Evo 2015 Rules Finalized For Smash Wii U

[BobVance_]

Customs being on is a bad idea. EVO Smash 4 will be nothing but cheese and jankyness.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

Errr wasn't Melee literally at its player cap at Apex? I wouldn't say that's few players

I understand what you mean man; however, when the player count is seen, Smash-4 easily takes the win off of that one. It's sad really, a game that is 2008 based off of Brawl minus techniques and add a few new characters and wa-la Smash-4. People eating every last drop of that sugar coated candy. Don't get me wrong though, in all honesty, if this is what players wanted Smash to be, ... this, since the player count is unbelievably ginormous compared in Smash history. Why not then, make easier games that take absolutely no more knowledge foundation based and skill involved.

It's depressing, saddling and killing what true competitive Smash really is. Only Melee is pretty much keeping the true competitive side alive (ten more years left of that game sadly). Brawl pretty much on its death bed and there isn't much left of the Brawlers (us) that's for sure; however, we know what is a better game than Smash-4 without even playing the game (and we have if you believe we haven't). And I'm not going to address what the other two clowns are ranting. If they so badly want to see my remarks, then go find them off of YouTube. Thanks.

 

[warriorman222]

He can't.
When he makes a statement he doesn't bother to provide his reasons, nor is capable of giving an explanation and instead lowers himself to petty insulting when he is at a loss for words. See how he failed to address any of your points and decided to focus on trivial matters. He is a manchild who is unable to have a proper discussion and the single thought of people liking a game that he has vendetta for no reason makes him miserable and hungry for attention.
Oh, and he is no troll. He believes in the stupidity that he spouts, which is even worse. Don't expect any intelligent rebuttals from him.

Look dude, whether or not that's true, posting insults about him isn't changing anything. The best we can do is ignore him. Next time I'll listen to "Don't feed the trolls"

Customs being on is a bad idea. EVO Smash 4 will be nothing but cheese and jankyness.

Tell me one custom that is better than a projectile, that on hit:
- Gives you the 20 frames, then another 10 frames before you can utilise a getup
-Puts you into an untechable downed state.
- Makes you grabbable on a character with easybake grab followups. Okay wtf
- Makes your hitbox at least 3 times as large as a normal downed state for most characters and 50% larger at best.
- Turns your getup options into s***. Roll and getup have little invinciblility, while getup attack has NONE, and does like 1-6% depending on character.

If any custom move is worse than default Banana, I'll be surprised as hell.

 

[Mic_128]

Not comparing Melee or Brawl to this game... Randall (In this case the cloud you're comparing) has a timing to it, if you watch over the clock (But you may already know that), and the Platform that rises at complete random in Brawl, but doesn't interrupt the fight by appearing off the stage is giving both players the even benefits, even it's really slight chance of luck.

I wouldn't call having an opponent saved by a randomly appearing platform is "not interrupting the fight."

As for timing, so does the Duck Hunt dog platform. Heck, the screen even turns mostly pink when it's about to be up for the longer part (when all ducks weren't hit) There's plenty of warning and can be predicted. You know, if you actually play on the stage.

I'm aware of how Broken Snakes kick is on Frame start-up, but this isn't Brawl.

The point I'm making is you can't say we can't allow something because of it supposedly having janky hitboxes (speaking of, can you be specific? Which ones have them?) when we've been fine with baseline characters having janky hitboxes previously.

This was a bit too far... I was referring to having Customs Off.

Then you say "I don't think customs should be on" instead of claiming they aren't a part of the game when, uh, they clearly are part of the game or they wouldn't be there in the first place.

The only thing I'm stumped on is that if this were to be turned off, it wouldn't be applied to Mii Fighters, generally there will be a handful to keep a mindset of through their combinations.

Over here we've always had Mii fighters legal with the default 1-1-1-1 moveset.

Generally, my idea was to just keep it simple and play a character for what it's simply is on the implementation Sakurai normally intended on

Keep in mind Sakurai is also the guy who doesn't want Smash to be competitive, at all. Why would we do what he 'intended'? Should we also put items on? He very much intended the game to be played with those.

I'm aware with the idea of for each advantage, the custom has a downfall backfire.

This is one of the biggest reasons why they should be allowed.

- As far as not having customs go, you memorize a characters ins and outs, hitboxes, weight, start-up/ending lag, animation frames, Slide and Techs (Glide Toss, B-Reverse, HitStun Cancel, Crouch slides, etc), combo/mix-ups, damage ratios, etc. You get a general idea of what hits give you enough reaction frames to get your punish in, even if you receive shield knockback. Then a wild Custom move comes and you're fighting against it, mainly because you're trying to figure it out, rather than fighting your opponent in a tournament match.

Only if you're stupid enough to never learn custom moves before the tournament. I had someone ***** at me about me beating them with Wii Fit trainer because they had no idea how to play against it. I asked if they had ever played the character, or vs'd bots with them, they said no.

That's the players problem, not the game. If you can't be bothered learning it, then the fault is on you, no one else.

EVO isn't until July.You have 4 months. Get learning.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

Look dude, whether or not that's true, posting insults about him isn't changing anything. The best we can do is ignore him. Next time I'll listen to "Don't feed the trolls"


Tell me one custom that is better than a projectile, that on hit:
- Gives you the 20 frames, then another 10 frames before you can utilise a getup
-Puts you into an untechable downed state.
- Makes you grabbable on a character with easybake grab followups. Okay wtf
- Makes your hitbox at least 3 times as large as a normal downed state for most characters and 50% larger at best.
- Turns your getup options into s***. Roll and getup have little invinciblility, while getup attack has NONE, and does like 1-6% depending on character.

If any custom move is worse than default Banana, I'll be surprised as hell.

No you wont, you'll butt in somehow, why? Because you're a human that wants your voice to be heard. I'm no troll try to fathom that, my views are biases but they are fair if you can coup with what I'm writing back to yourself.

Think about it, we went from Smash-64 the beginning, to the buffed up steroid game called Melee, to the meh Brawl game but is durable due to the fact it actually has/had a true learning curve and technique objective. Now we have Smash-4, a game that is anti-techquie based, nerf based, and the Intelligent Quote foundation learning standard curve of learning the ABCs (Alphabet) and one two threes (numbers). To elaborate more, the game mechanics are worse, the game overall has sunk for the worse towards a fighting party game that is seen as a joke. Now above all the game is a true joke and it's coming from a Smasher and that's just the lowest, saddest and deepest remark anyone can provide towards a Smash franchise they enjoyed and took competitively to be able to compete with other games.

Here's another kicker to the game support of Smash, Melee players tried Smash-4 and guess what? They disliked the game just like Brawl and went back onto Melee. I had high hopes that this game would finally set us Smashers onto a same page level towards enjoying the game mechanics and give the other games a rest to enjoy as a memory only. But there is a saying that goes like this, "never wish exactly what you want for that wish will not come true" and it's true the new game didn't provide any change but only flared more elitism towards playing that certain game only. So you must understand where many of us come from. The Smash scene atm is a discombobulated community that is spit apart as which game is better more than any other community. Alright I'm done here, I hope this clears any miscommunication. Also words will not shake me because I know they aren't true; however, you shake when I do mention them, could the situation be that the words are true? Thanks.

 

[Mic_128]

Alright I'm done here

Good. Because you've said you don't like the game, and that's all you need to say.

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

Good. Because you've said you don't like the game, and that's all you need to say.

I absolutely could not fathom what your, sarcastic?, bait? comment was all about. I'll take an educated guess, and write you support Smash-4 than any other game, and you aren't going to meander in this toasty situation due to you're a moderator, right? Or you despise the game as well. Or you read enough towards my ranting and want the ranting to be ended.

 

[Mic_128]

It's more the fact that we've had a blanket ruling of "No Brawl vs Melee" discussions and you and the other two are basically doing a Smash 4 vs Other Smash games" discussion.

And since you didn't take the hint, I'll just outright say it.

You've made your points known, you don't like Smash 4. This is a discussion on Smash 4. Unless you have something constructive to add, go away.

 

[Ryu Myuutsu]

No you wont, you'll butt in somehow, why? Because you're a human that wants your voice to be heard. I'm no troll try to fathom that, my views are biases but they are fair if you can coup with what I'm writing back to yourself.

Think about it, we went from Smash-64 the beginning, to the buffed up steroid game called Melee, to the meh Brawl game but is durable due to the fact it actually has/had a true learning curve and technique objective. Now we have Smash-4, a game that is anti-techquie based, nerf based, and the Intelligent Quote foundation learning standard curve of learning the ABCs (Alphabet) and one two threes (numbers). To elaborate more, the game mechanics are worse, the game overall has sunk for the worse towards a fighting party game that is seen as a joke. Now above all the game is a true joke and it's coming from a Smasher and that's just the lowest, saddest and deepest remark anyone can provide towards a Smash franchise they enjoyed and took competitively to be able to compete with other games.

Here's another kicker to the game support of Smash, Melee players tried Smash-4 and guess what? They disliked the game just like Brawl and went back onto Melee. I had high hopes that this game would finally set us Smashers onto a same page level towards enjoying the game mechanics and give the other games a rest to enjoy as a memory only. But there is a saying that goes like this, "never wish exactly what you want for that wish will not come true" and it's true the new game didn't provide any change but only flared more elitism towards playing that certain game only. So you must understand where many of us come from. The Smash scene atm is a discombobulated community that is spit apart as which game is better more than any other community. Alright I'm done here, I hope this clears any miscommunication. Also words will not shake me because I know they aren't true; however, you shake when I do mention them, could the situation be that the words are true? Thanks.

Despite the wall of text, you ended up saying absolutely nothing about why Smash 4 is bad. You mentioned that it's mechanics are worse, how? Anti technique based, because? You mentioned nerfs as a problem as well, which doesn't make sense as a negative point because in every Smash game each character receives nerfs and/or buffs. The remarks about the learning curve are hypocritical since every Smash isn't very difficult to pick and learn in the first place; you also mentioned that you could be good at this game without even trying but then again one can claim anything on the internet and pretend to be a tuff guy without any sort of proof. You've most likely haven't even picked the game not even more once which explains why you are mostly ignorant about it.

And the kicker is that all you have to add to this is your word (which so far means jack**** to any of us here), that because it comes from you and because you say so that a game you've barely touched is the worst thing ever and it's community should be demolished to the ground because of it. A lot of words yet no substance.

You even mentioned that you are biased, which takes a lot of your credibility, and that you were fair (which is false). You just want to keep hating this game and ignore anything that can be pointed out in it's favor, like a child covering his ears.

And I know you want to believe your words are true, you know no better than that so it's not like you have much of a choice. You get shaken by the thought of people even daring to like this game; you hate the fact that they don't hate the same thing you do and that makes you miserable, which is why you go out of your way to try to drag them into your personal hell hole. Very, very pitiful.

Well you said you were done here so bye, I guess? I would say that a desperate reply trying to insult me while ignoring everything said and failing to elaborate your case wouldn't be unexpected, but that would be so predictable of you.

 

[Mic_128]

Wow, because apparently everyone needs to have the obvious pointed out, @ Ryu Myuutsu , drop it.

 

[warriorman222]

Despite the wall of text, you ended up saying absolutely nothing about why Smash 4 is bad. You mentioned that it's mechanics are worse, how? Anti technique based, because? You mentioned nerfs as a problem as well, which doesn't make sense as a negative point because in every Smash game each character receives nerfs and/or buffs. The remarks about the learning curve are hypocritical since every Smash isn't very difficult to pick and learn in the first place; you also mentioned that you could be good at this game without even trying but then again one can claim anything on the internet and pretend to be a tuff guy without any sort of proof. You've most likely haven't even picked the game not even more once which explains why you are mostly ignorant about it.

And the kicker is that all you have to add to this is your word (which so far means jack**** to any of us here), that because it comes from you and because you say so that a game you've barely touched is the worst thing ever and it's community should be demolished to the ground because of it. A lot of words yet no substance.

You even mentioned that you are biased, which takes a lot of your credibility, and that you were fair (which is false). You just want to keep hating this game and ignore anything that can be pointed out in it's favor, like a child covering his ears.

And I know you want to believe your words are true, you know no better than that so it's not like you have much of a choice. You get shaken by the thought of people even daring to like this game; you hate the fact that they don't hate the same thing you do and that makes you miserable, which is why you go out of your way to try to drag them into your personal hell hole. Very, very pitiful.

Well you said you were done here so bye, I guess? I would say that a desperate reply trying to insult me while ignoring everything said and failing to elaborate your case wouldn't be unexpected, but that would be so predictable of you.

Look, dude, he has left. Drop it. Whether or not he's right doesn't matter, he is not coming back, and this argument needed to end.


So let's talk about the rules. I'd prefer a more liberal stagelist, and 3 stock 8 minutes, but I know that's not happening happen. I'm fine with this, and I'd personally like to see how customs would turn out.

You guys?

 

[QuadraSlashe]

Can't music just be turned off in the settings?

 

[dav3yb]

How many stages could they use if they went into the options and turned the music volume all the way down?

 

[infomon]

2-stock 6-mins, Full-list stage striking, custom moves and Mii legality.... these are huge wins. Bravo to Mr. Wizard.

It's not the perfect ruleset, but I think it's a great compromise, especially considering they have NDA constraints.

 

[RagtagNinjaboy]

Im glad it just got all finalized XD

 

[N.T.A.O ChangeOfHeart 死の剣]

It's more the fact that we've had a blanket ruling of "No Brawl vs Melee" discussions and you and the other two are basically doing a Smash 4 vs Other Smash games" discussion.

And since you didn't take the hint, I'll just outright say it.

You've made your points known, you don't like Smash 4. This is a discussion on Smash 4. Unless you have something constructive to add, go away.

Ah, okay, I understand, alright then man. Thanks.

 

[Mic_128]

How many stages could they use if they went into the options and turned the music volume all the way down?

Because if one person screws up/is a **** and turns it up, then legal issues ahoy.

Also worth noting that turning down the chance of individual songs doesn't help. Was at a friends and we had turned down all songs bar the Fire Emblem Melee song, and yet when we played on the stage we got an un-unlocked Roy's theme song.

 

[ninrok]

Yeah the music thing: the bar just lowers the chance something willyplay, not turn it off completely.

Only way to ensure no issues would be to mute the music in options... And that's not really appealing lol.

To the ruleset at hand: I can get with these rules. Thank god for 6 minutes. Though personally, 3 stocks / 8 minutes would be my preference, by far.

Hopefully by then I'll be decent enough to not get immediately bopped in pools like I've been doing locally, heh.

Still need to work on my Custom Rob and Custom Samus soon.

 

[QuadraSlashe]

Though what's more important? More legal stages, or having music play at all?

 

[dav3yb]

Because if one person screws up/is a **** and turns it up, then legal issues ahoy.

Also worth noting that turning down the chance of individual songs doesn't help. Was at a friends and we had turned down all songs bar the Fire Emblem Melee song, and yet when we played on the stage we got an un-unlocked Roy's theme song.

No, there is a sound option where you can adjust the various sound elements, music, characters, etc... volumes in the game, not just individual songs. I'm talking about just muting ALL the music across the board, so you don't even hear any music while playing.

 

[BobVance_]

Uh, for the people wondering why Smash 4 is bad...It's because it's ridiculously defensive and has a no-approach playstyle, there's no shield stun, it's very very basic and theres no depth to the characters; etc. Customs make it cheesier, and you win via dumb gimmicks and through your opponents lack of mu knowledge. See Nairo losing to adhd over some sillyness. The game doesn't reward skill, it's pretty janky. More like rock paper scissors than anything else.

 

[warriorman222]

Uh, for the people wondering why Smash 4 is bad...It's because it's ridiculously defensive and has a no-approach playstyle, there's no shield stun, it's very very basic and theres no depth to the characters; etc. Customs make it cheesier, and you win via dumb gimmicks and through your opponents lack of mu knowledge. See Nairo losing to adhd over some sillyness. The game doesn't reward skill, it's pretty janky. More like rock paper scissors than anything else.

Okay. We get it. You think Smash 4 sucks because it doesn't encourage the holy playstyle of offensive rushdown, and instead relies on cerebral skill.

Do you have anything productive to say? If not, I'll lead you to the door.

 

[BobVance_]

Okay. We get it. You think Smash 4 sucks because it doesn't encourage the holy playstyle of offensive rushdown, and instead relies on cerebral skill.

Do you have anything productive to say? If not, I'll lead you to the door.

Cerebral skill? LOL, you can plow through brackets spamming one mindless move over and over again. Stop acting like the game is simply "a little more defensive" when it relies on you never, ever approaching to have the best advantage. This game is easy as hell and takes little to no effort. There will be timeouts galore at EVO.

 

[brodouble]

Okay. We get it. You think Smash 4 sucks because it doesn't encourage the holy playstyle of offensive rushdown, and instead relies on cerebral skill.

Do you have anything productive to say? If not, I'll lead you to the door.

...cerebral skill...lmfao

 

[QuadraSlashe]

...cerebral skill...lmfao

You shouldn't criticize a game for requiring you to think. I realize you believe that you don't need to use your head, which really just demonstrates your not playing the game correctly. I could say the best strategy in Melee is to spam Down B as Pichu. Is that correct? No, it's not. I'm still playing the game though...

 

[brodouble]

You shouldn't criticize a game for requiring you to think. I realize you believe that you don't need to use your head, which really just demonstrates your not playing the game correctly. I could say the best strategy in Melee is to spam Down B as Pichu. Is that correct? No, it's not. I'm still playing the game though...

LOLOL omg plz stop. this is why the fighting community laughs at smash fans.

 

[warriorman222]

LOLOL omg plz stop. this is why the fighting community laughs at smash fans.

This argument has so much logistical and mechanical reasoning in it that I can't begin to argue it. I guess he's right. This game sucks! Let's all leave it and let it die upon the word of one unbiased, godlike opinion!

 

[brodouble]

This argument has so much logistical and mechanical reasoning in it that I can't begin to argue it. I guess he's right. This game sucks! Let's all leave it and let it die upon the word of one unbiased, godlike opinion!

i didnt say it outright sucks, but it's the easiest game in the series by far. u make it sound like you're doing complex math problems or some crap lol

 

[Mic_128]

This argument has so much logistical and mechanical reasoning in it that I can't begin to argue it. I guess he's right. This game sucks! Let's all leave it and let it die upon the word of one unbiased, godlike opinion!

Or you could go with option B) and just ignore the troll?

 

[ghaudephaede010]

"Keep in mind Sakurai is also the guy who doesn't want Smash to be competitive, at all. Why would we do what he 'intended'? Should we also put items on? He very much intended the game to be played with those."

I really dislike when people say this. It makes me cringe because it is simply not completely true. He has stated he wanted to make a more competitive Smash title after Brawl but balancing the game when it has items and other wackiness makes that job extremely delicate and difficult. I am pretty sure you can see from thee actions of this man and the people he hired to work on the game and continue to update the game that he obviously cares about making it competitive.

"This is one of the biggest reasons why they should be allowed."

Saying this in response to customs is also silly. I remember when people wanted certain items in Brawl and the main arguments were:

1) Metaknight does horrible with items on.
2) The game was designed with items in mind.

Custom moves are a lot like items. Are they are designed for additional play? I do not know but I am watching this community try to speak for Sakurai and his staff too often and it is getting old.

 

[DeDeDe90]

does this mean you can only use one customized special attack ? (which would be super reasonable)

but i rly dunno whats ment when they say "10 present movesets shown...."

In case they ment, allow all costoms for all B moves + Items (like the landing lag reduceing boots) it would be super inbalanced since some customs or Items are clearly broken ! > villager

 

[FearTheJiggles]

So will Lucas be allowed?

 

[HyruleSmasher]

I'm feeling a little bad for those who would want to try a do the unthinkable with mewtwo...at EVO it would be a short learning curve plus. but please i want to see him move up the ladder in one of the largest event that is EVO

 

[Sudoi]

Nintendo: Lucas Comes Out of Nowhere!
Tourneys: Ugh.

 

[rekgrizzly]

Im glad they made the presets for the customs, some of the stuff could be really broken