Momentum Deconfirmed for Brawl.

[Proverbs]

This is probably the thing that frustrates me the most about Brawl. Another point where they stepped backwards.

Now, let me ask you who don't know what I'm talking about to perform a little experiment. Pop in Melee (if you have it) in go into training mode with Captain Falcon on Final Destination. Now, first jump and then DI to the right. Secondly, go all the way to the left of the stage and run about halfway and jump while running, continuing the DI to the right. Did you feel the momentum Falcon had? Now do the same thing with Brawl.

Problem. Brawl gives characters no momentum after a run. This doesn't even make sense and inhibits good gameplay. Besides the fact that having run momentum would add another element to the game to give it more depth, Brawl lacking this feature is downright stupid. This is something incredibly fundamental and is experienced, as I'm sure you know, in reality. Around eighth grade I was able to jump seven feet from standing and around 15 feet+ after a run. Momentum, it exists in the real world. They took that into account for Melee and possibly 64.

So why take a step backwards with Brawl? Captain Falcon is the second fastest in Brawl and the fastest in Melee (and 64). This guy has some killer momentum stored up after he runs. So why is it that he seems to only be able to jump the same distance after a run? Perhaps this is also what inhibits his edgeguarding game that he had in Melee--the ability to jump all the way to the horizontal barrier and Falcon Punch a recovering opponent (just because you can!). This is ruined in Brawl.

So why am I writing this? Because I'm frustrated. Seriously frustrated. It seems like they just gave us a whole load of eye candy and said "Go ignore physics." How stupid do they think we are?

Games are supposed to have a sort of enhanced reality, or a surreality, but not something completely unbelievable. As it is, it's so hard to believe Brawl. The physics don't jive with what we know about reality and there was no purpose to making the two not go along with one another. Being able to jump in the air doesn't make sense when it comes to physics, but that adds another element to the game. This, however, is just downright stupid.

Anyone else share my frustration? I feel like this definitely contributed to the downfall of our dear Captain.

 

[Blackbelt]

oh, suck it up.



This is Brawl, not Melee 2.0


Stop acting like it's otherwise.

 

[SSBB4all]

I am pretty sure that human beings don't have a second jump or a recovery move, like they did in Melee. Correct me if I am wrong. Physics don't appyly in SSB. Sorry.

 

[Proverbs]

^ [This is in reference to Blackbelt] I was making a remark about how Brawl's physics don't make sense. I could just as easily have compared it to a different game which accomplished what Brawl did not. I think even that Super Smash Flash game that was put up on the internet factored momentum in. Not dead certain, but I'm pretty sure.

Brawl is a different game, but it also Melee's sequel. If the sequel detracts from what was in the original game as far as depth--and even sense goes, there's a problem.

Please don't just post saying "Cry moar" or whatever. If you have something important to say, let me know. Just because I'm not praising Brawl doesn't mean my post has no value.


SSBB4all--Did you not read my post or something? Didn't I mention that double jumps added something to the game? But doesn't the lack of momentum detract from it? Clearly you either didn't understand what I was saying or didn't even read all of it.

 

[SSBB4all]

^ [This is in reference to Blackbelt] I was making a remark about how Brawl's physics don't make sense. I could just as easily have compared it to a different game which accomplished what Brawl did not. I think even that Super Smash Flash game that was put up on the internet factored momentum in. Not dead certain, but I'm pretty sure.

Brawl is a different game, but it also Melee's sequel. If the sequel detracts from what was in the original game as far as depth--and even sense goes, there's a problem.

Please don't just post saying "Cry moar" or whatever. If you have something important to say, let me know. Just because I'm not praising Brawl doesn't mean my post has no value.


SSBB4all--Did you not read my post or something? Didn't I mention that double jumps added something to the game? But doesn't the lack of momentum detract from it? Clearly you either didn't understand what I was saying or didn't even read all of it.

You are trying to compare Melee's physics to real life, which you did when you were talking about momentum. I am simply saying that you can't compare real life physics to a game's physics. That's just stupid.

 

[thumbswayup]

I thought you meant no comeback momentum. In Melee, comebacks were always possible and you never had a match won until the end. It's such a great game, that any player of amazing skill can go insane for 3 stocks and make an amazing comeback (due to the freedom you had with your character AND COMBOS).

In Brawl, when you're losing by a significant amount, it's over. You have no chance of coming back to win. You can only trade hits for so long before you die.

Anyways, you're momentum meaning falls into the whole dash dancing being removed from Brawl, which pisses me off to no end. So, that's another two reasons why Brawl is terrible.

 

[SSBB4all]

I would also like to add that sometimes adding real life "physics" to a game can be one of the stupidest moves ever. Ehhem... TRIPPING... Ehhem....

 

[Proverbs]

You are trying to compare Melee's physics to real life, which you did when you were talking about momentum. I am simply saying that you can't compare real life physics to a game's physics. That's just stupid.

It isn't when certain things were removed from previous games. The thing is that they actually dumbed down the game. I'm comparing to the previous game and just common sense is all. But you seem to have a problem with me comparing two very closely linked games. Why that is I have no idea. I'm just appealing to your common sense.

And I can compare it to real life physics. This game has some of them. Gravity is downwards most of the time, as it is in real life. No one wields swords with their feet. Dash attacks are performed in a natural way as opposed to unnatural ways (like doing a backwards f-smash while dashing). The same concept applies. Momentum is something that is commonly accepted as are the other things.

This game becomes more unbelievable (not unrealistic) and thus the game is...made worse.

 

[Demon Kirby]

@thumbswayup: your constant praising of Melee like it's the game to end all games pisses me off

@Proverbs: I noticed this while playing Falcon in Brawl for the first time. It really pisses me off as well. Strangely enough, it's really just the small things that really anger me about this game (auto-sweetspot on the ledge, I hate you).

 

[JrdnS]

I am pretty sure that human beings don't have a second jump or a recovery move, like they did in Melee. Correct me if I am wrong. Physics don't appyly in SSB. Sorry.

theres second jumps and recovery moves in brawl too. what are you talking about? and physics somewhat are applied in SSB. but proverbs find just proves one way that brawl has digressed the ssb games realism. and we all know that the things in ssb arent possible

 

[Yukiwarashi]

I thought you meant no comeback momentum. In Melee, comebacks were always possible and you never had a match won until the end. It's such a great game, that any player of amazing skill can go insane for 3 stocks and make an amazing comeback (due to the freedom you had with your character AND COMBOS).

In Brawl, when you're losing by a significant amount, it's over. You have no chance of coming back to win. You can only trade hits for so long before you die.

Anyways, you're momentum meaning falls into the whole dash dancing being removed from Brawl, which pisses me off to no end. So, that's another two reasons why Brawl is terrible.

If he could, Lucario would give you the middle finger.

 

[AlmightyJeebus]

Just believe that since this game was released so early in the system's lifespan, there is possibility for another, better one in the future.

 

[Proverbs]

Just believe that since this game was released so early in the system's lifespan, there is possibility for another, better one in the future.

Definitely encouraging. Thank you.

 

[JrdnS]

Just believe that since this game was released so early in the system's lifespan, there is possibility for another, better one in the future.

that would be incredible.

 

[WoodyWiggins]

that would be incredible.

Don't believe that, there's no turning back.

 

[aznegglover]

In real life, we don't club each other over the heads with hammers as Pokemon either

 

[AlmightyJeebus]

Don't believe that, there's no turning back.

You kids and your fancy alternate text and sich, you all should just go proceed with the epic phailage elsewhere.

 

[Veggi]

I never noticed that before, I guess that's something to get annoyed about. I guess we all get bothered by some things, like I get completely frustrated when I think of some of the stupid movesets that were made. Mario can't crawl, when he obviously could in 64. Mario can't glide when he obviously has a cape, that doesn't even function anything like in the games. FLUDD has to be primed. There are always two parts to FLUDD where any of the other functions could help his recovery, yet he just lets himself die. The list goes on much further. Somehow I don't see alot of people care about it as much as I do.

 

[Magus-Cie]

I am just now being told Melee's physics were lifelike.

Wavedashing IRL for the win.

 

[Steck]

Just believe that since this game was released so early in the system's lifespan, there is possibility for another, better one in the future.

I doubt it. Melee was released early in the GameCube's lifespan. Brawl is what the Wii has till Nintendo makes another system (if they survive by catering to casuals).

 

[Rampage]

oh, suck it up.



This is Brawl, not Melee 2.0


Stop acting like it's otherwise.

This is the lamest excuse ever, you make it sound as if brawl is a child that can't stand on it's own 2 feet with any other argument than this. We know it's not melee, but that doesn't mean it has to be 100% different. Did you see the jump from 64 to melee? Yes, melee was different, but it enhanced the experience by added faster gameplay and spectacular combos. Now look at the jump from melee to brawl. it was simply horrible. and it was VERY different. but it did not bring to the table what melee did, it actually took a step backwards. stfu and stop saying this "melee 2.0" BullSh*t, We know it's not, but if it were, the game would have been 41241321x better than it is right now.

 

[Demon Kirby]

I doubt it. Melee was released early in the GameCube's lifespan. Brawl is what the Wii has till Nintendo makes another system (if they survive by catering to casuals).

May I please direct you to the console sales chart... Nintendo is performing just fine, and still would even without Brawl.

 

[WoodyWiggins]

Just believe that since this game was released so early in the system's lifespan, there is possibility for another, better one in the future.

I doubt it. Melee was released early in the GameCube's lifespan. Brawl is what the Wii has till Nintendo makes another system (if they survive by catering to casuals).

fancy alternate text

 

[Steck]

I like Brawl btw

May I please direct you to the console sales chart... Nintendo is performing just fine, and still would even without Brawl.

I know but...how many wii sports games can you make over a system generation and still have people buy it? I just wonder if the company's scheme will run out while the 360 still goes strong.
On the other hand Nintendo is smart so I guess they will most likely survive (by survive I mean not be like Sega)

 

[AlmightyJeebus]

I doubt it. Melee was released early in the GameCube's lifespan. Brawl is what the Wii has till Nintendo makes another system (if they survive by catering to casuals).

Dude, don't ruin it for 'em, they have no way of knowing that, even though nintendo never listens to there fans.

 

[Chum]

360 still going strong? I know it is currently in second leading the PS3 by 5 million units but the PS3 is currently out selling the 360. Don't plan on the wii losing ground any time soon since it's sale's are increasing. The wii currently holds 46% of the home console market (about 29 million units).

About the physics; different engines I believe brawl uses the havoc physics engine, I might be wrong though. Also I don't see how real physics can even be compared to the physics of either game.

 

[IM_A_HUSTLA]

this thread is so not worth the time to read,

why are people complaining about brawl on in the brawl boards

go post this **** in the melee part of this site not the brawl part

 

[AlphaZealot]

I'm confused, the entire concept of RARing is based off of forward momentum, ROFL.

Did you actually mean diminished?

 

[Tofu Beast]

^ what he said.

Your post didn't make a whole lot of since....

Also, why are people talking about the Wii?!
How is that at all relevant to this.

 

[Hughalicous]

Does the fact that things fall at different speeds, double jump, gain momentum from seemingly nothing with recoveries, Halt momentum from things like falling with Lucarios dair, gain momentum from sonics dair, Hitting people with a SWORD knocks them away, rather then cutting them in half, A person spinning around realy fast gives them upwards momentum, A princess can float, If I hit you once, you fly x, I hit you twice, you fly y. Smash isn't even set in a real world, what do you expect from it. THE CHARACTERS COME BACK TO LIFE IF THEY DIE?!??!!! Nothing is real.

There aren't actual physics in smash. Thats part of what makes Nintendo and Smash awsome, they aren't confined to realism. If you want a game with real physics and such, I'm sure you can find some sort of flight simulator for your computer, cause thats about the only games in existence that don't bend the rules of physics. Even games supposedly set in real worlds don't have physics that is true to real life. Some come close, and burn out your processor running, but none will have perfect physics. Go fight randoms in real life if you want physics, cause thats the only place the laws of physics even have to apply in.

 

[The Executive]

I want my Melee Falcon back.

 

[Spin-Dash]

^

Now that is something that everyone can agree with.

Oh well, Brawl Falcon's still fun sometimes.

 

[Vyse]

Just believe that since this game was released so early in the system's lifespan, there is possibility for another, better one in the future.

I'm going to be 25 before a new smash comes out.

 

[Gory snake]

This is the lamest excuse ever, you make it sound as if brawl is a child that can't stand on it's own 2 feet with any other argument than this. We know it's not melee, but that doesn't mean it has to be 100% different. Did you see the jump from 64 to melee? Yes, melee was different, but it enhanced the experience by added faster gameplay and spectacular combos. Now look at the jump from melee to brawl. it was simply horrible. and it was VERY different. but it did not bring to the table what melee did, it actually took a step backwards. stfu and stop saying this "melee 2.0" BullSh*t, We know it's not, but if it were, the game would have been 41241321x better than it is right now.

This man speaks the truth.

I am just now being told Melee's physics were lifelike.

Wavedashing IRL for the win.

He said the momentum of Melee was lifelike, not every little thing, and you've seriously never wavedashed in real life? You should try it.

this thread is so not worth the time to read,

why are people complaining about brawl on in the brawl boards

go post this **** in the melee part of this site not the brawl part

That makes no sense at all, a Brawl thread should be in the BRAWL forum

 

[hippochinfat!!]

oh, suck it up.



This is Brawl, not Melee 2.0


Stop acting like it's otherwise.

So what if it's Brawl? It's still a sequal and they have no reason to take it out. It was one of my favourite things in Melee about Falcon and other fast characters.

Anyways, I noticed the first time I played.

 

[PCHU]

I think it's stupid how you can trip from starting a run, but you can't use the momentum in the run?
So what exactly are we tripping from?
Momentum brings us forward, so how do we trip?
Perhaps every character has invisible shoelaces.

 

[Witchking_of_Angmar]

Yeah, it's been known for a while and it's one of my biggest gripes with Brawl as well.

You're not gonna be running much anyway in Brawl cuz of tripping though. :/

 

[thumbswayup]

@thumbswayup: your constant praising of Melee like it's the game to end all games pisses me off

@Proverbs: I noticed this while playing Falcon in Brawl for the first time. It really pisses me off as well. Strangely enough, it's really just the small things that really anger me about this game (auto-sweetspot on the ledge, I hate you).

Interesting how you insult me for praising Melee, then bash Brawl in the same post. You're really starting to annoy me, I've had problems with your trolling my posts in the past. You must hate me or something, but it's got to stop.

 

[Zema]

My GOD. If people hate Brawl why do they tell us to go back to Melee?!

I have Melee, and I dont give a rat about the **** physics that aren't in Brawl. I find Brawl way more fun than Melee, but thats just me, a regular gamer. I personally hate competitive gamers who say "Omg this sequel is terrible because it has no wavedash, no l-cancel and it feels like being underwater". NO! It does not! It is a Melee which I dreamed of! No tactics or glitches! It is just a simple game of Melee without the speed that glitches give you! I can finally fight someone who doesn't win by a glitch of the game.

Just leave Brawl alone if you don't enjoy it.

P.S. Bashing a part of a series is stupid. It's like saying the series itself sucks. Suck it up and don't share your hate for a game.

 

[SamuraiPanda]

This fact has been known for awhile. Running does not give you extra momentum in the air. You can just walk and jump forward, and you'll have the same momentum as if you were in the middle of a dash.

However, this does not give you an excuse to post another debate thread. Go post this in one of the existing debate threads if you want to continue it.