Weekly Character Discussion: Olimar

[Overswarm]

Grounded up+b has a little too much startup-lag for me to consider it a safe and viable defense... You'd be hitting htem when they are right in front of Oli.

 

[Mew2King]

olimar's gay, he has the most perfect camping in the game, gimping him is recommended

 

[SamuraiPanda]

I find it quite useful to actually look at what pikmin he has next when he's camping me. Generally their strategies change depending on which pikmin they have available to throw, and if you can read those strategies correctly (and considering there aren't that many variations, so it isn't that hard) you can stop his camping.

 

[Deleted member]

I find it quite useful to actually look at what pikmin he has next when he's camping me. Generally their strategies change depending on which pikmin they have available to throw, and if you can read those strategies correctly (and considering there aren't that many variations, so it isn't that hard) you can stop his camping.

See, your argument has a hole though in that you assume Olimar has a strategy for you to stop, and this is based on his current pikmin. Olimar can camp and spam regardless of what pikmin he has, and he can generally throw them faster than you can adjust for each one.

Gimping is recommended.

 

[Overswarm]

I'm curious... can you hit Olimar while he's up+bing, as in trade hits? I've never seen it done, but I'm curious now. If you could, it would make edgeguarding him easier. Hang on ledge, drop off by hitting left and bair when he gets close. Whether he jumps or up+bs, you'd hit him, assuming Olimar was recovering from below.

 

[Zankoku]

Tether recovery based characters don't gain invulnerability until they grab the ledge.

 

[Scamp]

Tether recovery based characters don't gain invulnerability until they grab the ledge.

Are you sure about that? I'm pretty sure this is how it works...

When you grab the edge normally you flash three times. During this time you are invulnerable but cannot do anything. Then you will flash three more times. During this time you can fall off or whatever.

When tether characters tether to the edge they flash three times. I thought that this gave them invulnerability but I did this test a long time ago so perhaps I'm wrong. (Note that the three flash period is very short.) When you pull yourself up you will only get the second three flash effect.

Am I wrong on this?

 

[LeeHarris]

I'm pretty sure you don't get invincibility just as Ankoku said. A lot of the time with Samus I'll tether and immediately retract but someone will be inbetween me and the stage and I'll get stage spiked.

 

[Gimpyfish62]

yeah you don't get it until you hit the stage I've been hit out of the middle of my tether recovery often enough to know that I'm clearly not invincible when it grabs - you get invulnerability when you get to the edge as far as I'm aware on tethers.

 

[Overswarm]

synopsis

Olimar is a character that is rare enough and strong enough to be a wild card in any tournament. Unfortunately for Olimar, his recovery is such a glaring weakness that everyone knows it right from the getgo whether they play against Olimar or not!

Despite this, Olimar can do incredibly well in certain matchups. He also gets destroyed just as easily in other matchups. This makes Olimar a poor choice for a solo character, but an EXCELLENT choice with a pair. Olimar's fluidity and ability to make the opponent approach makes Olimar an easy character to pick up but, due to Olimar's glaring weaknesses and incredible amount of variables, he is a difficult character to master.

Olimar's super armor from his down+b helps him tremendously upon returning to the stage, and Olimar's ability to kill with a plethora of moves in a variety of directions means Olimar is dangerous at all times. No worrying about stale moves with this guy!

Last but not least, Olimar is difficult to observe. His forward smash, down-smash, and grab, can all look eerily similar. This makes it difficult for an opponetn to consistently avoid Olimar's attacks! It becomes even more difficult when the timing and range changes depending on the pikmin available. Oli players will be able to use this to their advantage for quite some time, and it is a real advantage indeed.

 

[DanGR]

I'm actually satisfied with the summary. ^_^b

Soooo...what are the nonbroomers supposed to talk about?

 

[XienZo]

How Hylian is evil...

They think we're in denial when we say Olimar>Snake

which we're obviously not...

...mostly...

 

[RichBrown]

yeah, what are we supposed to do with this?

pivot grabs with olimar are absolutely vital to his game. eventually, every olimar player will abuse pivot grabs.

 

[itsthebigfoot]

I'm curious... can you hit Olimar while he's up+bing, as in trade hits? I've never seen it done, but I'm curious now. If you could, it would make edgeguarding him easier. Hang on ledge, drop off by hitting left and bair when he gets close. Whether he jumps or up+bs, you'd hit him, assuming Olimar was recovering from below.

overswarm, from what I've seen, olimar's upb has some weird sorta ghost-jesus priority that goes through everything, even walls guaranteed to connect if it touches a hurtbox

 

[Kirby-oh]

Yeah, what else is there to say?

Oh, how about: no, sonic is not at an advantage against Olimar.

 

[mimic_king]

Olimar is another misunderstood character.

By the way, I knew that Oli Oli refered to Olimar. Kind of obvious. I like this weeks hint.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

I KNEW Youko made that hint. Panda doesn't know musics.
Too bad that doesn't help solve it at all. >.<

Sonic-Olimar is said to be dead even. I personally think it's 55-45 Olimar's favor but whatev.

 

[Snail]

Nice summary (:

King Dedede definitely is a **** matchup for Oli though. Even if you can edgeguard <_<

 

[Dyyne]

lul, I'm surprised people still get frustrated with oli's smashes and grab looking similar. Just use logic. If he's not facing you and he's charging a smash, don't roll in front him because then, if it's an f-smash or a d-smash, it can hit, so presume it is a d-smash, and follow-up however. As for if he's facing you, just spotdodge. If it's a f-smash, you'll dodge it, if it's a grab, you'll dodge it. Seriously, just dodge and stuff and it's not that hard.

 

[mimic_king]

Olimar is small, which can make him annoying to fight at times. His throw, forward smash, and side special all look the same. He can land some powerful attacks as well as a powerful spike, but only when a yellow or red pikmin is at the tip. His blue pikmin are good for grabs because they are the longest ranged ones. Yellow and red pikmin are mainly for side smash because of their power. Pikmin throw isn't very useful, but the pikmin will latch on the enemy, causing extra damage. The white ones will deal poison damage, which is why they are the best choice for pikmin throw. The purple ones don't latch, but they have a little knockback. His down B is a super armor. I discovered this while playing with my friend and I used a smash attack on him while he was using pikmin order and he didn't die. We confirmed it through a replay. Now he keeps using it and it's annoying.

Olimar has many disadvantages though. He is very lightweight (eighth lightest). He is very floaty too. His pikmin come out at random, which calls for adapting to each kind of combination. He is very hard to learn.

Overall, Olimar is a pretty decent character and will eventually be high tier.

 

[Frogsterking]

lul, I'm surprised people still get frustrated with oli's smashes and grab looking similar. Just use logic. If he's not facing you and he's charging a smash, don't roll in front him because then, if it's an f-smash or a d-smash, it can hit, so presume it is a d-smash, and follow-up however. As for if he's facing you, just spotdodge. If it's a f-smash, you'll dodge it, if it's a grab, you'll dodge it. Seriously, just dodge and stuff and it's not that hard.

I believe the grab can get you on the way back, too. It has surprised my opponents many times.

 

[Kirby-oh]

Pikmin Throw is very useful. Spamming, baiting, eating projectiles, and everything else. Blue do not get more range on grabs; they just throw hard.

 

[asob4]

blues have half a person more range than whites (maybe all the others) and a whole person more than the others*

*whole person = mario length
check the guide in the tactical forum about the throws

purple up throw is also the strongest in the whole game, killing mario with no DI at i believe 114%
kills MK at ~101% and GnW at ~90% with DI
GG, son, GG

 

[Kirby-oh]

I never noticed that before. I just saw that Purples seemed short.

 

[Dyyne]

Olimar is small, which can make him annoying to fight at times. His throw, forward smash, and side special all look the same. He can land some powerful attacks as well as a powerful spike, but only when a yellow or red pikmin is at the tip. His blue pikmin are good for grabs because they are the longest ranged ones. Yellow and red pikmin are mainly for side smash because of their power. Pikmin throw isn't very useful, but the pikmin will latch on the enemy, causing extra damage. The white ones will deal poison damage, which is why they are the best choice for pikmin throw. The purple ones don't latch, but they have a little knockback. His down B is a super armor. I discovered this while playing with my friend and I used a smash attack on him while he was using pikmin order and he didn't die. We confirmed it through a replay. Now he keeps using it and it's annoying.

Olimar has many disadvantages though. He is very lightweight (eighth lightest). He is very floaty too. His pikmin come out at random, which calls for adapting to each kind of combination. He is very hard to learn.

Overall, Olimar is a pretty decent character and will eventually be high tier.

Any color can spike (cept white, maybe it has a weak one, i dont remember). Any color, cept white, is useful for attacks, cept purp at times. Purple has shorter range on the smashes, except d-smash where it is the same as the others. Also, purple u-smash kills at ridiculously low percents.

 

[asob4]

white's spike, it's just a small hitbox on them that actually spikes

purples are amazing for attacks, they have a surprising long lasting hitbox on fsmash

even with small range on their grab, it is still very possible to grab with them (what it becomes a normal grab range oh noes)


EDIT: for the lengths, white and blue reach 1.6 blocks and red/yellow are 1.5 blocks

 

[scalpel]

That wasn't even a discussion. They just spent a page and half talking about how to kill Olimar with other characters.

 

[Dyyne]

If you grab with a purple pikmin, they can escape before it pulls them to oli if it is at the tip of purp's range

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

Olimars grabs are SUCH a pain. I think they stay out longer than any spotdodge in the game. Maybe even a little longer than GaWs smashes.

 

[asob4]

not that long, but they can grab on the way back :D

 

[mimic_king]

Any color can spike (cept white, maybe it has a weak one, i dont remember). Any color, cept white, is useful for attacks, cept purp at times. Purple has shorter range on the smashes, except d-smash where it is the same as the others. Also, purple u-smash kills at ridiculously low percents.

Yes, but it's best with yellow.

 

[Riot_ Fires]

Im pretty offended by some of the Broomers thoughts on Olimar saying hes boring to play and why was he even a playable character in Brawl.. Everyone has there specific characters they play so dont judge it on personal preferance and look beyond them when determining a characters strengths weaknesses etc..

Olimar has pretty good priority, psuedo chain grabs, his pikmin depending on colour actually go through certain characters projectiles as well as his pikmin actually absorbing projectiles (works great against toon link and snake, yes snake), they blow up land mines your pikmin are awsome if you learn which colour does what and use them apropriately.. Pikmin management is a pretty big deal for olimar players, knowin when to grab with a certain colour, which to throw depending on your opponent and knowing when to play air game or ground game with and sometimes with which pikmin depending on your opponents attacks because both are very strong and effective..

I think some people have doubted him or based their experiences on intial reaction like 'omg hes so easy jus spam c-stick' well maybe intially when everyone started but theres more to him when your playing someone who knows how Olimar works, those with pikmin killing attacks or those who are insane edgeguarders and can get you killed the moment you screw up.. That when Olimar starts t shine by making him work against those odds (snake, TL, even meta knight as hard as those fights can be)

Anyways, i think theres alot more credit he deserves as hes played differently when played competitively against people who understand his mechanics and his weaknesses (mostly being his gimped recovery).. All i seen from Broomer comments is mostly payouts or misunderstandings on how essential knowing his pikmin orders, rotations and uses are.. I think alot of competitive players have gone beyond the 'OMG hes throwin his c-stick at me!! whatever will i do..!!' stage and this tactic only works on people who are new to the game..


BLAH..!

 

[BlackWaltzX]

-Doesn't read any of it besides something about TL beating Olimar-

Heh.. First I'll just say Olimar wins that fight.

Ok..
Olimar has low priority besides upair and upB.
Knowing your colors and how to efficiently use that knowledge is how to make Olimar good.
Cstick spamming is easy to punish. Hey, it's just like MK's tornado.
He kills very early on.
If the user has good DI and keeps a calm head, he can live to high percents.
Know what the hell your order and colors are.
True combos. Dthrow to fair.
On spacies, you can dthrow two to three times depending on your order. Finishing with a fair.
On certain larger characters (Rob) you can dthrow to TWO fairs.
If the Olimar knows what to do, he pretty much win any fight.

I don't know what else to say really at the moment.

 

[Olimarman]

What I disagree with is the "needs another character to play efficiently" part. Like Black Waltz mentioned, every character is beatable. His only match up that I personally can not stand is vs a Weegee. I haven't played enough peaches yet to decide whether or not I think shes a ho.

 

[mimic_king]

Im pretty offended by some of the Broomers thoughts on Olimar saying hes boring to play and why was he even a playable character in Brawl.. Everyone has there specific characters they play so dont judge it on personal preferance and look beyond them when determining a characters strengths weaknesses etc..

Olimar has pretty good priority, psuedo chain grabs, his pikmin depending on colour actually go through certain characters projectiles as well as his pikmin actually absorbing projectiles (works great against toon link and snake, yes snake), they blow up land mines your pikmin are awsome if you learn which colour does what and use them apropriately.. Pikmin management is a pretty big deal for olimar players, knowin when to grab with a certain colour, which to throw depending on your opponent and knowing when to play air game or ground game with and sometimes with which pikmin depending on your opponents attacks because both are very strong and effective..

I think some people have doubted him or based their experiences on intial reaction like 'omg hes so easy jus spam c-stick' well maybe intially when everyone started but theres more to him when your playing someone who knows how Olimar works, those with pikmin killing attacks or those who are insane edgeguarders and can get you killed the moment you screw up.. That when Olimar starts t shine by making him work against those odds (snake, TL, even meta knight as hard as those fights can be)

Anyways, i think theres alot more credit he deserves as hes played differently when played competitively against people who understand his mechanics and his weaknesses (mostly being his gimped recovery).. All i seen from Broomer comments is mostly payouts or misunderstandings on how essential knowing his pikmin orders, rotations and uses are.. I think alot of competitive players have gone beyond the 'OMG hes throwin his c-stick at me!! whatever will i do..!!' stage and this tactic only works on people who are new to the game..


BLAH..!

The SBRoomers have their own opinions, which are actually more accurate. But if you like Olimar, then stick with that.

 

[Dabuz]

luigi seems impossible to fight but peach is actually not ridiculous if you used to maibn he and know how shhe thinks, or if you just fight lots of them

 

[Kyas]

Okay, first off, nobody's mentioned how much Olimar ***** when he's below you. Uair eats just about everything, tetherpunch can be an unexpected long-range hit, and the long rang of Usmash means you can charge and outwait airdodges when you want a KO.

Oh, and Olimar is not invincible after tether, only when he pulls in and grabs the stage. I know this firsthand, having been spiked by my friend right after I tether. And Purple Uthrow is VERY weak, KOing every character at over 9000% on FD without DI.

 

[asob4]

purple uthrow = strongest in game

take that ness!

 

[peeup]

Earlier in the thread, the BRoomers had horribly misguided views on each pikmin and its strengths.

Purple: Good for arials and situational >special and throws. Not good for smashes IMO (somebody said they were on page 1). They lack the range that Oli players love. Purps are good for arials (high atk power) and situational >specials (to get through projectiles that knock away all other pikmin.) Uthrow is the purple's killer throw, not dthrow like somebody said earlier.

Blues: Best for throws. Obviously, everybody knows this.

Red: Good for smashes and arials. High attack power (not as high as purp methinks, but still) and the fact that they go farther than purples makes them much better for smashes.

Yellow: Good for smashes and >special. The extra range they have on smashes (and arials maybe, I don't know) can be pretty nice if an opponent thinks he knows how close he can be to you while still being safe. Their use in the >special is limited and situational, but in those situations, its pretty helpful.

White: Good for >special and early-stock throws. They can't kill, and do little damage, so smashing/arialing with them is a task better suited for every other color. Obviously, though, they pwn when thrown with >special. As for early-stock throws, I think they do the most damage on throws, but also the least knockback, so a downthrow can easily lead up to an upsmash with more total damage.

 

[mimic_king]

The bad thing about whites is that if they are at the front of the pikmin chain, then you wont be able to recover. This is something that I heard, so I need to test this out for myself.