Meta Wry Mustache Man: Dominating Strategies Discussion

[~ Gheb ~]

like reflex said, the sourspot is near the end of nair, i actually have yet to connect a fart after the sourspot of nair, does anyone know if it is guaranteed or if it works well? it seems like up air is guaranteed though.

It has to be a specific part of the nair hitbox as far as I could tell. If you hit with the front part of the hitbox or the hands it doesn't hit the opponent into the right spot for a fart follow-up. In order for the fart to be a guaranteed hit you need your opponent to be sent somewhere close above you, which only the weak hitbox can accomplish. According to Reflex Wario's body during the nair animation is that sourspot that I'm looking for. Sounds plausible enough.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Training Mode calls it a true combo from low to mid-high percents, for all it's worth.

 

[Micaelis]

Weak hit of Nair (4% not 6%) combos on all characters I've seen into Fair/Uair/Bair/Nair and Waft. You just have to check their DI after the hit and pick the attack that is in their direction. If they go straight up, Uair or Waft, left or right pick the correct aerial in that direction etc. This combo works longer on heavy and/or fast falling characters; works best low-mid percents.

Waft is most definitely a combo in this situation. I have ended many stocks using it (and against good players).

Edit: And on the topic of combos (haven't checked in training but have extensive use experience):
- Dtilt > Dtilt (with nice potential follow ups if you read one of their 4 options: jump, AD, do nothing, or attack)
- Utilt > Uair (low % and probably combos into Waft too)
- Fair > Fair (as long as they DI into you. Great for off stage)
- Falling Uair > Uair

Honorable Mention:
- Crashing Dair > Usmash
I believe this is just a frame trap but a great one against a lot of characters that lack quick aerials. With the new air dodge mechanics they only have 2 options to get out of this, jump or attack with a quick buffered aerial. If they lack the aerial they need to jump or the Usmash will land. It also is weight dependent but it can be performed on most characters within kill range albeit the window is sometimes tight. Although 16% damage from Usmash is never something to scoff at.

Great Pressure Options:
- FH Fair > FF Chomp
- SH Fair > FF Follow-Up (Chomp, Jab, Dtilt, Ftilt, etc)
- Traveling Bike Hit > FF Chomp
- Bike Hit (while riding) > Wheelie Hit

Hopefully some of this helps someone.

 

[DtJ S2n]

I think it should be mentioned that you can combo first hit of n-air to second hit of n-air at mid percents. Only really works doing it out of short-hop.

Landing d-air into the ground before the final hit, crashing d-air you call it, into grab seems really legit and sometimes Waft seems really good out of that.

 

[Rakurai]

I never really thought of it until I saw Gluttony attempt it in some of his matches, but a B-reversed Chomp can be a good way to try to abuse the one frame ledge vulnerability if you want to go for a Wariocide, especially against characters like Mega Man who don't have a hitbox around them to protect them as they approach the edge with their up B.

On a side note, the Rose Scented Waft has so many silly applications. The hitbox is actually big enough to reach through the underside of certain stages, meaning you can potentially catch your opponent off-guard by going under and behind them and wafting. Wafting your bike while someone is trying to recover low is also an amusing edgeguard option, as it keeps them from grabbing the ledge entirely, and can easily gimp characters who lack a strong recovery.

 

[Megaman11]

I don't see a lot of Wario on YouTube even when searching. And if I do, it's mostly 3ds stuff. Someone should make a video covering everything so far because I'm new to Wario and I plan on picking him up. I'm sure a lot of people would appreciate it not just me.

 

[Spinosaurus]

I don't see a lot of Wario on YouTube even when searching. And if I do, it's mostly 3ds stuff. Someone should make a video covering everything so far because I'm new to Wario and I plan on picking him up. I'm sure a lot of people would appreciate it not just me.

The video thread has some matches so check that out. I'd like to update the OP eventually but I'm waiting on Wafty.

Not a whole lot of tournament footage, though, unfortunately.

 

[Rakurai]

For whatever it's worth, the super armor on the fully charged Quick Waft triggers fast enough that you can interrupt most jab combos by dropping your shield the instant the first or second hit connects and wafting immediately.

It actually comes out fast enough that it can armor a half waft if they're both triggered on the exact same frame, meaning it starts on frame 3, assuming the half waft is as fast as in Brawl.

This also means the half waft can interrupt jab combos, as well, though it might not be worth the risk of it potentially getting stuffed if you time it too late.

 

[G-Guy]

Heya, Guys!

I have no clue where to post this, but can somebody explain Wario's Nair attack for me? It's so weird to use! I can hardly tell when and where it connects, when it'll do 2 hits and where that holy sourspot is... :-(

 

[TheReflexWonder]

NairFrame 4- 4: 6.5% 30b/100g (KO@ 243%) 40°
Frame 15-38: 4% 65b/100g (KO@ 309%) 70° 1.1-Hitlag
Max Damage: 10.5%

Sweetspot active on Frame 4 and only Frame 4, partly on his hands. Nine frames of empty space. A bunch of frames of sourspot on his belly.

 

[Adrian Marin]

Here's a neat little trick you probably all haven't thought of (learned it from MySmashCorner.) I've been using it, and it has been absolutely phenomenal for off-stage wafting:

I think WA players really need to use this tech when given the opportunity, as it is extremely effective. For those of you that don't see the point in wafting your own bike, it's worth noting that the waft's hitbox lingers for quite some time after using it against items such as Wario's Bike and opposers, so basically, this tech allows Wario to severely limit the recovery options of most characters whilst killing those with lowly percents (35%) that unfortunately get hit.

 

[Metalex]

Just a quick question,
Which part of Warios Dashattack trips the opponent? and is there any reliable followups if the opponent gets tripped?

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Just a quick question,
Which part of Warios Dashattack trips the opponent? and is there any reliable followups if the opponent gets tripped?

Any part past the sweetspot; after a couple frames, it's all sourspot.

 

[Rakurai]

Just a quick question,
Which part of Warios Dashattack trips the opponent? and is there any reliable followups if the opponent gets tripped?

Pretty much anything after the first moment Wario's face touches the ground will trip the opponent.

The follow-ups you can get are dependent on how late the dash attack hits. If it hits too early, you can't follow up. Otherwise, you can jab, bite, waft, grab, and possibly more.

 

[BJN39]

Pardon me if this was an incorrect thread to post this, but It appears this thead is more active (comparatively) and it IS about competitive talk.

The Zeldas have started discussion on the the Wario:Zelda MU, and we'd love input from the Wario players. ^ ^

< Click ha head to be transported directly to the MU thread!

 

[Phez_]

Hey fellow Wario mains

Do you think d-tilt is a reliable option?
I like it because if i sh fair / bair I can fastfall and d-tilt, which 'covers' the front of Wario and can deny some OoS options. (e.g may come out before a grab, or you can space around a shield grab, then d-tilt to punish the wiff.) It can also 'combo' into itself and grabs, if you catch your opponent with it.... But it does have very bad range.

tl;dr - should I continue to spam d-tilt after aerials (or when grounded) , or is its range too small for it to be good or reliable?

***EDIT: ignore this, just reposted to the Q&A thread.

 

[Sari]

I need a lot of help dealing with Villager as Wario.

It seems like every Villager I fight does the same thing: Lloid rocket (side-B), f-air/b-airs (slingshot), a few attacks that will push me away from them, and repeat. Using my bike is useless since the Lloid rocket will hit it or the Villager might pocket it. If I roll past the Lloid or chomp it, the Villager will easily d-air me and quickly follow up with a lot of weak ground attacks. Even if I manage to get past the Lloid rockets, I'll only be able to hit him about once or twice, and then they'll break out of it by using n-air and various other aerials.

 

[Phez_]

Villager counters Wario im pretty sure. Here are some of my notes;

Warios bike is *basically* no use in the matchup and villager has really good priority and range when compared to Wario, so it's really difficult. Against villager I like sh fairs, d-tilts and f-tilts, and if you see him In shield try to read a roll with waft or just chomp him.

You're better off avoiding the lloid via jumping, but villager can punish your jumps so be careful. If you can stay in his face and give him no room he tends to struggle a bit, but it's difficult with Wario. Killing him is hard but not impossible. Waft, f-tilt, f-throw and bair can all kill around 100-200

D-tilt is extremely quick (frame 5 and almost no cooldown) and it can cover Wario after any aerial approaches. perfect pivoting and pivot f-tilt are really helpful to space around his close-range shenanigans. If you get a grab, d-throw/u-throw at low percents to keep him nearby, and f-throw at higher percents 100-200 because it can kill. to edgeguard, try and clip his up-b with bairs, fairs or a waft. You can alsp set your bike as an item and then use it to edgeguard him by throwing it offstage or up if he's coming from above. an if he's got the bike in his pocket, you may wanna stay away so you can eat it on reaction. These are some small things that helped me alot, so try them out

Hope this helps


*** (btw this vid explains a lot of Warios bike tricks, so check it out if you haven't already)

 

[Rakurai]

Recovering low with the bike is probably a good idea if you're fighting Villager, since it'll deny him the chance to pocket it.

 

[WarioWaft]

Represented our Warior Code nicely last night.
Wafted my way to the championship, with help from Duck Hunt and Olimar in the Bo5 Grand Finals.

In Winner's Finals, I clinched the 5th set with a Wario victory over Rosalina. In Grand Finals, I set the tone with a Wario win over Rosalina, followed by Duck Hunt and Olimar to close it out.

Olimar is the perfect compliment to my Wario. If I just learn how to use a swordsman like Marth, Shulk or Lucina, I can finally get over the hump against really really good Luigis.

 

[Locke 06]

Hey Wario mains! We're discussing the Wario matchup on the Mega Man boards and would love it if you came over to contribute. Unlike you, we don't bite.

Ride your bike over here (but be sure not to get hit by a metal blade on your way there)

 

[crazyninjagod]

anyone think wario is better in brawl or ssb4?

 

[Phez_]

i prefer wario in ssb4 because of his frame 5 d-tilt
so pretty

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Started trying Wario as of late and he's someone I consider rather overlooked, he's like, not bad in any means.

I come from P:M Wario-using (though not competitive necessarily) so I wonder does that help me pick Wario up here? (i.e the aerial game knowledge)

 

[Sari]

Wario mains, I highly suggest using Wario's up-tilt against attacks such as Zero Suit Samus' flip jump [down-b] and Sonic's homing attack [neutral-b] if you're below them. I fought a few matches against a ZSS that kept using her down-b when trying to recover, and I always managed to hit her via up-tilt. It's very easy to time and has various launching effects depending on how you hit them. If you hit them directly with it, they'll launch upwards, but if you hit them with the end of the attack, they won't go as high which means it's easier to combo with an attack such as u-air. So far the only really beneficial uses I've found of this attack countering aerial attacks are the two mentioned.

If anyone finds anymore uses of Wario's u-tilt countering aerial attacks, feel free to share.

 

[DavemanCozy]

Letting Wario's bike ride along the ground doesn't seem to be affected like a normal projectile by reflectors. I find it hilarious that Fox can reflect Zelda's Phantom, but not Wario's bike. It just keeps motoring and hits him.

I was under the impression that Wario had been gutted from Brawl -> Smash4, but I've been playing around with him recently. I think he's still a very powerful fighter. I'm liking this Wario, and I'm looking to add him as one of my tournament characters. I have some questions:

Regarding his throw game. I want to know about Wario's throw game, and what he's capable of doing with all of them. Which is the most useful? What can he do out of certain throws?

D-tilt seems to be one of his best ground pokes, and U-tilt has a fantastic lingering hitbox that makes up for the start-up. F-tilt, on the other hand, is a move I find myself seldomly using. I've been reading around and it seems Warios like F-tilt, but I'm having trouble applying it properly: when it gets shielded, I get punished.
Which situations should I be looking for to use F-tilt?

Wario's bike: I've seen MySmashCorner's video on the bike tricks and Diddy's Supercrawl (Wario's crawl can mantain momentum with the crawl as well) as well. However, I'm a bit confused on how the hitboxes with Wario's bike work. Could anyone give me some information on when the hitboxes are out and when they are no longer present? What bike maneuvers cause the hitbox to appear?

OoS: Out of Shield options. I like U-Smash and Up-B, but dangerous when whiffed. Any others?

Thanks in advance for the info!

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Started trying Wario as of late and he's someone I consider rather overlooked, he's like, not bad in any means.

I come from P:M Wario-using (though not competitive necessarily) so I wonder does that help me pick Wario up here? (i.e the aerial game knowledge)

Rising F-Air is nice, and Neutral-B use is closer to PM than Brawl, but the character doesn't play all that similarly to either Brawl or PM counterparts.

Letting Wario's bike ride along the ground doesn't seem to be affected like a normal projectile by reflectors. I find it hilarious that Fox can reflect Zelda's Phantom, but not Wario's bike. It just keeps motoring and hits him.

I was under the impression that Wario had been gutted from Brawl -> Smash4, but I've been playing around with him recently. I think he's still a very powerful fighter. I'm liking this Wario, and I'm looking to add him as one of my tournament characters. I have some questions:

Regarding his throw game. I want to know about Wario's throw game, and what he's capable of doing with all of them. Which is the most useful? What can he do out of certain throws?

D-tilt seems to be one of his best ground pokes, and U-tilt has a fantastic lingering hitbox that makes up for the start-up. F-tilt, on the other hand, is a move I find myself seldomly using. I've been reading around and it seems Warios like F-tilt, but I'm having trouble applying it properly: when it gets shielded, I get punished.
Which situations should I be looking for to use F-tilt?

Wario's bike: I've seen MySmashCorner's video on the bike tricks and Diddy's Supercrawl (Wario's crawl can mantain momentum with the crawl as well) as well. However, I'm a bit confused on how the hitboxes with Wario's bike work. Could anyone give me some information on when the hitboxes are out and when they are no longer present? What bike maneuvers cause the hitbox to appear?

OoS: Out of Shield options. I like U-Smash and Up-B, but dangerous when whiffed. Any others?

Thanks in advance for the info!

None of his throws give guaranteed follow-ups. F-Throw's a KO move in a pinch, and it does the most damage out of all his throws. D-Throw generally sets up the best for pressure afterward and does decent damage. U-Throw gets people on platforms, but otherwise, unless the opponent is really bad in the air (like Little Mac), you're usually better off D-Throwing for follow-ups instead. B-Throw is weak and is almost always outclassed by D-Throw when your back is near the edge.

D-Tilt is fast but doesn't have good frame advantage; nice disruption similar to most Jabs, though, and can lead to other stuff if opponents like mashing. F-Tilt is a solid punish option due to the disjoint on his fist, good power, and a slight leaning back during the start-up. Think of it as diet F-Smash. Less risk but less reward.

When riding it, Wario's Bike has a hitbox when you're moving forward on it, generally at the front of the bike. A second hitbox is immediately generated if you start a wheelie or turn around on the bike. If you jump off the bike while it's moving on the ground, it continues to have a hitbox until it rides off the ground or falls over (as a result of losing speed).

N-Air is an okay out-of-shield option against taller characters, as is Neutral-B if you expect them to shield afterward. Down-B can be great after a powershield, too.

 

[Gombi]

Hi everybody i am currently playing Luigi but more and more i play him more that his floaty weight bother me (but i sitll love his gameplay and kill power) so went and try new character i got a liking to Wario, just like Luigi his moveset his so damm funny.

I would like to know what tech or tip and trick, combo, way to approach, move to use or to not use, i should know about him to master him because he is much much harder to play than Luigi. He is heavyweight but somebody i end up having hard time to lend the killing blow (The killmove that i know : Fsmash and Usmash (but hard to land), ftilt, waft, bair is there any other?).

Thanks for the time you take for the answer I did read all the guide on the website but there are not that much informaiton in them.

 

[DavemanCozy]

Thanks Reflex. I thought D-tilt was completely safe, had no idea its frame advantage was poor.

The bike is very interesting too. One of my favorite moves and weapons in this game.

I'll be trying out Wario this weekend at a local bar tournament and see how I do with him and Fox.

 

[Adrian Marin]

I normally find myself using Ftilt for spacing, so you should try that out against rushdown chars and others.

Regarding his throw game. I want to know about Wario's throw game, and what he's capable of doing with all of them. Which is the most useful? What can he do out of certain throws?

This won't work consistently, but you can throw opponents into bouncing bikes to deal a very large amount of damage.

Furthermore, you'll find that Wario's bike is excellent for edgeguarding. There are many ways to limit the opponent's options considerably. Followups can deal a lot of damage. I know one combo that does over 60%; however, I'm not sure if it's a true combo or not, but my opponents all seem to be unable to escape it. To set it up, you first need to throw your bike upwards near the ledge as the opposition is holding the ledge. Afterwards, you'll need to roll backwards and bait the ledge roll recovery. Once the opponent recovers with a roll, use your D tilt repeatedly (about 4 times,) then end it with a waft, Usmash or Fsmash. I believe this little trick is worth sharing, because I've destroyed stocks at very low percents with this combo. Since I lack a capture card, I'd like some help in getting this on Youtube. All you'll need to do is add me in the Wii U, I'll share the replay that showcases the combo with anyone that wishes to record it

 

[TheReflexWonder]

It's likely worth it to check out some properties of the Forward-B riding attacks; skids and wheelies instantly create a second hitbox, and those hits appear to have the highest base knockback of all of his moves, likely making them especially potent through the Rage effect.

I wonder if there are certain positions within Bike attacks that allow us to avoid moves, such as grabs.

 

[DavemanCozy]

I normally find myself using Ftilt for spacing, so you should try that out against rushdown chars and others.



This won't work consistently, but you can throw opponents into bouncing bikes to deal a very large amount of damage.

Furthermore, you'll find that Wario's bike is excellent for edgeguarding. There are many ways to limit the opponent's options considerably. Followups can deal a lot of damage. I know one combo that does over 60%; however, I'm not sure if it's a true combo or not, but my opponents all seem to be unable to escape it. To set it up, you first need to throw your bike upwards near the ledge as the opposition is holding the ledge. Afterwards, you'll need to roll backwards and bait the ledge roll recovery. Once the opponent recovers with a roll, use your D tilt repeatedly (about 4 times,) then end it with a waft, Usmash or Fsmash. I believe this little trick is worth sharing, because I've destroyed stocks at very low percents with this combo. Since I lack a capture card, I'd like some help in getting this on Youtube. All you'll need to do is add me in the Wii U, I'll share the replay that showcases the combo with anyone that wishes to record it

It seems like a smart thing to do, the ledge roll, since throwing the bike upwards limits like three of the opponent's options: ledge jump, getup, and getup attack (as even if it hits you the opponent gets hit back offstage with it). Wario's edge-guarding is pretty scary with the bike. Many people's safest assumption would probably be to roll backwards to the up-thrown bike so that they don't get hit by it. Punishing the roll is a pretty good prediction.

Does the number of d-tilts vary though? What about fighting a floaty like ?

 

[Adrian Marin]

It seems like a smart thing to do, the ledge roll, since throwing the bike upwards limits like three of the opponent's options: ledge jump, getup, and getup attack (as even if it hits you the opponent gets hit back offstage with it). Wario's edge-guarding is pretty scary with the bike. Many people's safest assumption would probably be to roll backwards to the up-thrown bike so that they don't get hit by it. Punishing the roll is a pretty good prediction.

Does the number of d-tilts vary though? What about fighting a floaty like ?

It does seem to be more effective against floaty characters and big ones. Chars like Sheik and Greninja sometimes escape it with a shield, but when that happens, it's extremely easy to pressure the shield or throw the opponent.

 

[Magik0722]

Found this while browsing youtube
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=989k00Qgv5g
Probably useless but just wanted to spread the info.

 

[DavemanCozy]

Wario is hard to play. I got 3rd place last night at a local using Wario and Fox. On the one hand, I'm glad there are people challenging me now, but on the other I lost to 3 KO punches in winners finals and a food fight vs a spider monkey in losers finals.

More questions:

Wario can eat Diddy's bananas and peanuts. I've never enjoyed the Fox vs Diddy MU, I'm tempted to go Wario for it instead. What are your thoughts vs the Spider Monkey, and are there any things I should be watching out for?

I also noticed that Wario can sometimes catch him during his Side-B with the Chomp, but other times Diddy will hit me with the attack. How does Wario's Chomp grab-box work? Or is it something about Diddy's Side-B hit / going for the grab?

Bike:
I was able to pull another bike after riding offstage, and I don't recall this happening in Brawl. How does the bike respawn work?

Landing the fart:
Ok, so I was going mostly for the fully charged waft, which I think was something I shouldn't have been going for all the time. I never took advantage of the half-waft nor the other stages of it. Are there any specifics I should know about the different charge levels of waft? For example: at what percent does a half-waft threaten my opponent?

Thanks in advance!

I'm really liking Wario so far I'm definitely going to stick with him as one of my characters.

 

[Magik0722]

Wario can eat Diddy's bananas and peanuts. I've never enjoyed the Fox vs Diddy MU, I'm tempted to go Wario for it instead. What are your thoughts vs the Spider Monkey, and are there any things I should be watching out for?

All of his aerials beat / trade with you, dont contest him in the air.

I also noticed that Wario can sometimes catch him during his Side-B with the Chomp, but other times Diddy will hit me with the attack. How does Wario's Chomp grab-box work? Or is it something about Diddy's Side-B hit / going for the grab?

If you predict a side b you really should be doing something else besides chomp. I usually even lands fsmashes on them

Bike:
I was able to pull another bike after riding offstage, and I don't recall this happening in Brawl. How does the bike respawn work?

If you bike offstage while still on the ground, you will be able to bike again once the bike goes to the bottom blastzone. There is even a particle effect wario has when he gains a new bike.

Landing the fart:
Ok, so I was going mostly for the fully charged waft, which I think was something I shouldn't have been going for all the time. I never took advantage of the half-waft nor the other stages of it. Are there any specifics I should know about the different charge levels of waft? For example: at what percent does a half-waft threaten my opponent?

At 55 seconds you get the half waft (although its really 66% waft) and that is usually good enough to KO people at around 80%

 

[Rakurai]

I also noticed that Wario can sometimes catch him during his Side-B with the Chomp, but other times Diddy will hit me with the attack. How does Wario's Chomp grab-box work? Or is it something about Diddy's Side-B hit / going for the grab?

From what I've noticed, the hitbox on Diddy's side B isn't consistent throughout the attack, and is disjointed enough on the later frames to beat the chomp; If he's at close range, it'll get stuffed, but if he's trying it closer to the move's max range, don't bother.

 

[Ridel]

Found this while browsing youtube
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=989k00Qgv5g
Probably useless but just wanted to spread the info.

Tried it yesterday in some friendlies, and yeah it's not that useful and is difficult to set up when your opponent is on your butt the entire match. Though my friend replied with a whole hearty "Da hell was that" after the match.

 

[mmik]

So I tested bike wafting a bit on training mode yesterday, and though I can see the difference between an open fart, and farting on your bike, it's hard to imagine that tiny extension actually being worth the effort for setup.

HOWEVER

I did throw a bike in the middle of battlefield against my friend the other day, as soon as I got waft charged, and he immediately refused to approach me. It was pretty funny. He knew there was something to be concerned about, so he just played it safe and hit on the ledge while I figured out what to do about the situation.

But as soon as your opponent knows how to properly handle that situation, I don't think you could expect the same reaction again.

What's been your experience?

 

[TheReflexWonder]

A full Waft on nothing has the initial hitbox active for only two frames, while hitting something makes it active for about twenty-two frames.