Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[chocolatejr9]

Just a head's up for anybody who cares: Thorgi's Arcade is posting his annual Smash-themed "Build the Roster" episode later this month, and this one is gonna be about Smash 6. Though he also mentioned it will have a twist that some people won't like, so take that as you will.

 

[SneakyLink]

Just a head's up for anybody who cares: Thorgi's Arcade is posting his annual Smash-themed "Build the Roster" episode later this month, and this one is gonna be about Smash 6. Though he also mentioned it will have a twist that some people won't like, so take that as you will.

After seeing outrage over the mobile game “Disney Magic Kingdoms” planning to add content from “Ice Age” to the game, I can assume that the twist people won’t like is either a character addition or removal.

If it happened for one game I assume it could happen to another.

 

[PinkFlare]

Playable fighter or bust

 

[fogbadge]

This Zippo leak seems somewhat opportunistic; were it not for the likelihood of the next console releasing this year (and the assumed potential shakeup of Direct schedules as a result) I doubt as many people would give him the time of day for suggesting a January presentation.

surely the leaker(s) we should be keeping an eye on is whoever got SMBW SMRPG and the another code remakes?

 

[Mamboo07]

After seeing outrage over the mobile game “Disney Magic Kingdoms” planning to add content from “Ice Age” to the game, I can assume that the twist people won’t like is either a character addition or removal.

If it happened for one game I assume it could happen to another.

ICE AGE!?

 

[BuckleyTim]

After seeing outrage over the mobile game “Disney Magic Kingdoms” planning to add content from “Ice Age” to the game, I can assume that the twist people won’t like is either a character addition or removal.

Now that's a pointless overreaction I can get behind!

"Well we bought out a major part of the film industry and casually shut down their animation studio, but look we've put their IP in our dumb 'look how many IP we own' mobile games! Isn't that cool and not tacky?"

I know I'm arguing this on the forum for the "look how many IP we can get" video game, but still you gotta admit that's tacky.

 

[chocolatejr9]

ICE AGE!?

Disney owns it after the Fox buyout, and they've been incorporating it into their larger brand it seems: this isn't even the first Disney mobile game to include it (I believe that honor goes to Disney Emoji Blitz).

 

[SneakyLink]

Disney owns it after the Fox buyout, and they've been incorporating it into their larger brand it seems: this isn't even the first Disney mobile game to include it (I believe that honor goes to Disney Emoji Blitz).

Yeah Emoji Blitz was the first.

Emoji Blitz also got Ron's Got Wrong (the actual first), Anastasia, and Titanic.

Anyways, this isn't really next Smash speculation (more current than next), but when does everyone think the first of 4 spirit events with new spirits will occur?

 

[Noipoi]

WHAT KILLED THE DINOSAURS

ICE AGE!?

 

[chocolatejr9]

Yeah Emoji Blitz was the first.

Emoji Blitz also got Ron's Got Wrong (the actual first), Anastasia, and Titanic.

Anyways, this isn't really next Smash speculation (more current than next), but when does everyone think the first of 4 spirit events with new spirits will occur?

Hm... well, the month's only just started, so they still have plenty of time, at least.

 

[HyperSomari64]

Hm... well, the month's only just started, so they still have plenty of time, at least.

Any chance to see Simpsons Tsum Tsum?

 

[SPEN18]

While I'd definitely still love to see several older Zelda reps, I am also in support of a dedicated BotW/TotK rep. And lately, after having played some more of TotK, I have been starting to think Rauru may be the optimal choice for that.
He's pretty prominent in the story, definitely a step up from a pure side character, and crucially is a character every player is basically guaranteed to encounter, which is important for a game like TotK in which so much story content is optional. Gameplay-wise he's a pretty clear and natural fit for Smash and for representing TotK. It bothers me a bit that he is more a TotK-exclusive rep than a split BotW/TotK rep, but I'd say his other merits outweigh this representative gripe. Sure, you could go with one of the Champions to represent these games instead, and attempt to justify the choice through the popularity measure, but Rauru may make more sense as a solo representative, and centerpiece of sorts for BotW-era representation.
Overall, I think my personal preference, if I could only pick one, would be geared towards an older Zelda rep that the community has wanted for a long time, but we can't deny the breakthrough success of BotW-era Zelda, either. I think Rauru is a solid choice who would elicit a "surprised but not that surprised" reaction from a lot of fans.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

I think Jonesy or Fortnite in general has a legitimate shot at inclusion in a future Smash

I think it would be cool if they made us think its a Fortnite trailer only for the smash letter to fall on Jonesy's lap.

Like its done by the same animators.

 

[KillerCage]

View attachment 382723

WHAT KILLED THE DINOSAURS

THE DINOSAURS!!!

 

[RodNutTakin]

Just a head's up for anybody who cares: Thorgi's Arcade is posting his annual Smash-themed "Build the Roster" episode later this month, and this one is gonna be about Smash 6. Though he also mentioned it will have a twist that some people won't like, so take that as you will.

You and I both know that "a twist that some people won't like" in this context is a code word for "I'm reducing/limiting the veteran/character count to an arbitrary number of my choosing to justify this random gameplay shift idea I had for SSB6."
And I'll quote Squidward on this one in response: "Daring today, are we?"

 

[magiciandude]

I think Jonesy or Fortnite in general has a legitimate shot at inclusion in a future Smash

I had this theory for a while if jonesy gets in, he'd be the third to last character for DLC and then Kratos and Master Chief are announced as the last DLC fighters. In my opinion that's how you topped soras "WTF never thought they could get in" character

 

[PinkFlare]

I had this theory for a while if jonesy gets in, he'd be the third to last character for DLC and then Kratos and Master Chief are announced as the last DLC fighters. In my opinion that's how you topped soras "WTF never thought they could get in" character

I doubt they ever plan to top Sora's reveal, especially with two characters that I honestly feel are relatively impossible

 

[Ivander]

I had this theory for a while if jonesy gets in, he'd be the third to last character for DLC and then Kratos and Master Chief are announced as the last DLC fighters. In my opinion that's how you topped soras "WTF never thought they could get in" character

Only a Sony character. With Microsoft not only allowing Banjo & Kazooie and Steve, but also 4 Mii Costumes involving Cuphead(which Microsoft doesn't own, but they did aid with the Switch release of Cuphead), Vault Boy, Dragonborn and Doomslayer, I honestly think Master Chief has a good possibility.
Not the best, especially as all of the properties in Smash weren't originally owned by them, but I heavily doubt Microsoft would deny Master Chief getting in Smash if Sakurai asked for him. And that's not including his crossover appearance in Fortnite that was also available on Switch.

Meanwhile, Sony is the more unlikely candidate since they still appear take their competitors seriously(even without the whole Microsoft & Activision Blizzard fiasco). It was around 5 years ago when Sony started relaxing on cross platform play, allowing Kratos(and possibly Aloy too) be accessible in all versions of Fortnite, including the Switch version, later and only recently have putting their games outside of Playstation, but only for PC. Compared to Microsoft who has been quite open with Nintendo, Sony still feels like the one who appears impossible to appear in Smash Bros. Whether it remains that way or not is another story.

 

[NotGenerico]

The only thing that bothers me about a possible Sony rep is that it would absolutely be Kratos. He's fine and all, but I'd prefer other Sony characters like Kat from Gravity Rush or a Bloodborne Hunter before him, lol.

 

[dream1ng]

Sorry for the late reply

I'd be a bit more optimistic about Dante's popularity remaining if he hadn't already taken a hit in popularity in the post-Ultimate era and if his popularity during the Fighter's Pass era wasn't so closely correlated to DMC 5's release and false leaks relating to Byleth's announcement. A lot of that also has to do with other Capcom characters like the Resident Evil cast and Monster Hunter being seen as viable again and Chun-Li and Zero increasing in popularity due to Sephiroth's inclusion, but he's no longer a Top 5 contender like the fanbase once thought he was.

I agree the Capcom competition will hinder him, but I also think the same will happen for the three (or more) of Microsoft, with one or two pulling ahead of the other. My guess is Chief will pull ahead, Crash will falter and Slayer will be somewhere between them.

The thing about Capcom is I don't think there will be a consistent pack leader. RE has its votes split, and I don't think Chun-Li gets popular enough until we actually see Ryu return - which I don't think will be at the beginning. I know you're including Zero here but he's not going to be as popular as any of these others. And MH probably will be the most expected since it's a unified character in a series that will probably get a new game on Switch 2. However, I think that character, like Hero, veers more towards expected than fan favorite. Outside Japan, at least.

However, were it not the point/topic of this conversation, I wouldn't treat any of these things as foregone conclusions until they actually happened.

I also don't think that Crash or Doom Slayer are necessarily the most comparable characters to Dante, as a lot of their appeal also comes from additional historical value that isn't applicable to Dante. DMC is important, but it was never the PlayStation's "Unofficial Mascot Title" like Crash Bandicoot or completely revolutionizing PC gaming like Doom. I do think Crash is going to be hurt by his franchise's health taking a sudden nose-dive with Crash Team Rumble's commercial and critical failure, but that historical value helps carry these characters during periods of inactivity. I also think there are still a handful of really popular third parties with a notably high Nintendo connection, like Ryu Hayabusa and Geno, so it's not like we're completely out of those woods.

They had historical value, Nintendo appearances, including Nintendo exclusives, and inactivity before Ultimate, and neither got popular until their revivals came to Switch. If Crash and Slayer never got revived, I doubt either would be that popular currently. I can see both of them slipping if the games don't keep up. Historical significance isn't a measure that guarantees enduring popularity. There are both characters who have it without much if any popularity, like Akira Yuki or Chosen Undead, and there are fairly popular characters who really don't have that much, like Geno and Rayman.

But fwiw, I have also seen arguments for Dante on the basis of his significance in codifying the genre of character action. I think all this genre stuff is a little overblown in forming demand and especially in leading to inclusion - it seems more a way to help justify a character who is already popular - but Dante is not without his contribution to gaming's library.

The Nintendo connection really doesn't matter anymore. The only thing it's good for is predisposing characters towards demand. But it's the demand that matters, and demand has clearly moved past the confines of the Nintendo-oriented.

Also, I don't think a DMC5 release on the Switch 2 would sway things much either way.

For popularity, of course it would. That's what we're talking about here. Not chance.

It wasn't DMC5's release that spurred Dante's popularity, it was the first four games coming to Switch (and the leak, and the reduction of competition). It wasn't the revivals that gave Crash and Slayer their popularity nearly as much as it was those games actually coming to Switch. Look at how MH Rise shot that character's popularity right back up - and I also think getting SF6 on Switch 2 would boost Chun Li's popularity.

Now that doesn't correlate to them actually getting in. But we're talking about popularity here. And getting games on Switch does, perhaps erroneously, but nevertheless increase popularity for a lot of characters, at least temporarily.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

The only thing that bothers me about a possible Sony rep is that it would absolutely be Kratos. He's fine and all, but I'd prefer other Sony characters like Kat from Gravity Rush or a Bloodborne Hunter before him, lol.

It would be a choice between Kratos, Ratchet or girl from the last of us.

Sony only cares about those three series

 

[dream1ng]

I agree Fortnite has a legitimate chance. I'm just bummed that Jonesy seems likely as the default, he's so bland.

I had this theory for a while if jonesy gets in, he'd be the third to last character for DLC and then Kratos and Master Chief are announced as the last DLC fighters. In my opinion that's how you topped soras "WTF never thought they could get in" character

I would advise against going in expecting
1) they are going to deliberately try to top Sora
2) their biggest reveal will inherently be the last
3) Sony

 

[Swamp Sensei]

2) their biggest reveal will inherently be the last

To be fair, I would have argued that the last reveal is never the biggest until Sora happened.

I do agree that Sora is not the norm though. If he wasn't able to be included we would have ended on... Kazuya. He's neat and all, but not nearly as impactful to the fanbase.

 

[smashkirby]

A lot of them are very fun, eclectic choices so for that matter I kind of miss the era where our (self-inflicted) limitations made us more creative. On the other hand, it's just a little embarrassing that Little King Story and Plok were getting a nod here over Dragon Quest, Shin Megami Tensei, Puyo Puyo or Minecraft. Strange omissions seeing how all of these did have a tight relationship with Nintendo already, among others with more dubious connection.

Genuinely all of those are pretty cool picks, and granted none of these SUPER weird ones were ever really a popular point of conversation, but I think it says something about the fanbase's neglect and short-sightedness. Like all those are here just because they were Nintendo exclusive at some point, that's the kind of logic many of us were operating on. But in a vacuum, give me Plok music in Smash please.

Exactly. I'm especially invested in nearly all of those 1st party choices. With how people sort of overlook those characters these days. I mean, for this list to consider folks like Mona a potential candidate.

 

[magiciandude]

I agree Fortnite has a legitimate chance. I'm just bummed that Jonesy seems likely as the default, he's so bland.


I would advise against going in expecting
1) they are going to deliberately try to top Sora
2) their biggest reveal will inherently be the last
3) Sony

Oh I'm not expecting anything so much as not ruling out anything because it's Sakurai. That man is unpredictable and I say that as a compliment.

 

[SPEN18]

Alleged leakers aside, do we think the first Direct of the year is simply doomed to be relatively mundane as far as new announcements go? We will likely get details on the previously announced games, but we all assume the Switch is on its way out. Probably smart to have lower expectations for the likely Feb Direct, but it would be nice to think there's an outside chance of something like either some real MP4 news or a remake or other more minor release for another Switch-inactive franchise.

 

[DarthEnderX]

After seeing outrage over the mobile game “Disney Magic Kingdoms” planning to add content from “Ice Age” to the game

...why? Ice Age is owned by Disney now.

 

[Noipoi]

Alleged leakers aside, do we think the first Direct of the year is simply doomed to be relatively mundane as far as new announcements go? We will likely get details on the previously announced games, but we all assume the Switch is on its way out. Probably smart to have lower expectations for the likely Feb Direct, but it would be nice to think there's an outside chance of something like either some real MP4 news or a remake or other more minor release for another Switch-inactive franchise.

No.

Donkey Kong will save the day

 

[Scrimblo Bimblo]

I don't see Kratos, or any Sony character, happening. Nintendo and Sony don't really work together, there's no Banjo/Steve situation (which you can extend to Crash and Doomguy) where the series is/has been playable for a long time on Nintendo consoles, there's not really much fan demand for it to happen, and finally they can bring in the PlayStation fanbase with characters like Cloud, Snake or Kazuya as they've already done anyways...
It feels like the only reasons they would do it is just for the sake of saying, "Hey, we've got Sony on board".

 

[dream1ng]

To be fair, I would have argued that the last reveal is never the biggest until Sora happened.

I do agree that Sora is not the norm though. If he wasn't able to be included we would have ended on... Kazuya. He's neat and all, but not nearly as impactful to the fanbase.

Well I'm not saying the last reveal absolutely won't be the biggest one. It's not implausible.

I just know a lot of people are going to be expecting it because even before Sora people believed Smash has to go out on a bang. Which it doesn't. And usually, it doesn't. But now Sora will have strengthened the expectation that it will.

But for all we know, who's to say how things would've ended had Sora not been acquired so much later than the others? Either like you raise, were he not acquired at all (maybe Kazuya still would've been FP10, maybe not - we can't know for sure), or had he been acquired much earlier, when negotiating for the other third-parties? Would they have still put him at the end, or would they have wanted to use him sooner? There were irregular extenuating circumstances here which don't make it ideal to use as precedent. But I know it will be. Again and again.

I'm just saying, even with Sora, treat the final reveal being the biggest simply as a possibility, not an expectation.

Oh I'm not expecting anything so much as not ruling out anything because it's Sakurai. That man is unpredictable and I say that as a compliment.

I understand, though even with Sony aside, and with the ending on the biggest touched on above, Sakurai doesn't add characters to try to "top" previous additions. I mean, he didn't include Sora or Banjo to top anyone, he included them because they were really requested.

So Sony, though pretty unlikely, could happen. And the chance of ending on a bang, though imo overrated, could happen. But adding a character to top previous additions isn't really how it works. So that motivation isn't a deciding factor. If we got Chief and/or Kratos, it'd be because... it's Chief/Kratos.

 

[fogbadge]

Yeah Emoji Blitz was the first.

Emoji Blitz also got Ron's Got Wrong (the actual first), Anastasia, and Titanic.

Anyways, this isn't really next Smash speculation (more current than next), but when does everyone think the first of 4 spirit events with new spirits will occur?

so what you're saying is they could have anastasia in kingdom hearts?

 

[Oshawott777]

...why? Ice Age is owned by Disney now.

I've seen something similar with Disney Speedstorm's fandom, there's a few people who don't like having "non-disney" stuff added to their games, EX Marvel, Star Wars, Simpsons. Emoji Blitz doesn't get it as bad, but those people I've been talking about prefer to focus on characters from Disney movies. Personally I disagree, I like it when a company has a variety of franchises represented.

 

[RileyXY1]

I've seen something similar with Disney Speedstorm's fandom, there's a few people who don't like having "non-disney" stuff added to their games, EX Marvel, Star Wars, Simpsons. Emoji Blitz doesn't get it as bad, but those people I've been talking about prefer to focus on characters from Disney movies. Personally I disagree, I like it when a company has a variety of franchises represented.

Although Speedstorm has currently stuck to just home-grown Disney and Pixar franchises, with none of the acquisitions being represented at all.

 

[fogbadge]

I've seen something similar with Disney Speedstorm's fandom, there's a few people who don't like having "non-disney" stuff added to their games, EX Marvel, Star Wars, Simpsons. Emoji Blitz doesn't get it as bad, but those people I've been talking about prefer to focus on characters from Disney movies. Personally I disagree, I like it when a company has a variety of franchises represented.

but it has a variety of franchises represented

 

[Oshawott777]

but it has a variety of franchises represented

I mean series besides the animated films exclusively.

 

[fogbadge]

I mean series besides the animated films exclusively.

it’s got live action films

 

[dream1ng]

Alleged leakers aside, do we think the first Direct of the year is simply doomed to be relatively mundane as far as new announcements go? We will likely get details on the previously announced games, but we all assume the Switch is on its way out. Probably smart to have lower expectations for the likely Feb Direct, but it would be nice to think there's an outside chance of something like either some real MP4 news or a remake or other more minor release for another Switch-inactive franchise.

Yeah I think it'll be underwhelming if you go in with normal Direct expectations. It's probably going to be the last one before the Switch 2 gets revealed, so it's presumably just going to be 2024 Switch games, which now seem to be in the tail-end phase of mostly being ports, remakes and spin-offs.

And we already know a decent amount of what's coming in the next few months, so the number of new first-party reveals may be pretty limited. I'd guess that forever-rumored FE remake will probably show up. Outside of that... who knows.

The third-party stuff could have some neat surprises, but if one of them is Hi-Fi Rush, well... that reveal has lost some of its cache. And that could've been one of the most noteworthy announcements, it is a first-party MS game. I wouldn't expect much big, but some cool ports seem possible.

 

[Dinoman96]

https://www.youtube.com/post/UgkxUMxRmMfZn7mDYoSb9Tgsu1ku4WirzbuT

Looks like he's heading back to the Smash salt mines, it seems.

 

[fogbadge]

https://www.youtube.com/post/UgkxUMxRmMfZn7mDYoSb9Tgsu1ku4WirzbuT

Looks like he's heading back to the Smash salt mines, it seems.

nah he’s making his next beetle VP

 

[dream1ng]

https://www.youtube.com/post/UgkxUMxRmMfZn7mDYoSb9Tgsu1ku4WirzbuT

Looks like he's heading back to the Smash salt mines, it seems.

That's part of it, probably. I don't doubt his ability to multitask, though. What I believe comprises another part is the team (at least some of it) who helps with these videos (the art/editing/translation/etc) also works at Namco, possibly in Studio S, and their work on this stuff is more time-consuming.

Studio 2/Studio S | バンダイナムコスタジオ

バンダイナムコスタジオ内で受託開発案件に特化した「バンダイナムコスタジオ 第2スタジオ/Sスタジオ」公式サイトです。『大乱闘スマッシュブラザーズ SPECIAL』『マリオカート8 デラックス』『マリオカート ツアー』 等手がけたタイトルの紹介や社員インタビューなどを掲載し、志高いクリエイター達の参戦を待っています！

www.bandainamcostudios.com

If you look at the art/design on this page you can tell it's at least some of the same people as the Sakurai videos. And I could be misremembering, so take it with a grain of salt, but I believe it was stated he's using some of the production team that worked on the DLC showcase videos.