Corner-Trap
Smash Ace
I haven't been on SWF in awhile and I still see that this thread is seriously inactive, I'm sadden by this.
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Ice Climbers Match-Up Thread *Game & Watch*
- Thread starter Corner-Trap
- Start date
NinjaFoxX
Banned via Warnings
i guess because we dont really have much info to go on(well we do,but its in a bunch of other threads)
also,why isint this stickied?
also,why isint this stickied?
KRDsonic
Smash Master
Not sure that I can be that helpful, but I'll try.
My neighbor mains G&W, so I'm used to fighting him with Ice Climbers.
Blizzards can help, but do NOT use them too often, since G&W can absorb it with his bucket extremely quickly. The fact that he can absorb the Ice and send it back at you isn't the main reason you should avoid it, since his bucket with your Ice is one of his weakest buckets, but the reason why you need to remember his Down B is because it can make all of your blizzards useless, so only use blizzards sparingly, to make them unpredictable, and so you can get them in when you actually need to.
I find Ice Blocks to be hand for making him come to me, though G&W can get rid of the Ice Blocks without much trouble by just using his Neutral A or Dtilts. Normally I desync my Ice Blocks against them and use desynced short hopped ones to go above his attacks, or I'll throw in a blizzard. Also, if a G&W user tries to use his bacon to send your Ice Blocks back then don't worry, your Ice Blocks will reach him through his bacon, and his bacon shouldn't hit you (though his bacon is never really a threat).
I don't suggest shield grabbing him much, because chances are a G&W user will approach with his Bair, which he can use to stay out of your grab range.
Normally when I fight a G&W, I try to keep in mind where his Dsmash and Fsmash ranges are, so I'll try to tempt them into using them, but I'll stay just out of the range so I can punish with a grab.
About fighting G&W in the air, I suggest you don't try it. If you end up above him at any time, then he can cause some major trouble for you, and he'll have no problems with getting your nana away then. I've found Uairs to work well against him though. Try to get him above you, since you can space yourself to where your Uair will hit him out of his key, which will force him away from turning the match into an air game.
Their Squall hammer never seems to work against G&W for me, since most of his moves outrange it, so it'll stop you.
One of the things you have an available option of against G&W is that he has no good projectile to make desyncing less useful. G&W tends to have trouble dealing with a desynced Ice Climber, and his best bet is to approach with a Dair or Bair, so keep that in mind.
Anyways, that's how I fight them.
My neighbor mains G&W, so I'm used to fighting him with Ice Climbers.
Blizzards can help, but do NOT use them too often, since G&W can absorb it with his bucket extremely quickly. The fact that he can absorb the Ice and send it back at you isn't the main reason you should avoid it, since his bucket with your Ice is one of his weakest buckets, but the reason why you need to remember his Down B is because it can make all of your blizzards useless, so only use blizzards sparingly, to make them unpredictable, and so you can get them in when you actually need to.
I find Ice Blocks to be hand for making him come to me, though G&W can get rid of the Ice Blocks without much trouble by just using his Neutral A or Dtilts. Normally I desync my Ice Blocks against them and use desynced short hopped ones to go above his attacks, or I'll throw in a blizzard. Also, if a G&W user tries to use his bacon to send your Ice Blocks back then don't worry, your Ice Blocks will reach him through his bacon, and his bacon shouldn't hit you (though his bacon is never really a threat).
I don't suggest shield grabbing him much, because chances are a G&W user will approach with his Bair, which he can use to stay out of your grab range.
Normally when I fight a G&W, I try to keep in mind where his Dsmash and Fsmash ranges are, so I'll try to tempt them into using them, but I'll stay just out of the range so I can punish with a grab.
About fighting G&W in the air, I suggest you don't try it. If you end up above him at any time, then he can cause some major trouble for you, and he'll have no problems with getting your nana away then. I've found Uairs to work well against him though. Try to get him above you, since you can space yourself to where your Uair will hit him out of his key, which will force him away from turning the match into an air game.
Their Squall hammer never seems to work against G&W for me, since most of his moves outrange it, so it'll stop you.
One of the things you have an available option of against G&W is that he has no good projectile to make desyncing less useful. G&W tends to have trouble dealing with a desynced Ice Climber, and his best bet is to approach with a Dair or Bair, so keep that in mind.
Anyways, that's how I fight them.
JustNoOne
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Mar 14, 2008
- Messages
- 1,537
Thank you for reviving the thread, I love you now since I think the ICs boards REALLY need this. =D
Here are two cents of my ways of defeating G&W.
Ice block spam makes G&W users come to me since they can't absorb it with their bucket. But than they tend to use Bair so I try and stop early so I have time to walk back or sidestep to dodge it.
Squall works wonder when I'm behind them, but I feel like most of his attacks have more priority over the ICs
That's what I can think of now
Here are two cents of my ways of defeating G&W.
Ice block spam makes G&W users come to me since they can't absorb it with their bucket. But than they tend to use Bair so I try and stop early so I have time to walk back or sidestep to dodge it.
Squall works wonder when I'm behind them, but I feel like most of his attacks have more priority over the ICs
That's what I can think of now
TKD
Smash Lord
ICES VS GAW is an EVEN MATCHUP. People that have trouble against gaw have to get used to its aerial game.
Grab-friendly IC players get ***** too.
The only bad matchups for IC are, at equal skill level:
MK 30% chance to win (omg nana noooo!!...omg edgeguard omg!!)
R.O.B. 40% chance to win (usually can't 0 to death it)
Olimar 40% chance to win (fsmash>blizzard OMG?? and spiking nana=too good)
Just stop trying to shieldgrab and try to not be stupid. Pressing Z twice per second also counts as not smart. Some characters are too hard to grab if played well, I feel like most of my matches against gaw players, I don't land a single grab. Of course, if you do land a grab, be ready to KO off of it.
IC players tend to think that EVEN MATCHUPS are bad for the ICs. Well they're not. So stop it, it's annoying.
Grab-friendly IC players get ***** too.
The only bad matchups for IC are, at equal skill level:
MK 30% chance to win (omg nana noooo!!...omg edgeguard omg!!)
R.O.B. 40% chance to win (usually can't 0 to death it)
Olimar 40% chance to win (fsmash>blizzard OMG?? and spiking nana=too good)
Just stop trying to shieldgrab and try to not be stupid. Pressing Z twice per second also counts as not smart. Some characters are too hard to grab if played well, I feel like most of my matches against gaw players, I don't land a single grab. Of course, if you do land a grab, be ready to KO off of it.
IC players tend to think that EVEN MATCHUPS are bad for the ICs. Well they're not. So stop it, it's annoying.
TKD
Smash Lord
Backwards dash/shorthop to space out an aerial, into >B is great specially against GAW because he gets stuck in his aerials since they're relatively long. So baiting gaw into trying to land aerials is good so you can space out and hit him back.
The usual blizzarding when falling through platforms and shorhop blizzards to defend yourself work excellent too.
If you land a grab (unlikely), fthrow chain into spike into fastfalled edgehog works great most of the time (although unlikely, your opponent can survive it by DIing towards the stage and teching off of it).
If you land a grab at 90%+, fthrow, make your assistant regrab, make your assistant backthrow into you, upsmash. If your assistant grabs, improvise. You can fthrow into a dash regrab and go for the kill by leading into an upsmash as I just stated.
Nair works great as a reckless attack even against MK and specially against opponents on platforms.
Yep that's it oh and trying to grab after shielding one of gaw's aerials or downtilts is not effective unless you really know what you're doing at the moment. If your opponent messes up near you, and you have more time to punish than to just jab him away, grab into a KO.
That's my advice against gaw. It's an even matchup by the way. I hope this post helps troubled IC players.
Squall Hammer works great. Bait gaw into shorthopping an aerial, shorthop backwards yourself, and fall into him with your squall hammer. Try it out. It makes gaw players try to find another way to attack you. Which is great because if they get too aggressive, you can just blizzard them out of your face.
Shorthopping backwards means
1) You are attempting to space out an attack
2) You can strike back by falling into your opponent with a squall hammer
3) You can fastfall a blizzard if you think >B would be dangerous
4) You can (LOL)...ice...block...maybe...if you're too far and even downB would be dangerous (or useless)
5) You can do nothing and fall airdodging or just fall so your reverse shorthop can't get punished if you think 2), 3) and 4) are all dangerous options.
From 2) to 5) it's ordered from safe to safest, depends on how the spacing is going and stuff
No. 2) means squall hammer is useful. I started out just dashing backwards into >B'ing back, but you can get spaced out (and by gaw, outprioritized with a downtilt or even an aerial if you attacked too early) so it's not as safe but still a great move.
TKD
Smash Lord
I'd say ICs vs G&W is an even matchup. Why are there no new posts or a new matchup up for discussion!? Such a great character, we have to better our knowledge of it by contributing!
FrozenHobo
Smash Hero
there one for ness?
Mmac
Smash Lord
I like to suggest Yoshi for next (This?) week. I don't think he's as easy as you say he is. In fact I think he actually has an advantage over them.
I can post reasons right now as on why, but I don't think you're done with Game & Watch yet. I can wait
I can post reasons right now as on why, but I don't think you're done with Game & Watch yet. I can wait
Mr.Victory07
Smash Lord
Egg lay OMG OMG!
Mmac
Smash Lord
NinjaFoxX
Banned via Warnings
eh?care to enlighten?...
KRDsonic
Smash Master
I actually agree, a good yoshi can give Ice Climbers some trouble, especially with his good aerial approaches, the same reasons peach can give Ice Climbers trouble is the same for Yoshi, he's constantly in the air and is easy to space with.
Mmac
Smash Lord
Well first of all, they're pretty well matched. Yoshi does better in the air, while IC's does better on the Ground, and have more versatile specials. Problem number one is that Yoshi is probably the best separating character against the IC's. Besides his obvious Egg Lay, His Ftilt, Bair, SideB, UpB Eggs, Ground DownB, Quick Discarding with Grabs, and even his Jab can also separate them easily. The main problem is that once Nana is in the air, Yoshi can very easily follow Nana with a 3 Hit Uair WoP for an easy kill with her relatively dumb AI, which in most cases you are unable to follow to save her.
Problem number Two is that Yoshi can gimp the IC's recovery so well, it's redicious. His Dair can cancel out your UpB. What makes it worse is that it desync's it, so if you panic, both you and Nana will do their UpB at the same time, but won't attach to eachother, Not to mention if you do take your time to readjust, Yoshi will have enough time to Edgehog, making you ditch Nana in most cases. It's the same if you're using your SideB. Dair also works, but Eggs are even worse. If you get hit by an egg when you're recovering with your SideB, it will cause you to scatter, and once again, cause a Desync, which will make Nana drop like a rock if you Panic and don't readjust. Course readjusting could also lead to an edgeguard If Yoshi follows up fast enough.
Course, they still have the legendary Infinite, but It's hard to snag an approaching Yoshi due to his fast horizontal speed, going past a shield grab if it happens. Plus a good Yoshi can deal with Nana easily, so you really won't have many chances doing such. Anyways, That's my view on it. I say about a 2 on your scale. We have 6:4 on ours, and I'm not going to lie, Infinites are scary, but he has so many ways to take out Nana, a good Yoshi usually doesn't need to worry about that.
Problem number Two is that Yoshi can gimp the IC's recovery so well, it's redicious. His Dair can cancel out your UpB. What makes it worse is that it desync's it, so if you panic, both you and Nana will do their UpB at the same time, but won't attach to eachother, Not to mention if you do take your time to readjust, Yoshi will have enough time to Edgehog, making you ditch Nana in most cases. It's the same if you're using your SideB. Dair also works, but Eggs are even worse. If you get hit by an egg when you're recovering with your SideB, it will cause you to scatter, and once again, cause a Desync, which will make Nana drop like a rock if you Panic and don't readjust. Course readjusting could also lead to an edgeguard If Yoshi follows up fast enough.
Course, they still have the legendary Infinite, but It's hard to snag an approaching Yoshi due to his fast horizontal speed, going past a shield grab if it happens. Plus a good Yoshi can deal with Nana easily, so you really won't have many chances doing such. Anyways, That's my view on it. I say about a 2 on your scale. We have 6:4 on ours, and I'm not going to lie, Infinites are scary, but he has so many ways to take out Nana, a good Yoshi usually doesn't need to worry about that.
Mmac
Smash Lord
I didn't mean to kill the thread
NinjaFoxX
Banned via Warnings
nah,this threads just pretty slow. we havent really gone through all the matchups(i really dont have enough of my own personal exp. to say enough about many matchups)
JustNoOne
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Mar 14, 2008
- Messages
- 1,537
The thread is only dead since the person that made this thread hasn't updated it, another reason why this thread is kinda dead is because the guy hasn't been on for a month now, I say we need a Mod here and update and sticky the important threads that should have been stickyed.
Mmac
Smash Lord
Well if he hasn't been online for awhile, why don't you just make a new one?
Plus it could use the 10:0 Ratio system for better accuracy
Plus it could use the 10:0 Ratio system for better accuracy
KRDsonic
Smash Master
and whoever makes a new topic could fix the matchups too, sheik is no where near and even matchup for Ice Climbers, they have a 9-1 advantage over her according to the sheik boards (And I've seen it first hand from both sides of IC vs. Sheik battles).