Stutter Step x2

It has already been discovered that certain characters can stutter step to increase the range of their F-smash. I know that Sonic and Captain Falcon are two that can.

Say your character is facing right. You can stutter step by tapping left on the control stick then quickly pressing c-stick right. This will increase the range of your f-smash to the right.
I did not discover this method.

After messing around I found out you can increase the range of your f-smash even more by using a stutter step. I don't really have a name for it, I wanted to make sure this wasn't known before I looked even dumber for naming an already known move. I'll refer to the move as a double stutter step from now on.

Once again, say your character is facing right. You can double stutter step by dashing right, quickly tap your control stick left (similar to the time of a dash dance I think) and then quickly pressing c-stick right. This will pretty much double the range of your f-smash depending on what character you are.

This move can be very useful for characters like sonic whose f-smash one of his strongest moves. I will play around with this more and fill you guys in if I come up with something along the lines of this. Let me know what you guys think, and if this is already known then my bad.


As of right now, double stutter stepping works with all characters. Some characters (like Kirby) barely move forward with this while others (like Falcon) double the range of their f-smash. Normal stutter stepping only works for a certain amount of characters and actually sends others backwards, shorting their f-smash range. Double Stutter Stepping works with all characters.

(Update) You can actually cancel all character's initial dashes by u-smashing and f-smashing. By canceling the character's initial dash with an f-smash you will increase the range of the f-smash. Double stutter stepping increases the range of a character's initial dash cancelled f-smash even more, but only for certain characters. If normal stutter stepping does not work for a character, double stutter stepping will not increase that character's f-smash range any more than an initial dash cancelled f-smash. So in less words, if a character doesn't get any range out of a stutter step, don't use a double stutter step, just cancel the initial dash with an f-smash.

If anyone notices that double stutter stepping doesn't work for a character, please point it out to me. Thanks.

Wow, that's a very interesting discovery. It seems to work, from what I just tried in training mode.

Finally, I did something right for once. Haha

nice. keep up the good work

very helpful, thanks dude

I would like to make a list of characters who gain range with their f-smash by doing this and am short on time tonight. If anyone can tell me any characters that gain f-smash range with this it would be greatly appreciated.

I think Wario can pull of the same technique.

Cool, thanks Tin for the Wario comment. I'll have to confirm this myself (most likely tomorrow) or have someone else confirm it to make sure he can.

well i think Ganon also works - cuz i heard u can increase his Fsmash with the 1st version of shutter step or w/e, so it shud work with ur discovery aswell

(It was posted in the Ganon section that u can do the 1st version, + if CF can do it, Ganon shud too?)

so how is this different from just a dash-cancel over smash?

and how is the double different from... the sort of fox-trot turnaround thing and then a dash-cancel over smash?

just wondering if it's semantics or is it different

This is known, and in Brawl we call it a Pivot.


-Kye

I think it's faster than the dash canceled over smash and the fox trot things that you're talking about Enoch, and this varies drastically depending on characters. We'll have to see how everything plays out to figure out which of these things will become more useful. I'm just pointing out something I found. It would be great if someone could make a video showing the differences in these techniques. At the moment, I'm unable to.

SynikaL said:

This is known, and in Brawl we call it a Pivot.


-Kye

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Really? I thought pivoting was different.
[goes to research pivot]

**Edit**

From what I've read pivoting is just turning around to grab/possibly attack. If I'm wrong please give me a link so I can read up on pivoting please. Thanks.

I think this is just the dash cancel.... i can't seem to get this to work any other way. Dashing one direction then immediately smashing the other way (or the same way) just cancels the dash into the smash... unless there's like a FRAME of difference between these things I think they're the same

that or i have ****** fingers

Enoch-Fox said:

I think this is just the dash cancel.... i can't seem to get this to work any other way. Dashing one direction then immediately smashing the other way (or the same way) just cancels the dash into the smash... unless there's like a FRAME of difference between these things I think they're the same

that or i have ****** fingers

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Try using falcon, it's really obvious. I know Kirby it's hardly noticable but their is a slight increase.

there isnt a single stutter step video on youtube..

the DOUBLE one is a lot better than a dash-cancel because you keep the momentum from the first dash I think... but what I mean is I think the SINGLE stutter-step is the same thing as cancelling out of the beginning dash animation into an over-smash... at least, the way you put it... I think it's just different terminology.

Is this a "dash-dance to smash" chain?

Haha, yeah with all the threads of new techiniques and a sticky that hasn't been updated with them it all gets confusing. All I know is that this double stutter stepping thing will be really useful for certain characters like sonic and falcon.

Plaz said:

Is this a "dash-dance to smash" chain?

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I guess you could put it that way. I'll try smashing out of a multiple dash dance tomorrow and see how that compares. I'm out for the night.

domiNate said:

Really? I thought pivoting was different.
[goes to research pivot]

**Edit**

From what I've read pivoting is just turning around to grab/possibly attack. If I'm wrong please give me a link so I can read up on pivoting please. Thanks.

Click to expand...

While I'm not sure anyone has made the clear distinction yet, there's two types of "Pivot" in Brawl. One, is the method you're describing which was obviously programed into the game. The second method is derived from Melee in which you lightly hit the opposite direction during an Initial Dash animation in an attempt to center the stick, which allows you to set your character to Neutral (where your character then has access to his full moveset).

In Brawl, the second method is only viable during the first 2-3 frames of the ID animation.

What you're doing is Pivoting using the first method, but Smashing Forward.

There's actually much confusion about it since hardly anyone used it in Melee, so very few people actually understand the concept of the second method, so we just call both methods Pivoting, since they function similarly.


-Kye

SynikaL said:

While I'm not sure anyone has made the clear distinction yet, there's two types of "Pivot" in Brawl. One, is the method you're describing which was obviously programed into the game. The second method is derived from Melee in which you lightly hit the opposite direction during an Initial Dash animation in an attempt to center the stick, which allows you to set your character to Neutral (where your character then has access to his full moveset).

In Brawl, the second method is only viable during the first 2-3 frames of the ID animation.

What you're doing is Pivoting using the first method, but Smashing Forward.

There's actually much confusion about it since hardly anyone used it in Melee, so very few people actually understand the concept of the second method, so we just call both methods Pivoting, since they function similarly.


-Kye

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quoted for truth.

your technique is old news, I was doing this back on the japanese version -_-

it works with any character that makes a step back to charge his smash (therefore yes it work with mario too) best use is for captain falcon by far though.

I agree, this is just a dash cancel. Doing it your way and canceling the dash with a smash produce the same results.

Damax said:

quoted for truth.

your technique is old news, I was doing this back on the japanese version -_-

it works with any character that makes a step back to charge his smash (therefore yes it work with mario too) best use is for captain falcon by far though.

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Old news or not, it will be new to a lot of people, and the OP explained it is straight to the point. Anyway, it doesn't work with Marth.

Sounds interesting ill try incorperating that into how i play

sounds like a dash dance stutter step to me......i'll have to try it out tomorrow to see if it's any different

deusofhearts said:

Old news or not, it will be new to a lot of people, and the OP explained it is straight to the point. Anyway, it doesn't work with Marth.

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Actually I found that stutter stepping doesn't work for marth but my double stutter step which I guess is actually a second version of a pivot does. It increases his range slightly.

SynikaL said:

While I'm not sure anyone has made the clear distinction yet, there's two types of "Pivot" in Brawl. One, is the method you're describing which was obviously programed into the game. The second method is derived from Melee in which you lightly hit the opposite direction during an Initial Dash animation in an attempt to center the stick, which allows you to set your character to Neutral (where your character then has access to his full moveset).

In Brawl, the second method is only viable during the first 2-3 frames of the ID animation.

What you're doing is Pivoting using the first method, but Smashing Forward.

There's actually much confusion about it since hardly anyone used it in Melee, so very few people actually understand the concept of the second method, so we just call both methods Pivoting, since they function similarly.


-Kye

Click to expand...

Alright, thanks for the input. Just to let you know the method I'm using has only worked with a character's f-smash, and no other moves. So I don't think this is really a pivot similar to a melee pivot because it doesn't bring the character to his neutral position. So really I have no clue if what I'm doing is already known, but it's new to me and many others right now. I think someone should name it instead of having two different "Pivot" moves in this game. Everything is really confusing at this point cause the advanced tactic sticky hasn't been updated in a while. Thanks again.

yea, sound interesting. anyone able to post a video of this.

I updated my first post a bit with initial dash cancel f-smashes. I'm still referring to this move as a double stutter step in my post because saying "the second type of pivot" will just confuse people. Also, isn't their a third pivot too? It's called the pivot grab and was shown on the dojo a while back. So yeah, I think we need different names instead of having three different pivots.

When you say 'control stick left' do you mean move the analog stick (the one you walk with) to the left or the c-stick to the left? Also, could this also be performed by performing the smash with the 'A' button instead of the c-stick?

mventre said:

When you say 'control stick left' do you mean move the analog stick (the one you walk with) to the left or the c-stick to the left? Also, could this also be performed by performing the smash with the 'A' button instead of the c-stick?

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When I say control stick left I'm referring to anolog stick left (the one you walk with). I don't think it could be done with the A button because you would end up dashing back in the first direction you dashed (for my example you would most likely dash right, dash left, dash right, then do a running attack). I think timing for the A button would be next to impossible.

If you're fast enough, and good enough at A-smashing, it could be done, I think many players use the C-Stick because it makes it less likely accidently do a running-A or Forward-A as opposed to the F-Smash.

we desperately need a terms definition thread or an updated tactics thread. There's atleast 5 names for nearly everything. Not to mention the idiots who try to name things after themselves.

Having two distinct techniques named "Pivot" is confusing.

I suggest we name this one "Dash Dance Revolution"

Seriously though, it sounds like all sonic players need to learn how to do this.

-GK

I'm surprised how well you handled SynikaL without being a jerk. Kudos to you.

Mikezor said:

I'm surprised how well you handled SynikaL without being a jerk. Kudos to you.

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Haha, thanks man. I think he meant well though, probably just a little annoyed at these threads "discovering" the same things over and over. You'd think someone would make a new sticky with all the new AT's instead of just crabbing at other people though. And yes we definitely need different names for all of these "pivots."

"Handled me?" What the h3ll? LOL.

I was just going to leave this thread alone, but that comment pulled me in:

domiNate said:

Alright, thanks for the input. Just to let you know the method I'm using has only worked with a character's f-smash, and no other moves.

Click to expand...

Then maybe you are talking about something different, but I highly doubt it: what I'm describing works with ALL Smashes.

So I don't think this is really a pivot similar to a melee pivot because it doesn't bring the character to his neutral position.

Click to expand...

That's why I clarified two versions for you -- from your descriptions you're employing the first version I delineated.

So really I have no clue if what I'm doing is already known, but it's new to me and many others right now. I think someone should name it instead of having two different "Pivot" moves in this game. Everything is really confusing at this point cause the advanced tactic sticky hasn't been updated in a while. Thanks again.

Click to expand...

I will freely admit that you have illuminated many on the subject, but these are people who were obviously never in the know regarding the game's system changes to begin with. While it isn't discussed very often-- if at all -- players have been employing this technique:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDgUo_9W724

Check the Marth at 44 seconds. It's simply self-evident to those familiar with Smash's gameplay engine. If you're alluding to something different, then my apologies. Continue on, and enlighten me in the process.

Also, you can call it "Stutter Step" if you'd like, but quite frankly, it's a silly name and won't last among anyone desiring to sound intelligent when discussing the game. I understand the desire to leave your mark on something you've unearthed for the people with personal touches, but unless it's some type of exploit that wasn't intentionally designed into the game, something that sprung from your own personal styles and ingenuities, you're better off with something more utilitarian if you truly want it to stick.

"Pivoting" works now simply because the Melee version is unlikely to ever be used, considering it's much harder to utilize in Brawl than in Melee (it was hardly used by anyone in Melee due to difficulty). It's too early to say for sure however, but I guarantee these things will work themselves out as players get more acclimated with the system. Again, I understand the desire, but show some restraint.


-Syn

Yeah dude, that marth did exactly what I'm talking about. If the melee pivot is no longer being used, then calling this a pivot is cool, I think it just needs to be clarified in a sticky. But as for me trying to leave my mark, what? I found this out on my own and wanted to share it with other smashers, I didn't even pick a name for it, I just based it's temporary name off of the move it's based off of that someone else discovered and named. Thanks for the video and the helpful info, it cleared things up. By the way, was it so hard to show us that and clear things up for us? You seem knowledgeable enough to make a new thread with all of the advanced tactics so all of us are less confused. I'm sure many people would appreciate it if you did. (hint hint)

The range doesn't actually magically get enhanced. You just "slide" a little.