What Tier is Cloud?

[TheDrWasMe]

I've been playing Cloud for a little while now and I'm really enjoying him. In my honest opinion, I'd think he'd be somewhere around the High-Mid Tier to Low-High Tier, though where would you guys put him into the tier list? I know he's just been only released for about 4 days, though I'm curious about it. I think I might make him a secondary of mine, though the opinion on where he's placed won't really change my view on him as a whole, I'm interested in seeing what you guys have to say.

 

[ChimaeraUltimo]

A lot of people have been putting him lower because of his recovery, but little mac is mid so...

I would put him on low-high. The only things stopping him from "breaking those limits" is his recover, which is OK, and his lack of a throw use. But that never stoped fox!

 

[kAffo]

Far too early to start making judgements on Cloud's current tier position.
But my opinion of him as of now would be somewhere in Low-Mid Tier.
He definitely has potential, don't get me wrong, but he most certainly has his flaws, and from experience, appears to have a fair amount of difficulty from numerous characters, especially Top-Tiers such as Sheik and Pika.
Anyway that's just my outlook, FOR NOW...

 

[TheDrWasMe]

A lot of people have been putting him lower because of his recovery, but little mac is mid so...

I would put him on low-high. The only things stopping him from "breaking those limits" is his recover, which is OK, and his lack of a throw use. But that never stoped fox!

Far too early to start making judgements on Cloud's current tier position.
But my opinion of him as of now would be somewhere in Low-Mid Tier.
He definitely has potential, don't get me wrong, but he most certainly has his flaws, and from experience, appears to have a fair amount of difficulty from numerous characters, especially Top-Tiers such as Sheik and Pika.
Anyway that's just my outlook, FOR NOW...

Yeah, pretty understandable. I can see the recovery being annoying (Considering the only good thing about it is his Limit Break Up Special, Though his horizontal recover is rather absent.) But with some of the tools and mechanics he has, such as some potential garenteed combos' or his Limit break Moves being quite useful for easy damage, I dunno. I'm still giving him a shot and some of the people I've seen play him have pretty much about mastered him. I want to say he's somewhere in Mid Tier though yeah, still too early to say.

 

[Fik]

I would say he's anywhere between the middle high tiers or middle low. His lack of capitalization off of throw combos and the fact that his grab range is among the worst in the game stops him from reaching any of the high tiers. His awful recovery which is among at least the top 5 worst in the game also keeps him from going any higher than middle high tiers. However, he can rack up easy damage with his up tilt and up airs, allowing for insane juggles at low to even high percents. His down smash attack is great for sending people off stage at low angles, which absolutely destroys characters with bad recovery, while his side smash attack has great shield pressure with multi hits, great range, and overall good knock back and damage. His up smash is a bit weak, but makes up for it with range. All of his aerial attacks posses the ability to edgeguard, and have overall good frame data (although he can't fish very far off stage for edgeguards due to his lack of recovery). Last but certainly not least, he has his special moves and Limit Breaker specials. His recovery is awful, but it does posses to ability to spike people offstage, as well as even surviving he manages to snap to the ledge. His side specials can be used after down throw at extremely low percents on a select group of characters, but other than that its fairly useless. Neutral be can be great for edgeguarding, and forcing the opponent to approach. While he appears to lack in the special department, limit breaker balances things out. All special moves (except up special) are usually able to K.O before around 120% with limit breaker, with Finishing Touch (down special) possessing the power to K.O at around 60%. All in all, Cloud is a solid character with many great tools that allow for great juggle combos, easy ways to comeback from a huge percent deficit, and deadly ranged attacks when spaced correctly. If a player is able to maintain stage control and use their Limit Breaker optimally, he has ridiculous potential. Hope to see him in tournament in the future!

 

[PapaJ]

I've been playing Cloud for a little while now and I'm really enjoying him. In my honest opinion, I'd think he'd be somewhere around the High-Mid Tier to Low-High Tier, though where would you guys put him into the tier list? I know he's just been only released for about 4 days, though I'm curious about it. I think I might make him a secondary of mine, though the opinion on where he's placed won't really change my view on him as a whole, I'm interested in seeing what you guys have to say.

Less then a week so anyone putting Cloud in any tier is A) a moron B) doesn't know how to play smash. Guessing is fine but heres what we do know
* Fsmash has pretty good range and KO power
* All his specials are good for KOing (while in limit)
* Almost all of his LB specials have Inful frames (excellent stuffing tool)
* Can combo with his amazing Uair and Dair
* All of his attacks deal a good amount of damage
* Can have trouble KOing outside of limit (not crippling but he lacks some options)
* terrible grabs all he can do is really use it to toss of stage or Uthrow to attempt a juggle or build limit
* Dsmash has meh range and can be teched
* Utilt is good for combos but can whiff. More so good then bad
* recovery is bad all he can do is Blade Beam for horizontal and Climhazzard for vertical.

Basically he has good and bad traits but it's how we use the good traits and how/if we can overcome the bad ones. Which will take time and a dedicated player base to share info.

 

[~Skelly~]

It's a little hard to say where he is in the metagame, given that he was only out for a few days. I'd give it about a week or two of labbing before we start considering placing him anywhere.

 

[Jaketto]

I think it's best that we wait for a big tournament to see how his ranking is. At the moment I'm thinking either low-high tier or high-mid tier. The recovery is what is going to be his downfall. In saying that though his limit break recovery is pretty good.

 

[DeadLuckChris]

i say middle

 

[Blasterman4]

Too soon, also this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMiI-sxxSOY

 

[HFlash]

He reminds me alot of Falcon. With his ability to kill early with LB, his great frame data, his combo-ability, and range, he is definitely better than half of the cast. Unfortunately, similar to Falcon, his lackluster recovery is really going to hurt him in high-level play, and is the biggest reason he will most likely sit around 15-20. This is all speculation, but I think roughly an accurate one.

 

[TheDrWasMe]

Less then a week so anyone putting Cloud in any tier is A) a moron B) doesn't know how to play smash. Guessing is fine but heres what we do know
* Fsmash has pretty good range and KO power
* All his specials are good for KOing (while in limit)
* Almost all of his LB specials have Inful frames (excellent stuffing tool)
* Can combo with his amazing Uair and Dair
* All of his attacks deal a good amount of damage
* Can have trouble KOing outside of limit (not crippling but he lacks some options)
* terrible grabs all he can do is really use it to toss of stage or Uthrow to attempt a juggle or build limit
* Dsmash has meh range and can be teched
* Utilt is good for combos but can whiff. More so good then bad
* recovery is bad all he can do is Blade Beam for horizontal and Climhazzard for vertical.

Basically he has good and bad traits but it's how we use the good traits and how/if we can overcome the bad ones. Which will take time and a dedicated player base to share info.

It's a little hard to say where he is in the metagame, given that he was only out for a few days. I'd give it about a week or two of labbing before we start considering placing him anywhere.

I think it's best that we wait for a big tournament to see how his ranking is. At the moment I'm thinking either low-high tier or high-mid tier. The recovery is what is going to be his downfall. In saying that though his limit break recovery is pretty good.

I know, like I said what is everyone's thoughts, not strait out what people's final statement on the character. I know it's been only a few days and yes I'm fully aware that the character's not yet been put in any tournaments, but just asking about what your opinion on him is all.

Too soon, also this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMiI-sxxSOY

iar
I know tier lists don't matter, reason why I have characters from all sorts of tiers in my Mains, Secondaries, and Tertiaries. I said before that it doesn't matter what people said in my paragraph, that I'm still making him a secondary.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Imma just beat my face against my bed post.

Cuz thats what this thread makes me feel like doing.

 

[TheDrWasMe]

Imma just beat my face against my bed post.

Cuz thats what this thread makes me feel like doing.

Did I in particular do or say something? Apologies if so.

 

[TheGoodGuava]

someone delete this post for me

 

[TheGoodGuava]

Pros:
-pretty heavy (17th heaviest)
-good mobility
-fast attacks
-insane kill power
-amazing ability to rack up damage (who needs combos when you have cross slash?)
-all aerials auto cancel at some point
-can airdodge onto the stage with no landing lag
-above average gimping ability
-has amazing footstool setups on heavier characters
-good projectile that helps him recover
-limit break improves nearly everything when active
-all smash attacks have low endlag


Cons:
-climhazzard doesn't ledge snap without LB
-doesn't have any guaranteed grab setups
-climhazzard doesn't ledge snap without LB
-poor combo game
-very gimpable recovery
-climhazzard doesn't ledge snap without LB

oh and did I mention climhazzard doesn't ledge snap without LB?


Honestly I think he could potentially be top 15 and maybe even top 10 if his recovery gets a bit of a buff but I doubt he'll every get there because everyone wants easy grab setups and an ungimpable recovery instead of putting in a bit of time to actually learn the character
But hey, a bad recovery didn't stop Ness did it?

 

[Emblem Lord]

poor combo game.

wait WHAT?!!?!?

 

[PIXLEsauce]

He's pretty good, and can recover better on certain stages where he can wall hop. His combo game is good and his f smash kills super early (like, 70% uncharged on some occasions). In addition, he has limit break which, when charged makes him overall much better at killing and recovering. Having a poor recovery makes him more balanced overall, since otherwise he would be incredibly powerful. I'd rate him up air / 10

also he has 2 meteors + up b suicide which is cool.

 

[TheGoodGuava]

poor combo game.

wait WHAT?!!?!?

Any examples of true combo setups that work at later percents? And if you say FH dair, I'm not even going to take you seriously, a FH dair can be seen from a mile away, I can only see it being used as a way to punish ledge getups and even then, its a FH, I doubt they wont be looking for that

 

[PapaJ]

Any examples of true combo setups that work at later percents? And if you say FH dair, I'm not even going to take you seriously, a FH dair can be seen from a mile away, I can only see it being used as a way to punish ledge getups and even then, its a FH, I doubt they wont be looking for that

I mean with Limit on he moves much faster and jumps lower. not to mention you can mxix that up with a double jump FF dair, etc, etc. But in either case he has FF uair (harder to do but harder to see coming), Bair into Bair works. Utilt strings into an Uair or another aerial if you know they are gonna airdoge. Nair can set up into combos as well.

 

[TheGoodGuava]

I mean with Limit on he moves much faster and jumps lower. not to mention you can mxix that up with a double jump FF dair, etc, etc. But in either case he has FF uair (harder to do but harder to see coming), Bair into Bair works. Utilt strings into an Uair or another aerial if you know they are gonna airdoge. Nair can set up into combos as well.

Any sort of dair can be seen from a mile away and is easily punished, and using your double jump is wayyyy to risky with cloud imo
a fastfall upair is great but its also pretty easy to see coming, and if you mess up against a character like Sheik? You're gonna just eat 30 - 40 percent for whiffing a combo that would only do maybe 24%

 

[PapaJ]

Any sort of dair can be seen from a mile away and is easily punished, and using your double jump is wayyyy to risky with cloud imo
a fastfall upair is great but its also pretty easy to see coming, and if you mess up against a character like Sheik? You're gonna just eat 30 - 40 percent for whiffing a combo that would only do maybe 24%

uhhh...a FF uair is not easy to see coming since you can easily just treat it like an empty jump > grab.or better. Also the most shiek has ever done to me is around the same as a pre patch luigi grab combo (24 percent about). I dont know how you allow yourself to get that much damage from shiek.

 

[Deleted member]

For what I've played with , he is underwhelming.

He IS fun, but competitively-wise, he's lacking what a Top-Tier needs.

First things first, his grab is horrible, the worse in the game (in my opinion). He gets no follow-ups out of it, literally NONE.

Second, his recovery. It's just bad, even worse than (without Limit Break). It doesn't snap to the ledge and you can gimp him with anything, ANYTHING!

For last, no kill set-ups whatsoever. He cannot kill without a Smash attack or LB Special (with reads), because he gets no combos for a kill.

Yes, he looks like a solid character, and he's really fun, but not a Top Tier, he looks more as a Mid-Tier. Even though, it doesn't really matter, Smash 4's Tier List isn't even official.

Enough with the hate, what do I think about his good stuff?

He is strong, STRONG. Like, he can kill with F-Smash in mid-high percents, around 80% I would say.

His aerials have great Frame Data, and can mixup quite well.

He's Limit Breaker is insane. Like, it's just great, gives him what he lacks (except for a combo game, R.I.P.).

LB Climhazzard is a OoS kill option in higher percents, LB Blade Beam looks decent for a offstage kill in early percents,
LB Finishing Touch can be mixed up with a Down Tilt, making it 50/50% chance of hitting Cloud off the move, but if he hits, it's basically a guaranteed kill in about 60%.

Rage, what can I say about rage, it's a stupid mechanic you'know?

Hope I helped in something!

 

[TheGoodGuava]

uhhh...a FF uair is not easy to see coming since you can easily just treat it like an empty jump > grab.or better. Also the most shiek has ever done to me is around the same as a pre patch luigi grab combo (24 percent about). I dont know how you allow yourself to get that much damage from shiek.

a good sheik, not some ****ty for glory sheik who cant even convert a fair chain into a bouncing fish
and if they're playing cautiously then theyre going to treat every empty jump as a threat and just wait for you to do something stupid

 

[PapaJ]

a good sheik, not some ****ty for glory sheik who cant even convert a fair chain into a bouncing fish
and if they're playing cautiously then theyre going to treat every empty jump as a threat and just wait for you to do something stupid

Again, unless it's horrible DI or smashvilles platform moved to help get more fairs. I have never fought a shiek in any of the tourneys I go to where I get more then 30 percent damage. I honestly do not know where you get 40 since that would have to be around 10 Fairs comboed, and usually Ive only ever see sheiks get maybe five. Even if it was Ftilts into fairs into BF thats still a tall order. Hell I don't think even ZeRo has gotten 40 damage from one combo. Maybe off a reset but that's an entirely different story

In any case thats good for them since if you Dair right you have 4 frames of end lag. Not to mention with limit you can just use LB Cross slash on landing to stuff any attacks (invul starts on frame six and you can space it out it's safe). So aside from your mythical shieks he has set ups that can ko and rack up damage (LB cross slash does twenty six damage and comes out on frame 10). The thing is he hasn't been out for a week even and people like you are "NO HE'S NOT" I heard the same thing with Ryu and Ive seen amazing plays. Although the OP's question i terrible all I have done, as well as others, have listed his pros and cons you on the other hand are not really helping and using situations that will be developed when more people share new AT's or combos or setups.

The only thing you have offered is "Cloud is bad at comboing" which he is not the uair and utilt combo strings work very well, more so again taller characters. and the fact that you dismiss the ability of Dair to combo, as well as it's generous AC window, is not helping in any way,shape or form. I have yet to go to tourney with Cloud but when I do im gonna use the Dair set up and using actual battles share it with the Cloud board and see what they do with it instead of automatically dismissing it and removing a possibly important tool in Clouds repertoire

For what I've played with , he is underwhelming.

He IS fun, but competitively-wise, he's lacking what a Top-Tier needs.

First things first, his grab is horrible, the worse in the game (in my opinion). He gets no follow-ups out of it, literally NONE.

Second, his recovery. It's just bad, even worse than (without Limit Break). It doesn't snap to the ledge and you can gimp him with anything, ANYTHING!

For last, no kill set-ups whatsoever. He cannot kill without a Smash attack or LB Special (with reads), because he gets no combos for a kill.

Yes, he looks like a solid character, and he's really fun, but not a Top Tier, he looks more as a Mid-Tier. Even though, it doesn't really matter, Smash 4's Tier List isn't even official.

Enough with the hate, what do I think about his good stuff?

He is strong, STRONG. Like, he can kill with F-Smash in mid-high percents, around 80% I would say.

His aerials have great Frame Data, and can mixup quite well.

He's Limit Breaker is insane. Like, it's just great, gives him what he lacks (except for a combo game, R.I.P.).

LB Climhazzard is a OoS kill option in higher percents, LB Blade Beam looks decent for a offstage kill in early percents,
LB Finishing Touch can be mixed up with a Down Tilt, making it 50/50% chance of hitting Cloud off the move, but if he hits, it's basically a guaranteed kill in about 60%.

Rage, what can I say about rage, it's a stupid mechanic you'know?

Hope I helped in something!

Have you tried using Nair, Fair, and Bair off stage? Fair can send them at a semi spike angle. Fair can kill and spike and bair has a pretty good range. Dair is only really good near the ledge since it's FAF in the air is longer then his AC window but you could also use Uair near the ledge too.

 

[TheGoodGuava]

Again, unless it's horrible DI or smashvilles platform moved to help get more fairs. I have never fought a shiek in any of the tourneys I go to where I get more then 30 percent damage. I honestly do not know where you get 40 since that would have to be around 10 Fairs comboed, and usually Ive only ever see sheiks get maybe five. Even if it was Ftilts into fairs into BF thats still a tall order. Hell I don't think even ZeRo has gotten 40 damage from one combo. Maybe off a reset but that's an entirely different story

In any case thats good for them since if you Dair right you have 4 frames of end lag. Not to mention with limit you can just use LB Cross slash on landing to stuff any attacks (invul starts on frame six and you can space it out it's safe). So aside from your mythical shieks he has set ups that can ko and rack up damage (LB cross slash does twenty six damage and comes out on frame 10). The thing is he hasn't been out for a week even and people like you are "NO HE'S NOT" I heard the same thing with Ryu and Ive seen amazing plays. Although the OP's question i terrible all I have done, as well as others, have listed his pros and cons you on the other hand are not really helping and using situations that will be developed when more people share new AT's or combos or setups.

The only thing you have offered is "Cloud is bad at comboing" which he is not the uair and utilt combo strings work very well, more so again taller characters. and the fact that you dismiss the ability of Dair to combo, as well as it's generous AC window, is not helping in any way,shape or form. I have yet to go to tourney with Cloud but when I do im gonna use the Dair set up and using actual battles share it with the Cloud board and see what they do with it instead of automatically dismissing it and removing a possibly important tool in Clouds repertoire



Have you tried using Nair, Fair, and Bair off stage? Fair can send them at a semi spike angle. Fair can kill and spike and bair has a pretty good range. Dair is only really good near the ledge since it's FAF in the air is longer then his AC window but you could also use Uair near the ledge too.

The 40 thing was a bit of an exaggeration, I do have rather poor DI though, thank you for pointing that out. That aside, I said he had potential to be top 15. Yes he has amazing kill power and kill setups, and amazing low percent combos that he could easily use to tack on like 70% in 50 seconds, but at <70 his main combo starters are falling dair, uptilt, and fastfall uair. Yes FH dair is an amazingly safe and highly rewarding approach but can be avoided by just rolling to the right. His uptilt is absolutely amazing, and combined with his dash dance/fox trot its very easy to land but its still something they're going to be looking out for and are most likely trying to avoid. FF upair is amazing but its mostly for larger models. No his combo game isn't garbage like Ganondorf's but it isn't amazing like Pikachu's

I say Cloud is high tier because he so much going for him that calling him anything below low-high would be a joke. And I know about his fair spike, don't worry. Some poor DK made the mistake of trying to fair spike me and got spiked instead. Cloud's fair comes out ridiculously fast for such a massive AND strong spike hitbox.

 

[PapaJ]

The 40 thing was a bit of an exaggeration, I do have rather poor DI though, thank you for pointing that out. That aside, I said he had potential to be top 15. Yes he has amazing kill power and kill setups, and amazing low percent combos that he could easily use to tack n 70% in like 50 seconds, but at <70 his main true combos are falling dair. Yes its an amazing approach option but if you can avoid getting hit by it you're safe

yeah sorry for being sassy before dealing with home **** and it's bleeding into smash. But yeah I hope to head to a local soon and see what happens where. But we'll see that when I can actually get to one lol. The one thing that I think cloud has that can be utilized is his weird dash though. when he dashes he can do anything out when both feet touch the ground. Dash > Fsmash. Dash > Ftilt, etc etc. I feel like that is something Cloud needs to utilize as well since I think he's the only guy who can act of dash without doing a dash attack. Basically he could have potentially great spacing and mind game potential.

 

[Deleted member]

Have you tried using Nair, Fair, and Bair off stage? Fair can send them at a semi spike angle. Fair can kill and spike and bair has a pretty good range. Dair is only really good near the ledge since it's FAF in the air is longer then his AC window but you could also use Uair near the ledge too.

Yes, as I said in my post, he has really good Frame Data on his aerials, but his unreliable recovery makes him gimp bait.

 

[Vyseskies]

Cloud is actually better than meets the eye, there are people doing good results in tournaments (doing even better than Yoshis and beating Diddy). M2K is also doing some effort on him and getting good results.

M2K (Cloud) vs Day (ZSS)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IH_OylH8ak

Its too early to judge but you can cleary see that cloud has potential, because one thing mostly: he has a safe kill move. That means a lot on this game.

i'd put him bottom of high tier in singles, very high tier in doubles.

 

[TheGoodGuava]

yeah sorry for being sassy before dealing with home **** and it's bleeding into smash. But yeah I hope to head to a local soon and see what happens where. But we'll see that when I can actually get to one lol. The one thing that I think cloud has that can be utilized is his weird dash though. when he dashes he can do anything out when both feet touch the ground. Dash > Fsmash. Dash > Ftilt, etc etc. I feel like that is something Cloud needs to utilize as well since I think he's the only guy who can act of dash without doing a dash attack. Basically he could have potentially great spacing and mind game potential.

Honestly he feels like Marth did in Melee, except I don't need to space everything perfectly. I mean, he even has the ken combo

 

[FamilyTeam]

Cloud looks like he has some interesting potential, to me. What's holding him back is how reliant he is on Limit Break for his specials to be effective. Without limit break, his recovery is something I'd expect to see on Melee, his projectile is a tad slow and really easy to reflect if you character has that option (TBH even the Limit Break version feels easy to reflect, and since it hits hard, that's a problem for Cloud) and Finishing Touch is a tad hard to hit and I heard you can just shield it (haven't tried it). Some people before me have already said this, but his grabs aren't anything worthy of note. His only good one, according to M2K, is his down throw at low percents, if I'm not mistaken. He is interesting, but he doesn't look like he has what it takes to be a Top Tier, hell, even a low High Tier. To me, he's at best a Mid tier;

 

[Deleted member]

Cloud is actually better than meets the eye, there are people doing good results in tournaments (doing even better than Yoshis and beating Diddy). M2K is also doing some effort on him and getting good results.

Remember, it's still too early to decide, we need more tournament play. It's been less than a week, heck you're talking about THE M2K.

 

[irokex13]

Any examples of true combo setups that work at later percents? And if you say FH dair, I'm not even going to take you seriously, a FH dair can be seen from a mile away, I can only see it being used as a way to punish ledge getups and even then, its a FH, I doubt they wont be looking for that

Up air, up tilt, nair, and d tilt lead to footstools at low percents. Nair into limit break side B starts working around 60%. Up air into up air works at around 75%. D tilt, up tilt, FH Dair, and FF up air lead into limit break up and kill around 90-100%.

Also, you can mixups opponents with FH dair, FH air dodge up air, and empty hop.

Cloud has plenty of ways to seal stocks. Once people start optimizing his kill setups, then we can get a more accurate look at his MUs so that we can guess his relative area on the tier list.

 

[Curleh_Mustache]

It's a little too early to determine what tier Cloud is on. He is a fast character with a lot of range and power. But he doesn't have a solid combo throw and has horrible recover. Limit break gives him much more power and gives him better recover though. I'd put him at mid tier. I can see him having potential though

 

[HoSmash4]

I think it's better to ask this. Who beats cloud?

Sheik gets answered in neutral.
Zss cant touch dtilt.
Cloud destroys luma/rosalina's big frame
Cloud can outrange mario/pikachu/ryu
Sonic is forced to approach clouds massive sword because of LB.
Cloud will probably destroy luigi.

Clouds matchup spread looks VERY good. I'd say top 15 for sure.

 

[Deleted member]

I think it's better to ask this. Who beats cloud?

Sheik gets answered in neutral.
Zss cant touch dtilt.
Cloud destroys luma/rosalina's big frame
Cloud can outrange mario/pikachu/ryu
Sonic is forced to approach clouds massive sword because of LB.
Cloud will probably destroy luigi.

Clouds matchup spread looks VERY good. I'd say top 15 for sure.

This is all wrong,

• literally just have to F-Air to answer Cloud. Not even kidding, she is just a perfect character.
• could have a hard time, but she can still kill you really early, one punish and he's dead meat, combo bait.
• can outrange all 3(), but they can also gimp him, really easily. (Not much about though, haven't seen the matchup.
• just needs to hit-n-run.(Not seen the matchup either.)
• isn't even that much of a threat anymore, and yet, he can also gimp fairly easy.

 

[WD40]

Way too early to say, but I think he is going to be a great counter to campy playstyles.

 

[Dark Dire Wolf]

Way too early to say, but I think he is going to be a great counter to campy playstyles.

How about megaman? He completely walled me off. Other campy characters I get.

 

[Gecko Moria]

literally just have to F-Air to answer Cloud. Not even kidding, she is just a perfect character.

Just gonna say one thing. I pretty damn sure that Cloud's nair, fair (although probably an unsafe option in neutral), and bair all beat sheik's fair. All he has to do is predict her to SH fair and he can beat it out.

 

[Deleted member]

It's way too early to determine how Cloud fares in the game. We need to have other results before putting him in a tier.
However, his recovery is garbage without Limit Break, he doesn't have guaranteed followups with any of his throws (except for maybe down throw to Cross Slash at early percents), and approaching for him can be a bit tricky and perhaps even predictable. Regardless, Cloud has amazing range, some of his most powerful attacks don't have too much cooldown, he does have some great mobility for a relatively heavy character, he has a pretty useful projectile, has amazing aerials, and has a combo game.
I think that Cloud has the potential to be high to mid tier based on my experiences. But, again, it's too early to determine that.