Q&A Kirby's Pondering Curse - Kirby Q&A/FAQ/Directory [CHECK HERE BEFORE MAKING A NEW THREAD]

[Mr.CreamCakes]

Overall is kirby nerfed or buffed?

 

[Asdioh]

Let's see. http://www.ssbwiki.com/Kirby_(SSB4)#Changes_from_Brawl I don't know how accurate this is, but there's a list.
He feels roughly the same or better, but at the same time it feels like more things were nerfed than buffed. Let's go over every move!

Inhale: feels the same, does more damage with Copy which is nice. Doesn't have superarmor like grabs and command grabs did in Brawl though, so if people hit you while you're sucking them in, you both take damage but don't get the Inhale.
Hammer: different uses than Brawl, gives Kirby stronger KO potential than ever before if you can break their shield or somehow land a fully charged hammer.
Final Cutter: feels exactly the same, but they nerfed the range of the projectile. Because the projectile was just oh so overpowered before.
Stone: feels the same.

Jab: better than ever because of the finisher. It's one of the better jabs in the game.
Ftilt: range feels nerfed. Still pretty useful but not as safe?
Dtilt: feels better possibly
Uptilt: it was good in every game, with n64 being best. It feels second best in this game, definitely a good combo starter and one of his best moves.
Dash attack: still pretty mediocre, but better than it was in Brawl because of how you can't escape multihit moves as easily.

Fsmash: feels nerfed! Less crazy priority, possibly a bit weaker.
Dsmash: might feel nerfed. I think the knockback angles were changed, and I feel like it should KO at lower percents than it does.
Upsmash: not sure if better or worse than Brawl, but it's pretty good. Probably basically the same. The page I linked says it's buffed.

Grab: his grab range was reduced I guess, but so was basically everybody from brawl. It's still pretty good.
Pummel: he basically has the second highest DPS pummel in the game, it's amazing.
Fthrow: has few or no combos, even at zero percent.
Bthrow: has a backthrow->bair combo on about half the cast at very low percents. No followups available after that. It can KO in this game at high percents, which is nice.
Upthrow: supposedly has more KO power than Brawl according to this website, but I don't feel it, with how DI works in this game. It's his most useful throw after early percents because it does the most damage.
Dthrow: absolutely sucks, only does about 7% and has NO followups because it has stupid high knockback at all percents.
Which is ABSOLUTELY DISGUSTING considering how they gave a TON of characters GUARANTEED followups from their throws (mostly downthrows) at MOST percentages. Looking at you, Diddy/Dedede/Mario/Sheik/Greninja/Palutena/etc.

Nair: super buffed. Combo breaker, combo starter, dodge punisher. I feel like it went from his worst aerial to one of his best, but I can't put my finger on what they changed exactly.
Fair: feels the same or better. Might have less range than before? Can start combos with hits 1 or 2 as you land on the ground, can KO near the edge with hit 3, pretty fast and good spacing move.
Bair: definitely feels nerfed. Less range, lower duration for sweetspot? Feels much harder to sweetspot with. Can no longer act after a short hop Bair. Still a good move to space with and get KOs with, but not his bread and butter move (for me) anymore.
Dair: feels buffed overall. I think. Definitely feel like it meteors better by itself, and feels easier to footstool with as well. Leads into some guaranteed followups onstage such as a tilt or grab, occasionally a smash. Problem is they can also tech it onstage which means it will probably be detrimental later on in the game's life when people know to tech it?
Upair: feels great in this game, hard to say if it's buffed or the same. Definitely combos into itself or just generally puts them in a bad spot.


And according to that site Kirby runs/walks faster, and moves faster in the air, which is what he needed, but it isn't overall noticeable with Smash4's increased speed. Also says his weight is nerfed which is NOT what he needed.


Anyway he feels the same or better to me, and he's viable. So yeah.

 

[Mr.CreamCakes]

Let's see. http://www.ssbwiki.com/Kirby_(SSB4)#Changes_from_Brawl I don't know how accurate this is, but there's a list.
He feels roughly the same or better, but at the same time it feels like more things were nerfed than buffed. Let's go over every move!

Inhale: feels the same, does more damage with Copy which is nice. Doesn't have superarmor like grabs and command grabs did in Brawl though, so if people hit you while you're sucking them in, you both take damage but don't get the Inhale.
Hammer: different uses than Brawl, gives Kirby stronger KO potential than ever before if you can break their shield or somehow land a fully charged hammer.
Final Cutter: feels exactly the same, but they nerfed the range of the projectile. Because the projectile was just oh so overpowered before.
Stone: feels the same.

Jab: better than ever because of the finisher. It's one of the better jabs in the game.
Ftilt: range feels nerfed. Still pretty useful but not as safe?
Dtilt: feels better possibly
Uptilt: it was good in every game, with n64 being best. It feels second best in this game, definitely a good combo starter and one of his best moves.
Dash attack: still pretty mediocre, but better than it was in Brawl because of how you can't escape multihit moves as easily.

Fsmash: feels nerfed! Less crazy priority, possibly a bit weaker.
Dsmash: might feel nerfed. I think the knockback angles were changed, and I feel like it should KO at lower percents than it does.
Upsmash: not sure if better or worse than Brawl, but it's pretty good. Probably basically the same. The page I linked says it's buffed.

Grab: his grab range was reduced I guess, but so was basically everybody from brawl. It's still pretty good.
Pummel: he basically has the second highest DPS pummel in the game, it's amazing.
Fthrow: has few or no combos, even at zero percent.
Bthrow: has a backthrow->bair combo on about half the cast at very low percents. No followups available after that. It can KO in this game at high percents, which is nice.
Upthrow: supposedly has more KO power than Brawl according to this website, but I don't feel it, with how DI works in this game. It's his most useful throw after early percents because it does the most damage.
Dthrow: absolutely sucks, only does about 7% and has NO followups because it has stupid high knockback at all percents.
Which is ABSOLUTELY DISGUSTING considering how they gave a TON of characters GUARANTEED followups from their throws (mostly downthrows) at MOST percentages. Looking at you, Diddy/Dedede/Mario/Sheik/Greninja/Palutena/etc.

Nair: super buffed. Combo breaker, combo starter, dodge punisher. I feel like it went from his worst aerial to one of his best, but I can't put my finger on what they changed exactly.
Fair: feels the same or better. Might have less range than before? Can start combos with hits 1 or 2 as you land on the ground, can KO near the edge with hit 3, pretty fast and good spacing move.
Bair: definitely feels nerfed. Less range, lower duration for sweetspot? Feels much harder to sweetspot with. Can no longer act after a short hop Bair. Still a good move to space with and get KOs with, but not his bread and butter move (for me) anymore.
Dair: feels buffed overall. I think. Definitely feel like it meteors better by itself, and feels easier to footstool with as well. Leads into some guaranteed followups onstage such as a tilt or grab, occasionally a smash. Problem is they can also tech it onstage which means it will probably be detrimental later on in the game's life when people know to tech it?
Upair: feels great in this game, hard to say if it's buffed or the same. Definitely combos into itself or just generally puts them in a bad spot.


And according to that site Kirby runs/walks faster, and moves faster in the air, which is what he needed, but it isn't overall noticeable with Smash4's increased speed. Also says his weight is nerfed which is NOT what he needed.


Anyway he feels the same or better to me, and he's viable. So yeah.

His down smash was actually buffed with better speed, power, and range

Fthrow actually has quite few combos

Dash attack is actually stronger

stone is actually buffed like it kills at 70 and does so much shield damage

 

[Unknownkid]

I can see maybe speed for Dsmash but range and power? The hit box for it is weird. Sometimes, you can hit at the tip and other times you cannot. I need frame data.
Fthrow actually has quite combos? Like what? All we know is Fthrow->Fair which can be cancel into other stuff. But that is Fair has quite a few combos to it.

 

[2Mixer]

idk if i am too dumb or maybe cuz i am using tab jump...

but what is the exact input for bthrow2bair?

 

[Unknownkid]

Back Throw -> Opposite Direction "of where you are facing" Attack In the Air?

 

[Mr.CreamCakes]

honestly I think the worst thing that was nerfed was bair like it was amazing and they nerfed its range, sweetspot duration, and they added lag. it killed well, it still kills but its harder to sweetspot now. idk if uptilt to bair works anymore cuz it worked in brawl. Even though it was nerfed omg nair is like amazing now. it can cover air dodges, it can start combos, it breaks combos. Words don't describe how much I love this move.

 

[Asdioh]

idk if i am too dumb or maybe cuz i am using tab jump...

but what is the exact input for bthrow2bair?

Grab, hit back to throw, continue holding back and then MASH A, and you do bair since bthrow puts you in the air.

Also fthrow fair really doesn't work if they DI away from you.

 

[Mr.CreamCakes]

I don't see why people r saying that down throw is bad. It's great for stage control, and it also puts them in an awkward position.

 

[GrnFzzTgr]

Down throw is bad because the damage is miniscule and we can't follow up from it. Please define what you mean by "it puts enemies in a bad position" and "it's great for stage control." Are you sure you're not using meta knight, who is a character that can combo from his down throw? Even drag the enemy across part of the stage while doing it?

I think the only reason any of us use down throw is A. out of habit, B. because we love seeing Kirby dance on somebody's face. Otherwise we're better off with Fthrow- (which has limited combo ability, works on some foes, but can be avoided with DI, Up-throw for damage, or back throw off stage and for it's limited combo, and it's ability to kill at the edge of stage sometimes.)

I don't know, but I can't help but feel like he was better in brawl. Sure he got buffed in smash 4, but most everybody else did too. He feels underpowered to me in smash 4, and it feels like the majority of my battles with him are uphill. I can win, sure, but I have to work much harder than users of other characters do.

That said, Nair is awesome now, and I honestly don't use it enough.

Also correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't B-Air and Fair used have disjointed properties? I don't feel like they do anymore?

 

[iMAGN]

Ok, I can't stand the problem simply known as ROB

He outranges, outspeed, outspams, and overpowers kirby in every whay
He can recove easily from the bottom

Its nearly impossible to approach him
His spinning top breaks shield and Camo one is hard to see

He can spam nearly as much as pit
He can gimp a recovery or simple ledgegrab
His grab is outrageous
His upthrow nearly always KOs at 120 percent

The only way to really KO him is off the side... but his range stops kirby from doing any sort of Fsmash or FSpecial

HELP

the only way I have seemed to get some sort of damage is by spamming hopelessy UpSpecial and Bair, but it leaves me wide open. I can't seem to get any combos whatsoever

100% this guy

 

[GrnFzzTgr]

I believe rob is vulnerable to being juggled. I played a pretty decent rob on For Glory once who kept getting into aerial battles with me, I found myself having to bait out his aerials (he loved nair and back air) and then juggling him with Up air. That's the only advice I can give, try to get him into a juggle. It's one of the few robs I ever played, but certainly one of the best I ran into.

 

[iMAGN]

What if it's a noobish Little Mac, and you got him on the edge for whatever reason. Is it still a bad way to get a free stock on them?

I utilize Kirbycide religiously. It's no gimmick and I'm currently working on an advanced edge tech guide. If you want to see my rough draft let me know.

 

[iMAGN]

I believe rob is vulnerable to being juggled. I played a pretty decent rob on For Glory once who kept getting into aerial battles with me, I found myself having to bait out his aerials (he loved nair and back air) and then juggling him with Up air. That's the only advice I can give, try to get him into a juggle. It's one of the few robs I ever played, but certainly one of the best I ran into.

lol Rob gains momentum So quickly.. how do I break it? Getting in is so hard he stops everything I try..

 

[GrnFzzTgr]

Kirbycide is fun, but I usually find myself punished or disadvantaged for trying it.

 

[GrnFzzTgr]

Well, really, we have to space ourselves and be more patient. Being totally aggressive doesn't help us in a lot of match ups, which is something I'm learning. I don't like it since I'm pretty aggro myself, but I have to accept it. I believe quite a few of Rob's attacks have lag on them afterwards don't they? Try to punish after he throws them out. Since he's not easy to gimp we have to try to kill him out right. There are some attacks rob throws out that we can duck under as well. I had one person complain to me about Kirby being too short against rob, forcing him to change how he handled the matchup >_>

 

[iMAGN]

Kirbycide is fun, but I usually find myself punished or disadvantaged for trying it.

It's really an art. I'm working on perfecting it, I feel like I'm close to a breakthrough

 

[iMAGN]

.Would you be willing to read My guides rough draft? It's in its first stages but my main headings and initial overview is mostly there.

 

[warriorman222]

I utilize Kirbycide religiously. It's no gimmick and I'm currently working on an advanced edge tech guide. If you want to see my rough draft let me know.

Ok, I need to work on my jokes BADLY. That was a joke.

 

[iMAGN]

Ok, I need to work on my jokes BADLY. That was a joke.

only because you don't have the dexterity to manage it. Works for me and my rising win rate.

 

[Mr.CreamCakes]

Down throw is bad because the damage is miniscule and we can't follow up from it. Please define what you mean by "it puts enemies in a bad position"

It gives u stage control and if ur on the edge and downthrow a captain falcon or a character with similar recoveries, U would want to be in that position

 

[Masonomace]

Heyy Kirby Q & A thread, first time posting here (I think) & I have a few questions about how some of Kirby's moves work: (Also please quote my post as I didn't watch this thread, sorry but thank you)

• How does Kirby's spitting attack with a character work now in terms of collateral damage? (Still weight-dependent?)
  
  
• Does a Monado Art that affects Kirby's weight decrease / increase the falling speed of Stone?

 

[GrnFzzTgr]

It gives u stage control and if ur on the edge and downthrow a captain falcon or a character with similar recoveries, U would want to be in that position

Back throw or forward throw are still better options in this case. If you fast fall a fair after a forward throw at the edge of the stage, you can drag a foe downward offstage IIRC. Still much better than down throw.

Also you haven't explained how down throw supposedly gives stage control, you just keep saying it does without any examples.

No offense, but you're not sounding very credible to me.

Also people typing in short-hand instead of full words is a bit of a pet peeve of mine.

 

[The Pink Marshmallow]

I only use it to watch him dance on the opponent's face

 

[Agent Emerald]

Heyy Kirby Q & A thread, first time posting here (I think) & I have a few questions about how some of Kirby's moves work: (Also please quote my post as I didn't watch this thread, sorry but thank you)

• How does Kirby's spitting attack with a character work now in terms of collateral damage? (Still weight-dependent?)
  
  
• Does a Monado Art that affects Kirby's weight decrease / increase the falling speed of Stone?

1st question: I can't answer this one, since I've yet to hit someone that isn't a Smash run enemy with a star.

2nd question: It doesn't.

 

[Unknownkid]

So guys.. How is the transition from 3ds to Wii U? I don't have my game yet but I want to know what you guys think of Kirby now.

 

[GrnFzzTgr]

The better controllers alone enhances performance. I feel like I'm able to pull off much more than I could int he 3ds version.

 

[Ansou]

I got my Wii U yesterday. I have not yet gotten used to playing with a Wii U Pro controller yet and actually using the C-stick again, but I feel that it will be great once I've gotten the hang of it!

 

[Aunt Jemima]

I got my Wii U yesterday. I have not yet gotten used to playing with a Wii U Pro controller yet and actually using the C-stick again, but I feel that it will be great once I've gotten the hang of it!

Yay! Hopefully you have fun with it!

 

[GrnFzzTgr]

Hope you have fun! I enjoy the wii U pro and the GCN controller, i was using both for a while, but now I use the GCN.

Gosh, I really hope nintendo makes it so the GC controller works for other games...

 

[Ansou]

Hope you have fun! I enjoy the wii U pro and the GCN controller, i was using both for a while, but now I use the GCN.

Gosh, I really hope nintendo makes it so the GC controller works for other games...

I actually have some GC controllers lying around, but I don't really want to use them since they're old and act kinda weird. Figured I'd just use a Pro controller instead so that I could use it for other games as well. It also has a more similar layout to the 3DS (and New 3DS for when it comes out), which I felt was convenient. :3

 

[Nickname87]

Seems to be 3 seconds before you start taking recoil. The only way to land it safely is to use it to punish an extremely laggy move, like Little Mac's Side B.

His hammer flip is acually pretty usefull if you use it in the air cause it comes out much faster, you get two swings, and there seems to be less lag. I got a lot of connects with it.

 

[KirbyandSonicrock14]

Two questions. I played him at a gathering yesterday. I don't got the game yet. I will be getting it this week. Anyways here are my questions.

1. Does he suck?

2. Why haven't I seen a full changelog from brawl to smash 4 1.03 and 1.04?

 

[GrnFzzTgr]

Kirby didn't get changes in the update. So there's no real need to mention the changelog.

 

[Aunt Jemima]

Two questions. I played him at a gathering yesterday. I don't got the game yet. I will be getting it this week. Anyways here are my questions.

1. Does he suck?

2. Why haven't I seen a full changelog from brawl to smash 4 1.03 and 1.04?

Yes, Kirby sucks. Quite literally, as he devours his enemies to then become an identity theif. He's not that great in Smash, either.

No changes were made to Kirby in 1.04,Brawl changes can be seen on the Smash wiki.

 

[Unknownkid]

Two questions. I played him at a gathering yesterday. I don't got the game yet. I will be getting it this week. Anyways here are my questions.

1. Does he suck?

2. Why haven't I seen a full changelog from brawl to smash 4 1.03 and 1.04?

1. Yes, he still sucks and blows. You press the Neutral B/special button to Suck your opponent into your mouth. Then you have a choice to Swallow (B button again) to obtain the opponent power or Blow/Star Shot (A Button instead) to shoot/spit the opponent out.
2. Because Nintendo didn't drop notes and nothing of Kirby has changed. If anyone says otherwise, he/she is high off placebo.

Edit: Oops! Looks like I got Ninja'D. Well played, Reserved.

 

[KirbyandSonicrock14]

Well when I was playing him at the gathering...the dude was just slow...and his new move is so situational I thought all the character spefic combos with Tager in BB was confusing.

 

[Zero Suit Senpai]

When it comes to mashing out of Kirby's inhale, does the game accept both control stick motions and button inputs? Or just one of them? In general, is there a best "strategy" to mashing out of Kirby's inhale, or should you just go ham on your controller?

 

[Salad Bowl]

Yes, Kirby sucks. Quite literally, as he devours his enemies to then become an identity theif. He's not that great in Smash, either.

No changes were made to Kirby in 1.04,Brawl changes can be seen on the Smash wiki.

I think kirbys actually quite good. He's buffed from brawl and I think he's around mid. Mikekirby has been showing people how good kirby is and people are starting to give kirby some credit.

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

Since Sakurai decided to make the Hammer a charge move, I've been having trouble adapting to it. In Brawl, I would use Hammer a lot in the air to punish enemies but in Sm4sh is a little harder to hit because it takes longer to swing despite using an uncharged one. There is also the fact that an uncharged version is slightly weaker than the one in Brawl.

Either way, I want to use this move effectively so any tips?

I've managed to punish a couple of times with it by reading a roll or an air dodge, and boy it's one of the most satisfying feelings ever.