Chorus Kids for Smash Bros. DLC! ~ Lend your Song of Support in the Smash Bros. Fighter Ballot! ~

[pupNapoleon]

My apologies, I should've been more specific when I was referring to on and offline matches. I'm trying to get across that, with online matches/tournaments (this is also the context I meant when I said popping in the game), I feel that it is unfair for everyone to be obligated to "invest" in all the characters in order to have an even and balanced playing field. For example sake, let's pretend Metaknight was the sole DLC character in Brawl. He has such an advantage over the rest of the cast that anyone who hasn't bought him is essentially at a disadvantage, to the point where they're obligated to buy him. Likewise, the reason I don't think you can compare soccer to Smash is because, in Smash, everyone is presented with the same supplies (the roster) after buying the game, where as in real life the referees don't supply both soccer teams with the same gear; it's up to the athlete and individual teams to buy their own supplies. You're telling me Smash should be like that in order to compete? It would be good design to be required to invest money in order to gain an edge? That makes no sense. It's never been that way; everyone should be presented with the same content on the disc when playing online and the only real "investment" should be time put into practicing. (bolded because I can't stress this point enough)

Overall, it isn't as much as how much the DLC would cost- it's more so the concept of having to pay extra in a competitive video game to qualify for an even playing field, and likewise, the ability to buy a completely exclusive and potentially advantage-granting character to use in competition. Smash Bros. ain't no free-to-play pay-to-win MMO.

Now, as for offline tourneys and matches- I feel like it would mostly affect tournament organizers. They would all be responsible for purchasing all of the DLC and everything just gets.. messy and inconsistent. Say I attend a local tournament and want to play as my main, Chorus Kids, which happens to be DLC and the TO hasn't purchased the character. If all the characters were on the disc to begin with, situations and disputes like that wouldn't be spawned. My main problem with DLC pertaining to offline is that inconsistency.

Whew.. Sorry for those walls of text.

Well, Meta Knight is only hugely OP to the people willing to invest time to get competitive.
Invest time. The person who practices more is likely to have a leg up. We are not talking about much money, we are talking the likelihood of 6 characters at 5 dollars each. Sure, money is money, but we are not talking about a paywall, which is a term for benefit to people for spending money. Usually, pay as you go, continual amounts.

Some people do not have strong internet connections. Is that factored into your paywall account? That the person who can spend more for a connection may win, or that those who have no internet at all cannot update patches, and therefore patches should not exist?
No, that is ridiculous.
How about buying a 'procontroller?' That is an added cost. The person who is playing on the best control is going to do the best. If may be somewhat subjective, so does that mean, each player should have purchased all controllers, because if not, the person who has tried out each option to see which he does best in, has an advantage?

I'm sorry, there is no paywall option for DLC. Or, if it exists for DLC, it exists elsewhere, such as with internet, and controls, as I've just explained.

 

[Jigglystep]

Well, Meta Knight is only hugely OP to the people willing to invest time to get competitive. Invest time. The person who practices more is likely to have a leg up. We are not talking about much money, we are talking the likelihood of 6 characters at 5 dollars each. Sure, money is money, but we are not talking about a paywall, which is a term for benefit to people for spending money. Usually, pay as you go, continual amounts.

Aren't we basing this on people who intend to compete though? (that was my assumption with the whole soccer comparison) Regardless of how much time two players have invested, Metaknight still has an edge over the other character, therefore would indeed be paid benefit.

Also, get the idea of a literal "paywall option" out of your head; obviously it wouldn't be a subscription, I'm trying to get across how a system of being restricted from using superior characters and gaining benefit from paying would be wrong for Smash. Heck, not even just superior characters.. exclusive characters could really make or break matchups, and at that point, balance is thrown out the window since it would be incredibly difficult to balance characters on an inconsistent basis like that.. Of course, the designers could balance the game around the complete roster that includes DLC, but that would be assuming the ideal balanced roster should be fully paid for- which, in turn, brings me back to my figurative paywall point. For tournaments, TOs would be obligated to purchase all the characters in order to get the fully realized roster, building up a wall of payment for everyone who wants to have a consistent roster to oblige to as more and more characters are offered. Get what I'm saying? It'd all be very messy. Situations like "Oh, I can't play as *insert character* on your game? Psh, I don't want to play in this tournament.." or "Oh, you have these OP DLC characters? I don't want to play in this tournament.." would occur if a tournament organizer couldn't/didn't acquire all the characters. In my opinion, the fully balanced and thought out roster should be on the disc from the get-go to keep everything consistent and level.

A bit more on topic- I definitely agree with you guys. At this point, I'd be satisfied with any Rhythm Heaven character.. a rhythm-based moveset does sounds very fun regardless of who represents it, and all the viable reps seem appealing!

 

[pupNapoleon]

Aren't we basing this on people who intend to compete though? (that was my assumption with the whole soccer comparison) Regardless of how much time two players have invested, Metaknight still has an edge over the other character, therefore would indeed be paid benefit.

Also, get the idea of a literal "paywall option" out of your head; obviously it wouldn't be a subscription, I'm trying to get across how a system of being restricted from using superior characters and gaining benefit from paying would be wrong for Smash. Heck, not even just superior characters.. exclusive characters could really make or break matchups, and at that point, balance is thrown out the window since it would be incredibly difficult to balance characters on an inconsistent basis like that.. Of course, the designers could balance the game around the complete roster that includes DLC, but that would be assuming the ideal balanced roster should be fully paid for- which, in turn, brings me back to my figurative paywall point. For tournaments, TOs would be obligated to purchase all the characters in order to get the fully realized roster, building up a wall of payment for everyone who wants to have a consistent roster to oblige to as more and more characters are offered. Get what I'm saying? It'd all be very messy. Situations like "Oh, I can't play as *insert character* on your game? Psh, I don't want to play in this tournament.." or "Oh, you have these OP DLC characters? I don't want to play in this tournament.." would occur if a tournament organizer couldn't/didn't acquire all the characters. In my opinion, the fully balanced and thought out roster should be on the disc from the get-go to keep everything consistent and level.

A bit more on topic- I definitely agree with you guys. At this point, I'd be satisfied with any Rhythm Heaven character.. a rhythm-based moveset does sounds very fun regardless of who represents it, and all the viable reps seem appealing!

Why would a tournament NOT have the characters? That is such a ludicrous claim. My analogy of relating it to internet and controllers, if you refuse to take my analogy of taking it to a sports match, is on point, and ignored. It is a similar situation of a consumer reaching a price point that they would have to pay to play better potentially. It just does not make any sense dude. But I'm dropping it now, obviously I will not understand what you are trying to communicate to me, and vice versa, because I logically cannot see anyway what you are seeing could happen.

That said; I'm glad we both want Rhythm Heaven represented in this game.

 

[Jigglystep]

All the talk of the musicians for Smash 4 has gotten me thinking about what they could do with the Rhythm Heaven soundtrack, so I decided to try my hand at recreating one of my favorite themes:

Enjoy! (hopefully! )

 

[Spinosaurus]

So the leak is real, someone uploaded the video.

But that someone said on Reddit that there's more characters, and his name there is "Dubadubadubizattrue2"

Take it as you will

 

[Esquelen]

The Chorus Kids confirmed

 

[XStarWarriorX]

The Chorus Kids confirmed

http://archive.moe/_/search/image/0DIpTWxhqggdjy4Vt20lEg/

Fake.

 

[Spinosaurus]

And a repost of an old 4chan post as well.

Leaker is really playing around the idea of a playable RH rep.

 

[PixelPasta]

So the leak is real, someone uploaded the video.

But that someone said on Reddit that there's more characters, and his name there is "Dubadubadubizattrue2"

Take it as you will

Wasn't Izat True the name of the leaker's youtube channel?

 

[Spinosaurus]

Wasn't Izat True the name of the leaker's youtube channel?

Yeah. It's the same guy.

Blatant Rhythm Heaven reference and the other guy is playing around a bit with the possible inclusion of a Rhythm Heaven character.

 

[Hippopotasauce]

I would gladly accept the wrestler.

 

[Jigglystep]

The Chorus Kids confirmed

WOAH.. don't do that to me man, I lost it for a second..

Anyway, going off of the information floating around from the people and mods associated the leak, I think it's safe to say they're in.

We have this tidbit from the Ninka leak: (which, if I'm not mistaken, was released weeks prior to the roster images/gameplay footage and all the details match up flawlessly.. so it's undeniably credible at this point)

>Dixie
>Shulk
>Chorus Men
>Ridley
>Bowser Jr
>Mewtwo
>Duck Hunt Dog

In addition to that, it's been stated by reliable sources that the roster shown in the leaked images is 100% not the final roster.. if that wasn't enough, there is an image of All-Star mode, which is locked.. implying the shown roster is indeed incomplete. The initial leaker of the video footage and screenshots also confirmed it.

So, in short, put the pieces of the puzzle together. The Chorus Kids have been mentioned on several occasions by many people involved in the Ninka/Dubadubadubizattrue2/the-numerous-other-people leaks, the leaker's NAME is a blatant reference to Rhythm Heaven, and we know the roster isn't complete..

My thoughts?

GET HYPED.

 

[PixelPasta]

http://archive.moe/_/search/image/0DIpTWxhqggdjy4Vt20lEg/

Fake.

What if it is real, and the poster is just trying to throw us off by saying that they made it!!!!!

I'm only kidding. Though I am really desperate for a Chorus Kids confirmation/leak.

 

[Zzuxon]

At this point, the worst case scenario is that Chorus Kids were cut due to technical limitations.

 

[DonkaFjord]

At this point, the worst case scenario is that Chorus Kids were cut due to technical limitations.

Or just give his moves to a singular RH entity.

 

[Jigglystep]

waitwaitwaitwaitWHATWOAAHWOAAHH

A Nintendo employee tweeted about Rhythm Heaven!?

https://twitter.com/toraton/status/456673899174821888

I mean.. I doubt it means anything, but why? Rhythm Heaven DS is really outdated, and not really relevant to anything.. so where did this come from? If anything, you'd think he'd reference the more recent game in the series.

Oh, and mind you, he also retweeted this:

The people who spend years of their lives working on something have earned the right to present it the way they want. Not how you want.

With that acknowledgement, he definitely knows about the leak, and could very well know a thing or two about Smash 4, being a system engineer for Nintendo and all.. (I did some background research)

Soo, perhaps.. a certain newcomer trio along with more Rhythm Heaven content in the games has sparked his interest and gave him reasoning to tweet that? Mentioning Rhythm Heaven out of the blue just strikes me as.. odd.

Call me a straw grasper, but take it as you will. i'm not crazy please trust me

 

[DonkaFjord]

Oh, and mind you, he also retweeted this:

The people who spend years of their lives working on something have earned the right to present it the way they want. Not how you want.

Damn that is actually really heartbreaking....

 

[Banjodorf]

WOAH.. don't do that to me man, I lost it for a second..

Anyway, going off of the information floating around from the people and mods associated the leak, I think it's safe to say they're in.

We have this tidbit from the Ninka leak: (which, if I'm not mistaken, was released weeks prior to the roster images/gameplay footage and all the details match up flawlessly.. so it's undeniably credible at this point)



In addition to that, it's been stated by reliable sources that the roster shown in the leaked images is 100% not the final roster.. if that wasn't enough, there is an image of All-Star mode, which is locked.. implying the shown roster is indeed incomplete. The initial leaker of the video footage and screenshots also confirmed it.

So, in short, put the pieces of the puzzle together. The Chorus Kids have been mentioned on several occasions by many people involved in the Ninka/Dubadubadubizattrue2/the-numerous-other-people leaks, the leaker's NAME is a blatant reference to Rhythm Heaven, and we know the roster isn't complete..

My thoughts?

GET HYPED.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure these little badasses are still safe. My bets are on them, Metwo and Dixie still being in a good place. And if that's not enough, there's a movement growing of those of us who think Sakurai is hiding some newcomers for the Wii U release. To be added to the 3DS version freely of course.

Seriously though. Sneaky Spirits were in the E3 build. They wouldn't have decided that late to remove them and the Chorus Men. As I recall, no one saw Polar Bears in the actual demo.

So..yeah.

Besides, it'd be a ****ing shame to ignore how popular Rhythm Heaven is, and it's amazing musical score.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

That Nintendo-Rep... yowch.

He has a point though.

 

[Spinosaurus]

For what it's worth All Stars mode is locked, meaning that it might not be the full roster. Moreover, Barbara the Bat's trophy description is empty, and there are some typos in others. The videos COULD be an unfinished build, but still eligible to be rated. Regardless if it is the final build or not, the DVD does not need to show every hidden secret in the game, including characters.

Check this out.

During the final stages of development and prior to a game being released to the public, game publishers submit responses to a detailed written ESRB questionnaire (often supplementing such responses with lyric sheets, scripts, etc.), specifying exactly what pertinent content (as defined by ESRB) will be in their game.

Along with the written submission materials, publishers must provide a DVD that captures all pertinent content. This includes typical gameplay, missions, and cutscenes, along with the most extreme instances of content across all relevant categories including but not limited to violence, language, sex, controlled substances and gambling. Pertinent content that is not playable (i.e., "locked out") but will exist in the game code on the final game disc must also be disclosed.

ESRB does not need to know every content there is in the game, especially not hidden content UNLESS it's pertinent. We're possibly not looking at the whole picture here.

 

[Jigglystep]

For what it's worth All Stars mode is locked, meaning that it might not be the full roster. Moreover, Barbara the Bat's trophy description is empty, and there are some typos in others. The videos COULD be an unfinished build, but still eligible to be rated. Regardless if it is the final build or not, the DVD does not need to show every hidden secret in the game, including characters.

Check this out.

ESRB does not need to know every content there is in the game, especially not hidden content UNLESS it's pertinent. We're possibly not looking at the whole picture here.

You do bring up some really valid points. Unless one of the final newcomers is Bayonetta or something, there isn't much reason to review that content. Plus, the ESRB doesn't play/see the full game in its entirety; only the pertinent stuff like you said, as backed up by this:

Why don’t the ESRB raters actually play the games they rate?

ESRB raters do not actually play the games during the rating process for a variety of reasons. First, many games have upwards of 50 hours of gameplay, so requiring a minimum of three raters to play through each of the more than 1,000 games rated annually by ESRB would be inefficient given the high degree of repetition in video games. Additionally, because games are player-controlled there are many different permutations of gameplay. In other words, one player of a particular game may see very different types of content than another depending on his or her actions or decisions in the course of playing. Consequently, engaging in gameplay as part of our rating process would offer no greater assurance that all pertinent content was considered in the assignment of a rating.

 

[Banjodorf]

The empty Barbara description was telling that this isn't the final build, at least.

 

[Opossum]

That Chorus Kids "leak" nearly gave me a heart attack.

But really, my hope for K. Rool is severely diminished, so these guys are the last newcomers not listed that I'd really like to see that have a plausible shot. I just hope they happen...have faith in the name of the Wrestler, the Choir, and the Sneaky Spirit.

 

[Laniv]

That Chorus Kids "leak" nearly gave me a heart attack.

But really, my hope for K. Rool is severely diminished, so these guys are the last newcomers not listed that I'd really like to see that have a plausible shot. I just hope they happen...have faith in the name of the Wrestler, the Choir, and the Sneaky Spirit.

B-b-but Reporter...

 

[BluePikmin11]

@vaanrose clarified that the Impa, Mach Rider, Dixie leak is fake.

 

[Jigglystep]

@vaanrose clarified that the Impa, Mach Rider, Dixie leak is fake.

Yep.

The cards are slowly falling into place.

 

[Cloudy]

Oh god, if the Ice Climbers are cut AND we dont get a RH rep, I don't know what I'm going to do!

I hope we at least get a stage, so we get the songs, but a playable character would be ideal.

If the only thing we get from RH is the Sneaky Spirits in Smash Run... I'm going to kill Sakurai

 

[Jigglystep]

Hey, has anyone considered this?

There's a spot for one more stage to be unlocked, so if the remaining characters are indeed Chorus Kids, Dixie, Mewtwo, and Ridley as that one related leak specified, wouldn't it make sense for the remaining locked stage to be for Rhythm Heaven since those final characters would introduce one last franchise? (RH) I can't see what other stage would need to be unlocked if there was no new franchise left to be introduced. This would also follow the pattern of how a franchise stage is generally unlocked with its character, such as Green Hill Zone being unlocked with Sonic and Flat Zone with G&W. It falls into place a bit too well.

RogersBase mentioned this point in a discussion video, and I thought I'd throw it out there.

 

[Opossum]

These guys are pretty much my last newcomer that I still have at least some hope for. I really hope they get in. Gematsu showed me how much I'd adore these fellas, and everything up until now has fallen into place.

Of note, that obviously fake text post (the Isabelle one) has one glaring issue, dealing with the absence of a RH fighter. He claims the Sneaky Spirit was added due to Sakurai wanting more handheld enemies. The Spirit only appeared in Fever...

...derp.

 

[PixelPasta]

Of note, that obviously fake text post (the Isabelle one) has one glaring issue, dealing with the absence of a RH fighter. He claims the Sneaky Spirit was added due to Sakurai wanting more handheld enemies. The Spirit only appeared in Fever...

...derp.

Sneaky Spirits originated on the GBA, didn't they? That's a handheld...

 

[PlTe]

Put me on the support list. A rhythm based character would be awesome.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Of note, that obviously fake text post (the Isabelle one) has one glaring issue, dealing with the absence of a RH fighter. He claims the Sneaky Spirit was added due to Sakurai wanting more handheld enemies. The Spirit only appeared in Fever...

...derp.

Actually they are in Tengoku, a handheld game. The bonus games in Fever are actually updated Tengoku games.

 

[Jigglystep]

Even so, I honestly doubt that was Sakurai's reasoning for including the Sneaky Spirit, especially considering a Rhythm Heaven enemy, of all things, would be completely out of nowhere if there was no other content for the series.

Put me on the support list.

Speaking of which, where has @Louie G. been?

 

[Opossum]

It was on Tengoku? Huh. Didn't know. I've only seen footage of the Wii version.

 

[smashkirby]

We'd better get an RH rep. I'm serious. I don't care if it's Ms. Rhythm (my preferred choice, personally.) or even the Chorus Kids. Heck, I'll even take it as Marshal, Ms. Ribbon, and Cam from Fever as a playable trio. That's how much I want an RH character.

 

[Hippopotasauce]

Give me my Karate Joe

 

[Ridles the Space Pirate]

You know, when Gematsu and Sal had first put them in their leak, I was completely against the chorus kids inclusion(s)(?) just so the leak could be disproven, but now that I have seen the dedication of many of you to this character(s), I'm ready to accept them as the true possibility they are.

 

[Jigglystep]

You know, when Gematsu and Sal had first put them in their leak, I was completely against the chorus kids inclusion(s)(?) just so the leak could be disproven, but now that I have seen the dedication of many of you to this character(s), I'm ready to accept them as the true possibility they are.

Glad to hear that more people are coming around to the idea. :D
Chorus Kids and space dragons shall live in harmony.. honestly, I'm strongly confident they'll both be playable, and the recent leaks have only convinced me further.

 

[TempahRelapse]

Haven't checked but I do hope the support list is updated. I do believe that Nintendo, look at these forums for suggestions. And I think if Chorus Kids don't make it into the game from the start, we will see them as DLC. As I do believe from watching videos and surfing the internet, that the Chorus Kids popularity has spiked and seem to be on everyone's radar since the Gematsu, Fematsu, asdfdaessd (whatever you call it) leak.

 

[PixelPasta]

Apparently a new Japan-only Nintendo Direct is tomorrow, focusing on upcoming 3DS games.
Doesn't that sound like a possible time to reveal Chorus Kids?