked Stages much. Any stages you guys want to see in?

Magicant and Corneria. And Temple. And Saffron City. Uhhh.

And some new ones if there's time I guess.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

I would like to see the Altar of the Sunne/Moone from Pokemon Gen 7 games. Could be a situation like the Boxing Ring where holding down a button changes which altar it is. Or it could be random, doesn't really matter as it would just be cosmetic.
I'd prefer it had no stage hazards, but as I believe that's unreasonable thinking for a smash game, Ultra Beasts could come out of the Ultra Wormhole and interact with the stage. Could be a good alternative to making a Beat Ball item.

 

[T-Hell]

That brings up a good point actually. We haven't really talked Stages much. Any stages you guys want to see in?

As long as I get Hyrule Temple back once again with that beautiful music track, I'm served.

 

[JamesDNaux]

That brings up a good point actually. We haven't really talked Stages much. Any stages you guys want to see in?

The only stage I need in my life is Fountain of Dreams.

Though a DK stage that isn't another jungle would be nice.

 

[Fenriraga]

I'd personally like a Golden Sun stage, even is Isaac himself doesn't make the cut. Golden Sun has such a vibrant and interesting world that is begging to be shown in HD at least once in its lifetime.

 

[?????????????]

They should just eventually add back every "veteran stage" through DLC.

 

[Opossum]

FEW didn't have time constraints as far as i know. Clones were completely on purpose.

Some of them, yes. But Celica, Lyn, and Lucina in particular were on record as having been added late in development.

That brings up a good point actually. We haven't really talked Stages much. Any stages you guys want to see in?

Bowser's Castle
New Donk City
Iki Town
Ultra Space
Duma Tower
Outrealm Gate (a neat way to get several Fire Emblem locales in one stage)
Gluglug Lagoon (Legendary Starfy)
The Lady Liberty (Code Name: S.T.E.A.M.)
A Punch-Out!! Stage based on the NYC jogging route
N. Sanity Beach

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

That brings up a good point actually. We haven't really talked Stages much. Any stages you guys want to see in?

Fountain of Dreams, please.

As for new stages? I've got nothing

 

[Ura]

Protip: You don't speak for everyone, so don't pretend to.

That's where your issue is: it isn't A small part of the franchise anymore.

It is. In comparison to the rest it's pretty damn small considering even other entries in it's own series have better sales figures.

Whichever way you slice it, FE2/FE15 whatever ever you'd like to call it would be a mistake with the current state of it's roster.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

They should just eventually add back every "veteran stage" as DLC.

Oh lord lmao. I get wanting all the characters back because of the whole "each character has their own very dedicated fans" thing, but to get all the stages, we'd truly have an "Include everything from every Smash game ever" sort of scenario building up.

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

Protip: You don't speak for everyone, so don't pretend to.

That's where your issue is: it isn't A small part of the franchise anymore.

And don't become to Andy what "he who shall not be named because the mods will yell at me" is to Daisy.

"People" doesn't mean everyone.

 

[Danpal65]

As for new stages? I've got nothing

I never considered a stage that was purely a white backdrop, I can imagine some fun green-screen stuff happening with that

 

[Ura]

I'd personally like a Golden Sun stage, even is Isaac himself doesn't make the cut. Golden Sun has such a vibrant and interesting world that is begging to be shown in HD at least once in its lifetime.

Yeah i'd love to see Venus Lighthouse or even a stage that incorporates all 4 lighthouses similar to Unova PKMN League and Paper Mario.

 

[AreJay25]

I'd like a Sonic stage that isn't Green Hill or a derivative of Green Hill.

I say this fully knowing the latest two Sonic games had Green Hill.

 

[AlphaSSB]

That brings up a good point actually. We haven't really talked Stages much. Any stages you guys want to see in?

Odyssey Kingdom Tour, Hyrule Wilds, Phendrana Drifts, Thorntail Hollow, and Alola Islands.

Although I had an idea for a successor to Poke Floats, called Nintendo Floats. Same premise, but replace the Pokemon floats with Nintendo hardware. Start with the logo as a spawn platform, then move through Nintendo's hardware history, ending with the Switch or LABO stuff before returning to the logo.

 

[Fastblade5035]

That brings up a good point actually. We haven't really talked Stages much. Any stages you guys want to see in?

Duma Tower from Shadows of Valentia to replace Castle Siege. Starts outside the tower, then inside with Terrors in the mix, and finally the final map itself with Duma in the background.
(Please any way to get this into smash sakurai https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=u55JMw5bRiI )

That, and the Opera House from Fates. Fighting on boats with Azura performing in the background

 

[Fenriraga]

Some of them, yes. But Celica, Lyn, and Lucina in particular were on record as having been added late in development.

New Donk City
The Lady Liberty (Code Name: S.T.E.A.M.)
A Punch-Out!! Stage based on the NYC jogging route

Man, that list kinda makes me wish Smash would pull a Playstation All-Stars and cross over stage elements. Imagine fighting in New Donk/New York, then suddenly the Aliens from Codename S.T.E.A.M. drop out of the sky and The Lady Liberty shows up in the background to fight them off.

Obviously it's modern-ish NY and not 1860's NY, but still.