Q&A How to Wreck *****es with Ganon?- Linguini Q&A Thread

[tm]

spider_sense vs a link

https://youtu.be/bM36s5ZFQY0

Gotta grind that dash behind JC grab.

I don't know about you guys, but I think Ganon's cg on Falco just got a lot easier.

https://youtu.be/-WIl_CXLlm4

1:07 and 1:52

LOL. Too bad they can react to which throw it is (uthrow is 17 frames before launching, dthrow is 20 for falcon)

EVO was fun, and I'm super glad that I got to meet Ace and Spidey, and see some of you other guys again.
I got recognized by a stranger who complimented me on my ganon, and Blur went out of his way to compliment me on my set with ORLY. Living the dream lol.

P.S. Blea is easily one of the coolest smashers I've met, so shoutouts to him. He even started an "Ole!" chant for me in losers finals of our pool. :')

P.P.S. I'm not going to EVO next year, but I WILL be going to CEO for the first time, so I'll see you ******* again.

 

[-ACE-]

Yo I mIght be saying **** Evo too. Not nearly enough setups!!!! Other nationals for sure. Nice meeting you too man.

And I just mean knowing left or right means you basically jc grab in that direction and profit lol. Ez$

 

[X WaNtEd X]

So my friend let me borrow one of the new gamecube controllers they made for people to use with smash 4. And actually, it's pretty ****ing good. Within one day of practice I'm back to where I was with pivots. Unfortunately, it seems to be weird when I have to roll the control stick super precisely. So I don't perfect waveland or 1 frame drop quite as consistently as I would with my previous controller. But the inconsistency is very small and within a week I think I'll have adjusted to it completely. I was worried I wouldn't be able to pivot as well on another controller, but I still got that **** down.

 

[X WaNtEd X]

So on the subject of EVO, where is the rest of the Ganon footage? Other than Bizz vs. Kage, of course. Everyone has seen that by now.

 

[-ACE-]

https://youtu.be/96yLMbXnAX4

Blea gelo vs Bizzarro flame

 

[Bwmat]

Is it just me or was bizz playing pretty bad that set against blea? Not that blea was playing bad...

 

[PseudoTurtle]

Yea, wayyyyyy way way too much jumping. That won't work vs luigi.

 

[X WaNtEd X]

I don't think there are any notable Luigi mains in norcal.

Also there were like no grabs from bizz. Gotta get your grabs in that mu

 

[-ACE-]

I think it's known that Blea is a good friend of mine, so I don't want to john for him but he played super nervous against bizz. He asked me for advice once and I could tell part of him feared being the next bizz gfycat lmao. I just reminded him that Ganon is free and bizz likes to use aerial baits. Bizz asked me about Blea and I told him not to spam anything lol. Not sure but Bizz might have thought it was going to be easy. He definitely spammed aerials too much anyway.

https://youtu.be/0z7ZrR8_nZo
That weegee puts in work

When I first saw bizz, both of us were just like YO!! Mandatory hug and catch up time. He tells me he won't be playing too many friendlies after singles since he'd be studying for the Bar. I told him he should study for 3 hours and play melee for 1 hour as a break. He said, you know, I like that ratio that might work out. And I'm like, "bro.... I don't care if I'm one FRAME away from utilt'ing you, you can quit out and go study, it's np" and his eyes got huge and he basically said THIS ****ING GUY lol

 

[-ACE-]

Ian vs Armada pools

https://youtu.be/xA-7GpZ0_SU

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

evo was cool. spider sense and i being in the same pool was pretty silly. kage and i both got 65th iirc. if i had beaten fly like i was supposed to then i'm pretty sure i'd have made top 32. not sure who kage lost to in his pool. bizz placed under both of us, and spider sense beneath him.

pretty hard tournament, but also very silly in seeding/brackets, though i suppose there's really no delaying the inevitable, which is that we will all have to fight the best players.

however, be proud that double ganondorf placed top 8 at one of the most stacked team events of all time. kage/bizz did a phenomenal job and i was very impressed. really wish some of it had gotten recorded.

a shame we didn't get that group picture.

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

oh god plz no that set with armada noOOOOOOO i'm so ****ing bad

 

[-ACE-]

https://youtu.be/uxbz0JVbemQ

1:19:35 bizz vs a decent blonde

 

[-ACE-]

Also.... Darkrain is awesome.

https://youtu.be/r7C_apxHaDw

I died at d1 just past the 21 minute mark. Hilarious

 

[-ACE-]

So who did you lose to Ian? @ Эикельманн [РУС]
Armada and? Edit: OOPS. You said Fly.
And for bizz... Blea and?
Kage losses?

I lost to a decent peach named sergio Rodriguez (no one could handle the surge) and uuaa's fox. Choke artist status.
Spidey lost close ones to Tian's sheik and forward's sheik.
Pseudo lost to zephyr's fox someone and else...
Think tm lost to zephyr too?

 

[Divinokage]

I lost to MacD and Amsa.. I got bracket ****ed really early.

 

[Duel]

Would've made first seed if that was any sort of good indicator. That's a little bogus, but it's cool, I'll get them next year. I need to convince more people to play marth so I can bop them lol.

Yo and I forgot to tell you (you're gonna be pissed lol). When I got to the hotel, we got upgraded from four people in a one bedroom tiny *** room to a king suite. Totally could've fit you with us

If only we'd known beforehand.

God dammit , Lol, I regret not going even more now, but I'm sure I'll see a lot of you at The BiG house 5.

 

[tm]

Yeah lost to Blea (on stream) and Zephyr.

 

[-ACE-]

LOL I never saw that actually

 

[YvngFlameHoe]

CG on marth is only til 12% right? Cause I can get most of my homies to percents higher than that from regrabs, but it might be bad DI

 

[-ACE-]

If he DI's behind you can get the regrab at fairly high percents. For no DI or DI away they can jump or fair out. 2 regrabs are given if you don't pummel from zero. If you pummel, only regrab once.

 

[PseudoTurtle]

I lost to zephyr and some peach player who was decent at best. I definitely think I was the better player, but I have next to zero peach experience. I got kinda bodied lol.

Tm gave me some good advice on the matchup, but implementation is hard on the fly. Fvck peach, campy, veggie throwing entitled b¡tch.

Can anyone give me some good peach advice? It's probably surpassed falco as my worst matchup lmao.

Yo @ Duel we will hang at big house. I wanna see how far that ganon's gotten since last year. Midwest ganons are underrepresented.

 

[Superspright]

I lost to zephyr and some peach player who was decent at best. I definitely think I was the better player, but I have next to zero peach experience. I got kinda bodied lol.

Tm gave me some good advice on the matchup, but implementation is hard on the fly. Fvck peach, campy, veggie throwing entitled b¡tch.

Can anyone give me some good peach advice? It's probably surpassed falco as my worst matchup lmao.

Yo @ Duel we will hang at big house. I wanna see how far that ganon's gotten since last year. Midwest ganons are underrepresented.

There's a lot of advice if you go back a bit...or use the search option. We were discussing her for like 40 pages a month or two ago.

 

[-ACE-]

My biggest mistakes vs Peach lie in the basics. I know what to do but I misread/mis-space stuff and get combo'd.

You basically space/wall her out completely, applying as much pressure as possible while fully respecting her dash attack, dsmash, her float, and the speed of her dj cancel aerials. Grabs are super important and shield DI should be used as often as possible to get more grabs. Catch turnips obviously and get rid of them quickly. And edgeguard her intelligently. Don't let get bait you into going offstage when it isn't safe. Or onstage for that matter! Spacing means so much that Ganon can't afford to give space away.

^^ almost every single time I lose to a peach I ****ed up one of those things.

 

[YvngFlameHoe]

If he DI's behind you can get the regrab at fairly high percents. For no DI or DI away they can jump or fair out. 2 regrabs are given if you don't pummel from zero. If you pummel, only regrab once.

I get ALOT of regrabs, like I feel like im getting more than I should

 

[-ACE-]

I get ALOT of regrabs, like I feel like im getting more than I should

You are. Have fun with it if you want but don't rely on it.

 

[YvngFlameHoe]

How do I practice CG's on sheik? I feel like if I put zelda on lvl1 she'll just change back n forth randomly

 

[-ACE-]

Once she changes to sheik don't let her change back. For DI behind simply turnaround grab for DI full behind up until 43-44%, don't dash. Level 1's DI behind after the first throw typically (which is often partial behind).

 

[YvngFlameHoe]

Yea I just figured that out xD

 

[Coastward]

almost beat 2 notable sheiks in a row at a tournet today.

i think i've figured out how to play against her now, even though i've been kinda on a break. lost because i wasnt punishing full hop nairs properly and i kept dropping chaingrabs.

last friday i was thinking about dropping ganon for fox, but i realized how far i've already come with ganon that it's not worth it. plus there's so much more i can improve and my fox is ass LOL.

how many of you guys already regged for big house 5? i'm all prepped for it so i'll be there 100%.

 

[megacrusher9999]

How notable were the sheiks?

 

[Shiny Mewtwo aka Jigglysir]

almost beat 2 notable sheiks in a row at a tournet today.

Was one of them Seena?

 

[Coastward]

Was one of them Seena?

yup, the other was K.

How notable were the sheiks?

they're like, the next best sheiks after kirbykaze that come to ontario minds when sheik skill is brought up. almost beat a big demon of mine today.

so if anyone can help me with this, i'd appreciate it. @n0ne was telling me that if i dealt with shield pressure better, id be better than ian. so do you guys have good ideas or tricks on how i can practice this when im alone? really wanna get better fast and i think thats whats holding me back at the moment.

 

[X WaNtEd X]

Could someone point me to some videos to study for learning the ICs matchup? I'm struggling against two notorious wobblers in my region. I think I just suck at escaping and avoiding the wobble setups because I usually win in neutral. There are other things I could be improving in this matchup like punishes and edgeguards. I think I have a better idea of how to fix those problems, though. I just hate outplaying an ICs for a stock only to get wobbled.

@ Coastward I think the only thing you can really do on your own is to practice all your in shield and oos options and think about all the different situations where you should use each of them. None of Ganon's in shield and oos options require that much technical precision, but just going through each of them and trying to make them extra crispy will help you think about what you have to do with each other them. But more importantly, you have the luxury of having a lot of recorded footage to go back to. Look at your videos and see what you could've done better when in shield. Maybe you shouldn't have even been shielding in the first place half the time.

 

[-ACE-]

Shielding is best used very briefly as a last resort to maintain any strategic positioning advantage you might have. Shielding is really only bad when it is overused and/or when you shield a well-spaced approach. Shielding obviously kills your mobility and the range of your options. The better your neutral game is, the less often your opponent will be able to pressure your shield effectively. If his approach is mis-spaced, Ganons oos options become twice as effective and much easier to execute. Shield DI also becomes less of a necessity which makes things easier.

Sometimes I like to think of all approaches as if you are about to get uair KO'd by a fox. Minus the straight upward SDI, you should shield DI approaches the same way you SDI out of fox's uair (shield DI forward to AC bair oos, shield DI backwards to retreating AC uair scoop, shield DI either direction to up-b, fh dair oos, wd oos, buffered roll, etc.). If they are going to barely cross you up, shield DI forward bair oos. If they perfectly space an approach, shield di backwards and grab or retreating uair scoop oos. Choose whichever direction makes the spacing of his approach worse.

You'll get a ton more asdi/cc grabs and jabs when people can't attack your shield exactly how they'd like to.

 

[Linguini]

yo dayve, playing with clay later today, time to brush off some heavy rust. join us meng

 

[-ACE-]

I'LL BE THERE. 5 to 9:45pm.

 

[Linguini]

 

[-ACE-]

Leggo!

 

[X WaNtEd X]

Shielding is really only bad when it is overused and/or when you shield a well-spaced approach.

And well spaced approaches are pretty common these days. But there are a lot of things you can do to get past, as you discussed, with shield DI.