Combos and General Strategies

[Odaroloc]

I've only played Lucas a couple times so far, and I wanted to start this thread to see what you guys are coming up with for combos. He's a fun character, and I think he's got some serious potential.

To start, I found that around 0-20% you can down-grab into a SH Nair. In roughly 0-40%, you can down-grab into a fair (SH or full hop depending on %). I am playing against Ryu in training mode, and these are the two combos I am able to get across. If you guys could list some pointers or observations while playing Lucas, I'd love to hear it

 

[Tommy - S.N.]

Or down throw into uptilt

 

[Jigglystep]

Here are some true combos I've tested out with a human player:
- D-Throw > Nair > Uair (Uair only works at low percents)
- Fastfall Uair > Uair (Solid 26~ damage combo that works until about 60-70% depending on the character)
- D-Throw > Uair (This is our killing hoo-hah. If you get a grab at least around 110% you should be able to kill with this true combo)

 

[arncakes]

Down-throw to turn around back air can kill most characters between 20 to 40 lol. True combo, too. Try it on Roy at 30% near the edge. Spikes him too far to recover, and is a true combo too (if you read DI). Kinda difficult, but definitely doable.

Also, at 0%, down-throw to ff nair (first 2-3 hits) pulls the opponent to the ground and sets up for a regrab. Idk if it's true, but it works sometimes.

Down-throw u-tilt works up to like 100% or something. Lucas can act out of his down-throw almost at the same time the opponent breaks out of the ground, and it hits them on the way up.

 

[Odaroloc]

Now that I've gotten some experience with Lucas, The dthrow utilt wont work against Mewtwo and Ganondorf. Maybe it was just a DI thing, but every time I played against those two I couldnt get the combo off past 15%.

But really guys, I think we need to discuss Lucas' bair. I've found it to be one of the easiest meteor smashes to land, and in almost every 1v1 match, I could get a bair meteor on them. It's a mighty fine attack IMO

 

[Tommy - S.N.]

Ledge Trump to spike bair!!!

 

[arncakes]

Now that I've gotten some experience with Lucas, The dthrow utilt wont work against Mewtwo and Ganondorf. Maybe it was just a DI thing, but every time I played against those two I couldnt get the combo off past 15%.

But really guys, I think we need to discuss Lucas' bair. I've found it to be one of the easiest meteor smashes to land, and in almost every 1v1 match, I could get a bair meteor on them. It's a mighty fine attack IMO

I agree with the bair. It kills SOOO early... Killed a zelda at like 30 with rage. The sweetspot can be hard at times, but it's pretty safe to go for it.

 

[Odaroloc]

I agree with the bair. It kills SOOO early... Killed a zelda at like 30 with rage. The sweetspot can be hard at times, but it's pretty safe to go for it.

With such good jumps and recovery, it's almost always worth it to go for it xD. I was playing against a ZZS, and she tried to pursue me off the edge while I was returning to the stage. Floated right past her, and bair'd xD

I think Lucas is top tier:3

 

[divade]

Ftr the data thread is also talking techs atm.

 

[Odaroloc]

Does anyone use U-Throw? I havent found it to be very useful, nor a kill move. B-Throw kills at high percents near the ledge, F-Throw is good to get people off the edge to Bair them, and D-Throw is our combo starter. Maybe it's because I haven't analyzed U-throw's potential, but it seems like it should be avoided since the other throws are just better.

 

[Animekey]

I used UpThrow with a bit of rage at 110%ish, and that's a kill throw. But that's with rage....I guess it's an option if you can't kill your opponent early enough.

I found that if you can force your opponent into thinking you're going for a FSmash or an Air move once they're forced to the ledge. UpSmash is very good for tossing em up, and most likely kill if they're at high percentages of course.

Oh! And another thing. DTilt -> Jab is a good mix-up also. Just wanted to put that out there.

 

[Odaroloc]

Oh! And another thing. DTilt -> Jab is a good mix-up also. Just wanted to put that out there.

I have also found that to work well.

 

[Drippy]

Does anyone use U-Throw? I havent found it to be very useful, nor a kill move. B-Throw kills at high percents near the ledge, F-Throw is good to get people off the edge to Bair them, and D-Throw is our combo starter. Maybe it's because I haven't analyzed U-throw's potential, but it seems like it should be avoided since the other throws are just better.

Up Throw is amazing, note how you have to be on the ledge for B-Throw to kill and compared to Ness's grab or most characters with a B-Throw, Lucas's grab isn't nearly as fast or easy to pull off if it's a competent player. Up Throw can kill at pretty high percents from any point of the stage and if you're on a stage with a platform even earlier and if you're on a stage with a low ceiling then it's even much earlier.

 

[rosetta_stoned]

Didnt get near as much time to play with him as i hoped today as dlc wasnt working for me until the afternoon and then Had to go out but im struggling with dair. How are other people finding it / using it? Im finding it to be a horrible approach option and i cant seem to follow up on it.

Saved a few replays of some epic bair spikes though. God that move is satisfying.

 

[Kenturo]

Down-throw>nair>nair>up air or fair
pretty much the bnb and works on everyone i tried it on. Fair is for when your opponent is too low for up air to connect

 

[theyellowflash26]

Didnt get near as much time to play with him as i hoped today as dlc wasnt working for me until the afternoon and then Had to go out but im struggling with dair. How are other people finding it / using it? Im finding it to be a horrible approach option and i cant seem to follow up on it.

Saved a few replays of some epic bair spikes though. God that move is satisfying.

Prolly shouldn't use it to approach. I've been using it to read air dodges and to edge guard. Double jump>dair can catch people recovering or when they roll onto stage.

 

[phili]

Hey everyone, I made a video showing a few super simple easy true combos that I figured out in an hour or so today playing lucas. Many of these combos are mentioned above, but you can see how they work in the video if you are interested.

 

[FlynnCL]

I can also vouch for down-throw > full hop neutral-air > double jump neutral-air > up-air at low percent. Works really well because of how floaty Lucas is combined with how well neutral air traps opponents close to you.

 

[PKPenguin]

Dtilt to utilt is a super-basic two hit guaranteed combo which effectively adds a teeny bit of damage and range for when you would normally just utilt. Works at pretty much any percent, but hitting them with the tip of the dtilt at around 100% can cause them to slide out of range of the utilt.
Edit: Hitting them with the tip of the dtilt at all causes them to be knocked back horizontally instead of vertically. Just avoid hitting the tip at all.

Edit: Also super nice since the dtilt can jablock.

 

[Zeriora]

This is a true combo, good at mid percents.
Down throw into Nair into Fair, it works, at high percents. Not a killing move. Does 22% in total.

 

[Flamjam]

up-tillt > uptilt > nair seems to be a thing at low percents, or double uptilt at the very least! Needs more testing though.

 

[EnhaloTricks]

if you can nair someone off stage you can get a double jump bair spike as long as you read DI correctly. Works best at low percents, so the spike isn't gonna kill but it might catch them off guard.

pk freeze -> jump -> pkt2 is awesome especially if you loop pkt through them. Been trying to hit pk freeze -> pk freeze but I'm finding it harder to do than in brawl, but I'm sure it's possible.

EDIT: I've also managed to pull off dthrow -> nair -> pk freeze starting at around 30%. It's gotta be completely uncharged but if you can hit with it that's another free attack assuming you react fast enough.

 

[PGP]

Lucas can do d-throw->any aerial as a true combo (depending on percent). This includes bair facing opponent, bair facing away from opponent, and zair (I've seen people mention some of these individually, just wanted to note that every single aerial works).

He can do zair->f-tilt, guaranteed at low percents so long as you're close and time it correctly.

 

[an1bal]

So there's this setup i was messing aroudn with today. Loving the bair.

 

[knu_OOKA]

Didnt get near as much time to play with him as i hoped today as dlc wasnt working for me until the afternoon and then Had to go out but im struggling with dair. How are other people finding it / using it? Im finding it to be a horrible approach option and i cant seem to follow up on it.

Saved a few replays of some epic bair spikes though. God that move is satisfying.

As a ledge getup option: Fast fall to double-jump cancelled dair. It covers under you and you can do a nair right before you land.
I pretty much like to use dair while rising with a double jump to cover below me, and only use it while falling to spike.

 

[Edgar allan pooh]

Lucas can do d-throw->any aerial as a true combo (depending on percent). This includes bair facing opponent, bair facing away from opponent, and zair (I've seen people mention some of these individually, just wanted to note that every single aerial works).

He can do zair->f-tilt, guaranteed at low percents so long as you're close and time it correctly.

I've been trying to use Zair as a way to approach because my brother plays ness so I can't use PK fire.

I don't remember the percent around, 80-100% you can back throw into a magnet not a true combo but it kills

 

[Plain Yogurt]

Not sure if this was the place for general impressions but I didn't notice a thread for them so here goes:

Disclaimer: all impressions based on a few hours of For Glory play.

So I spent the afternoon messing with Lucas and while it took a bit of getting used to, I'm pretty happy with him. I found solid results playing him zoning with PK Fire and PK Freeze (The endlag's short enough to mess with aerial approaches a little, at least in the wonderful world of FG) and smacking them with tilts and jab when they got in.

-His grab feels about as good as a tether grab usually does with the added "fun" of being one of the shorter tethers. A shame, as his throws are all excellent (BThrow is FRAUDULENT, if not as fraudulent as Ness's). It's nice to be able to tether recover though, because PKT2 is WONKY. I literally hit a ledge head on once and still bounced off.

-Speaking of PKT2's wonkiness, it's hitbox is also deceptive. I've hit people who were nowhere near Lucas near the end of it. And then sometimes it gives me the multi-hit and other times it'll knock them away right away. Weird move. And PKT1 is bleh. It's nice when you trap with it but Lucas has like twice Ness's endlag afterwards so onstage use is pretty much impossible.

-Lucas has a solid edge-guarding game. PK Freeze is quick and the short endlag can help set up traps, and Down smash's hit box is nice and big for thinner edges like Battlefield's. If you space it right you appear to be able to cover the roll option too since the third burst hits behind him.

-Dair is blah, Fair is okay but I wish it autocanceled on short hop, Nair launches at a nice angle for follow ups, bair is okay, and I can't figure out Uair's hitbox at all but it feels good when it lands. Meanwhile, magnet stalling is nice for jump mixups with it's stupid low cooldown and solid hitbox. And when he uses an aerial during his second jump, he seems to stall in the air for a bit. Weird, but it helps him when he does a rising aerial back onto the stage.

-UTilt is a great anti-air. So is Ness's for that matter. People should use them more. Having a quick disjoint above your head is super nice. FTilt is passable and I don't quite get DTilt.

-I LOVE his down smash and I probably use it too much.

Overall: I'm a fan, though I can see why people have mixed opinions. Especially since he got released alongside two heavy-hitting combo machines while he's more a patient zoner character. I'm not expecting him to make a huge splash, but I could see a dedicated main performing well with him.

 

[VBD]

Dair's spike hitbox has a ton of hitstun, so if you get the timing down, it can combo into Upsmash at kill percents, around 110% on midweights (I used Marth). Also, while not a combo, PK Magnet can be used pretty well as an edgeguarding tool, even though it isn't as easily applicable as in brawl, it has serious hitstun and horizontal knockback, making it really useful against characters lacking in horzontal recovery options, like Roy or Captain Falcon. The hitbox for magnet comes out after you pull the magnet back in, so practice the timing on it first. Just some thoughts. I think Lucas can be really good, especially if we see some Advanced techniques come out some time soon.

 

[Drippy]

NAKAT has been doing Neutral Air -> Neutral Air -> Neutral Air a lot at low percents and that's a solid like 23% damage that I can't seem to escape at low percents. Even at mid percents I think he's still able to chain together like at least two. Neutral Air is used a lot as his approach option or to punish the enemy for a laggy move / if they're landing on stage, definitely something I need to get into the habit of because I see him do it consistently with great success.

 

[EnhaloTricks]

NAKAT has been doing Neutral Air -> Neutral Air -> Neutral Air a lot at low percents and that's a solid like 23% damage that I can't seem to escape at low percents. Even at mid percents I think he's still able to chain together like at least two. Neutral Air is used a lot as his approach option or to punish the enemy for a laggy move / if they're landing on stage, definitely something I need to get into the habit of because I see him do it consistently with great success.

you can link it more or less indefinitely... I've carried people from one side of the stage to the opposite and off the ledge. But you have to hit with the first or second hit or else they can hold shield and punish.

 

[phili]

Also, to add to @ D Drippy 's post about Nair, you can fast fall the nair after you connect the first hit, and at mid percent to high percent you can normally get an up tilt from it. It's not a huge combo or a kill setup, but it is something.

I've tried grabbing after the FF nair, but a lot of times the opponent ends up behind lucas and you can't turn around grab fast enough before they can roll or spot dodge.

 

[Drippy]

you can link it more or less indefinitely... I've carried people from one side of the stage to the opposite and off the ledge. But you have to hit with the first or second hit or else they can hold shield and punish.

Hmm not so sure since I haven't really tried it myself nor recall NAKAT doing it but I'm usually able to escape by the third N-Air but what you're saying is the two hits of the N-Air if they connect you can continue the chain even longer? If so I'll try that out.

Also, to add to @ D Drippy 's post about Nair, you can fast fall the nair after you connect the first hit, and at mid percent to high percent you can normally get an up tilt from it. It's not a huge combo or a kill setup, but it is something.

I've tried grabbing after the FF nair, but a lot of times the opponent ends up behind lucas and you can't turn around grab fast enough before they can roll or spot dodge.

This was discovered yesterday actually and I believe it works at low percents as well.

 

[phili]

This was discovered yesterday actually and I believe it works at low percents as well.

It kind of works at low percents, but if the opponent DI's down, or is just heavy, they can put up shield before up tilt connects. So I try not to go for it at low percent

 

[TriForceOmelet]

Dair's spike hitbox has a ton of hitstun, so if you get the timing down, it can combo into Upsmash at kill percents, around 110% on midweights (I used Marth). Also, while not a combo, PK Magnet can be used pretty well as an edgeguarding tool, even though it isn't as easily applicable as in brawl, it has serious hitstun and horizontal knockback, making it really useful against characters lacking in horzontal recovery options, like Roy or Captain Falcon. The hitbox for magnet comes out after you pull the magnet back in, so practice the timing on it first. Just some thoughts. I think Lucas can be really good, especially if we see some Advanced techniques come out some time soon.

I've been doing this a lot. As low as 80% with rage, you can full jump the Dair while starting it as soon as possible and carry your opponent a tiny bit into the air and back down, allowing you to connect all the previous hits before the meteor. I had it teched on me once, and there seems to be enough time for you to roll or jump away safely; otherwise, they'll bounce up stunned, leaving you enough time to throw out an Up Smash.

 

[EnhaloTricks]

Hmm not so sure since I haven't really tried it myself nor recall NAKAT doing it but I'm usually able to escape by the third N-Air but what you're saying is the two hits of the N-Air if they connect you can continue the chain even longer? If so I'll try that out.

yeah, pretty much. If you can read the DI it can pretty much go on for awhile (til around the 40%s) but the knock back will shoot them forward and if they DI they can only go above you, so you have s bit of time to react. You just have to make sure the initial hits connect or they'll get out.

 

[phili]

Hey guys, I think FF nair may also connect into SH nair. This can lead into a nair string that @ EnhaloTricks is talking about in the posts above. You can finish the string with uair or sometimes a bair spike.

Here is a video showcasing how this works. (Note: these are not registered as true combos in training mode, but should work in game if you follow your opponent's DI properly. May be escapable if the opponent has a very fast nair like Luigi)

 

[Metal Fish]

I would guess chaining N-airs is DI dependent. I just watch to see where they end up. Sometimes the last hit sets up easy U-tilts, which can set up into other things. N-air is a solid approach with combo potential, and it can cross up shields so it's relatively safe.

 

[Curlz]

I haven't tested this on humans yet, but at low-mid percents Down Throw -> PK Freeze -> U-Air seems to be a thing. I still have testing to do, but it seems to be a viable mix up.

 

[Suicidal_Donuts]

I don't know if anyone has mentioned this, but I use PK Thunder and guide it into the lower part of the stage to stage spike characters for easy KO's. It's risky if you miss, but chances are they're not going to recover if you land it.

 

[Benergy]

Now that I've gotten some experience with Lucas, The dthrow utilt wont work against Mewtwo and Ganondorf. Maybe it was just a DI thing, but every time I played against those two I couldnt get the combo off past 15%.

But really guys, I think we need to discuss Lucas' bair. I've found it to be one of the easiest meteor smashes to land, and in almost every 1v1 match, I could get a bair meteor on them. It's a mighty fine attack IMO

The fact that its possible to spike an opponent that's offstage, without going offstage yourself is really good! With some decent timing, Lucas can really take advantage of linear recoveries, such as Fox?