Ask Ice Climber Players About Ice Climbers Thread

[Binx]

Marth is invulnerable for 7 frames as he throws popo or nana into the other climber, the only thing you can do is shield which doesn't always work for Nana.

 

[1048576]

When the opponent is at high damage and I land a grab, I like to make Nana charge a smash for the kill. How come sometimes after she connects with a full-charged f-smash does the opponent remain in Popo's grasp?

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

because of the percent they are at the higher the percent the harder it is to knock them out of the grab, same thing with everyone else with the grab punch thing

 

[1048576]

Okay, I'll just learn to d-throw up-smash like everyone else Thanks

 

[Binx]

you can charge and then downthrow into the smash! even better cause you get a charged smash AND you get some throw damage!

 

[`EX]

I'm haveing trouble wave-dashing into an u-tilt. is there a specific way to do this, or any things that help you do it?

 

[1048576]

Wait how do you charge a smash and then flick down on the control stick without releasing the smash?

 

[pockyD]

I'm haveing trouble wave-dashing into an u-tilt. is there a specific way to do this, or any things that help you do it?

no, not really

can you not utilt in general or something? (this is a legitimate problem a lot of people have at some point) adding the wavedash doesn't really change anything, as wavedash->anything can generally be construed as two separate actions anyway where you just have to learn how fast you can act after initiating a wavedash through practice (maybe jumping would be different, but certainly not tilting/smashing)

Wait how do you charge a smash and then flick down on the control stick without releasing the smash?

why not?

i don't know how you're charging your smash, but the two standard ways...

c-stick + Z => hold Z, so you can do the throw with both the c-stick and regular control stick
direction + A => hold A, so you can again do the throw with both the c-stick and regular control stick

... I'm guessing this is where your question is, so the answer is that you don't need to hold the direction while charging; only Z or A

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

press z then quickly start charging the smash and then throw when ready same thing as using down B in a grab and would side B to a B or an air be a good de-sysce?

 

[Binx]

You charge a smash by doing this

1) Grab them
2) have nana Jab
3) VERY quickly hit a direction plus the A button while nana is in the jab animation - continue to hold A
4) move the analogue stick to the desired throw, down or up work best
5) release A

 

[Gu3r0]

zup from vnzla guys.. i wanted to ask something.. Im trying to grab with popo and then with nana, but i cant make nana throw where i want.. how can i do it ?

 

[Dogysamich]

Do the ICs have any viable chaingrabs on doc?

I mean like, d.throw -> d.air, the relay, whatever.

 

[Blitzmidfielder]

What are good grab combos? I only know Dthrow - Blizzard and Fthrow - Fair.

 

[Fly_Amanita]

@Dogy: The ledge CG is the only one I'm aware of that Doc can't get out of.

@Blitz: The ICs can do too many things out of grabs. Are there any characters in particular you're curious about CGing? Anyways, dthrow -> dair, a few variants of that, and wobbling are probably the most important CGs to know. I'd say the ledge CG (see the top sticky) is of comparable importance if you can actually do it, too.

Simple things like dthrow -> usmash also tend to work really well. There's really a lot of random crap I could list about ICs grabs.

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

Gu3r0 you can't make nana throw were you want ,but you can limit her throw options look at the ledge guide at the top.

is side B a good move to de-scynce with anything i don't ready care

 

[Binx]

I'm haveing trouble wave-dashing into an u-tilt. is there a specific way to do this, or any things that help you do it?

If you try to utilt too soon during the wavedash it won't register and the timing will be very slow, try waiting a second and get the timing down.

 

[*P*L*U*R*]

Do the ICs have any viable chaingrabs on doc?

I mean like, d.throw -> d.air, the relay, whatever.

As far as I know, nothing outside of the handoff works on doc.

I try to just Dthrow -> Fair tech-chase doc if I can grab him.


You have to **** me at HERB

 

[pockyD]

i liked comboing out of reverse dair O_o

 

[Blea Gelo]

are u seius? because i saw wobbles doing like fthrows grabs in a row..

 

[Binx]

are u seius? because i saw wobbles doing like fthrows grabs in a row..

That is the handoff chain throw, it only works near the ledge or if nana fthrows 1/4 but like I said before if you handoff to nana and start charging a forward smash or upsmash you have a 3/4 chance that your smash will hit, uthrow will reverse their DI possibly sending them off stage, dthrow does the usual stuff and so does fthrow, if nana backthrows you miss the smash so I usually just downthrow upsmash and try to land an uair, with cape stalling though its not too reliable unless your good at predicting it.

Reverse dair smash works on doc I think at 40+

Left my controller at a friends house or I'd go test it real quick.

 

[Blitzmidfielder]

@Dogy: The ledge CG is the only one I'm aware of that Doc can't get out of.

@Blitz: The ICs can do too many things out of grabs. Are there any characters in particular you're curious about CGing? Anyways, dthrow -> dair, a few variants of that, and wobbling are probably the most important CGs to know. I'd say the ledge CG (see the top sticky) is of comparable importance if you can actually do it, too.

Simple things like dthrow -> usmash also tend to work really well. There's really a lot of random crap I could list about ICs grabs.

Spacies, Peach, Samus, Jiggs, Falcon. The three worst characters for me, and the three I have to worry most about.

Also: Dittoing ICs; Good things to know?

 

[pockyD]

fsmash ***** IC dittos

generally, fsmash, bair, dsmash

throw in fair from time to time (if they are predictable with dsmashes) and jab sparingly

 

[Binx]

I've never had another IC punish my jabs but eh.

Umm check the match up thread for info on all of those characters. Post any additional questions on that thread, thats why its there.

here is a link super awesome thread of beastage

 

[pockyD]

get dsmashed?

also, you want to be facing away more often than not to take advantage of bair and the slightly faster dsmash, so jabbing is less practical in that sense too

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

when does fair spike and is side B to whatever a good de-synce ?

 

[Blea Gelo]

thx binx partner XD

 

[Binx]

when does fair spike and is side B to whatever a good de-synce ?

Fair spikes when you hit with the end of it, unlike brawl either climber can spike alone or together. Side b desynch is never reliable, its too easy to crouch cancel and if you aren't hitting them with it, its slower than spot dodging or rolling. Stick to pivot, dash dance, grab, and hit lag desynchs for the most part, if you have time to set up another one its okay to use them sparingly as well.

thx binx partner XD

Your welcome!

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

thanks i asked 3 times and please don't talk of brawl here

 

[Jam Stunna]

So are IC players in agreement that Marth is now the worst matchup for ICs?

 

[Kyu Puff]

Not at all... personally I think it's no worse than 60-40. Peach and Samus are much harder for me.

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

most people think marth is the hardest but peach and samus are rarer and i think marth is really hard due to gay range. but keep in mind a good IC can win.

i remember the time my brother picked up marth and he 2 stocked me and he was proud and he lost the rest of his stocks and keep in mind i only chain if you are being cheap or annoying

 

[Smasher89]

Peach, no other char can possibly be harder then her, Marth is managable due to that the matchup is all about mindgames, but peach is like hi, I want to use floatcancelled fair to dsmash to quickly get Nana out and play safe against Popo...

 

[Binx]

Marth I'm pretty positive is the worst match up followed by Peach and then Fox and Samus is a distant fourth. At least you can hit peach if you guess correctly, even if it is risky, and yes her shield pressure is a b**** but she is slow enough to take some defensive options at least.

Marth though is completely untouchable unless he approaches too close, so all he has to do is at certain ranges and slowly push you back and then take advantage of you, the only time you should be able to put pressure on a good Marth is while your invincible after he kills you. If you off the edge at any percent with/without Nana your probably dead, Solo your dead for sure unless they make a mistake. If Marth doesn't feel like playing campy he can mix in surprise grabs and throw you at the other climber while invincible too.

Samus has great crouch cancels and you can't reflect her missiles with Nana present, her dsmash and dtilt are both great at separating ICs making it basically impossible to jab her since Samus lives off CCs. The match up is winnable if you are better than them but I don't get enough Samus practice.

Fox is really tough because he can laser camp if he can predict well enough or he can play aggressive, all his moves can be countered, making him more beatable than Marth, unfortunately a lot of his moves can't be Punished, and there are a few you have to start answers for early like utilt to counter a drill in the middle of your head (not that a good fox would do this anyways) Once you get hit a single time he can either continue to combo you or in a lot of situations he lands one shine on Nana shines her off the stage, by then its a simple guessing game, is Popo gonna attack me? if Yes forward smash him, bair him, shine him, whatever else. If no gimp nana and sweetspot the ledge (my friend has learned the timing pretty well with Fox to shine Nana turn around and sweetspot his double jump, he also likes to mix it up with shine turn around jump straight up and forward b or up b through me).

 

[Jam Stunna]

Yeah, I was showing a friend yesterday how it's literally impossible for the ICs to get inside of short hopped fair. Peach can at least be punished, but it's like nothing works against Marth.

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

yeah fair is to fast and really d-B barely out ranges marth and that does really help to much because with percent spacing you would get about 3%? WTF marth is unbeatable and roy is stupid easy wants up with that? (i know why)

 

[Kyu Puff]

How can Marth completely shut down a character with one of the fastest ground speeds in the game, one of the only characters with range to compete with his own? His "unbeatable camping" game is quite beatable in an actual match because he has absolutely nothing to force you to approach. If you keep getting punished by f-air and d-tilt simply be patient, or bait with wds until the situation has changed a bit. If you predict a shorthop you can easily waveshield into his f-air range and shieldgrab. D-tilt is harder and I'll admit that it takes a lot of prediction to completely bypass f-air d-tilt.

You can create pseudo-pressure by attacking with a safe move (jab/f-tilt/b-air) into the shallower part of his DD range. If he dashes away, you're safe, and if not, you've created an opening. Every time you land a grab it puts you at a huge advantage.

 

[Binx]

Marths throws are fast, so its a simple guessing game, he can do more to us out of his throws than we can to him, his opening dash animation is too fast to do anything to him on reaction and once you are under pressure its done. Name one top level Marth that loses to Chu Dat.

I understand what your saying, I really do, but Marth beats Ice Climbers, very badly. Period.

 

[Kyu Puff]

He's beaten m2k multiple times at high level tournaments (pound 2?). From a grab you can do a fast 50-60% to correct DI and send him off stage; from a grab he can at most combo Nana. I'm not the best at punishing other characters grabs but supposedly you can shield his throws and shieldgrab afterwards if he grabs Nana.

Approaching into the front end of his dd range doesn't require any reaction, it's simply safe because he can't punish a jab or b-air from a dash dance. I'm sure there are examples of this if you watch any vid of Chu vs a high level marth.

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

yeah but most likely he will grab popo so yeah but still it's a good plan and maybe you could up-b his fair if their is a platform above you, just an idea nana can't be hurt for up-B (half*** plan)

 

[Jam Stunna]

Pound 2? That's reaching pretty far. M2K recently 3-stocked Chu, and Wobbles recently lost to Taj, another Marth main.