Pound Prizes

[Laijin]

I swear no posts past the first 2 pages ever get read.

Except by the people who are making the thread go past 2 pages to begin with.

lol here is the cycle of literally this entire thread:

Person A states a point.
Person B answers that point.
Person A brings up a counter to person B's point.
Person C comes in, doesn't read the thread and brings up Person A's point again.
Person B or D or whatever answers person's C point with the same answer as before.

Repeat and rinse.
No progress is made.
Welcome to internet arguing.

 

[ranmaru]

lol here is the cycle of literally this entire thread:

Person A states a point.
Person B answers that point.
Person A brings up a counter to person B's point.
Person C comes in, doesn't read the thread and brings up Person A's point again.
Person B or D or whatever answers person's C point with the same answer as before.

Repeat and rinse.
No progress is made.
Welcome to internet arguing.

Hahaha. I think it's just that we feel like contributing our thoughts on this situation. I do not think that is wrong. I also think we feel like letting out thoughts known and be there to counter any counters we'd get.

 

[GameClucks]

If plank were to "should" pay anything back it should only be for winners travel expenses and nothing more, but even that he shouldn't be obligated they still choose to come to an UNDERGROUND tournament ran by ONE MAN this kinda thing should have been foreseen as a possible outcome. Also what if these top players became bed ridden with some type of disease while there and couldn't win? You really shouldn't be traveling unless you can cover the expenses in the first place.

Also to all you brawl players again I ask HOW CAN YOU BE MAD AT PLANK WHEN YOU WOULDN'T HAVE EVEN HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE A LOT OF MONEY PLAYING A VIDEO GAME IF IT WERE NOT FOR HIS HARD WORK AND DEDICATION AND RISKS HE TOOK AND PUT IN JUST FOR THE LOVE OF THE GAME!? Jeez. So unappreciative.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ LOLOLOLOLOLOL
You are an IDIOT.

You have never run anything in your life have you??



Those of you "supporting" Plank and saying "great event too bad it didnt work out this time" etc are the worst of the worst. It is you all that cause things like this to happen and you are the reason society is going down the ****ter.

I can GUARANTEE that if say MLG did something like this, every one of you would be screaming for law suits.

What is diff about Plank vs MLG? He is your friend, or someone you respect. MLG is a company, prob in your mind an evil company that tries to profit off of your backs.

Anyone remember when Active Gamers had their disaster?
I would be willing to bet money that some of you Plank supporters were all about "screw AGLA"
Why is this one any different?

IDIOTS is what you are.

There is NO DIFFERENCE in this situation.

Pound has a "series" and a "reputation" of paying certain %ages of entries in prizes. By you paying that money to Plank, you paid it based on the Venue Fee, Entry Fee and Prize Structure. It is in a way a contract.

So those of you **** riding Plank, are fools and morons and you are why things like this happen. You are a direct cause of it, because you lack the ability to see Right from Wrong and approve of the Wrong all too often.



His bad planning is NOT an excuse for not paying prizes.

HE PLANNED BADLY.
When a company or person plans poorly, they are expected to make it right.
There is NO POSSIBLE WAY his expenses came out to $10,000 for this.
So even if he could not pay full prizes, he could have paid a significant portion of them, BASED UPON the %ages to pay out.
Not pay out 1 or 2 people because he thinks they are cool or something.
You pay EVERYONE a part of what you owe them.




This is not rocket science. Quit being **** riders.

 

[Laijin]

Hahaha. I think it's just that we feel like contributing our thoughts on this situation. I do not think that is wrong. I also think we feel like letting out thoughts known and be there to counter any counters we'd get.

Its not wrong. It just doesn't get us literally anywhere and all its doing is causing tons of hate between us and tension that shouldn't be there. I don't think anyone in this community should look down on anyone else, but this seems to be generating as the thread continues.

 

[Laijin]

snip

This guy just literally proved my last two posts to be completely correct and accurate.

 

[AlphaZealot]

Mostly agree too Gameclucks except for:

There is NO POSSIBLE WAY his expenses came out to $10,000 for this.

I do believe Plank was in a contract highly not in his favor. That was the bad-planning part you were talking about. I do not think Plank pocketed or took any money, and I'd bet he lost a lot of money (relatively).

 

[FlipX]

Pound 5’s the case, no time to waste
Stacks been replaced (aye aye)
Who’s hidin’ dough, whose got some mo’
Who’s liable? (Plank Plank)
Got all lawsuits, got all disputes
What does not compute? (Bens Bens)
This mystery, brings misery
Pound 5’s the case (aye aye)

Is everybody ready for the gavels and juries?
Is everybody ready for the Ally fury?
Court fees worth mad cheese and things seized
Big decisions from the attorneys
I’ll be givin’ out the objections, Phoenix
Twistin’ testimonies the right way, helix
All my evidence be rock hard, Steelix
Lawyers slippin’ from the cross-examine, Felix
No checks to Quebec it’s all theft
Don’t settle now, don’t exit the stage left
Tell ‘em “Gimmie all my money back,” PayPal accept
Winners be ragin’ like they got hit by a rest

Hahahaha, SFG killin it. Yo btw I heard you go to kent? Shoot me a PM to confirm holmes.

 

[Pierce7d]

Mostly agree too Gameclucks except for:



I do believe Plank was in a contract highly not in his favor. That was the bad-planning part you were talking about. I do not think Plank pocketed or took any money, and I'd bet he lost a lot of money (relatively).

Quoted for agreement. At this point, it's unlikely that Plank has pocketed any money. I mean, the bills are there in front of us. Poor play if he wanted to pocket money. He would not have made this thread, unless he's just a moron.

I believe he might be a bit foolish, I believe he made some mistakes, I believe a lot of things about Plank, but I don't think he's a moron.

 

[So Fatal]

Quoted for agreement. At this point, it's unlikely that Plank has pocketed any money. I mean, the bills are there in front of us. Poor play if he wanted to pocket money. He would not have made this thread, unless he's just a moron.

I believe he might be a bit foolish, I believe he made some mistakes, I believe a lot of things about Plank, but I don't think he's a moron.

what about the missing 5k Chibo pointed out?

 

[DarkLouis331]

Hyatt Hotel = Typical greedy corporate ******* for doing that to you. I will admit that.

Though it is always best to reserve less rooms than you think you'll need. Smashers are poor and usually cram 10 people to a room or find housing elsewhere. There was no need to rent out nearly the entire place.

 

[Laijin]

what about the missing 5k Chibo pointed out?

Already proven to have tons of inconsistencies in multiple posts, making the "unaccounted money" easily add up to nothing. If you want to know what I'm talking about, go reread the thread. King's post especially clears most of it up.

 

[CT Chia]

There is NO POSSIBLE WAY his expenses came out to $10,000 for this.

It easily could, did you not see the part of my post where I said when shopping around for CoT5 venues a nice hotel in center city philadelphia (comparable to crystal city dc) gave a rough quote of $10k for a 2 day event? And this is 3 days. Honestly 15k is very believable (and the bank statements added up to that) but any more than that and Plank would be stupid for dealing with that venue (if it cost more than 15k).

Already proven to have tons of inconsistencies in multiple posts, making the "unaccounted money" easily add up to nothing. If you want to know what I'm talking about, go reread the thread. King's post especially clears most of it up.

lol I don't know what you mean. It's simple really.

Plank showed us how much the hotel charged him. I added it all up, around 15k
I estimated the venue fee he collected to be 9k
He owes $9,700 in prizes (9k for the sake of simplicity in this post)
Meaning if he used the entry fees to pay for the 4k leftover, there should still be 5k floating around

and even if there is a misconception or two or misestimated venue fee, i'm not $5,000 off lmao

I think people just don't want to accept the fact that there could easily be leftover money. I completely believed plank to be true and fine about this (though thought $9,000+ money missing was fishy), but doing the math basing from the bank statement HE provided us, it just doesn't add up

 

[So Fatal]

Already proven to have tons of inconsistencies in multiple posts, making the "unaccounted money" easily add up to nothing. If you want to know what I'm talking about, go reread the thread. King's post especially clears most of it up.

isn't it pure math? How does it add up to nothing? Was there 5K plus of random expenses?

 

[Laijin]

isn't it pure math? How does it add up to nothing? Was there 5K plus of random expenses?

Did you miss the part where I said its already been answered before in the thread several times? I don't feel like retyping out everything. The thread isn't that long. I'm sure you can find it.

Edit: Basically. We won't really know anything about that until Plank makes another post about it. But as of now the "unaccounted money" isn't looking to be likely true

 

[Zankoku]

I think I read something to the effect of this. Is omitting variables still pure math?

I already posted exactly how i feel about the situation in the "Pound 5" thread in the tourney discussion, so I won't get into it here. I just wanted to add a couple pieces of information concerning the calculations for missing funds.

While you're figuring only the difference of ((entry fee + venue fee) - (hotel fees incurred) = remaining funds), you're forgetting about his other expenses. Primarily:

--Paypal percentage cuts from all processed funds (approximately 2.5% of all money through paypal, or about $400)
-Door security (OP description mentioned it, paying $10 an hour throughout the event)
-$15 refund per full setup brought by the community (no idea how many setups the community brought, though, or even if he actually refunded people)
-The price of purchasing all the TV's/Cubes which he supposedly stockpiled (The cached thread stated at the time that he had 30 tv's & 15 cubes so far, i'm sure even those weren't cheap.)
-Webhosting costs for his preregistration page, if any.
-He apparently hired an 8-person staff to help run the pools/brackets, at the cost of $50 a person

And the fact that your venue fee calculation is already an overestimate, seeing as how there were not 394 individuals at the tournament but rather that is just a combined number of entry-fee sources.

Total everything up, and the "missing funds" figure really starts to shrink fast, lol.

 

[Pierce7d]

Well, several people on staff of the event can be quoted to show that they did not get paid, but The King's point is totally valid.

 

[DJRome]

seeing as Plank has lost money at every pound I don't feel this is a fair judgement

pretty sure i heard plank made 1k pound 4, but i could be wrong since im not around him all the time. it's not much for a tournament that size, but i know at least he didn't lose that much money pound 4 if any

 

[So Fatal]

I already posted exactly how i feel about the situation in the "Pound 5" thread in the tourney discussion, so I won't get into it here. I just wanted to add a couple pieces of information concerning the calculations for missing funds.

While you're figuring only the difference of ((entry fee + venue fee) - (hotel fees incurred) = remaining funds), you're forgetting about his other expenses. Primarily:

--Paypal percentage cuts from all processed funds (approximately 2.5% of all money through paypal, or about $400)
-Door security (OP description mentioned it, paying $10 an hour throughout the event)
-$15 refund per full setup brought by the community (no idea how many setups the community brought, though, or even if he actually refunded people)
-The price of purchasing all the TV's/Cubes which he supposedly stockpiled (The cached thread stated at the time that he had 30 tv's & 15 cubes so far, i'm sure even those weren't cheap.)
-Webhosting costs for his preregistration page, if any.
-He apparently hired an 8-person staff to help run the pools/brackets, at the cost of $50 a person

And the fact that your venue fee calculation is already an overestimate, seeing as how there were not 394 individuals at the tournament but rather that is just a combined number of entry-fee sources.

Total everything up, and the "missing funds" figure really starts to shrink fast, lol.

There was no security.
Most of the people who worked the event said they did not get paid
Didn't VGBC bring the majority of the tvs?
Regardless of the people going or not he still got the cash

 

[Vorosh]

I'd be really interested in seeing Plank respond to all this.
He's got his whole bank statement, (maybe something was left off the 3 screenshots?) and the exact info for how much money went in and out. I think it would help a lot of people out. For one example, Chibo's calculations didn't account for setup discounts. Plank had 30 tvs, so we should subtract (n-30)x15 where "n" is the number of tvs, I don't know how many there were. Also, Chibo mentioned that Plank had to pay for unused rooms, but he didn't say how many there were and how much that all cost.

Realistically, it is time (if not past the time) for Plank to make another post explaining himself and responding to some of the posts. M2K has accused him of dishonest conduct, which I'm not necessarily inclined to believe. Plank needs to make a post essentially showing all of the money he got from venue fees, all of the money he got from entry fees, and an itemized list of all of his tournament related expenses.

I swear no posts past the first 2 pages ever get read.

Except by the people who are making the thread go past 2 pages to begin with.

False

 

[ranmaru]

Yes Plank should post more. It feels he is disregarding it as "It's done so it's done".

 

[Pi]

I already posted exactly how i feel about the situation in the "Pound 5" thread in the tourney discussion, so I won't get into it here. I just wanted to add a couple pieces of information concerning the calculations for missing funds.

While you're figuring only the difference of ((entry fee + venue fee) - (hotel fees incurred) = remaining funds), you're forgetting about his other expenses. Primarily:

--Paypal percentage cuts from all processed funds (approximately 2.5% of all money through paypal, or about $400)
-Door security (OP description mentioned it, paying $10 an hour throughout the event)
-$15 refund per full setup brought by the community (no idea how many setups the community brought, though, or even if he actually refunded people)
-The price of purchasing all the TV's/Cubes which he supposedly stockpiled (The cached thread stated at the time that he had 30 tv's & 15 cubes so far, i'm sure even those weren't cheap.)
-Webhosting costs for his preregistration page, if any.
-He apparently hired an 8-person staff to help run the pools/brackets, at the cost of $50 a person

And the fact that your venue fee calculation is already an overestimate, seeing as how there were not 394 individuals at the tournament but rather that is just a combined number of entry-fee sources.

Total everything up, and the "missing funds" figure really starts to shrink fast, lol.

Quoting this so people stop taking chibo's estimate as fact.


And also planks original post on things

After weeks of trying to get money back/barter with the hotel I regretfully am faced with informing everybody that there is not going to be any prize money at this time from *Pound*. The hotel was rented out on a sliding scale of rooms rented and that would lower the cost of the venue. I got a really amazing place in a convenient location because we expected MORE entrants. We budgeted so we would be still fine with COMPARABLE entrants. However with over 100 entrants less for melee and like 60 less for brawl, being short those funds/hotel rooms really screwed everything. I'm taking a slight hit myself for even hosting the event.

I still held some hope even through the event the funds I collected in person would be enough to at least PARTIALLY pay people out and give them SOMETHING for their performance. However so many people cancelled their rooms or no-showed the weekend of the tournament that it dropped the room rental down below the threshhold and I got charged EVEN MORE (the money I planned on paying entrants).

The place was crazy expensive but everything would've been fine with a more expected turnout. This mixed with people cramming into rooms (I saw a ton of rooms with extra people in them. More people=less rooms rented=more money I have to pay to hotel=less prizes).

I had to rent out a certain # of rooms to fulfill my contract, and once I rented these rooms I tried to bribe people to get into these rooms for cheap and use that money to help fund the tournament.

With Pound 4 being so successful and the biggest downfall being the distance of travel between the hotel and the airports, and with the new venue being right next to an airport with the venue INSIDE the hotel, along with all the promotional deals, we expected such a larger number than what we got.

This is why there was no internet at the venue and why I went out and got my own PA system for 1/5 the price of the venue PA system. I knew coming into it that prizes were going to be tough and maybe smaller but the room cancellations the weekend of the venue was really the nail in the coffin. There were over 30 cancellations the last week and I had bought out the difference of rooms (had to because of my contract) and so even with the 90 rooms I was forced to purchase it still came up short and cost even more money.

I am at least glad everyone had a good time while they were there before I had to drop this bomb..... I was really hoping it wouldn't come to this. The event was overall just not successful at all on a financial level. I really apologize again and I know it won't do justice, and I know I'm going to get tons of **** for it but there is absolutely nothing I can do at this point.

So....I'm sorry again...I never expected this and when I saw it slightly starting to happen I tried my hardest to get more people to come and to find alternate ways to make money, but to no avail. I'm probably not going to really log back in to check this much because I already know the backlash I will get and it will just make me feel worse so I'll just leave it at that.

I guess thats the best I can do as far as this post goes...... I had to let everybody know, hopefully my friends realize that this was just a horrible misjudgement/sequence of events, but I definitely do expect people to be pissed, clearly I would too, but there is nothing that can be done at this point so all I can do is say "I'm sorry" like a broken record.

so....

I'm sorry

where he does in fact say he is sorry (@the one guy claiming he didn't apologize)

 

[Euclid]

Seeing such disunity among the Smash community is the best thing I've seen in a long time. Plank is a god for being solely responsible for such a historic moment. Props to your enormous miscalculation bro.

 

[DJRome]

I'm just more upset that people would be willing to leave Plank with 30k (or w/e) of debt because they want their money that they "worked hard" to get.

i don't want to rage, but. . .

people definitely spent more than 30k coming to the event. they spent far more than that on lodging, gas, plane tickets, food, and other amenities.

but you want them to take on more debt just to save plank's ***.

hmmmm.

and to the point of "worked hard," i don't think you realize how much people work on smash. i happen to know dr peepee puts in tons of work everyday on smash, and it is insulting that you, being a person who plays (presumably) the game of smash and respects the skill involved, would belittle his efforts. the winners have indeed worked hard. the combined value of practice people in the tournament have put in even at minimum wage at least exceeds a million bux

edit:

@ fatal: at the time of last pound, i sold him 8 cubes with melee and he had already 10 setups then so just a clarification on that part

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

Why is this thread still open?

 

[KageMurphy]

Pound 5’s the case, no time to waste
Stacks been replaced (aye aye)
Who’s hidin’ dough, whose got some mo’
Who’s liable? (Plank Plank)
Got all lawsuits, got all disputes
What does not compute? (Bens Bens)
This mystery, brings misery
Pound 5’s the case (aye aye)

Is everybody ready for the gavels and juries?
Is everybody ready for the Ally fury?
Court fees worth mad cheese and things seized
Big decisions from the attorneys
I’ll be givin’ out the objections, Phoenix
Twistin’ testimonies the right way, helix
All my evidence be rock hard, Steelix
Lawyers slippin’ from the cross-examine, Felix
No checks to Quebec it’s all theft
Don’t settle now, don’t exit the stage left
Tell ‘em “Gimmie all my money back,” PayPal accept
Winners be ragin’ like they got hit by a rest

Promote this man ASAP!

Seeing such disunity among the Smash community is the best thing I've seen in a long time. Plank is a god for being solely responsible for such a historic moment. Props to your enormous miscalculation bro.

It's a sticky situation but it is one of epic proportions, if this was a concert I'd frame my ticket stub.

 

[ranmaru]

@Eikel:

Why should it be closed? Why do you want to cut off discussion on such a big occurance?

 

[Pi]

i don't want to rage, but. . .

people definitely spent more than 30k coming to the event. they spent far more than that on lodging, gas, plane tickets, food, and other amenities.

but you want them to take on more debt just to save plank's ***.

hmmmm.

and to the point of "worked hard," i don't think you realize how much people work on smash. i happen to know dr peepee puts in tons of work everyday on smash, and it is insulting that you, being a person who plays (presumably) the game of smash and respects the skill involved, would belittle his efforts. the winners have indeed worked hard. the combined value of practice people in the tournament have put in even at minimum wage at least exceeds a million bux

edit:

@ fatal: at the time of last pound, i sold him 8 cubes with melee and he had already 10 setups then so just a clarification on that part

what the ****....

EVERYONE READ THIS KIDS POST

am I the only one who refuses to believe people actually think like this?

 

[Lobos]

Its a good laugh......alot of misinformation, pointing of fingers, etc.

IMO everyone who made top 8/top 4 teams should be able to express what they think about it and most of them did......now its just a bunch of yentering lol mic did not get the joke

 

[GDX]

Itemized post of all the fees? Interesting concept.

Also lol @ p5 remix song. All albums gotta have guest tracks right?

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

@Eikel:

Why should it be closed? Why do you want to cut off discussion on such a big occurance?

I just don't see how it's going to do anything, or what positive effect it's having on our community. It's not going to effect the matter at hand at all.

 

[Laijin]

Its pretty sad but there are people like him in the community.
He's the one who also said this earlier.

again, who the **** cares about the reputation of the community. 10k is owed u a89f298nh2398vba9pw8b3vaw9p8bvawp98ejafcs

This is the cancer that is killing smash.

I can't believe our community is filled with people like this. Doesn't even matter what you think is right in this situation at that point.

 

[Pi]

It's no surprise to me that the people who yell "stealing!" over and over tend to be those who have little to no experience running tournaments. First of all, if anything, Plank would be guilty of breach of contract, and not theft. Now it's not like Plank had 2 boxes labelled "venue payment" and "prizes" and took earmarked money from the prize box to pay off the venue. I was one of the co-head TOs for Genesis, and I can tell you that what happens is, you simply have one lump sum of money, and you have two debts. Your first obligation is to the venue. If you understand this, then you understand that it makes absolutely no sense to say there was any kind of "theft." People saying that Plank "stole" or "scammed/fooled" people apparently just make up their own story of how tournaments are run in their minds. You guys need to stop repeating your uninformed arguments over and over again, and consider the points that other people are making.

Now, what you CAN say happened is that Plank failed to fulfill a promise to pay prizes. I don't know if there is a LEGAL basis for that, but there is a moral basis. Did Plank **** up? Yes, but you have to look at it for what it is - he didn't get the attendance or rooms reserved that he expected, and that caused him to be unable to pay prizes from the entry fee money, and nothing more. Certainly something should be done about that, but again, the situation has to be looked at for what it is.

re-posting this as well

 

[DJRome]

what the ****....

EVERYONE READ THIS KIDS POST

am I the only one who refuses to believe people actually think like this?

what is your problem with what i have said then?

you're saying since plank worked really hard on the tournament, people who worked really hard (but i mean come on, they just play a video game!) to win don't deserve any reward for playing a dumb game. let's just let plank pay off his debt.

is that accurate?

 

[ranmaru]

I just don't see how it's going to do anything, or what positive effect it's having on our community. It's not going to effect the matter at hand at all.

Right, the reputation should be looked at. Some people are probably here for drama and just to argue with others or something.

But it seems that there are others who want to discuss and comment on the "morals" of what has been done.

Plus, I'm sure there are some who want to get closure.

 

[KageMurphy]

Why are some of you clowns saying this thread should be closed? Because it's hurting the communities reputation? What do you mean? No one else but people in the community are reading this so how's it hurting anything? You think Judge Judy or someone is lurking? Chill. We all already know this community is gutter lmao. Let people speak freely.

 

[Pi]

what is your problem with what i have said then?

you're saying since plank worked really hard on the tournament, people who worked really hard (but i mean come on, they just play a video game!) to win don't deserve any reward for playing a dumb game. let's just let plank pay off his debt.

is that accurate?

no, it's not
nothing you have said in this thread is accurate
you've been here since it's started but you very well could have come in on this page and you would still be ignorant

I don't know what is wrong with you but clearly there is something, or you're trolling, but god damn if you're trolling kudos cause you got me

your analogies are all garbage, every single one of them, you seem to have absolutely no concept of gravity, reality, individual expenses, or the English language

I don't know if you've been toking up the whole time you've been reading this thread or if you've taken hits of some stronger drugs one too many times if your life but every single one of your posts has been misinformed, exaggerated, confrontational, off topic, or all 4.

just stop it, jesus christ kid, just stop

 

[ranmaru]

Plus, if this thread was closed, you know we'd just open a new one, because we want to talk about it. Nothing wrong with that.

Don't silence us.

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

Why are some of you clowns saying this thread should be closed? Because it's hurting the communities reputation? What do you mean? No one else but people in the community are reading this so how's it hurting anything? You think Judge Judy or someone is lurking? Chill. We all already know this community is gutter lmao. Let people speak freely.

Phil, I was asking not because of whatever reputation we may have (quite frankly, I don't even really care about that). I just fail to see the point of this thread.

 

[DJRome]

ok, man, at least voodoo was cool enough to actually make a point instead of insulting me with no support

 

[Coney]

lmfao @ absolutely anyone caring about how others perceive the community when there's literally $10k unaccounted for

get over yourselves