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Q&A Game Play Advice and General Discussion

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Megamang

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As a pika main, im pretty glad when I see a falcon yes.

As for comp, go in with an open mind and try and learn as much as you can about your characters, and the game in general.


If you get eliminated, dont leave! stay and play friendlies, its a great way to improve. Ask good players why they do things you don't understand. Accept that they are better than you, and didn't win because of a gimmick.
 

MonadoEmbassy

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Plenty of people regularly attend tournaments over an hour away, including myself. Can't expect it to be in your backyard...
Ha, don't worry. I know that me saying that is a bit stupid. I say that because I don't have a drivers license. I doubt anybody wants to spend hours on the road for me to go to a Smash Bros tournament of all things.
 

M15t3R E

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Ha, don't worry. I know that me saying that is a bit stupid. I say that because I don't have a drivers license. I doubt anybody wants to spend hours on the road for me to go to a Smash Bros tournament of all things.
Reach out to others who go to tournaments in your region or local area. Maybe some of them live near you.
 

LightLV

Smash Ace
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Watch streams.

You can practice for mechanical skill, but you do not always a controller in your hand to get better.

And smash 4's training mode is terrible.
 
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Baby_Sneak

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Don't be a sore loser. You should learn most from your losses. Here's a pro tip: save replays when you lose to re-watch them and learn where you have room for improvement.

Not really. With only fundamentals expect to place respectably but not top high level tournaments. Reading the opponent is crucial.
But Reading the opponent is part of fundamentals 0____0

I think everyone in this thread should look up "fighting game footsies guide" on the google search bar and read the threads and youtube vid since that'll answer like, 80-90% of the questions here
 

M15t3R E

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But Reading the opponent is part of fundamentals 0____0

I think everyone in this thread should look up "fighting game footsies guide" on the google search bar and read the threads and youtube vid since that'll answer like, 80-90% of the questions here
That's true. Judging by his context I assumed by fundamentals he meant having an understanding of how to play the footsies game and playing to his character's strengths while not being great at making reads.
 

Baby_Sneak

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That's true. Judging by his context I assumed by fundamentals he meant having an understanding of how to play the footsies game and playing to his character's strengths while not being great at making reads.
Right, but you can't have a good footsie game without being able to pick up I reads.
 

LivingSunshine

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This might seem like an odd question, but I'm drying to improve, so I want to ask it.

How can I be more in the moment while playing? Like, I want to be able to adapt quickly and not play so auto-piloty, you know, get those reads and whatnot. But it seems like I can't stay in the moment, I don't know what questions to ask myself about the other person's play in order to better read their movements. Essentially my gameplay boils down to "Go with plan A. Did it work? Great, you won. Did they adapt? Welp, you're going to lose now."

Looking at tournament gameplay, everyone's movements seem so...crisp, so fluid, and even though I'm playing the same character, it just feels like I'm not at all.

I know it's really vague, but any amount of advice will be greatly appreciated.
 

Baby_Sneak

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This might seem like an odd question, but I'm drying to improve, so I want to ask it.

How can I be more in the moment while playing? Like, I want to be able to adapt quickly and not play so auto-piloty, you know, get those reads and whatnot. But it seems like I can't stay in the moment, I don't know what questions to ask myself about the other person's play in order to better read their movements. Essentially my gameplay boils down to "Go with plan A. Did it work? Great, you won. Did they adapt? Welp, you're going to lose now."

Looking at tournament gameplay, everyone's movements seem so...crisp, so fluid, and even though I'm playing the same character, it just feels like I'm not at all.

I know it's really vague, but any amount of advice will be greatly appreciated.
Watch your opponent instead of your own character.
 

Tobi_Whatever

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This might seem like an odd question, but I'm drying to improve, so I want to ask it.

How can I be more in the moment while playing? Like, I want to be able to adapt quickly and not play so auto-piloty, you know, get those reads and whatnot. But it seems like I can't stay in the moment, I don't know what questions to ask myself about the other person's play in order to better read their movements. Essentially my gameplay boils down to "Go with plan A. Did it work? Great, you won. Did they adapt? Welp, you're going to lose now."

Looking at tournament gameplay, everyone's movements seem so...crisp, so fluid, and even though I'm playing the same character, it just feels like I'm not at all.

I know it's really vague, but any amount of advice will be greatly appreciated.
I have the same problem but I slowly start to get around it. Start with veeeeeeeeery easy things. Does he play balls to the wall aggro? Start playing defensively. Does he sit in shield a lot and wait? Try to apply pressure.
There, you did your first step into adaptation.
Don't concentrate on too many things. Start with small and obvious stuff like rolling habits. Like does he always tech roll away and can you chase it? Do they jump a lot? Stuff like that.
 

Wintropy

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Well I guess I'd best open up to the clever people who can help me with thins kinda thing.

Recently I've come to the decision that I am, indeed, a mediocre player. That isn't really much of an epiphany to me, I never considered myself to be a top-tier tourney-er, but I was content to maintain that I am fundamentally above average. Now I don't know. I am questioning my skill, my motivation, my ability to keep up good fundamentals and my focus on the game.

I am a relatively decent player in my scene - that is to say, I can sometimes beat the best player, which makes me the second-best by default. He is, however, much better than me. So much better. I play him near-daily, and I tend to get frustrated and upset by how good he is at basic stuff like reads and footsies, to the point where he can body me near-effortlessly on a good day. The fact that he outright told me he doesn't take the game too seriously and can forego his full potential when he fights me - gotta say, that was a bit of a kick in the teeth in terms of my self-confidence. But I'm glad he said it, because now I know that I have a ways to go before I can say I'm truly content with my gameplay.

Right now, I'm experiencing something of an existential crisis. On the one hand, the idea of going to tournaments and fighting good players for fame and glory is pretty neat; on the other hand, I question my desire to spend time and money I don't have to go halfway across the country to probably get beaten with no real goal in sight. I must wonder if I am trying to run before I can even crawl, since I have yet to even win a local tournament, much less something on the national scale (but Ireland is a pretty small nation, so it's realistically feasible for me).

I don't know how to get better. I've told my friends many times over, just play the game, you will naturally pick up on things and improve bit by bit every time you enter a match. Yet I am beginning to question the veracity of my own wisdom. Whenever I enter a match recently, whatever theory or gameplan I have in my head dissipates; I become flustered and scared, I can't hit the right buttons, I flub everything and I die spectacularly. I can do well against players relatively weaker than me, but whenever I am faced with a player who knows what they're honestly doing, I fall apart. I don't know how to fix this. I go to training mode regularly, I watch videos of top-level players, I play decent players on a regular basis, yet I can't discern exactly what I need to do to improve or how to do it. I know I am pretty poor at reading and adapting, in addition to the fact that my tech skill isn't as good as it should be. I don't know how to fix that. It depresses me.

I don't really know where to go or what to do. I am hoping somebody here can help me out, because with the rut I am currently in, I don't know how much I can take before I throw in the towel and concede I am beyond repair.
 
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DanGR

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@ Wintropy Wintropy A lot of your problems are psychological. It'd probably help to research ways to gain confidence in a sports setting. There are a lot of podcasts out there on this very topic.

I know one big thing is to practice the situations that come up in real games. Go into training mode with a partner and practice them hitting you off-stage and then trying to gimp your recovery. Now practice gimping them. Practice getting out of their combo strings. Practice hitting them in the air and reading their movements back to the ground. Challenge them to safely get to the ledge, past you and examine why what they're doing works. Most importantly, talk about why things worked or didn't work. Be detailed and try to understand the point of view of your practice opponent. Get in their head and understand why they acted in different ways, and you'll be able to read them in game. Get some muscle memory and reactions down and gain that confidence back that you can do these things if you work hard at it. Good luck man.
 

Daxter

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This might be a dumb question, but if you can't win most For Glory games, do you have any chance at all of being a competitive player? The world seems to ridicule FG players, but I practice every day for hours (since the DEMO launched!) and I still just keep losing and losing to the same things. There are no local scenes for me to practice at, all of my friends play casually (as in 4-player-Smash-Ball games) and since the people on Anther's are highly unfriendly to me, For Glory on 3DS is all I've really got. I have the Wii U version, but the bullying name tags and replay sharing disheartened me to the point of quitting it.
 
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NickRiddle

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Online and offline play are generally considered completely different... being bad at FG doesn't necessarily mean you will be bad offline, but not playing much offline would put you at a disadvantage.
 

Wintropy

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Far from deciding I'm beyond repair, I've made efforts to change my focus in the game and it's really helped so far. Thanks for the feedback!
 

Megamang

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This might be a dumb question, but if you can't win most For Glory games, do you have any chance at all of being a competitive player? The world seems to ridicule FG players, but I practice every day for hours (since the DEMO launched!) and I still just keep losing and losing to the same things. There are no local scenes for me to practice at, all of my friends play casually (as in 4-player-Smash-Ball games) and since the people on Anther's are highly unfriendly to me, For Glory on 3DS is all I've really got. I have the Wii U version, but the bullying name tags and replay sharing disheartened me to the point of quitting it.

Why are people on anther's highly unfriendly to you?

If you know what you are losing to, try and create a solution. Ask your character boards if you are stumped with a certain tactic or matchup.

The wii u is probably more suitable for the competitive platform, try and ignore the toxicity of people. If someone makes an insulting name tag, leave and requeue. But if you want to be very good locally, you have to play locally sometimes. Find a nearby scene.
 

KakuCP9

What does it mean to be strong?
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I was wondering if someone could tell me the difference between bait and punish and footies or if there is even a difference to begin with?
 

Baby_Sneak

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I was wondering if someone could tell me the difference between bait and punish and footies or if there is even a difference to begin with?
Footsies is kinda like fighting game theory. There are some concrete lessons to teach and there are off-the-wall, super weird ones you'll learn yourself.
Bait and punish is one of the many lessons from footsies.
 

Daxter

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Why are people on anther's highly unfriendly to you?

If you know what you are losing to, try and create a solution. Ask your character boards if you are stumped with a certain tactic or matchup.

The wii u is probably more suitable for the competitive platform, try and ignore the toxicity of people. If someone makes an insulting name tag, leave and requeue. But if you want to be very good locally, you have to play locally sometimes. Find a nearby scene.
I guess I've had an unlucky experience, but barely anybody joins my games on there, and if I ask for advice in the chat, I get slandered by a number of players.
 

Wintropy

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@ Daxter Daxter , have you tried making friends here and organising training sessions? I'd definitely encourage you to stick with the Wii U if you can, no point in backing down from improvement because people can be unkind.

I'd be happy to play some time if that'd be beneficial. I find the best way to get better is to play regularly with people you trust and get good feedback.
 

Daxter

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@ Daxter Daxter , have you tried making friends here and organising training sessions? I'd definitely encourage you to stick with the Wii U if you can, no point in backing down from improvement because people can be unkind.

I'd be happy to play some time if that'd be beneficial. I find the best way to get better is to play regularly with people you trust and get good feedback.
I do my best to try contacting people, but all I can really use are the PMs here and Anthers, and I get so busy sometimes these days, I barely get to find time to set up anything but a convenient, quick and above all, portable 3DS game.
 

T4ylor

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I play based on reaction. I usually win if my opponent approaches me, but if they just stand there spamming projectiles or even doing nothing then I lose, because there's nothing for me to react to. Any way I can learn to overcome this?
 

Wintropy

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I play based on reaction. I usually win if my opponent approaches me, but if they just stand there spamming projectiles or even doing nothing then I lose, because there's nothing for me to react to. Any way I can learn to overcome this?
Find somebody who plays a projectile-heavy character (Villager, Mega Man, etc) and keep playing until you develop a habit for countering their moves. This is a good first step to get in tune for this kind of match.

Then it's a matter of discipline. It seems to me that you're complacent with waiting for the approach because it's worked so far, to the extent that it's detrimental to other options. Going beyond your comfort zone is a good way to combat this. If your character has a reflector or absorb, determine the best time to use it to neutralise the projectile game; if your character has to make the approach, then practice powershielding and spotdodging if necessary. If your opponent does the same thing that you do (i.e. stand there and wait for the approach, then punish), it's just a matter of discerning that and getting into their head - just remind yourself, "I know this strategy, so I know how to beat it!" If the opponent isn't prepared for their options being challenged or the wall of projectiles is defeated, then it's a case of doing the best you can with the tools you have, since forcing the opponent into a state of disadvantage is the most difficult part of a stall match. If the opponent is in disadvantage, then it's time to go mad~
 

Sonicninja115

Experiment. Innovate. Improve.
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What is the best way to practice movement? Most of the time people only talk about movement tech, which is good, but they never talk about actually moving and getting around the stage easily. Is there a guide I could read/watch or ways to practice it?
 

NickRiddle

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... Set a movement goal, and keep trying until you get it... there's no real way to practice movement without just trying to do it until you no longer mess up.
 

Avokha

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Hey all. I've been playing smash pretty much my whole life, but never on a competitive level until Smash 4 came around. Granted, I learned about competitive smash in the brawl era and dabbled in some brawl tech. Come Smash 4, and I decided to begin training for competion so I can expose myself and get exposed to fellow members of the community and represent my characters of choice, and NOT to be the next ZeRo :laugh:

Finally, I found my first ever local tourney and participated, wowing the crowd with my :4robinm: and finishing the tourney at 4th place, falling from winners bracket to a quite skilled :4littlemac: and getting eliminated in the round just before losers finals to the TO's :4ness:. I also had many friendlies, playing much of the competition I did not get to face, including a skilled :4pikachu:. The TO was quite impressed with my :4robinm: play and invited me to his weekly smashfest this Friday to discuss and play smash with others.

Thus, I have officially become a member of the smash community (4's at least). After seeing the crowds reaction to my :4robinm:, whom the community prior practically forgot existed, I now feel a massive drive to represent such an underrated character and thus help everyone involved improve, myself included. I have a philosophy that players who want to be the best have their characters fight for them, akin to a knight seeking to wield a sword best suited to winning battles. I want to fight for my character and show everyone what they can achieve, win or lose.

(This is all so VERY sappy Embarrass)

How can I achieve this most effectively? As a newly initiated competitor, my outlook on my future as a smash player is quite optimistic, so this is certainly not meant to be taken like one of those serious, doom-and-gloom threads that occasionally pop up :p

TL;DR: Now that I'm competing, how should I further my smash career? :seuss:
 

HFlash

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Pretty much rinse and repeat, you get better and develop more contacts by getting out of your house and playing against people who as good as you, or preferably, better. Get your ass handed to you, learn what you can do to improve, and keep going to tournaments. Placing 4th at your first tournament is pretty good. Keep at it, but like you said your self, you probably won't be the next Zero, so play the game for fun without foregoing life responsibilities like school (I'm assuming you are still in school, correct me if I'm wrong). Ultimately, have fun :).

Note: You may want to remove the white from the background of your default.
 

Wintropy

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Funny that I'm in the same boat as you: I don't play to win, I play to win with my favourite characters!

That said, when you realise that that's what you want to do, it means you can just play the game without being burdened by a desire to be "the best". HFlash said it best: go to tournaments, play with friends and other competitors, have fun and keep practicing. You will get beaten, that's inevitable (unless you do turn out to be the next ZeRo, heh), but that's okay - it helps you get better.

I don't have much in the way of advice beyond that, just that I respect your dedication to playing just to play your favourite characters, rather than to win. That's pretty refreshing!
 

Avokha

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Pretty much rinse and repeat, you get better and develop more contacts by getting out of your house and playing against people who as good as you, or preferably, better. Get your *** handed to you, learn what you can do to improve, and keep going to tournaments. Placing 4th at your first tournament is pretty good. Keep at it, but like you said your self, you probably won't be the next Zero, so play the game for fun without foregoing life responsibilities like school (I'm assuming you are still in school, correct me if I'm wrong). Ultimately, have fun :).

Note: You may want to remove the white from the background of your default.
Graduated from high school a few months ago, so that's no longer the case :smash:
 

hypersonicJD

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Hi there people. I actually wanted to bring out this thread to get a match-up breakdowns from many people.

The reasons why I'm opening this thread are for 2 reasons:

1.- I actually wanted some advises on my matches and what my opponent could have done better to actually have a response againts that situation.

2.- I really wanted other people to post videos of their matches and have a complete breakdown, for the sake of just helping the competitive scene.

I really don't know if this does fit in this forum or is not allowed. But I really wanted to bring out something like this to have some help and analize match-ups in a more efficent way. I hope I don't get in any trouble for this though D:

And to get going on the thread, what do you think of one of my matches here?


Sorry for the bad quality thoug. I'm recording on a phone so it's really hard to get a good quality.

Noboy replies to this thread right? :p
 
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LozNerd

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Hi, two custom based questions. First, meteor bomb or normal bomb, power bow or hero's bow? And, best side special custom for Fox? thanks!
 

ぱみゅ

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Bombs come to preference. Standard Bow is generally better at most scenarios as its uncharged version is more reliable, but Power has its uses.

Fox's are also preference.

Those are my opinions, alternatively you can go to both Character Boards and ask there (not sure about those two, but some boards still have the Custom Project thread as Stickies).
:196:
 
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