Was the change in the ledge mechanics better or worse for this game competitively?

[Solutionme]

The new ledge mechanics mean for a more friendly game. A good player could get on FG or FF and abuse the ledge mechanics against people who dont understand them. Im 100% sure it was added to make the game more accessible

I personally feel like it gives some recoveries much more varied uses, aether became a very good offensive based recovery with the ledge mechanics, and it also helps characters with bad recoveries actually make it back on stage, such as Bowser. My only issue is that air dodging off stage is still too good, and is overall still too strong of an option, it should have en ending animation where the character how air dodged gets back onto the proper axis, that way it becomes more situational.

 

[Ulevo]

I'm not a fan. I enjoy the fact that characters no longer gain invincibility after a re-grab. That's where my appreciation ends. The ledge game was what made Smash unique, and while it is still there and still prevalent, it has far less emphasis than it did before and that's a shame. The current system is a lazy way to allow characters to have overwhelming recoveries without making them overwhelmingly good. I'd rather have a deep ledge system and properly balanced characters. Of course part of this is made worse by the fact that they gave most of the cast overdone recoveries. i.e. Fox being able to use Fox Fire after Illusion.

 

[Kangaexe]

I personally feel like it gives some recoveries much more varied uses, aether became a very good offensive based recovery with the ledge mechanics, and it also helps characters with bad recoveries actually make it back on stage, such as Bowser. My only issue is that air dodging off stage is still too good, and is overall still too strong of an option, it should have en ending animation where the character how air dodged gets back onto the proper axis, that way it becomes more situational.

I dont reaaaallly agree with the air dodging being as good as you say. With characters like Ness it is but if you go against Falcon or ZSS to a degree a air dodge off stage will be a free spike :3

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I'm not a fan. I enjoy the fact that characters no longer gain invincibility after a re-grab. That's where my appreciation ends. The ledge game was what made Smash unique, and while it is still there and still prevalent, it has far less emphasis than it did before and that's a shame. The current system is a lazy way to allow characters to have overwhelming recoveries without making them overwhelmingly good. I'd rather have a deep ledge system and properly balanced characters. Of course part of this is made worse by the fact that they gave most of the cast overdone recoveries. i.e. Fox being able to use Fox Fire after Illusion.

Is it deeper to consider the yomi of trumping or to remove all options with an edgehog.

I've debated with myself on this and can't find a real answer.

I'm hit and miss overall with it, more hit with this iteration.

I'm so thankful characters can't just roll onto the stage when I am right on the ledge and I cant grab it until their roll onto the stage is completely done like in Melee.

I don't like how because how this new one interacts, some characters I can't really force a yomi game because their recovery can't be stopped due to properties. I can force a trump them go from there, but that is about it.

That's more or less where my hit and miss for both systems are.

I think it was better for the overall health of the ledges in smash...but I think some things could have been refined with the cast to make edgeguarding a tad stronger, though I do think it is at an acceptable fine level right now.

Just some aspects that irk me a bit.

And now I am just rambling at this point, lol.

 

[Solutionme]

I dont reaaaallly agree with the air dodging being as good as you say. With characters like Ness it is but if you go against Falcon or ZSS to a degree a air dodge off stage will be a free spike :3

Yeah but that is due to their momentum, look at Ness or even Mewtwo, who imo right now has the best time getting back on stage due to how good his momentum in an air dodge is not even counting his useful up-b. Also ZSS doesn't need to air dodge, her down b has invincibility and is a good mix-up. As for on stage air dodging, I'd say Sheik probably has the easiest time abusing it since she could just air dodge throughout her entire time in the air and at the point where if she air dodges once more she gets landing lag she could just use her fair to put out an attack that pretty much has no landing lag. It's pretty much how i said it, it'd be nice if there was an ending animation on it where the character gets back on the proper axis.

 

[Octagon]

It's not better or worse, i feel its just a different

 

[otter]

Is it deeper to consider the yomi of trumping or to remove all options with an edgehog.

I've debated with myself on this and can't find a real answer.

I'm hit and miss overall with it, more hit with this iteration.

I'm so thankful characters can't just roll onto the stage when I am right on the ledge and I cant grab it until their roll onto the stage is completely done like in Melee.

I don't like how because how this new one interacts, some characters I can't really force a yomi game because their recovery can't be stopped due to properties. I can force a trump them go from there, but that is about it.

That's more or less where my hit and miss for both systems are.

I think it was better for the overall health of the ledges in smash...but I think some things could have been refined with the cast to make edgeguarding a tad stronger, though I do think it is at an acceptable fine level right now.

Just some aspects that irk me a bit.

And now I am just rambling at this point, lol.

If trumping worked as intended, there might be a discussion. However, as discussed in this thread, it only really works with tether characters.

Also, edge hogging does not remove all options. It forces a mixup in the aggressor's favor, just like a tech chase situation. With Sm4sh's edge play, the aggressor can take a big risk and go offstage, or take yet another break from the game and wait for their opponent to recover. Neither option really seems indicative of having an advantage or makes it feel different from otherwise superior fighting games.