Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Al-kīmiyā']

Metroid 1986 has Ridley jumping up and down for the entirety of the battle.

Metroid Prime has Ridley landing after he is shot down from the air.

Metroid: Zero Mission has Mecha Ridley, who does not even jump.

Metroid Prime 3 first has Ridley falling down the shaft, possibly fighting without flying. The second battle had me about to change my mind, until he gets seriously wounded and then starts flying through holes in and out of the room with seemingly no need to land.

Metroid: Other M has Ridley either being shot down or landing inexplicably.

Metroid: Samus Returns has Ridley landing after taking enough damage, but then he flies again. Then he lands again after taking damage and the Metroid attacking him.

It seems like in most of his battles, Ridley only stops flying when he is shot down, or he just feels like landing. Is he getting tired? Who knows? I am not a big fan of the character, so I don't really know what his supporters want from him. It just seems to me that flying is a big part of his repertoire.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

The CPU racers in Mario Kart 64 can be very unfair with their rubberbanding. At least the rubberbanding has been far less severe in the later Mario Kart titles, but instead of CPUs who receive unfair speed advantages, you have to instead watch out for item assaults from Red Shells, Spiny Shells, and even Lightning.

And speaking of Red Shells, they probably deserve a comeback after being absent from two Smash Bros. installments in a row.

Yes, I miss the Red Shells. They made the game a lot of fun, especially if you want to watch some random fights too(nothing but Fox on Hyrule Castle with Red Shells is hilariously silly).

That said, the rubberbanding is still easier to deal with than immense item spam. You can still easily get around one, while the other is pretty much locked on to you. Lessening the rubberbanding is nice, but not when an even worse thing to deal with exists.

 

[Cosmic77]

Metroid 1986 has Ridley jumping up and down for the entirety of the battle.

Metroid Prime has Ridley landing after he is shot down from the air.

Metroid: Zero Mission has Mecha Ridley, who does not even jump.

Metroid Prime 3 first has Ridley falling down the shaft, possibly fighting without flying. The second battle had me about to change my mind, until he gets seriously wounded and then starts flying through holes in and out of the room with seemingly no need to land.

Metroid: Other M has Ridley either being shot down or landing inexplicably.

Metroid: Samus Returns has Ridley landing after taking enough damage, but then he flies again. Then he lands again after taking damage and the Metroid attacking him.

It seems like in most of his battles, Ridley only stops flying when he is shot down, or he just feels like landing. Is he getting tired? Who knows? I am not a big fan of the character, so I don't really know what his supporters want from him. It just seems to me that flying is a big part of his repertoire.

Being a Flying type, Charizard should probably have more mobility in the air and a better recovery. However, because of his weight and size, this would be very hard to do without making him incredibly OP.

Same thing with Ridley here. If you're going to add a heavyweight character who's hard to launch off the stage, the best way you can compensate for this is by giving them mediocre or limited recovery options. Even with his wings, giving Ridley a lot of mobility would be difficult to implement without making him very unbalanced.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

One thing to say about Ridley's tail. It's actually something that appears often in fights and its length is kind of key. He uses it to do basically a pogo stick downstab during one boss fight. It still needs to have some range to work. Of course, it not having a hit or hurtbox while you're idly(not using an attack with it) is reasonable. However, fixing up the wings' size is significantly more difficult in comparison. But as noted above, you can't just give him high recovery without actual downsides. He needs to have limitations to it. Like having super low defense while in flight, like the opposite of Yoshi's super armor while doing his second jump(well, not necessarily an extremely low defense, but lower) if the recovery is going to be really dang good. Especially if we're talking about having lots of power and range. Even with a lot of weight, a long/high recovery needs a reasonable downside.

This comes into what I said earlier; just making a moveset is easy. Making it flow is the kicker.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

And speaking of Red Shells, they probably deserve a comeback after being absent from two Smash Bros. installments in a row.

It always annoyed me how Green Shells were called Green Shells in Smash when Red Shells were still absent. And Spiny Shells only made the problem worse.

That said, they REALLY need to be fixed so they don't hit the player who threw em. In Melee I normally find myself turning this item off because it's too much of a hassle to deal with.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

Being a Flying type, Charizard should probably have more mobility in the air and a better recovery. However, because of his weight and size, this would be very hard to do without making him incredibly OP.

Same thing with Ridley here. If you're going to add a heavyweight character who's hard to launch off the stage, the best way you can compensate for this is by giving them mediocre or limited recovery options. Even with his wings, giving Ridley a lot of mobility would be difficult to implement without making him very unbalanced.

I've addressed this before. There's no in-universe reason to assume that a pokemon being a flying type entails that it can fly indefinitely. It would make sense, but just going off of the games, it's not necessarily true, particularly in light of the fact that flying pokemon don't just fly out of reach unless you teach them Fly.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I've addressed this before. There's no in-universe reason to assume that a pokemon being a flying type entails that it can fly indefinitely. It would make sense, but just going off of the games, it's not necessarily true, particularly in light of the fact that flying pokemon don't just fly out of reach unless you teach them Fly.

That's not what he was arguing though. Just that Charizard should have better mobility due to being a flying type. But doesn't for balance reasons. He never even mentioned indefinite flight.

 

[Bowserlick]

Ridley's wings can either:
• Be contained on the Z-axis unless attacking with them
• Not contain hurt-boxes unless attacking with them
• Take damage, but not knockback

Up B is Fly mode. Ridley only has one jump and walks on all fours when grounded. Fly Mode shoots him up in the air and gives him better air mobility and acceleration, but also less weight. He also gains a fixed amount of jumps (3-4). He does not regain his Up B unless he hits the ground.

His projectiles in the air are angled downward. They do very little knockback and less damage when used in the air. However, they cause splash damage and become stronger when they impact the ground.

Ridley would be an air-to-ground fighter. He would be slow and cumbersome on the ground like Bowser in his first two appearances.

 

[Krysco]

One thing to say about Ridley's tail. It's actually something that appears often in fights and its length is kind of key. He uses it to do basically a pogo stick downstab during one boss fight. It still needs to have some range to work. Of course, it not having a hit or hurtbox while you're idly(not using an attack with it) is reasonable. However, fixing up the wings' size is significantly more difficult in comparison. But as noted above, you can't just give him high recovery without actual downsides. He needs to have limitations to it. Like having super low defense while in flight, like the opposite of Yoshi's super armor while doing his second jump(well, not necessarily an extremely low defense, but lower) if the recovery is going to be really dang good. Especially if we're talking about having lots of power and range. Even with a lot of weight, a long/high recovery needs a reasonable downside.

This comes into what I said earlier; just making a moveset is easy. Making it flow is the kicker.

Sm4sh in general has really good recoveries due to low fall speeds, high air speeds and generous distance on recovery moves. That being said, the heavyweights do for the most part have more poor recoveries compared to the rest of the cast. One big exception is King Dedede who has numerous jumps, is hard to knock off stage or outright KO and his Super Dedede Jump isn't bad at all for distance. The downsides being that his air speed is the worst in the game, his jumps are all very low and he lacks a hitbox on his up special until it's going down and at that point, he can't grab the ledge. He does have super armor on it though. Dedede also has decent power and range on stage. I only say decent because some of his moves have awful hitboxes like his bair and then moves like fair and ftilt are actually rather weak.

That all being said, I can see Ridley's wings and tail becoming big, vulnerable targets while he's airborne to offset his potentially good recovery. I could also be wrong on this but I believe Mewtwo's tail keeps it's hurtbox during attacks and it gets put into the x axis during attacks too. So for example, while Mewtwo's tail isn't a big target on 3D stages if he's airborne, if he uses bair or uair, he puts his tail at risk of being hit especially since his aerials can't clank. Ridley could get a very similar situation if his wings and tail are kept in the z axis while airborne. He'd likely have poor air speed too. I'm pretty sure every character with multiple jumps has poor air speed except for Jigglypuff since she was designed to be an ultimate air fighter of sorts.

 

[Cosmic77]

Here's a challenge for everyone. Try to add one newcomer (or cut veteran) to each of the 27 franchises currently in Smash. You can add whoever you want and it doesn't have to be someone likely to get in. The only rule is that is that the character you choose has to be from a game that's already released. You can't just say "Pokémon from Gen VIII" or "Fire Emblem Switch character".


Here's mine:

Super Mario: Pauline
Donkey Kong: Dixie Kong
Legend of Zelda: Mipha
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandana Dee
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokémon: Lycanroc
F-Zero: Black Falcon
EarthBound: Ninten
Fire Emblem: Lyn
Game & Watch: Chef
Kid Icarus: Medusa
WarioWare: Ashley
Pikmin: Alph
Famicom: Diskun
Animal Crossing: Isabelle
Wii Fit: Wii Fit Board
Punch-Out!!: King Hippo
Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex & Pyra
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): Wild Gunman
Sonic: Tails
Mega Man: Zero
Pac-Man: Ghosts
Street Fighter: Ken
Final Fantasy: Black Mage
Bayonetta: Jeanne

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

Here's a challenge for everyone. Try to add one newcomer to each of the 27 franchises currently in Smash. You can add whoever you want and it doesn't have to be someone likely to get in. The only rule is that is that the character you choose has to be from a game that's already released. You can't just say "Pokémon from Gen VIII" or "Fire Emblem Switch character".


Here's mine:

Super Mario: Pauline
Donkey Kong: Dixie Kong
Legend of Zelda: Mipha
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandana Dee
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokémon: Lycanroc
F-Zero: Black Falcon
EarthBound: Ninten
Fire Emblem: Lyn
Game & Watch: Chef
Kid Icarus: Medusa
WarioWare: Ashley
Pikmin: Alph
Famicom: Diskun
Animal Crossing: Isabelle
Wii Fit: Wii Fit Board
Punch-Out!!: King Hippo
Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex & Pyra
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): Wild Gunman
Sonic: Tails
Mega Man: Zero
Pac-Man: Ghosts
Street Fighter: Ken
Final Fantasy: Black Mage
Bayonetta: Jeanne

OK lemme try:

Mario: Petey Piranha
Donkey Kong: King K. Rool
The Legend of Zelda: Mipha
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandanna Dee
Star Fox: Leon Powalski
Pokemon: Pheromosa
F-Zero: Samurai Goroh
Mother: Kumatora
Fire Emblem: Micaiah
Game & Watch: Chef
Wario: Captain Syrup
Kid Icarus: Viridi
Pikmin: Alph. If he's not allowed, Louie.
R.O.B.: Professor Hector
Animal Crossing: Isabelle
Wii Fit: Wii Fit Balance Board
Punch-Out!!: Soda Popinski
Xenoblade: Rex & Pyra
Duck Hunt: Gumshoe from Hogan's Alley.
Sonic: Cream
Mega Man: Roll
PAC-MAN: MRS. PAC-MAN
Street Fighter: Chun-Li
FINAL FANTASY: Warriors of Light. If spin-offs of the series are to be counted, then Agnes Oblige from the Bravely series.
Bayonetta: Jeanne

 

[TheLastJinjo]

I really don't get why people are still classifying Pauline as a Mario character. She appeared in literally one Mario game in a level where she was surrounded by references to Donkey Kong & Donkey Kong Country.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Here's a challenge for everyone. Try to add one newcomer (or cut veteran) to each of the 27 franchises currently in Smash. You can add whoever you want and it doesn't have to be someone likely to get in. The only rule is that is that the character you choose has to be from a game that's already released. You can't just say "Pokémon from Gen VIII" or "Fire Emblem Switch character".


Here's mine:

Super Mario: Pauline
Donkey Kong: Dixie Kong
Legend of Zelda: Mipha
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandana Dee
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokémon: Lycanroc
F-Zero: Black Falcon
EarthBound: Ninten
Fire Emblem: Lyn
Game & Watch: Chef
Kid Icarus: Medusa
WarioWare: Ashley
Pikmin: Alph
Famicom: Diskun
Animal Crossing: Isabelle
Wii Fit: Wii Fit Board
Punch-Out!!: King Hippo
Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex & Pyra
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): Wild Gunman
Sonic: Tails
Mega Man: Zero
Pac-Man: Ghosts
Street Fighter: Ken
Final Fantasy: Black Mage
Bayonetta: Jeanne

There's no way I can think of ones for every single franchise. Also, I'm not going to try and group ones together, but keep it to the clear franchise. This means that Duck Hunt is more or less impossible without stretching it to another franchise. And Cloud was intentionally a representation of FFVII only. Anyway.

Super Mario: Paper Mario
Donkey Kong: King K. Rool
The Legend of Zelda: Tingle
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandanna Waddle Dee
F-Zero: Samurai Goroh
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokemon: Deoxys
EarthBound/Mother: Porky
Fire Emblem: Hector
WarioWare/Land: Ashley
Animal Crossing: Resetti
Punch-Out!!: King Hippo
Xenoblade: Rex & Pyro(I know too little to say otherwise)
Kid Icarus: Medusa
Metal Gear: Raiden
Sonic the Hedgehog: Shadow
Mega Man: Proto Man
Pac-Man: Ms. Pac-Man
Street Fighter: Akuma

If I didn't add one for franchises(like Pikmin), I believe it wouldn't really make much sense to add them. I can't think of anyone highly unique for Pikmin that has something other than being pretty much exactly the same as Olimar, due to a lack of actual unique Pikmin to give to Alph(who I would otherwise choose. Rock Pikmin and Bulbmin do exist, but we kind of need at least 3 more to remotely feel different. For that matter, Rock Pikmin are fairly similar to Purple Pikmin to the point that they could be a model swap like Alph is and still represent him just as well as the alt does. I will say, though, not using Alph's ship for the Final Smash was kind of lame).

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

I really don't get why people are still classifying Pauline as a Mario character. She appeared in literally one Mario game in a level where she was surrounded by references to Donkey Kong & Donkey Kong Country.

I personally don't care enough for Pauline to care if she's repped under the Mario or Donkey Kong series, though I will say her trophy is listed under the Donkey Kong series in Smash 4.

And no, don't bring up Wario's trophy in Melee. That was before the Wario series was an established universe in Smash. Completely different case.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I personally don't care enough for Pauline to care if she's repped under the Mario or Donkey Kong series, though I will say her trophy is listed under the Donkey Kong series in Smash 4.

And no, don't bring up Wario's trophy in Melee. That was before the Wario series was an established universe in Smash. Completely different case.

For that matter, she could be either and it works. She was still a damsel to be rescued by Mario canonically, reappears in actual Mario games since Donkey Kong(Arcade) itself. It's not a big deal either way. I do think she's likely to be under the DK moniker anyway, but it's not that big of a deal. I mean, she's not exactly the most likely playable character to come along either(she has lots of potential, at least).

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

That's not what he was arguing though. Just that Charizard should have better mobility due to being a flying type. But doesn't for balance reasons. He never even mentioned indefinite flight.

I'm not familiar with Sm4sh Charizard, but in PM, he has good mobility in the air.

 

[Troykv]

Here's a challenge for everyone. Try to add one newcomer (or cut veteran) to each of the 27 franchises currently in Smash. You can add whoever you want and it doesn't have to be someone likely to get in. The only rule is that is that the character you choose has to be from a game that's already released. You can't just say "Pokémon from Gen VIII" or "Fire Emblem Switch character".


Here's mine:

Super Mario: Pauline
Donkey Kong: Dixie Kong
Legend of Zelda: Mipha
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandana Dee
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokémon: Lycanroc
F-Zero: Black Falcon
EarthBound: Ninten
Fire Emblem: Lyn
Game & Watch: Chef
Kid Icarus: Medusa
WarioWare: Ashley
Pikmin: Alph
Famicom: Diskun
Animal Crossing: Isabelle
Wii Fit: Wii Fit Board
Punch-Out!!: King Hippo
Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex & Pyra
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): Wild Gunman
Sonic: Tails
Mega Man: Zero
Pac-Man: Ghosts
Street Fighter: Ken
Final Fantasy: Black Mage
Bayonetta: Jeanne

Hmm...

Super Mario: Waluigi/Pauline
Donkey Kong: King K. Rool
Legend of Zelda: ???
Metroid: Omega Metroid (or any kind of representation of them)/Ridley
Yoshi: Namek
Kirby: Bandana Dee/Adeleine
Star Fox: ???
Pokemon: Decidueye
F-Zero: Black Shadow (that Wakamoto voice)
Earthbound: ???
Fire Emblem: Micaiah
Game & Watch: ???
Kid Icarus: Medusa
WarioWare: Ashley
Pikmin/Famicom/AnimalCrossing/WiiFit/PunchOut: ???
Xenoblade: I guess Rex & Pyra would be interesting.
Duck Hunt: Eh?
Sonic/Megaman: I don't have any choice in particular, this is weird for me xDU
Pac-Man: No
Street Fighter: Many good choices, it's hard to decide.
Final Fantasy: I need to play more FF to know who would be my favorites characters.
Bayonetta: I guess Jeanne?

 

[Deleted member]

Here's a challenge for everyone. Try to add one newcomer (or cut veteran) to each of the 27 franchises currently in Smash. You can add whoever you want and it doesn't have to be someone likely to get in. The only rule is that is that the character you choose has to be from a game that's already released. You can't just say "Pokémon from Gen VIII" or "Fire Emblem Switch character".


Here's mine:

Super Mario: Pauline
Donkey Kong: Dixie Kong
Legend of Zelda: Mipha
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandana Dee
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokémon: Lycanroc
F-Zero: Black Falcon
EarthBound: Ninten
Fire Emblem: Lyn
Game & Watch: Chef
Kid Icarus: Medusa
WarioWare: Ashley
Pikmin: Alph
Famicom: Diskun
Animal Crossing: Isabelle
Wii Fit: Wii Fit Board
Punch-Out!!: King Hippo
Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex & Pyra
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): Wild Gunman
Sonic: Tails
Mega Man: Zero
Pac-Man: Ghosts
Street Fighter: Ken
Final Fantasy: Black Mage
Bayonetta: Jeanne

Mario: Waluigi
Donkey Kong: King K. Rool (Dixie is cool as well tho)
Legend of Zelda: Skull Kid
Metroid: Sylux
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandana Dee
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokemon: Decidueye
F-Zero: Samurai Goroh
Earthbound: Jeff
Fire Emblem: Takumi (Waiting for the next interesting FE character to show up, going with personal bias for now)
Game & Watch: no
Kid Icarus: Viridi
Warioware: Ashley
Pikmin: Alph
Famicom: Takamaru
Animal Crossing: Tom Nook
Wii Fit: no
Punch-Out: Bald Bull
Xenoblade: Rex
Duck Hunt: no
Sonic: Eggman
Mega Man: Zero
Pac-Man: ...no
Street Fighter: Guile
Final Fantasy: Black Mage
Bayonetta: I don't know any of them
Golden Sun: Isaac

I don't know much about most franchises in Smash so I was kinda grasping at straws on some of them

\(°|°)/

 

[Zem-raj]

Okay

Super Mario: Fawful
Donkey Kong: King K. Rool
Legend of Zelda: Skull Kid
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandana Dee
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokémon: Decidueye
F-Zero: Samurai Goroh
EarthBound: Porky Minch
Fire Emblem: Chrom
Game & Watch: N/A
Kid Icarus: Medusa
WarioWare: Ashley
Pikmin: N/A
Famicom: Ayumi Tachibana
Animal Crossing: Isabelle
Wii Fit: N/A
Punch-Out!!: King Hippo
Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex & Pyra
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): N/A
Sonic: Eggman
Mega Man: Zero
Pac-Man: N/A (I'd rather a character from another IP from Bandai Namco)
Street Fighter: M. Bison
Final Fantasy: Black Mage
Bayonetta: N/A
Metal Gear: Snake

 

[GolisoPower]

Here's a challenge for everyone. Try to add one newcomer (or cut veteran) to each of the 27 franchises currently in Smash. You can add whoever you want and it doesn't have to be someone likely to get in. The only rule is that is that the character you choose has to be from a game that's already released. You can't just say "Pokémon from Gen VIII" or "Fire Emblem Switch character".


Here's mine:

Super Mario: Pauline
Donkey Kong: Dixie Kong
Legend of Zelda: Mipha
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandana Dee
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokémon: Lycanroc
F-Zero: Black Falcon
EarthBound: Ninten
Fire Emblem: Lyn
Game & Watch: Chef
Kid Icarus: Medusa
WarioWare: Ashley
Pikmin: Alph
Famicom: Diskun
Animal Crossing: Isabelle
Wii Fit: Wii Fit Board
Punch-Out!!: King Hippo
Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex & Pyra
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): Wild Gunman
Sonic: Tails
Mega Man: Zero
Pac-Man: Ghosts
Street Fighter: Ken
Final Fantasy: Black Mage
Bayonetta: Jeanne

I'll give it a shot:

Super Mario: Daisy
Donkey Kong: Dixie Kong
Legend of Zelda: Impa
Metroid: Sylux
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandana Dee
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokemon: Buzzwole
F-Zero: Samurai Goroh
Earthbound: Ninten
Fire Emblem: Caeda
Game & Watch: Chef
Wario: Ashley
Pikmin: Alph
Famicom: Professor Hector
Animal Crossing: Resetti
Wii Fit: Wii Fit Board
Punch-Out!!: Mr. Sandman
Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex and Pyra/Mythra
Light Gun Games: Cardboard Criminal (Hogan's Alley)
Sonic: Eggman
Mega Man: Proto Man
Pac-Man: Ms. Pac-Man
Street Fighter: Akuma
Final Fantasy: Noctis Lucis Caelum
Bayonetta: Rodin

 

[Cosmic77]

I really don't get why people are still classifying Pauline as a Mario character. She appeared in literally one Mario game in a level where she was surrounded by references to Donkey Kong & Donkey Kong Country.

The reason I listed Pauline as a Mario character is because she's never appeared in a video game where Mario (or Mini Mario) wasn't the playable protagonist. Because Donkey Kong (arcade game) marks the beginning of both franchises and isn't tied down to just one, and because Pauline hasn't appeared in a strictly DK game, I feel like the Mario series has more going for her at the moment. Especially if she begins making regular appearances in Mario spin-off games.

Aside from Smash choosing to list her with DK characters, I can't really think of any other reason why she'd be recognized as a Donkey Kong character over a Mario character.

 

[Luminario]

Here's a challenge for everyone. Try to add one newcomer to each of the 27 franchises currently in Smash. You can add whoever you want and it doesn't have to be someone likely to get in. The only rule is that is that the character you choose has to be from a game that's already released. You can't just say "Pokémon from Gen VIII" or "Fire Emblem Switch character".

This looks fun

Super Mario: Pauline
Donkey Kong: Dixie Kong
Legend of Zelda: Mipha
Metroid: Mother Brain
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Adeleine
Star Fox: Krystal
Pokémon: Mimikyu
F-Zero: Black Shadow
EarthBound: Kumatora
Fire Emblem: Anna
Game & Watch: Balloon Fight
Kid Icarus: Viridi
WarioWare: Ashley
Pikmin: Just winged Pikmin on their own
Famicom: Birdo (Doki Doki Panic was apparently released on the Famicom, so it works)
Animal Crossing: Isabelle
Wii Fit: Wii U Fit Trainer, based more heavily on the minigames as opposed to yoga poses.
Punch-Out!!: Punch Out Peach (based on that rumour she was going to be a fighter) If that doesn't work, Punch Out DK
Xenoblade Chronicles: Fiora
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): Hogan's Alley
Sonic: Amy
Mega Man: Roll
Pac-Man: Ghosts
Street Fighter: Chun Li
Final Fantasy: Terra
Bayonetta: Jeanne

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Aside from Smash choosing to list her with DK characters, I can't really think of any other reason why she'd be recognized as a Donkey Kong character over Mario.

So aside from Smash recognizing her as a Donkey Kong character, you can't think of why Smash would recognize her as a Donkey Kong character.

Okay.

 

[Tailisu10]

I just chose franchises with characters that interest me personally.
Super Mario: Paper Mario
Legend of Zelda: Skull Kid
Pokémon: Starmie
EarthBound: Masked Man
Kid Icarus: Medusa
WarioWare: Ashley
Pikmin: Plasm Wraith
Animal Crossing: Isabelle
Xenoblade Chronicles: Melia
Sonic: Shadow
Mega Man: Megaman.Exe
Street Fighter: Juri
Final Fantasy: Terra
Bayonetta: Jeanne

 

[Cosmic77]

Wow. I didn't expect to get so many replies so quickly. It took me forever to make mine (although, choosing a different colored text for each character probably ate up more time than I thought).

So aside from Smash recognizing her as a Donkey Kong character, you can't think of why Smash would recognize her as a Donkey Kong character.

Okay.

I was talking about Nintendo as a whole recognizing Pauline as a Mario character, not just Smash.


And Smash is terrible at staying canon anyway. We're talking about the same franchise that referenced the Pokémon anime in two of it's trophies.

 

[Deleted member]

I have a good solution for the Pauline problem. Here me out!

Spoiler

Probably gonna get infracted for that but I don't care it's ****ing worth it

\(°|°)/

 

[Cosmic77]

I have a good solution for the Pauline problem. Here me out!

Spoiler

Probably gonna get infracted for that but I don't care it's ****ing worth it

\(°|°)/

I'll give you a pass because I genuinely thought that was funny.

 

[Deleted member]

Here's a challenge for everyone. Try to add one newcomer (or cut veteran) to each of the 27 franchises currently in Smash. You can add whoever you want and it doesn't have to be someone likely to get in. The only rule is that is that the character you choose has to be from a game that's already released. You can't just say "Pokémon from Gen VIII" or "Fire Emblem Switch character".


Here's mine:

Super Mario: Pauline
Donkey Kong: Dixie Kong
Legend of Zelda: Mipha
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandana Dee
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokémon: Lycanroc
F-Zero: Black Falcon
EarthBound: Ninten
Fire Emblem: Lyn
Game & Watch: Chef
Kid Icarus: Medusa
WarioWare: Ashley
Pikmin: Alph
Famicom: Diskun
Animal Crossing: Isabelle
Wii Fit: Wii Fit Board
Punch-Out!!: King Hippo
Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex & Pyra
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): Wild Gunman
Sonic: Tails
Mega Man: Zero
Pac-Man: Ghosts
Street Fighter: Ken
Final Fantasy: Black Mage
Bayonetta: Jeanne

- Toad
- New Funky Mode Dixie Kong
- Ganon
- Ridley
- Kamek
- Bandanna Dee
- Wolf
- Meowth
- Black Shadow
- Porky
- Lyn
- Chef
- Hades
- Ashley
- Louie
- Professor Hector
- Tom Nook
- Wii Balance Board
- King Hippo
- Melia Antiqua
- Wild Gunman
- Dr. Eggman
- Zero
- Ms. Pac-Man
- Chun-Li
- Terra Branford
- Balder

Bonus

- Polar Bear
- Raiden

 

[Bowserlick]

~ List based on Cosmic's challenge ~​

Super Mario: Toad (anti-aerial speed fighter)

Donkey Kong: King K. Rool (can change costumes and specials w/ Down B)

Legend of Zelda: BotW Link (play based on movement/quests)

Metroid: Ridley (Air-to-Ground fighter)

Yoshi: Birdo (semi-clone)

Kirby: Waddle Dee (can pole-vault w/ spear and needle enemies w/ spears slowing them down)

Star Fox: Andross with a body

Pokémon: Decidueye (projectile aerial attacks that can be charged)

F-Zero: Samurai Goroh (in your face sword-fighter)

Kid Icarus: Medusa or fleshed out Dark Pit

WarioWare: Waluigi (based on personality rather than sport games)

Pikmin: Alph w/ Rock Pikmin (semi-clone)

Animal Crossing: Tom Nook (furniture/obstacle course themed moveset)

Wii Fit: Mii Fit (specials that can be picked on reworked-standard A moveset Mii)

Punch-Out!!: King Hippo (all A aerial moves can be held for a stall-then-fall move)

Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex & Pyra (Pyra fights on Z-Axis)

Sonic: Knuckles or Tails

Mega Man: Zero

Street Fighter: Zangief (super heavyweight grappler)

Final Fantasy: Mog (uses dance attacks and can control weather effects on stages)

Bayonetta: N/A
EarthBound: N/A
Fire Emblem: N/A
Game & Watch: N/A
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): N/A
Famicom: N/A
Pac-Man: N/A

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

And Smash is terrible at staying canon anyway. We're talking about the same franchise that referenced the Pokémon anime in two of it's trophies.

Being the anime is severely notable more than any other official animation among any series in Smash, what's the issue here? Pokemon is popular because of both the anime and games. Many only learned of it via the anime. It makes a ton of sense.

Smash was never about canon, and it has nothing to do with the Pokemon examples. It's a non-canon crossover itself meant to be interesting. Now them stating glaringly untrue things in Trophies(and again, the Pokemon examples don't count in either case since the Anime is severely well known and it makes sense to reference them here and there, especially since Sakurai considers the anime his gateway into figuring out good character choices, though not for all, but for multiple ones), and that's a bigger issue in itself. Though sometimes that's a localization factor, like the whole relationship between King K. Rool and Kaptian K. Rool. They're the same person in one region, and family in another. Though at least they didn't have to deal with the Eggman/Robotnik issue. I'm trying to think of some blatantly false facts they've had, though. Whether it's incorrect release dates for the games, something that isn't a localization problem(which means it's not false entirely, just something that was arguably done wrong for the localization. It's arguable, to be clear, because some people might like the changes in the other region more than the original version).

 

[Cosmic77]

Being the anime is severely notable more than any other official animation among any series in Smash, what's the issue here? Pokemon is popular because of both the anime and games. Many only learned of it via the anime. It makes a ton of sense.

Smash was never about canon, and it has nothing to do with the Pokemon examples. It's a non-canon crossover itself meant to be interesting. Now them stating glaringly untrue things in Trophies(and again, the Pokemon examples don't count in either case since the Anime is severely well known and it makes sense to reference them here and there, especially since Sakurai considers the anime his gateway into figuring out good character choices, though not for all, but for multiple ones), and that's a bigger issue in itself. Though sometimes that's a localization factor, like the whole relationship between King K. Rool and Kaptian K. Rool. They're the same person in one region, and family in another. Though at least they didn't have to deal with the Eggman/Robotnik issue. I'm trying to think of some blatantly false facts they've had, though. Whether it's incorrect release dates for the games, something that isn't a localization problem(which means it's not false entirely, just something that was arguably done wrong for the localization. It's arguable, to be clear, because some people might like the changes in the other region more than the original version).

I feel bad that you typed all of that up because I completely agree with you. Smash isn't about sticking to what's canon, and it honestly shouldn't be taken that seriously in the first place.

Probably should have been more clear.

 

[Schnee117]

Here's a challenge for everyone. Try to add one newcomer (or cut veteran) to each of the 27 franchises currently in Smash. You can add whoever you want and it doesn't have to be someone likely to get in. The only rule is that is that the character you choose has to be from a game that's already released. You can't just say "Pokémon from Gen VIII" or "Fire Emblem Switch character".


Here's mine:

Super Mario: Pauline
Donkey Kong: Dixie Kong
Legend of Zelda: Mipha
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandana Dee
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokémon: Lycanroc
F-Zero: Black Falcon
EarthBound: Ninten
Fire Emblem: Lyn
Game & Watch: Chef
Kid Icarus: Medusa
WarioWare: Ashley
Pikmin: Alph
Famicom: Diskun
Animal Crossing: Isabelle
Wii Fit: Wii Fit Board
Punch-Out!!: King Hippo
Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex & Pyra
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): Wild Gunman
Sonic: Tails
Mega Man: Zero
Pac-Man: Ghosts
Street Fighter: Ken
Final Fantasy: Black Mage
Bayonetta: Jeanne

Mario: Fawful or Waluigi
Donkey Kong: Cranky Kong
Legend of Zelda: Urbosa
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: N/A
Kirby: Galacta Knight
Star Fox: Slippy
Pokemon: Tyranitar
F-Zero: Black Shadow
Mother: Giegue
Fire Emblem: Black Knight
Game & Watch: N/A
Kid Icarus: Hades
Wario: Captain Syrup
Pikmin: Louie
Famicom: N/A
Animal Crossing: N/A
Wii fit: N/A
Punch-Out!!: Mr Sandman
Xenoblade: Mumkhar
Zapper: N/A
Sonic: Eggman
Mega Man: Zero
Pac-Man: Spooky
Street Fighter: Akuma
Final Fantasy: Kefka
Bayonetta: Rodin

Bonus:
Ice Climber: N/A
Metal Gear: Raiden

 

[N3ON]

So aside from Smash recognizing her as a Donkey Kong character, you can't think of why Smash would recognize her as a Donkey Kong character.

Okay.

She could be either, but the more impact she continues to have in the Mario series the more likely Smash acknowledges that as her series going forward.

Especially if they intend to draw from Odyssey in representing the character.

 

[RouffWestie]

Super Mario: Dry Bowser
Donkey Kong: King K. Rool
Legend of Zelda: Toon Zelda
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Samurai Waddle Doo
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokémon: Squirtle
F-Zero: Black Shadow
EarthBound: Ninten
Fire Emblem: Hector
Game & Watch: Egg Wolf
Kid Icarus: Eggplant Wizard
WarioWare: Ashley
Pikmin: Bulborb
Famicom: Ice Climbers
Animal Crossing: Puzzle League Villager
Sonic: Tails
Mega Man: Megaman.EXE
Pac-Man: Mrs. Pac-Man
Street Fighter: Chun-Li
Final Fantasy: Black Mage

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

This challenge is interesting for me, since I would cut some characters. Should I say that, or should I try to add someone? I think I'll put cuts in parentheses, and characters added will be assuming no one is cut. If I genuinely care for a character to get in, I will bold their name.

Here's mine:

Super Mario: (cut Rosalina and Bowser Jr.) Paper Mario
Donkey Kong: K. Rool
Legend of Zelda: (declone Ganondorf) Skull Kid
Metroid: (cut ZSS) Sylux (would be Ridley, but no one has really given a solution to the problem I have with him yet.)
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandana Dee
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokémon: Zygarde
F-Zero: Black Shadow
EarthBound: (make Lucas, Ninten, and Ness costumes for Paula) Pokey Minch in his robot
Fire Emblem: Ephraim
Game & Watch: no idea
Kid Icarus: (cut Dark Pit and Palutena) Medusa, idk
WarioWare: Ashley, idk
Pikmin: Alph, idk
Famicom: this isn't a franchise edit: apparently Ice Climbers can work for this? If they can't do cool **** like de-sync, then Takamaru
Animal Crossing: (Make Tom Nook and anyone else who makes sense a costume for Villager) Mr. Resetti
Wii Fit: (cut WFT) no idea
Punch-Out!!: (cut Little Mac) King Hippo
Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex & Pyra
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): (cut duck hunt dog) no idea
Sonic: Knuckles
Mega Man: Zero
Pac-Man: (cut Pac-Man) Ghosts
Street Fighter: (Cut Ryu) Zangief
Final Fantasy: (cut Cloud) Cecil
Bayonetta: (cut Bayonetta) Balder, I guess

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

Punch-Out!!: (cut Little Mac) King Hippo

How does cutting Little Mac, but introducing King Hippo make any sense?

Edit: re-read your post again; things make sense now.

 

[Zerp]

Here's a challenge for everyone. Try to add one newcomer (or cut veteran) to each of the 27 franchises currently in Smash. You can add whoever you want and it doesn't have to be someone likely to get in. The only rule is that is that the character you choose has to be from a game that's already released. You can't just say "Pokémon from Gen VIII" or "Fire Emblem Switch character".

Super Mario: Waluigi
Donkey Kong: King K. Rool
Legend of Zelda: Ganon
Metroid: Ridley
Yoshi: Poochy
Kirby: Dark Matter
Star Fox: Wolf
Pokémon: Jirachi
F-Zero: Black Shadow
EarthBound: Porky
Fire Emblem: Chrom
Game & Watch: Octopus
Kid Icarus: Medusa
WarioWare: Mona
Pikmin: Plasm Wraith
Famicom: Balloon Fighter
Animal Crossing: Tom Nook
Wii Fit: Balance Board
Punch-Out!!: Doc Louis
Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex + Pyra
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): Mr. Stevenson
Sonic: Dr. Eggman
Mega Man: Megaman X
Pac-Man: Ms. Pac-Man
Street Fighter: Chun-Li
Final Fantasy: Moogle
Bayonetta: Jeanne

 

[TheHumanSonikku]

Super Mario: Geno
Donkey Kong: Dixie Kong
Legend of Zelda: Vaati
Metroid: Ridley or a Federation Force Soilder
Yoshi: Kamek
Kirby: Bandana Dee
Star Fox: Krystal
Pokémon: Sandslash
F-Zero: Jody (Or Judy) Summers
EarthBound: Kumatora
Fire Emblem: Michiah
Game & Watch: Possibly a Ms. Game And Watch of some kind that focuses on the games Mr. Game And Watch doesn't have in his moveset.
Kid Icarus: Hades
WarioWare: Mona
Pikmin: Alph
Famicom: This may be strange, but I would want Diskun.
Animal Crossing: Isabelle
Wii Fit: N/A
Punch-Out!!: King Hippo
Xenoblade Chronicles: Rex & Pyra
Duck Hunt (or any game to use NES Zapper): N/A
Sonic: Knuckles
Mega Man: Megaman.EXE
Pac-Man: Blinky, he's the most popular Pac-Man ghost.
Street Fighter: Guile
Final Fantasy: Squall
Bayonetta: N/A
Metal Gear: Raiden

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

Game & Watch: Possibly a Ms. Game And Watch of some kind that focuses on the games Mr. Game And Watch doesn't have in his moveset.

Good Idea.

 

[UserKev]

This is the part where I let someone else take it from here because my English is bad.

\(°|°)/

Nah. Your English is ok. As you've pointed out, I'm no pro at speculation. I'm just a grumpy smasher who speaks his mind on matters with different beliefs.

And speaking of Red Shells, they probably deserve a comeback after being absent from two Smash Bros. installments in a row.

I actually didn't know they were gone.

Here's a challenge for everyone. Try to add one newcomer (or cut veteran) to each of the 27 franchises currently in Smash. You can add whoever you want and it doesn't have to be someone likely to get in. The only rule is that is that the character you choose has to be from a game that's already released. You can't just say "Pokémon from Gen VIII" or "Fire Emblem Switch character".

Paper Mario
Cranky Kong
Ghirahim
Ridley
Baby Bowser
Bandana Dee
Wolf
Mimikyu
Black Falcon
Jeff
Lyn
Ashley
Alph
Isabelle
Doc Louis
Knuckles
Mega Man X
Blinky
Ken

I skipped the franchises I know nothing about or just content with the characters that already represent them. Sorry for not following fully.