Official Patch Notes for 1.1.1

[Kami-V]

Thank goodness. I'm not the only one who thinks that UpB comes out faster.

I'm glad you and @ Huggles828 have also noticed this. There are now three of us that have noticed this, independently. I know we're all in a rage over the jab cancel & other nerfs, but this Up-B does seem to be a significant buff. Can others take a look at this and see what they think and/or test it?

 

[Zelkam]

Does a lvl 9 cpu in training mode set to jump always jump out of hitstun at the earliest possible moment? Does anyone know? That's how I was thinking about testing hitstun, but I'm not sure if it'll work.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

I personally wouldn't trust it. Use a second controller.

 

[Linkmario00]

Does a lvl 9 cpu in training mode set to jump always jump out of hitstun at the earliest possible moment? Does anyone know? That's how I was thinking about testing hitstun, but I'm not sure if it'll work.

Nope, I'm 100% sure it doesn't. Was trying true combos with boomerang yesterday (seems to have more hitstun) and a lot of times the CPU just lands after the hitstun. I mean, simply throw a boomerang or any move and test it by yourself.

 

[RikudouSlayer]

I'm new, so I don't know if this is the right place to ask a question, but does Links down tilt still meteor smash? I can't seem to get it to work anymore.

 

[Zelkam]

I'm new, so I don't know if this is the right place to ask a question, but does Links down tilt still meteor smash? I can't seem to get it to work anymore.

I believe FSK mentioned that it doesn't hit characters hanging from the ledge like it used it. I believe it still meteors but the the hitbox is either smaller or has been moved.

 

[FSK]

I believe FSK mentioned that it doesn't hit characters hanging from the ledge like it used it. I believe it still meteors but the the hitbox is either smaller or has been moved.

This is correct, the hitboxes have changed significantly it seems. Still need proper confimation on it though (psst that's your job).

 

[Zelkam]

This is correct, the hitboxes have changed significantly it seems. Still need proper confimation on it though (psst that's your job).

I'm making a list of all the things I need to test as we speak

 

[Huggles828]

Landed a dtilt spike earlier today. iirc pre-patch it would send them down and at a slight angle like in Brawl (I may be wrong about that but I don't exactly use dtilt much since it kinda sucks lol). Now, it sends them straight down and seems to meteor; it reminded me a lot of getting dair spiked by a C. Falcon at low percents. It didn't seem like a particularly powerful meteor (I think I hit at about 70% and they were still able to recover), and I have no clue as to the hitbox change.

 

[Elessar]

So basically, another nerf. And to make it even funnier, a need on a horrible move that nobody used and was borderline useless anyways.

Perfect logic.

 

[PKBeam]

i did a bit of rough testing.
startup on all standard moves seem to be the same. landing lag almost certainly hasn't changed. so i don't think we need to worry about that.
someone definitely needs to check out spin attack, because the 1.0.4 frame data said frame 4 and i got frame 8 or 9.

 

[TNS|Quake]

Was this a thing before the patch? Some dude posted this in the competitive smash bros FB group. Basically running at the ledge and up B'ing and getting one that looks like it's sped up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSb8NyQiG6Y

 

[FSK]

Was this a thing before the patch? Some dude posted this in the competitive smash bros FB group. Basically running at the ledge and up B'ing and getting one that looks like it's sped up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSb8NyQiG6Y

Yeah I think so, it was what happened when you failed to do a SAF.

 

[TNS|Quake]

I'm n00b. Just checked the smash dictionary and googled. All I got is super armor frames. Soon as Frames? What is SAF?

EDIT: (of course I didn't search our own friggin boards). Oh Spin Attack Fall. Why is the animation sped up? I get why we eat **** and suicide now when it's grounded but I don't understand the aerial Up B doing what it does in the vid

 

[FSK]

I'm n00b. Just checked the smash dictionary and googled. All I got is super armor frames. Soon as Frames? What is SAF?

EDIT: (of course I didn't search our own friggin boards). Oh Spin Attack Fall. Why is the animation sped up? I get why we eat **** and suicide now when it's grounded but I don't understand the aerial Up B doing what it does in the vid

Its probably the same in brawl, it happens in smash 4 because Nintendo are lazy pieces of **** that loves to copy paste buggy code. I'll check brawl one sec.

It doesn't happen in brawl so I'm not sure, its probably just a bug thing, I doubt its intentional. They are still lazy pieces of **** though.

 

[Zelkam]

i did a bit of rough testing.
startup on all standard moves seem to be the same. landing lag almost certainly hasn't changed. so i don't think we need to worry about that.
someone definitely needs to check out spin attack, because the 1.0.4 frame data said frame 4 and i got frame 8 or 9.

I had tested spin attack's speed on patch 1.0.5 I think, and it was 11 frames. So if it really is 8 or 9 now then it is indeed faster. I'll find out for sure soon though. Where did you see that it hit on frame 4?

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Where did you see that it hit on frame 4?

I believe he's talking about the mined frame data notes for every character. Basically, you need to ignore the frame data for specials in those notes. Specials are special. There are difficulties with mining the data on them.

 

[PKBeam]

Oh, it said frame 4 on the frame data so I just assumed it was frame 4.

 

[Linkmario00]

Oh, it said frame 4 on the frame data so I just assumed it was frame 4.

If I'm correct, OOS spin attack comes out at frame 4. It was probably a mistake.

 

[PKBeam]

wait, there's a difference between OoS Spin Attack and normal Spin Attack?
why?

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

If I'm correct, OOS spin attack comes out at frame 4. It was probably a mistake.

wait, there's a difference between OoS Spin Attack and normal Spin Attack?
why?

Spin attack does not come out on frame 4 normally or OoS.

 

[Zelkam]

Progress report:

Alright, so I went ahead and looked into the controversial claims first to check their validity. There were also a couple big things that stood out to me that I hadn't seen mentioned before. These are all listed below. I still have to sift through the rest of the data which, to be totally honest, could take me several days. So you'll just have to take me at my word for the stuff below and then I'll upload a video with everything together once I'm finished.

Note: All knockback percentages are for the earliest percent to create the lightning effect on Mario at the center of FD


Jab

• Move duration has been nerfed from 19 frames to 27

Spin Attack

• Start up time for the front swing has been reduced from frame 11 to 9
• Start up time for the back swing has been reduced from frame 13 to 10
• Knockback for the front swing has been buffed from %152 to %130
• Knockback for the back swing has been nerfed from %152 to %171
• Move duration has been shortened by 4 frames

Dtilt

• Can no longer spike characters hanging from the ledge for unknown reasons
• Knockback drastically nerfed from %175 to %312

Dash Attack

• Knockback for the hitbox on the sword hilt has been nerfed from %106 to %128 (This means the tool tip is now correct in saying that the tip of the sword is stronger than the base. It was actually the other way around before)
• The hitbox comes out sooner (unsure as to how soon, I'll test this more thoroughly later) meaning that Link can now hit characters above him like he always should have. It's now possible to hit characters on the lower platforms of battlefield with the dash attack.

Dair

• Landing lag has been reduced by 1 frame

Things that have not changed

• Uthrow knockback
• Dthrow knockback
• Ftilt hitboxes
• Utilt hitstun
• Boomerang hitstun
• Dsmash startup lag

 

[DUKEL]

Things that have not changed

• Uthrow knockback

So it's still a kill move? Excellent.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

There's definitely something weird going on with the spike hitboxes for D-tilt. Like there's the fact that the angle it launches has been changed and that it has been nerffed from a spike to a meteor, but I actually think that it's easier to land now for some reason. I can only guess that either the spike hitbox priority has been changed or that the hitboxes have been spaced apart to make it easier to avoid the non-spike hitboxes. [It used to be, and probably still is, that you had to hit with the spike hitbox and only the spike hitbox, avoiding all others, otherwise it wouldn't spike.]
I don't have any way of confirming any of the above so don't take it for truth.

Also, D-tilt can still spike people hanging on the ledge. This is confirmed. It's probably just harder due to the spike hitbox being made smaller or something. Try it against Charizard if you want to see it yourself.

Actually, come to think of it, it could be that many of the hitbox sizes on D-tilt have all been made smaller. Someone with both versions please check this scientifically. I only suggest this because it would explain a lot. I could easily be wrong.

 

[FSK]

You are doing amazing work Zelkam. Could you check the dair hitbox? Its pretty disgusting now but unsure if its always been like that. For the record we beat diddy's uair now.

http://postimg.org/image/bb3a07dqp

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

For the record we beat diddy's uair now.

I thought we always did(?)
I legitimately don't know for sure. I remember Zero saying something about it, but you know.


Edit: Yep. He did say that. https://youtu.be/AzqODzcRnaQ?t=24

 

[FSK]

I thought we always did(?)
I legitimately don't know for sure. I remember Zero saying something about it, but you know.


Edit: Yep. He did say that. https://youtu.be/AzqODzcRnaQ?t=24

Yeah don't trust Zero when it comes to Link he has no idea what he's talking about. Heres Kirin match vs. Player-1. At 23:40 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zM5QgIjuwss

To be able to trade now, diddy has to hit Link with the tip of his uair or else we win.

I'm able to beat or trade with Rosalina's uair. I am also able to make Rosalina win, but the hitbox has to be at max range or close to it.

Fox you need to test this further because your testing skills are way better than mine :$

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Yeah, I was already wary of trusting him as an authority on Link (hence the 'but you know'), especially when he started going on about the link infinite some 30 seconds later XD.
Good to know.

 

[Zelkam]

You are doing amazing work Zelkam. Could you check the dair hitbox? Its pretty disgusting now but unsure if its always been like that. For the record we beat diddy's uair now.

http://postimg.org/image/bb3a07dqp

What exactly needs checked? And for the record, I've updated to 1.0.6 now to my ability to test things has been limited, but I might be able to to work some things out if need be.

 

[FSK]

For everyone's viewing pleasure:

postimg.org/image/i4getsv83

What exactly needs checked? And for the record, I've updated to 1.0.6 now to my ability to test things has been limited, but I might be able to to work some things out if need be.

Just see if the hitbox has changed on the dair. How early we hit someone with it as show in my images.

 

[Zelkam]

For everyone's viewing pleasure:

postimg.org/image/i4getsv83



Just see if the hitbox has changed on the dair. How early we hit someone with it as show in my images.

So you think the hitboxes are disjointed further down now? If that's what you're saying then you might be onto something because I remember dair acting a bit weird while I was recording. I'll examine the footage today and get back with you on that one.

 

[FSK]

So you think the hitboxes are disjointed further down now? If that's what your saying then you might be onto something because I remember dair acting a bit weird while I was recording. I'll examine the footage today and get back with you on that one.

Yeah I'm pretty sure it has changed, we used to never be able to challenge Rosa's uair and now we can.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Yeah I'm pretty sure it has changed, we used to never be able to challenge Rosa's uair and now we can.

Woah, for real?

... well it's not working for me. Rosalina still beats our Dair. That Uair is probably a bad example though.
Gay's U-air still beats us too...

Maybe it was just Diddy's U-air that got nerfed. We already know it got it's damage and knockback nerfed. Maybe they also slightly nerfed it's range or added some hurtboxes to make it less disjointed?

 

[FSK]

Woah, for real?

... well it's not working for me. Rosalina still beats our Dair. That Uair is probably a bad example though.
Gay's U-air still beats us too...

Maybe it was just Diddy's U-air that got nerfed. We already know it got it's damage and knockback nerfed. Maybe they also slightly nerfed it's range or added some hurtboxes to make it less disjointed?

That is really strange I'll test some more.

 

[Zelkam]

Did a quick test and it appears that FSK was correct. Dair is now more disjointed than it was before. The image below shows the exact point of impact from both versions. Green Link is 1.0.5 and red Link is 1.0.6

 

[Linkmario00]

Seems a pretty good buff in hitbox. Maybe they also increased horizontal hitbox? Because it seems to me that now I don't need to be almost exactly above the player for hit him.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

They nerfed his jab?

That is so ****ing gay.

RIP mix ups.

****...

 

[Himura Kenshin]

Does the increased hitboxes mean the spike is easier to pull off?

 

[Zelkam]

Does the increased hitboxes mean the spike is easier to pull off?

Theoretically, yes

 

[Knife8193]

Progress report:

Alright, so I went ahead and looked into the controversial claims first to check their validity. There were also a couple big things that stood out to me that I hadn't seen mentioned before. These are all listed below. I still have to sift through the rest of the data which, to be totally honest, could take me several days. So you'll just have to take me at my word for the stuff below and then I'll upload a video with everything together once I'm finished.

Note: All knockback percentages are for the earliest percent to create the lightning effect on Mario at the center of FD


Jab

• Move duration has been nerfed from 19 frames to 27

Spin Attack

• Start up time for the front swing has been reduced from frame 11 to 9
• Start up time for the back swing has been reduced from frame 13 to 10
• Knockback for the front swing has been buffed from %152 to %130
• Knockback for the back swing has been nerfed from %152 to %171
• Move duration has been shortened by 4 frames

Dtilt

• Can no longer spike characters hanging from the ledge for unknown reasons
• Knockback drastically nerfed from %175 to %312

Dash Attack

• Knockback for the hitbox on the sword hilt has been nerfed from %106 to %128 (This means the tool tip is now correct in saying that the tip of the sword is stronger than the base. It was actually the other way around before)
• The hitbox comes out sooner (unsure as to how soon, I'll test this more thoroughly later) meaning that Link can now hit characters above him like he always should have. It's now possible to hit characters on the lower platforms of battlefield with the dash attack.

Dair

• Landing lag has been reduced by 1 frame

Things that have not changed

• Uthrow knockback
• Dthrow knockback
• Ftilt hitboxes
• Utilt hitstun
• Boomerang hitstun
• Dsmash startup lag

Can you verify the KB changes on the moves FSK mentioned earlier? I don't see a difference, but then again some of those buffs were subtle.