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Official General Post-DLC Discussion [Closed]

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Ura

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You made a good point, I said the exact same thing about character completion being about two months LOL look back in the thread and I said something similar to this, I'm betting on Rayman and Snake as the last two characters by the way guys
Could be possible but the only other 3rd party character that can hold up to Cloud's enormous popularity is Banjo TBH. If Sakurai didn't have a 3rd party character as hype as Cloud, he would have undoubtly had some other character being shown off in the November Direct. Not saying Rayman isn't worthy but he doesn't really match up to Cloud the way Banjo does IMO.

Think of it like this. It would be like showing off Ryu in the April Direct instead of Lucas and revealing Lucas and Roy in the June Direct video. Both characters are great (I am a big Roy fan after all) but they just don't match up to Ryu.

Sakurai's obviously saving the best for last here so i'm not expecting any random indie or third party to get in unless said individual happens to be a bear along with his bird.
No.
Because that slot was made in the gap of mid September to early October.
Cloud has far more than a Month to a month and a half's worth of time put into him and the stage.
They couldn't START work until that deal got approved.
I think that slot was for the last character being revealed in December. Would fit well with my theory of the last remaining DLC characters being Cloud, Wolf, Snake, and another big 3rd party name (Banjo most likely).
 
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SwordOfSeals

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Could be possible but the only other 3rd party character that can hold up to Cloud's enormous popularity is Banjo TBH. If Sakurai didn't have a 3rd party character as hype as Cloud, he would have undoubtly had some other character being shown off in the November Direct. Not saying Rayman isn't worthy but he doesn't really match up to Cloud the way Banjo does IMO.

Think of it like this. It would be like showing off Ryu in the April Direct instead of Lucas and revealing Lucas and Roy in the June Direct video. Both characters are great (I am a big Roy fan after all) but they just don't match up to Ryu.

Sakurai's obviously saving the best for last here so i'm not expecting any random indie or third party to get in unless said individual happens to be a bear along with his bird.

I think that slot was for the last character being revealed in December. Would fit well with my theory of the last remaining DLC characters being Cloud, Wolf, Snake, and another big 3rd party name (Banjo most likely).
Yeah see I was on the fence about that, if Cloud was a character who really hyped up the audience then having Snake and Rayman would be a little less hype than him. But also remember this, when that Rayman fake was going around everyone was getting excited, as well as he has a design in the game itself, not only that but I'm pretty sure Snake fans have been spamming the ballot so who knows what can happen in December, but I definitely know what your saying which is why I don't think they will reveal a first party or veteran in December because it wouldn't be as exciting as Cloud. LOL what if Sakurai gives us Tabuu as the last character.
 

Burruni

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Actually another thing about Push, it seems as though he's believed every rumor that's appeared as long as a source was appearent, which is not a good idea. Push is a great guy, don't get me wrong, but I don't think any of these rumors he's believing are true nor do I think we should believe them, unless it's datamining, it's most likely fake. Anyways moving along.

Burruni Burruni , I thought you had a whole rant about third-parties that you were writing, what happened? :3
Here.

WARNING: LONG POST
Let's take a bit of a serious conversation about 3rd Parties past and present, and take a glimpse on how this could very well reflect upon future choices.

With Melee, both Snake and Sonic were in some capacity planned. Kojima asking for Snake in Melee but it being too late in its rushed development to be a thing, and the head of SEGA back in early 2000s stated that Sonic was almost in THAT title itself but once again the tight time kept it shut out.

Then we turn to Brawl, from its very beginning we had our heads REALLY jerk when our first 3rd Party fighter confirmed, namely due to a deal of friends (Sakurai and Kojima) to get :snake:. While not to the degree of a certain Soldier First Class, this was a major surprise because of Snake and Metal Gear being far more associated with Sony, but having the "justification" of his origins on the MSX/NES era and a few re-releases on later Nintendo consoles. Nonetheless, Snake being part of one of the most recognizable games for the industry for crafting the stealth genre to what it is, being held as one of the pinacles for a cinematic approach to game making across all of the Solid titles, and just about any gamer at that time would recognize a "!".

Very late into Brawl, after a LOT of legal back and forth over getting the usage of the rights, we had the classic rival to Mario who arguably truly started Console Wars as we know them, :sonic:. Arguably a bigger piece of Nintendo's history than a fair chunk of the roster then and now, a VERY well received newcomer and possibly the biggest spike in hype that Smash has ever seen, though it did come at a fairly heavy delay which further emphasizes the amount of work in and out of game development to get a 3rd Party fighter some times.

E3, 2013. The reveal of Smash 4.... with the initial trailer closing with :4megaman:. Mega-Fuggin-Man. SUPER FIGHTING ROBOT, MEGA MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN. The hype over this fighter was massive, it was clear, and it was seen as plain as day in the raw excitement from crowd and commentator alike at the Smash Invitational the following year. While arguably the least impactful of the third party characters so far, that... is actually saying a lot. A gaming icon from NES to DS era without a question of fading with sub series across a ton of Nintendo consoles, a legend in his own right. As I've said before, the fact that gamers refer to a bit of common programming as "Megaman-styled respawning enemies" alone says just how integrated the Blue Bomber ended up being.

E3 2014. Arguably the only gaming character more recognizable than :4mario: joined the roster. :4pacman:. Originally pushed by Miyamoto himself for Brawl but declined by Sakurai, a character pulled out full of the arcadey nostalgia of Namco sprinkled into a moveset that embodies one of the forefathers of gaming, arguably the first true gaming 'Character" or "Mascot."

While leaked... we turn to E3, 2015. A shocking choice almost on the level of Snake, especially with miscommunication of Sakurai's stance on Fighting Game characters, :4ryu:. The face of fighting games. The man and series that hit the top 15 best selling games of the SNES twice. The man who's kit was a massive inspiration to :mario64:'s moveset. Even people who wouldn't recognize him by name or look may still very well be familiar with the iconic specials of Haduken and Shoryuken because his legacy goes beyond him to such a level. Hell, his series being one of the first cases of competitive multiplayer for games that wasn't going faster in a race or scoring more points, something that was direct of player vs player.

And now, we have our 6th and arguably most controversial character. :4cloud:. Yes, a poster of the post-Nintendo era for mainline Final Fantasy. However, dig a little deeper. We're still talking about the most iconic protagonist, character, of Final Fantasy. One of the single most well known, well-selling, and impactful series in gaming history that truly carved out and defined the JRPG genre to the points that we hold it to today with 6 main games which started all on Nintendo with plenty of re-releases and spinoffs to dot handhelds and consoles alike even when the main series went to Sony. But there's also a bit of trivia over Cloud and FF7 with Nintendo. When the N64 was attempting to have a Disc Drive add on, the "64DD," that was what Final Fantasy 7 was originally made for. It's only when that was withdrawn and a game on the scale of FF7 was impossible for Cartridges that Sony snatched it. And that game remains one of the most well recieved titles in the entirety of gaming history. A product of its time for variety of gameplay, cinematic cutscenes of some mind-blowing CGI of the age, and a gripping story for the generation of gamers... that's aged about as roughly as Super Mario 64. And, who knows? With the next Dragon Quest title being PS4 & NX, this may damn well be the precursor for FF7 HD going home to Nintendo at last.

Of course, that's where we stand. 6 Third-Party fighters. Y'know how many characters Smash has had if you included all of the cuts (not counting the Forbidden 7's unfinished fighters)?
12 from Smash 64. 14 from Melee. 18 from Brawl. 19 currently for Smash WiiU/3DS.
12 + 14 + 18 + 19 = 63.
Across all of the choices that have, less than a tenth of the additions to Smash have been 3rd Parties. Still an honor. Still something to earn. Still something with damn high credentials.

Given the amount of time and cost for contracting, especially since a nearly-finished Cloud is the most that the Smash 4 DLC team has to show during our 5 month lull? I VERY HIGHLY doubt seeing another 3rd Party character for this game. While some may argue that "getting Cloud of all characters only opens up the door more," it further reinforces the kind of resume you need to have to get into Smash, and the how much the team goes through to make one.

Now, when we look towards the future. We bring to question what new series could be brought up, as we stand that it's still VERY unlikely that any 3rd Party series will get a second character, with :4sonic: at the forefront.

That brings into question: Who has hit gaming history to the level to be on part of this?

:snake:: The man who shaped the Stealth genre and holds as one of the best examples of a Cinematic experience in Video Games. HE got in due to a buddy-buddy deal of makers.

:4sonic:: The classic rival to :4mario: who's become just as much of a household name. The first real example of Console Wars as we know it who's become such an integral part of Nintendo he's just become associated now. Had the push of utterly massive demand behind him.

:4megaman:: An incredibly long lasting series with a strong fanbase through generations that was one of the biggest series of the NES which has become one of the most iconic and integral series to gaming history and the culture with a massive worldwide demand behind him.

:4pacman:: He's Pac-Man. That's really all you NEED to say.

:4ryu:: The King of Fighte-- wrong series. The Fighting Game World Champion. One of the single biggest games on the SNES that rivaled Super Mario World, Donkey Kong Country, and A Link To The Past with re-releases and spinoffs sprinkled across Nintendo's consoles throughout the years. Arguably even "forced" onto Sakurai for getting Megaman in the game.

:4cloud:: The most iconic character from one of gaming's single biggest franchises. The RPG series that overshadows almost all others and the face of it who originally was meant to be part of the N64 Library. One of the single most popular and ranked amongst the "Best" games of all time.


The closest things we have in comparison for standard third parties... comes down to Castlevania. Anything else, even Bomberman, is just not in the same S-Rank kind of gaming series. We'll see what comes... but... that's the biggest series I can think of.

Indies, a subclass of the third party range, solely bank on the hopes of an Indie character "need" being recognized because they are well aware they can't match the calibur of these third party characters. And that's what they will continue to bank on.

I'm just a fan of the series.
I'm not "schooled" for analysis of this stuff.
I'm not paid to try to dissect this kind of stuff.
This is just looking at the cards we've been dealt and being REALLY suspicious of having another Ace in the deck when there's plenty of cards still in the deck.
 
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Kalimdori

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Actually another thing about Push, it seems as though he's believed every rumor that's appeared as long as a source was appearent, which is not a good idea. Push is a great guy, don't get me wrong, but I don't think any of these rumors he's believing are true nor do I think we should believe them, unless it's datamining, it's most likely fake. Anyways moving along.
Don't dump on PushDustIn PushDustIn s good name if you clearly don't know what you're talking about in the first place.

Push has refused to name the source of the reason he believes Shovel Knight has a strong chance, other then saying that is a source that has provided legitimate information in the past. Push has done nothing in the past to show that he's an untrustworthy individual, he provides a constant stream of legitimate and interesting information, he's given us no reason to doubt him.

That said, Push has NEVER said he fully believes the Shovel Knight rumor. Last thing I remember him saying about was that he was around 60-70% confident in it, and that was a while back.

Cloud is an industry icon, Shovel Knight is a one-hit indie character.
And given what was announced a few days ago this line of thinking is straight up naive.

We CLEARLY have no idea what goes on with the Smash Development team and how they get the rights to third party characters. 3 days ago most, if not all people on this board would have said that Shovel Knight was MORE LIKELY then :4cloud:. And we'd all be wrong.
 

NintenZ

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Don't dump on PushDustIn PushDustIn s good name if you clearly don't know what you're talking about in the first place.

Push has refused to name the source of the reason he believes Shovel Knight has a strong chance, other then saying that is a source that has provided legitimate information in the past. Push has done nothing in the past to show that he's an untrustworthy individual, he provides a constant stream of legitimate and interesting information, he's given us no reason to doubt him.

That said, Push has NEVER said he fully believes the Shovel Knight rumor. Last thing I remember him saying about was that he was around 60-70% confident in it, and that was a while back.


And given what was announced a few days ago this line of thinking is straight up naive.

We CLEARLY have no idea what goes on with the Smash Development team and how they get the rights to third party characters. 3 days ago most, if not all people on this board would have said that Shovel Knight was MORE LIKELY then :4cloud:. And we'd all be wrong.
I wasn't trying to, I just disagreed with him is all. I thought there were other rumors he believed, like the Inkling one and the Layton one. I just disagree is all, sorry if I came off the wrong way as that was not my intention.
 
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PushDustIn

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NintenZ NintenZ why are you so obsessed with Shovel Knight? I think it will do you a lot of good not to talk about it/think about it as it's clearly affecting your psyche. Seriously...every post you make lately on the NintenZone is about Shovel Knight and the rumor. You are obsessed with it. Why? I know you dont like SK, but the only reason people are still thinking about this rumor is because you are constantly talking about it.

As far as rumors go, I have a perfect track track record of the ones I posted on Source Gaming so far. Therefore, if SK is wrong it will be the first one that I was wrong to officially commit to. It might have been a mistake but I can say I've done a far better job than 99.99% of the other people who make Smash content when it comes to reporting on rumors/ "leaks" (who--lets be honest, most of the time are doing it for the money. For the record, I lose money on Source Gaming every money. I am NOT making a profit.).

I saw a video yesterday that was about a 4chan rumor that got 90,000 views. It's awful because it just propagates lies...as there is no way Metal Mario is going to be a DLC character or even a regular character...like that doesn't make any sense but people still "report" on obvious BS all the time. Source Gaming posts high quality posts every day. It's not easy, brah. So give me some slack, alright?
 

NintenZ

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NintenZ NintenZ why are you so obsessed with Shovel Knight? I think it will do you a lot of good not to talk about it/think about it as it's clearly affecting your psyche. Seriously...every post you make lately on the NintenZone is about Shovel Knight and the rumor. You are obsessed with it. Why? I know you dont like SK, but the only reason people are still thinking about this rumor is because you are constantly talking about it.

As far as rumors go, I have a perfect track track record of the ones I posted on Source Gaming so far. Therefore, if SK is wrong it will be the first one that I was wrong to officially commit to. It might have been a mistake but I can say I've done a far better job than 99.99% of the other people who make Smash content when it comes to reporting on rumors/ "leaks" (who--lets be honest, most of the time are doing it for the money. For the record, I lose money on Source Gaming every money. I am NOT making a profit.).

I saw a video yesterday that was about a 4chan rumor that got 90,000 views. It's awful because it just propagates lies...as there is no way Metal Mario is going to be a DLC character or even a regular character...like that doesn't make any sense but people still "report" on obvious BS all the time. Source Gaming posts high quality posts every day. It's not easy, brah. So give me some slack, alright?
Because I don't want him to be in the game and he's everywhere I go. I'm sorry, it just won't stop, I didn't mean to drag you into this, I'm honestly ashamed... Please forgive me... Anyways, I just want it to be over, I don't want it to continue, I don't feel like be deserves to be in the game because he's just not an icon, but now I realize that I need to stop spending so much time on it, I'm very sorry, I've lost control over my actions, so what I think I should do is legitimately take a break from Smash, get it out of my head, play other games and whatnot, and etc. I'm a huge fan of your content, and I love it, but I guess stress got to me, and well, yeah. So yeah, it's time I take a break, hopefully we'll get the answers soon. Sorry if I got carried away, I realize you meant nothing bad, I really hope you can forgive me, I just, I don't know. Anyways I'm very sorry about this, I'll be back on the site in two weeks, I need a breather. I hope you can understand that any harm done was unintentional. You're an awesome dude Push, and I love your stuff.
 
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D

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Gonna drop by to say I hope for one of King K. Rool, Bandana Dee, or Snake. These are the last characters I would say I'm invested in as anyone else I want has no shot.
 
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LunarWingCloud

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With Cloud in Smash, I'd really like to see Snake return too, it'd just feel like a natural fit now.

I'm also rooting for Wolf to return, and for King K. Rool and Inkling as newcomers.
 

Spazzy_D

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PushDustIn PushDustIn says that there will be no additional Square Enix content in the game.

I say there will be (likely Mii costumes and music from games other than FF7).

I'm throwing down the gauntlet here in front of all of you. Official bet time, Push. One month of avatar control? A WiiWare/PSN/Steam/Eshop/Live game?

Name your terms!

EDIT: Wrong thread! But so what! Still stands :p
 
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PushDustIn

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PushDustIn PushDustIn says that there will be no additional Square Enix content in the game.

I say there will be (likely Mii costumes and music from games other than FF7).

I'm throwing down the gauntlet here in front of all of you. Official bet time, Push. One month of avatar control? A WiiWare/PSN/Steam/Eshop/Live game?

Name your terms!
Mii Costumes? No Way! They would have appeared in the trailer. Music other than FF7....that's debatable.

If we do avatar control, can you at least use the Warioluma for me if I lose? As long as it's not offensive, you can put him with anything.
 

Spazzy_D

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Mii Costumes? No Way! They would have appeared in the trailer. Music other than FF7....that's debatable.

If we do avatar control, can you at least use the Warioluma for me if I lose? As long as it's not offensive, you can put him with anything.
Yeah, wouldn't dream of doing otherwise. Need Bomberman in some capacity in mine as well.
 

Burruni

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If by some ungodly magic we get a Gilgamesh assist trophy I will call this inclusion a net positive.

I may consider it even if we get Battle of the Big Bridge.
 

LunarWingCloud

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To be fair, it is possible they simply didn't announce all the details of the Smash x FFVII collab. I don't think anything major will come of it, but costumes for the Mii Fighters isn't entirely unlikely.
 

PushDustIn

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Yeah, wouldn't dream of doing otherwise. Need Bomberman in some capacity in mine as well.
Alright I'll bite. If Mii Costumes of other characters come, you can change my avatar to something with WarioLuma for one month. If they don't come I can change your avatar to something with Bomerman for a month.
 

SuperSceptile15

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If you think about it, all the third party characters in/that have been in Smash are iconic ones who rep a different (sub)genre of games
Sonic - Action Platformer
Snake - Stealth
Mega Man - Side-scrolling Shooter
Pac-Man - Arcade/Puzzle
Ryu - Fighting
Cloud - RPG
What genres do that leave us with? FPS, Racing, Survival Horror, Collectathon, etc
Who would be the most iconic characters from each of these genres that belong to series which have history with Nintendo?
 
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Burruni

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If you think about it, all the third party characters in/that have been in Smash are iconic ones who rep a different (sub)genre of games
Sonic - Action Platformer
Snake - Stealth
Mega Man - Side-scrolling Shooter
Pac-Man - Arcade/Puzzle
Ryu - Fighting
Cloud - RPG
What genres do that leave us with? FPS, Racing, Survival Horror, Collectathon, etc
Who would be the most iconic characters from each of these genres that belong to series which have history with Nintendo?
FPS - Duke Nukem (3D was on the 64) or Doomguy (Doom back on the SNES)
Racing - Since most racing series have no major character because they carry no story, I'mma just say...:4mario:
Surival Horror - either someone from Silent Hill (Revelations & Homecoming) or Jill/Chris from Resident Evil (various Nintendo releases).
Collectathon: C'mon, nobody is a more recognizable collectathon character than :4mario:. No matter what angle you wanna try to twist for the Bear & Bird.

And, admittedly, I forgot about attributing Silent Hill or Resident Evil for major third party series, but that's... a bit because a Silent Hill character is one that's just obtuse for Smash and Resident Evil... Iunno, too... standard shooting-y and runs into the same kinda feeling as :snake:
 

SonicMario

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Racing - Since most racing series have no major character because they carry no story, I'mma just say...:4mario:
There is at least :4falcon: Especially if you take into consideration F-Zero GX which did have a story mode.

But I know you're talking about major icons that are the mascots or at the very least quite iconic for their company. As much as we all love the ol' Captain here he's far from being anywhere on a level of Mario and the 3rd Parties represented in Smash.
 

Burruni

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There is at least :4falcon: Especially if you take into consideration F-Zero GX which did have a story mode.

But I know you're talking about major icons that are the mascots or at the very least quite iconic for their company. As much as we all love the ol' Captain here he's far from being anywhere on a level of Mario and the 3rd Parties represented in Smash.
I mean...
The question was over most iconic characters for the Genre.
And Falcon's more known for Smash than F-Zero at this point.
Fast Racing Neo proves that Indies made a F-Zero game for WiiU before Nintendo did and that kills me.
 
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We need someone to fill the linear 3d platformer. So give us Crash :troll:



I dont see a good reason for all of the Square Mii costumes to be in Cloud's trailer. It's the CLOUD trailer for a reason. Plus with there being more info in December about Cloud there is only so much that can be said. Im not 100% on it but I definitely think it's illogical for the Cloud trailer to double as the Square Enix showoff time. The Ryu trailer had one mii costume. Yet the Virtua Fighters would have fit just fine with that criteria.

Not even Megaman exe and Zero from Capcom were shown off. Just Heihachi. I think it's a fair assumption the same could be said for Cloud.
 
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LunarWingCloud

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If they do end up doing Mii Costumes for FFVII I think we can all agree Sephiroth for Sword Fighter, Barret for Gunner, and Tifa for Brawler is a given.
 

RetroBro

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I think people are confusing or allowing themselves to believe that Cloud was not desired at all.

Truth is that most people did not expect him to even be possible. Given the circumstances, it is incredible that a controversial character like Cloud actually MADE it into smash. He's a icon of the PS1, he's owned by Square-Enix, and he's presumably super expensive.

All these comments regarding, "Nobody asked for this" are just echo chamber thoughts. People love FF7 (inb4 FF6 elitists come in and start crying) and are looking forward to seeing him and playing him. People just didn't think he was a realistic vote or possibility.
 
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Ura

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I want to see other FF series have Mii Costumes though TBH. Give me Squall, Tidus, and Zidane swordfighter outfits plz.
 

SwordOfSeals

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If you think about it, all the third party characters in/that have been in Smash are iconic ones who rep a different (sub)genre of games
Sonic - Action Platformer
Snake - Stealth
Mega Man - Side-scrolling Shooter
Pac-Man - Arcade/Puzzle
Ryu - Fighting
Cloud - RPG
What genres do that leave us with? FPS, Racing, Survival Horror, Collectathon, etc
Who would be the most iconic characters from each of these genres that belong to series which have history with Nintendo?
I guess Rayman could be the
"Unique Platformer" who never gets Game Overs and series shows creativity.
If him and Snake come for the final characters we can also have a GRAND 8 PLAYER SMASH OF GAMING ICONS
Nintendo/Sega/Capcom/Namco/SquareEnix/Ubisoft/Konami
 

LunarWingCloud

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I think people are confusing or allowing themselves to believe that Cloud was not desired at all.

Truth is that most people did not expect him to even be possible. Given the circumstances, it is incredible that a controversial character like Cloud actually MADE it into smash. He's a icon of the PS1, he's owned by Square-Enix, and he's presumably super expensive.

All these comments regarding, "Nobody asked for this" are just echo chamber thoughts. People love FF7 (inb4 FF6 elitists come in and start crying) and are looking forward to seeing him and playing him. People just didn't think he was a realistic vote or possibility.
I don't think no one asked for it. It's more like no one EXPECTED it.
 

Ura

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Cloud was certainly not on my list of likely characters for Smash though I was really happy to see him in the game. I'll admit however that I was shocked at first (not in a bad way) when I saw his trailer.
 
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I think people are confusing or allowing themselves to believe that Cloud was not desired at all.

Truth is that most people did not expect him to even be possible. Given the circumstances, it is incredible that a controversial character like Cloud actually MADE it into smash. He's a icon of the PS1, he's owned by Square-Enix, and he's presumably super expensive.

All these comments regarding, "Nobody asked for this" are just echo chamber thoughts. People love FF7 (inb4 FF6 elitists come in and start crying) and are looking forward to seeing him and playing him. People just didn't think he was a realistic vote or possibility.
TLDR it's Ryu all over again. A character a humongous amount of people know and love but think is impossible.

Just a different reason why people thought it was impossible.
 

Kenith

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If you think about it, all the third party characters in/that have been in Smash are iconic ones who rep a different (sub)genre of games
Sonic - Action Platformer
Snake - Stealth
Mega Man - Side-scrolling Shooter
Pac-Man - Arcade/Puzzle
Ryu - Fighting
Cloud - RPG
What genres do that leave us with? FPS, Racing, Survival Horror, Collectathon, etc
Who would be the most iconic characters from each of these genres that belong to series which have history with Nintendo?
FPS - Master Chief
Racing - Banjo
Survival Horror - Jill Valentine
Collectathon - Banjo & Kazooie
 
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Ah man. The entire Shovel Knight thing is interesting. Weather he gets it or not I support him. But enough about that. Nintenzilla I wish you a good break and hope too see you refreshed and back with us in two weeks.
 

Ura

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I know Butt Butt is the subject of a lot of controversy and stuff but do you guys honestly believe they would put him in with characters like Ryu and Cloud in not to mention the possibility of someone like Banjo getting in? That would just be extremely ridiculous TBH. Not to mention that we're nearing the end of Smash DLC and stuff.
 

Moon Monkey

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I think Etika put it perfectly Here (3:46 to 5:29)

I think we all need to get out of this mode of setting up all these imaginary red tapes. Whether they be legal restrictions, profit earnings, representation quotas etc...

Honestly, any character who has any connection with Nintendo, even the slightest is fair game.

When discussing characters, it really isn't matter if it is possible; It's honestly a matter of if we would like them added or not.
 

N64's Our Boy

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I know it seems like a bad request because I know the reasons why this is unreasonable. But I really want the Ice Climbers back just because I like the dual character mechanic but playing Rosalina for me is something that feels so different I can't really do it enough to be competent with that character. But Isaac from Golden Sun would be very nice as well.
 

Arcadenik

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I've said this before and I'll say it again...

Simon Belmont for Smash!!!!
 

Ura

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I think Etika put it perfectly Here (3:46 to 5:29)

I think we all need to get out of this mode of setting up all these imaginary red tapes. Whether they be legal restrictions, profit earnings, representation quotas etc...

Honestly, any character who has any connection with Nintendo, even the slightest is fair game.

When discussing characters, it really isn't matter if it is possible; It's honestly a matter of if we would like them added or not.
Not going to lie, the way Etika came across in that video was condescending and rude. The way he was all like 'haha you guys don't know anything about third party characters" was just so friggin annoying and he came off as such a smug douche. Geez A-Hole, it's not like you thought said character could get in the game either so shut your damn mouth.

You all know i'm all in for Cloud in this game though I really hate those kinds of attitudes.
 

PushDustIn

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I think Etika put it perfectly Here (3:46 to 5:29)

I think we all need to get out of this mode of setting up all these imaginary red tapes. Whether they be legal restrictions, profit earnings, representation quotas etc...

Honestly, any character who has any connection with Nintendo, even the slightest is fair game.

When discussing characters, it really isn't matter if it is possible; It's honestly a matter of if we would like them added or not.
They don't even need a connection to Nintendo. As long as the character's company gives Sakurai permission and the character is important they are fair game.

Etika's video on the topic is good, but he really overestimates development time.

I wrote up a list of 5 Reasons Cloud got into Smash. This article explains why it's Cloud...and not Black Mage, Geno or another SE character that got into Smash.
 

Cutie Gwen

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Not going to lie, the way Etika came across in that video was condescending and rude. The way he was all like 'haha you guys don't know anything about third party characters" was just so friggin annoying and he came off as such a smug douche. Geez A-Hole, it's not like you thought said character could get in the game either so shut your damn mouth.

You all know i'm all in for Cloud in this game though I really hate those kinds of attitudes.
It's Etika, do you expect him to act with tact? We'd sooner get Geno before Cloud than Etika not acting like an idiot
 

True Blue Warrior

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We CLEARLY have no idea what goes on with the Smash Development team and how they get the rights to third party characters. 3 days ago most, if not all people on this board would have said that Shovel Knight was MORE LIKELY then :4cloud:. And we'd all be wrong.
I actually have stated that I believed that Cloud made more sense than Shovel Knight. Also, we do know that one of the requirements of a third-party character is that they must carry gaming history, which Shovel Knight severely lacks in.
 

PushDustIn

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I actually have stated that I believed that Cloud made more sense than Shovel Knight. Also, we do know that one of the requirements of a third-party character is that they must carry gaming history, which Shovel Knight severely lacks in.
Out of the current indie characters, I would see he is the one that is most likely to fulfill that requirement. Shantae doesnt come close in terms of the number of crossovers SK has been in, and Yacht Club Games was the first studio to get their amiibo out so they have a good relationship with Nintendo, at least. I think he's less important to gaming than the 3rd parties by a long shot but to say he has nothing is wrong too (See my April 5th post on Indie Representation in Smash for more arguments against indie rep in Smash). I personally think Steve from Minecraft is the most important "indie" "representative" there is though.
 

True Blue Warrior

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Out of the current indie characters, I would see he is the one that is most likely to fulfill that requirement. Shantae doesnt come close in terms of the number of crossovers SK has been in, and Yacht Club Games was the first studio to get their amiibo out so they have a good relationship with Nintendo, at least. I think he's less important to gaming than the 3rd parties by a long shot but to say he has nothing is wrong too (See my April 5th post on Indie Representation in Smash for more arguments against indie rep in Smash). I personally think Steve from Minecraft is the most important "indie" "representative" there is though.
First of all, none of those crossover appearances are in any major games and are even less known than his own games. Second of all, him getting an amiibo means little considering it is conirmed that any indie character can have their own amiibo licensed and ther eis also the fact that Yatch Club produced said amiibo with Nintendo licensing it.

Besides, a lack of gaming history is still a major thing against him consideirng that even accounting for the fact that he has only been around for a short while, he doesn't come from a franchise that has made a huge impact on video gaming in general. And it is pretty clear that no third-party character has been in for the sake of repping stuff, but because of their own merits as characters, which Shovel Knight extremely lacks in general. Being the biggest indie doesn't mean much when every single indie character is obscure to a wider gaming audience. Millions of people who play video games knows who Ryu, Snake, Sonic, Mega Man, Pac-Man and Cloud are. You can't say the same for someone like Shovel Knight. Unlike the other third-party characters mentioned, you could put in any majorly requested Nintendo character and they still would be more profitable to Nintendo than Shovel Knight.

There is literally no reason, after all the third-party characters we have gotten, especially after Cloud, for me to think that Shovel Knight is anything but unrealistic at this point. He isn't the special snowflake that people make him out to be. I consider him Bayonetta.2 where people used the fact that her game got promotion by Nintendo to argue that she had a decent chance citing the fact that Nintendo even teamed up with Playboy to promote her as well as the recognition she got when Nintendo celebrated Women's History. Shovel Knight could also be compared to Lloyd, another character people argued for based off factors such as Nintendo closeness.
 
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