Project M Social Thread

[JOE!]

We still need more playtesters in Massachusetts... *cough*

I'm in dedham, where you at? :V

also, Shanus, this means you got 2 possible people to play with..

 

[Vigilante]

And I need a Montreal crew. Please apply.

 

[ValTroX]

you need to get someone on Puerto Rico, on the west side please.

 

[SuperHappyCow]

its not really any different than falcons or ganons air grab they stall for a sec too it doesn't look weird at all.

Well, it could.

Kirby's inhale is technically a grab, afaict. If one wanted, that could probably be used for a normal velocity option, I think. That'd be a pain in the *** to animate, however.

 

[ph00tbag]

Fair loses it's ability to be combo'd into from Uthrow around 100% with good DI. 120%ish with no di.

So you start comboing from dash attack and dtilt.

Fsmash and fair are also both solid responses to a dsmash hitconfirm, as well. And you're going top hit a lot of dsmashes while edgeguarding.

I think the only change that could really be argued in the realm of KO power is increasing the knockback growth on uair just a tad. Otherwise, she's fine.

 

[GP&B]

You guys need more Floridian playtesters.

Like me, even though I have minimal tournament experience and I'm not really that good

 

[GHNeko]

So you start comboing from dash attack and dtilt.

Fsmash and fair are also both solid responses to a dsmash hitconfirm, as well. And you're going top hit a lot of dsmashes while edgeguarding.

I think the only change that could really be argued in the realm of KO power is increasing the knockback growth on uair just a tad. Otherwise, she's fine.

I'm completely against giving Uair more KO power.

i'd rather another move get stronger in the KO department.

Like Bthrow.


and lol how can i forget dtilt. my bad.

but dash attack? naaah. really? couldnt be.
That move is like a ****tier fthrow. :|

 

[ph00tbag]

I'm completely against giving Uair more KO power.

i'd rather another move get stronger in the KO department.

Like Bthrow.


and lol how can i forget dtilt. my bad.

but dash attack? naaah. really? couldnt be.
That move is like a ****tier fthrow. :|

It's a really good combo move at around 80-120%, actually, depending on character and such. If they DI it anywhere but up, you can usually just do it into itself, so it's really easy to condition people to DI it up, then punish with fair. *****es sleepin' on dash attack.

IMO, KO throws aren't worth having unless they're absurd, like Ness bthrow or Olimar blue bthrow. Not to mention, ZSS's bthrow is really good for tech chase/combo set-ups.

I think it's been fixed, but flthrow used to semi-spike with a good deal of knockback, and it destroyed space animals.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Lucario's airgrab looks really weird.

Using a charge to do that is kinda weak compared to Fox and co, imo.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

Actually, it is just muscle memory. I did that for so long I just do it by instinct.

Glad you guys liked the combo. I think Lucario is the kind of character whose metagame will continue to evolve years even after the release. He has clear weaknesses, but his strength is in his combo versatility. It is very hard to know where you should DI against a good Lucario. and he has a tool for most situations.

I am not the best player in the BR, far from that, but I really want to make clear that if I can do this with Lucario, you should imagine what even more dedicated players could pull off.

Also Kaizo, I could not finish with n-air because I was too close to the ground and the frame would have been too late for me to pull it off. . ALthough if I had gone a tad higher, maybe it would have been possible.

You didn't do that combo holding the controller up side down did you?

 

[standardtoaster]

Lucario's airgrab looks really weird.

Using a charge to do that is kinda weak compared to Fox and co, imo.

You don't use a charge to use his sideB in the air like that. If you choose to expend a charge that you have with sideB, the angle and kb are much better for gimping them. Using a charge with sideB is meant to be a finisher.

 

[MonkUnit]

You didn't do that combo holding the controller up side down did you?

Of course he did. That's how he plays. lol.

 

[JOE!]

Upside-Down Controllers confirmed for P:M

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

You don't use a charge to use his sideB in the air like that. If you choose to expend a charge that you have with sideB, the angle and kb are much better for gimping them. Using a charge with sideB is meant to be a finisher.

Still, overall, felt weak compared to what I know the others can do. Heck if I assume Fox and co are still similar they have far stronger combos in terms of damage.

 

[iLink]

You also have to realize he was able to start that from a distance with a dash attack and pressure his shield to poke through it and get the combo. That's more then what most characters have.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

Of course he did. That's how he plays. lol.

Wait, that's how he normally plays? I just thought that it was how he COULD play. My mind has just been double ****ed.

 

[Rikana]

You also have to realize he was able to start that from a distance with a dash attack and pressure his shield to poke through it and get the combo. That's more then what most characters have.

I'm assuming he's comparing Lucario to Fox and Falco. If that's true then I agree with Red Ryu. I still find Fox and Falco's pressure game much more overwhelming than Lucario's. The lasers and shines are just really good. They don't need to build damage to start shine combos and Fox's shine can kill early.

You could probably bring back the argument that he used dash attack to start the combo but what kind of Falco or Fox player would just mindlessly dash attack a player that knows he's being approached..?

 

[rk-9000]

yes fox and falco are still top tier and you can directly compare any character to them and find things that are inferior but he does still have a unique and strong pressure and combo game, besides those who are pro lucario in this argument arent even trying to say hes broken beyond fox or falco so the comparison is unnecessary anyways

 

[GHNeko]

It's a really good combo move at around 80-120%, actually, depending on character and such. If they DI it anywhere but up, you can usually just do it into itself, so it's really easy to condition people to DI it up, then punish with fair. *****es sleepin' on dash attack.

IMO, KO throws aren't worth having unless they're absurd, like Ness bthrow or Olimar blue bthrow. Not to mention, ZSS's bthrow is really good for tech chase/combo set-ups.

I think it's been fixed, but flthrow used to semi-spike with a good deal of knockback, and it destroyed space animals.

Still iffy on Dash attack. All weekend, no one DI'd dash attack in a way that allowed me to really combo from it, except for another dash attack. And I used that move a lot. :/

I also meant to call Bthrow a ****tier fthrow. Bthrow pales in comparison to Dthrow for techchasing.

It also is overshadowed by uthrow for combos. :/

Fthrow semi spike angle that exists nwo is legit tho

 

[F. Blue]

My roommate plays Melee pretty well with his feet. It's impressive, but he's merely couch-competitive, no advanced techniques.

 

[Ecks]

Vigilante's not good enough. He should use the controller backwards and upside down for 100% opposite style fancyness.

 

[shanus]

Lucario's airgrab looks really weird.

Using a charge to do that is kinda weak compared to Fox and co, imo.

and by really weird, you mean a vbrawl animation?

Also, it doesn't use a charge?

Overall, ???? at you?

 

[Ecks]

Was Lucario's side b throw inspired by something? It seems awfully familiar to me... Maybe I used to watch too much dbz or something.

Anyway, is there an Ex version for every b special? Makes me wonder what could be done with down b and ub b.

 

[humble]

The thing is, Lucario play is probably just going to keep getting better. Imagine what Vigi did, but more consistently, done off of every hitconfirm. That seems kinda scary, the level of pressure Lucario can apply- he's like "**** yo shields man" and proceeds to **** ***. Too legit.

PS, someone should leak details on this Snake remake. Or at the very least, hint at the direction it's going.

 

[cloneofshadow]

I liked the montage at the start of the video.. Kind reminds me of the commercials where [INSERT CELEBRITY] is asking for help in [INSERT PLACE] and wants [INSERT VALUE HERE].

 

[ph00tbag]

I also meant to call Bthrow a ****tier fthrow. Bthrow pales in comparison to Dthrow for techchasing.

I don't really feel this way at all. Throws that automatically ground your opponent don't give as much advantage as ones that flip your opponent into the air for a very short period. Compare Sheik's melee dthrow to Fox's. Which one is used more for starting tech chases? The one that knocks into the air, of course. Not only does Sheik have more time to respond after her dthrow than Fox, but the player can also take DI into account when reading the tech in order to look for patterns, and their opponent can be manipulated that way.

Heck, against fast fallers, a lot of Foxes use uthrow to start their tech chases. The primary reason dthrow is used is to catch one's opponent unprepared to tech the throw, because they haven't had to before in the match.

 

[GHNeko]

Was Lucario's side b throw inspired by something? It seems awfully familiar to me... Maybe I used to watch too much dbz or something.

Anyway, is there an Ex version for every b special? Makes me wonder what could be done with down b and ub b.

EX Up/Down B are nothing more than allowing interrupts when you want with w/e.

 

[Avalancer]

Playing melee after playing P:M for a while feels a bit awkward. The attacks feel lagged when I play melee (on the gamecube). Could this be TV lag? Because i'm not getting this slight attack lag on P:M.

 

[kaizo13]

Playing melee after playing P:M for a while feels a bit awkward. The attacks feel lagged when I play melee (on the gamecube). Could this be TV lag? Because i'm not getting this slight attack lag on P:M.

if you're comparing Melee to the P:M demo then, that's the problem

 

[Avalancer]

if you're comparing Melee to the P:M demo then, that's the problem

Ah, the demo. So, being good at the P:M demo doesn't automatically mean i'm good at melee GC?

 

[UltiMario]

The P:M demo is very, very old and doesn't really capture the Melee feel like the current dev build does.

 

[Archangel]

honestly I think the Demo at this point is an insult to melee and project melee. Some kind of demo version 2 should perhaps be put into consideration soon.

 

[JCaesar]

Gee we haven't thought of that, thanks.

 

[Shadic]

Definitely haven't got plans for the not-too-distant future that we've mentioned wanting to keep quiet on the details of, no-siree.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

honestly I think the Demo at this point is an insult to melee and project melee. Some kind of demo version 2 should perhaps be put into consideration soon.

Here we go again >_>

 

[Stevo]

I'm personally crossing my fingers for having it by November 11th, as I'm having lots of people over for the long weekend that used to play melee and quit smash because of brawl.

although, it would make a good christmas present as well.

It's too bad the PMBR havn't thought of it yet, though

 

[rk-9000]

ooh deadlines...

 

[metroid1117]

I don't really feel this way at all. Throws that automatically ground your opponent don't give as much advantage as ones that flip your opponent into the air for a very short period. Compare Sheik's melee dthrow to Fox's. Which one is used more for starting tech chases? The one that knocks into the air, of course. Not only does Sheik have more time to respond after her dthrow than Fox, but the player can also take DI into account when reading the tech in order to look for patterns, and their opponent can be manipulated that way.

Heck, against fast fallers, a lot of Foxes use uthrow to start their tech chases. The primary reason dthrow is used is to catch one's opponent unprepared to tech the throw, because they haven't had to before in the match.

Sheik's DThrow is certainly better, but Fox/Falco's DThrows still have great (albeit limited) utility on platforms since the opponent can't tech anywhere safely; it can set up for UTilt combos at low-mid %s and kills at high %s.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

I'm personally crossing my fingers for having it by November 11th, as I'm having lots of people over for the long weekend that used to play melee and quit smash because of brawl.

although, it would make a good christmas present as well.

It's too bad the PMBR havn't thought of it yet, though

Not gonna happen

 

[Vigilante]

For boosting U-air on ZSS's u-air, we once had it was powerful as Fox's but it didn't combo as well as it did. It is more efficient at it is.

For Lucario, yeah, I did little damage, but he shielded a few of them. Also, this is not the only extent of Lucario's guard-breaking capabilities. For example, if he side-B's fast enough out of jump cancel U-smash, he can get a grounded grab. Lucario is meant to be both a skill and mindgame character. lack either of them and you will suck. Also, Lucario needs to be reactive. Because of enemy DI, no combo is quite bread and butter.

However, if all hits had connected, the damage would have been fairly intense.