Triforce of Inspiration: the last piece of the Tetraforce is...

[otheusrex]

So, the fair idea you want @ Angell is more or aless a ness style fair for zelda? it's for fair right? and has a new animation for it where her hands are hitboxes and it's good for comboing/juggling?

 

[Angell]

So, the fair idea you want @ Angell is more or aless a ness style fair for zelda? it's for fair right? and has a new animation for it where her hands are hitboxes and it's good for comboing/juggling?

I'm thinking like a rob style.

 

[otheusrex]

Hey, guys! normally I want to keep the surprise going, but I'd rather avoid some future disappointment. There's been a lot of wonderful offerings this week, and the Goddess is very pleased! But some of the ideas are mutually exclusive so some will have to wait until next week. At first I was tempted to go with what changes seemed to be most popular (desired by more people) but I realized that the Goddess would be displeased with my service to her if I didn't honor each request that is within my capability. So I've decided to carry out changes in order of request.

On a different note, thank you all so much for being here! The Temple of Thought is not a physical place, but its splendor is directly a result of the minds who choose to enter it, and already it is looking magnificent!

Lastly, if you guys have concepts of overall zelda builds, where you want only certain changes/lots of changes paired with previous ones, you'll have to make that desire implicit. Thus far, I've been working into these builds all the changes that can coexist with each other per week without discrimination.

More lastly, I like the interaction between @ WhiteCrow and @ Angell about whether bair or fair should be a combo move. They disagreed, made their points, but civilly. That's exactly the type of discussion that pleases the Goddess, since it cultivates more thought without hindering it with contention!

 

[otheusrex]

A combo bair the pallid crow desired,
The noble Prynne hath also recommended
That fair should dealeth of percent the one
That numbreth twenty for the whole entirety
The once of Echo did request a dual
Recovery; the old and new unite!
And in addition, Luxingo requested
Of Me a beacon that would illume the void
Revealed at the departure of our princess
These things the Goddess, I, hath done; to seeth,
Thine hands in shimmering derision must lift!
Now go all ye! To the Fires of Media!

http://www.mediafire.com/download/nqn13mvdd9na771/uptaunt_farore_and_combo_bair.rar​

​

 

[luxingo]

Wow, amazing job! Looks fantastic. Thanks for your work.

Quick question: what will you do with these alternate builds with 3.6 coming round?

 

[otheusrex]

Wow, amazing job! Looks fantastic. Thanks for your work.

Quick question: what will you do with these alternate builds with 3.6 coming round?

great question! it kind of depends on if there are any global changes that might effect zelda's pac in unespected ways. You can always place them on future builds and often they work just how they did, but I know with 3.02 fitzelda.pac dins fire has a strange vertical momentum boost for some reason. I think its because magus mentioned something about placing zelda changes in the actual gct file instead of solely in her pac file. We'll just have to see if they'll work or not in 3.6.

Of course, you can always request certain changes that you've liked to come back in another request for the Goddess. Each week is supposed to focus on a new build anyways, so there's plenty of room for changes to come and go.

 

[WhiteCrow]

I have only experimented with the most recent build and boy howdy there are lots of goodies in it. When I started messing around with the build it took me a moment to realize Zelda starts with her 3.02 teleport and shifts to the 3.5 teleport via up-taunt. It has been a very long time since I've practiced with 3.02's teleport so I felt rusty as hell, but it was a nice reminder of where our character has come from. With the improved collision detection of 3.5 (still present in this build) it almost felt more difficult to wave land out of teleport, especially onto platforms. Playing with the old teleport also reminded me of how powerful teleport forward WD back used to be in neutral. I forgot how much I missed AGT out of teleport...

But enough reflection, on to the teleport trail. You can activate 3.5's teleport by using up taunt and I have to say the animation looks very nice. The taunting animation I mean. I almost want that animation over her current up taunt because it's so pretty to look at. Zelda has cool Nayru's Love and Din's Fire animations... but Farore's Wind has always been lacking. We get a small green ribbon animation and an ending explosion? Playing with this build's teleport made me realize how mediocre in aesthetic the current Farore's Wind is by comparison to her other specials. I was really curious how the Goddess would track Zelda while in teleport and I am absolutely in love with the wind effect that was chosen. It really feels like you're riding the breeze across the stage. If this was in the official game I would not even care about my recovery being telegraphed because it looks so damn cool, especially when auto snapping to ledge. It really helps you understand the speed and distance of Farore's Wind, much better than using the smoke ball. It did feel like wind animation was a little behind when I cancelled the teleports (making judging the end distance slightly harder) but that might just be because of the little slide Zelda gets at the end of teleport now. Overall, this teleport animation is gorgeous, doesn't disrupt game-play, doesn't feel like a nerf, and really helps with ledge cancelled teleporting.

Lastly, the glorious combo oriented back air I requested. Most characters have moves that combo into each other extremely well, and a lot of them can beat out crouch cancels. Zelda does not have this luxury unless she's grounded. Marth's infamous up air strings, Captain Falcon's ability to combo you with every aerial in one combo, ZSS' nair>fair, Lucas's dair>up air/DJC fair>anything, ect. It's a big list when you really look at it. Sure, at zero percent up air can combo into up air or nair, and she has her own stomp>knee (even though ours is like a thousand times harder to use), but almost all of her aerials push people out and away. If they are DIing correctly at all it is very difficult to extend combos without a Din in play. While the back air that is in this build might be broken (sweet spot is entire hitbox, hit stun is incredible, combos into everything) it was really fun experimenting with aerial combos with a reliable comboing move. It made me want to explore all of it's options (which I won't because it won't be in the official build) and it inspired some Zelda combos I have never dreamed of using. Bair>auto canceled first up air hit> dair sweet spot, bair>dair sweet spot>bair missed tech>up tilt, bair>pivot up tilt, bair>f-tilt, bair>wave land grab. So many awesome things can be done with this move, and it compensates for dairs unreliability, or forward air's precision, or nair's small hit box. Since it has all frame data of normal bair (same IASA, same activation time, same hitbox window) it was really easy to quickly get out other aerials or wave lands while the victim was still in hitstun. I know the move won't be official but it was fun to dream.

Oh Goddess, just for the hell of it, can we have a Nayru's love that is jump cancelable like the spacies shine?

 

[Prynne]

Oh Goddess, just for the hell of it, can we have a Nayru's love that is jump cancelable like the spacies shine?

Oh god please yes - this must happen now - I need it in my life.

 

[otheusrex]

Beware the power
Jump canceling from Nayru's
Wavedashing to end

Up directionals
Those twins have traded places
Thumbs might get confused

Angell's proposed fair
With all those damned hitboxes
Hope I did it right!

Now go see my work
To the fires of media
So saith the Goddess

http://www.mediafire.com/download/3i5aeboxrrhui9m/NEW_FAIR.rar​

 

[luxingo]

Goddess, may I request a build with only the Farore's Wind/uptaunt toggle change?

 

[WhiteCrow]

First impressions: Holy crap you can do so much with JC Nayru's Love. It's filthy. Also, up-tilt swapped with up smash is very interesting, especially with up smash OoS.

 

[ECHOnce]

Holy poop this sounds glorious. Could we get some gifs up on here?? I feel like an impatient 5-year-old on Christmas Eve, without a Wii

EDIT: I'm so excited that the U-taunt toggle idea actually worked out aha, got me all giddy inside ; U; can't wait to try it

 

[otheusrex]

some people had asked me for a copy of just the gfx toggle with teleport and uptaunt, no other changes, tournament legal. I decided to past it here in case anyone else wants it. enjoy!
http://www.mediafire.com/download/8elsazx0eppzqzq/only_teleport_gfx_and_uptaunt.rar

 

[otheusrex]

Luxingo was super nice and actually made a giff of what that edit looks like so everyone can see, even if they don't have access to a wii.

https://gfycat.com/ImpassionedWavyEnglishsetter

 

[ECHOnce]

Luxingo was super nice and actually made a giff of what that edit looks like so everyone can see, even if they don't have access to a wii.

https://gfycat.com/ImpassionedWavyEnglishsetter

Nothing could prepare me for how sexy that was. I was expecting some cheap visual indicator by some dude who took a few weeks in a college 3d modelling course or something, to be completely honest. That would've been amazing on it's own. But this. Mmmph~

 

[Vitriform]

Luxingo was super nice and actually made a giff of what that edit looks like so everyone can see, even if they don't have access to a wii.

https://gfycat.com/ImpassionedWavyEnglishsetter

Wow, that looks amazing. As much as I'd prefer not to have a visual effect on the teleport (mostly because it'd make Zelda way too predictable during recovery and approach), I think I'd be able to live with it just because that wind effect is gorgeous.

 

[flying_tortoise]

I....I....I started to tear up....
http://data:image/jpeg;base64,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No freaking way man, no freaking way.

I want to try out these builds so bad but I have to keep school my priority.
Can you make it so that the camera stops following the din? Everyone (non-zelda players, commentators) hate it... it's disorienting for everyone. idk if it has been fixed b/c i havent played your builds but just putting that in their.


What would people think of a slightly faster zelda, less range on nayru, the wind telegraphing Farore's Wind (mb even reduce the distance it can travel as well?), same grab as other characters, and the combable bair that I believe WhiteCrow mentioned?

My thinking was for a comboing, quick zelda. while I believe reducing some other things of zelda to compensate?

I'm not offering the idea for a build b/c I havent been able to play the others. But if others think it would be interesting then go ahead.

 

[WhiteCrow]

Goddess of Wisdom and inspiration
Hallowed be thy name
Give us this day our daily Din's
But deliver us from evil
​

One thing I hear a lot from Zelda's is how different the new Din's are. One thing I hated about old Din's was how slow and unsafe they were. Why not have both? The ability to place 3 Din's Fire traps but at the speed of 3.5. You won't be able to detonate them but you can refresh them. Maybe allow us to toggle it with side-taunt so we can keep our builds legal at tournaments where we show them off.

 

[Downdraft]

Goddess of Wisdom and inspiration
Hallowed be thy name
Give us this day our daily Din's
But deliver us from evil
​

One thing I hear a lot from Zelda's is how different the new Din's are. One thing I hated about old Din's was how slow and unsafe they were. Why not have both? The ability to place 3 Din's Fire traps but at the speed of 3.5. You won't be able to detonate them but you can refresh them. Maybe allow us to toggle it with side-taunt so we can keep our builds legal at tournaments where we show them off.

WhiteCrow, they weren't as unsafe as you're making them sound. 3.02 and 3.5 Din's are both punishable at close and midrange especially against faster characters that aren't in hitstun. With 3.02 Din's, you'd like to rack up the opponent's percentage first and a super sweetspot wouldn't hurt either to setup one or two. Another thing I think that you're forgetting is that 3.02. Din's can be placed closer, farther, and higher than 3.5 Din's. Also, 3.02 and 3.5 Din's are opposite in their acceleration. 3.02 speeds up as it travels while 3.5 slows down. Combine 3.5 Din's slower speeds when setting farther and reduced range with the fact that it can't control the space, and you have a worse projectile. My guess is that the people that like 3.5 Din's more hadn't mastered or understood 3.02 Din's. 3.5 Din's are simpler and take away some of the thinking required. Zelda has less tech and options, so while she has to fight harder, she doesn't have to think as much since there isn't as much that she can do in this build.

B-throw allows you to setup a Din's in 3.02 and 3.5. Multiple mines allows you setup future combos, especially when you've knocked the opponent offstage. Multiple mines allow you to cover your approach or control your opponent's movement. Din's damage was reduced in 3.02, but it remained a good way to tack on damage on characters unlike 3.5 where if you miss, they go through it, or they block it, you have to wait before setting another mine. Resetting takes longer in 3.5, and the camera plus the explosions matching the mine's size + the glow before detonation + the pulsing sound effect make Din's kills easy to avoid if you avoid getting grabbed after it's been set.

 

[WhiteCrow]

My guess is that the people that like 3.5 Din's more hadn't mastered or understood 3.02 Din's. 3.5 Din's are simpler and take away some of the thinking required.

I've already posted my lengthy opinion of this many times on the social and in other threads so I don't feel like I have to repeat myself. I was simply making a suggestion. I like the current speed because it's safer to place in the air and you can get more Din's out per stock than 3.02. Why not just suggest making 3.02 Din's that don't decelerate and have less end lag instead of explaining why 3.02 Din's were amazing? And for the record I would always rather KO with a confirm off of a Din than from the explosion of a Din. It might also be worth suggesting a Din that doesn't detonate at all, or one that detonates when someone touches it instead of the standard knock back.

 

[Downdraft]

I've already posted my lengthy opinion of this many times on the social and in other threads so I don't feel like I have to repeat myself. I was simply making a suggestion. I like the current speed because it's safer to place in the air and you can get more Din's out per stock than 3.02. Why not just suggest making 3.02 Din's that don't decelerate and have less end lag instead of explaining why 3.02 Din's were amazing? And for the record I would always rather KO with a confirm off of a Din than from the explosion of a Din. It might also be worth suggesting a Din that doesn't detonate at all, or one that detonates when someone touches it instead of the standard knock back.

You got confirms off 3.02 Din's, sometimes off of multiple ones if the opponent bounced between them. The explosion combos are just for style, and you can perform similar style combos in 3.5. Eh, I won't mention it again to you specifically or perhaps at all. I've already posted my thoughts multiple times on 3.5 Nayru's, Din's, and kicks.

 

[Lemonworm]

someone should post a gif of some jc nayrus love shenanigans, that sounds ****ing filthy

 

[WhiteCrow]

someone should post a gif of some jc nayrus love shenanigans, that sounds ****ing filthy

When I can get my capture card working I'll be posting my own "What if Zelda had" videos showcasing Elf's builds.

 

[Downdraft]

@ otheusrex What are your plans for this Tuesday's build? If it's just the Din's blend, then I'd like to ask for lightning kicks that are like lightning stomp. Buff the sourspots, so they're more respectable. Eliminate the lightning kick sweetspot in favor of the 1-frame super sweetspots. If you have them, you can use the sweetspot hitboxes and frame data from 3.02, or even better (2.6b). My idea is to have stronger kicks that reward spacing while having the sourspots stronger in case you aren't frame perfect or hit shield with them. Lastly, could you replace the lightning kick sound effect with the meteor heel/Brawl sweetspot/super sweetspot sound effect? Thanks.

Sorry I typed so much. I'm not asking for much, but I wanted to be detailed.
Feel free to ask me for further clarification.

 

[flying_tortoise]

Luxingo was super nice and actually made a giff of what that edit looks like so everyone can see, even if they don't have access to a wii.

https://gfycat.com/ImpassionedWavyEnglishsetter

Ok so I just watched it again...cuz i loved it that much.
1) I rly hope PMDT sees this and doesn't just use it to nerf zelda, but instead gives us something back in return. Do I believe that they would make Zelda more predictable and not give us anything back in return? Idk man, idk.. If they do go with the idea.

2) And more important... That U-taunt..... Can we give that a wind box??? plz... I feel like that would be such a troll. You knock em into the air and you read so well you get the taunt's windbox to hit and it send em to the top Yoshi Story (w/o killing of course)

 

[otheusrex]

Why not just suggest making 3.02 Din's that don't decelerate and have less end lag instead of explaining why 3.02 Din's were amazing?

@ otheusrex What are your plans for this Tuesday's build? If it's just the Din's blend

For the record, I can't modify 3.5 zelda to turn dins back to the way they were, at least not yet. I've looked everywhere in psa in the extensive codes that cover that, and thus far I believe it would not be possible to simply revert it to 3.02 as i believe the code concerning the returning article function after the initial explosion is something that I would need a different program and type of coding for than PSA.

that's not to say that I can't do anything with 3.5 dins fire, however. Things like gfx and hitbox size, acceleration, maneuverability, and timer are things I've been able to change in the past and I know this build is no different in that regard. I will continue to figure out what I can with dins fire though.

If nothing else, I could simply tweak 3.02 zelda and include 3.02 project m with it so it would work properly, however, I imagine that's not going to be as satisfying since it's not really forward looking to see how changes you guys propose would feel like in the current setting

 

[Downdraft]

So, what are your plans for tomorrow's build? I just don't want the kick mod with a bunch of other significant mods.

 

[otheusrex]

ok, up to this point, i'm not really sure. flying tortoise mentioned a few things but also said he didn't want it to be a build unless other people did. Some people mentioned the dins fire stuff, but unfortunately i can't do that. So at this point just the kicks?

what do you guys want? i'm not sure this week

 

[Downdraft]

ok, up to this point, i'm not really sure. flying tortoise mentioned a few things but also said he didn't want it to be a build unless other people did. Some people mentioned the dins fire stuff, but unfortunately i can't do that. So at this point just the kicks?

what do you guys want? i'm not sure this week

@ otheusrex What are your plans for this Tuesday's build? If it's just the Din's blend, then I'd like to ask for lightning kicks that are like lightning stomp. Buff the sourspots, so they're more respectable. Eliminate the lightning kick sweetspot in favor of the 1-frame super sweetspots. If you have them, you can use the sweetspot hitboxes and frame data from 3.02, or even better (2.6b). My idea is to have stronger kicks that reward spacing while having the sourspots stronger in case you aren't frame perfect or hit shield with them. Lastly, could you replace the lightning kick sound effect with the meteor heel/Brawl sweetspot/super sweetspot sound effect? Thanks.

Sorry I typed so much. I'm not asking for much, but I wanted to be detailed.
Feel free to ask me for further clarification.

 

[flying_tortoise]

@ otheusrex alright well then if no one minds could we go with the ideas I mentioned? I just wanted to see if anyone could come up with something better. sorry about that..
but yah I would be honored *bows*

and.. *ahem* if that wind box on the u-taunt is possible...*ahem*... that'd be amazing.

 

[Downdraft]

@ otheusrex alright well then if no one minds could we go with the ideas I mentioned? I just wanted to see if anyone could come up with something better. sorry about that..
but yah I would be honored *bows*

and.. *ahem* if that wind box on the u-taunt is possible...*ahem*... that'd be amazing.

I don't mind; I'd just want it separate from mine.

 

[otheusrex]

Improvements to speed I can change
But these for a cost have been paid
with neutral and Up b's less range

The wind of the upwards derision
Can lift to the sky thy opponent
when used with good wit and precision

The spiraling winds of these graphics
also now grace her Up b's
ye can use this to help with your tricks

And Teleport distance is less
yet quick as the grounded departure
from air to the ground with success

A faster increase in her dash
With a great sense of speed in her run
make for followups after a smash

More speed as she flies through the air
will give her more combos 'twixt jumps
especially with this new bair

And with this also comes grab
both of her grabs, dash and standing,
will reach lower to nab pesky foes

To attack with a dash on the field
a faster and farther assault
can power ye over their shield

But all of this comes with a cost
as I mentioned before, that with nayru's
its outermost hitboxes lost ​

Now ye to the Media Fire
To witness the thoughts of your kin
so saith the Goddess, Desire

http://www.mediafire.com/download/gd6fk1rs31wg0ue/fast_zelda_bair_and_wind_gfx.rar

​

 

[flying_tortoise]

Improvements to speed I can change
But these for a cost have been paid
with neutral and Up b's less range

The wind of the upwards derision
Can lift to the sky thy opponent
when used with good wit and precision

The spiraling winds of these graphics
also now grace her Up b's
ye can use this to help with your tricks

And Teleport distance is less
yet quick as the grounded departure
from air to the ground with success

A faster increase in her dash
With a great sense of speed in her run
make for followups after a smash

More speed as she flies through the air
will give her more combos 'twixt jumps
especially with this new bair

And with this also comes grab
both of her grabs, dash and standing,
will reach lower to nab pesky foes

To attack with a dash on the field
a faster and farther assault
can power ye over their shield

But all of this comes with a cost
as I mentioned before, that with nayru's
its outermost hitboxes lost ​

Now ye to the Media Fire
To witness the thoughts of your kin
so saith the Goddess, Desire

http://www.mediafire.com/download/gd6fk1rs31wg0ue/fast_zelda_bair_and_wind_gfx.rar

​

o...omg...
man i dont want to comment until i play it, but i cant play it until i finish hw...
I will hurry up and play it asap.
..THANK YOU

 

[otheusrex]

o...omg...
man i dont want to comment until i play it, but i cant play it until i finish hw...
I will hurry up and play it asap.
..THANK YOU

well did you play it yet?

 

[WhiteCrow]

I played it for a little bit but had to switch to vanilla; the North West Majors and two huge house tournaments are coming up and I need to be as consistent as possible. I will say that it felt really strange having so much aerial control. Jump forward>fair>pull back>wave land forward covered sooo much space and felt super safe compared to her current neutral options. I was missing wave lands off platforms and ledge dashes because I was just so damn fast. It was awesome but it would take time to adjust to it. The combo bair seemed harder to connect with but that's just because I wasn't used to the aerial speed. I loved her improved ground speed. Tech chasing felt smoother, her dash dance felt more threatening, and it made me want to play so much more aggressively. One weird thing was her wave dash felt so... sub-optimal compared to her great air and land control. Could you make a build with a Mario/G&W length WD? That could even be it's own build, vanilla Zelda with buffed WD.

Oh, and the teleport nerf wasn't that bad since her movement is so godlike in this build.

 

[Downdraft]

Could you make a build with a Mario/G&W length WD? That could even be it's own build, vanilla Zelda with buffed WD

That seems like it would be simple. It's not drastic, so I wouldn't mind it being combined with the build I proposed.

 

[flying_tortoise]

well did you play it yet?

Sorry I actually played it the day you posted it... cuz well I gave into the temptation
Its just actually typing in here i procrastinated on.

I absolutely loved it. I felt like I could be more aggresive.
Time for an in-depth analysis. I really hope others try it and say what they think

Bair:
I feel like having bair no longer be a kill move will calm a lot of complaints. When I used to use her in tournies ppl would complain that you could be on the retreat, throw out a bair and you actually might kill the opponent. I kind of have to agree with that statement. Sure you are spacing but it is too easy to runaway bair.
BUT...with this that'll calm ppl down.
And I actually found myself trying to come into my opponent with bair because although awkward and not free, I wanted the possibilty of the amazing combos. Bair to anything depending on their DI. And with the combos it'll add a feel that the zelda needed more skill to pull off the kill as opposed to a quick bair kill (trying to think in the perspective of opponent).

Mobility:
Yes...I was able to DD and apply pressure. I was able to do more follow ups. Even using the Din more effectively b/c I could space myself easier and follow up on it should the opponent get hit.
The grab was also very freeing.

Again with the mobility i was able to get some fun strings in.
I got dthrow -> bair -> u-smash when they DI'd poorly so nice...

Teleport:
There were quite a few moments where I was like... "****..her recovery ain't rly good anymore "
I felt more worried about getting hit off-stage. Not just that I was prone to getting more damage dealt to me, but that I might actually not make it back.
Also the indicator made it a lot scarier to recover for the obvious reason of you can get punished hard if you don't cancel it properly and the opponent will always be right on my tail. (but the indicator looks so good I actually didn't mind. It felt like it should be there, and that it fits the character. Also it looks badass when you properly teleport around the stage (but with the mobility you aren't over using it))

Honestly the less distance felt like it balanced the character's buffs really well and the distance of recovery is still decent.

Nayru:
the reduced range felt like it was deserved with the other changes.

Utaunt:
...looks so nice....
I tried getting a string with it but it was so hard to do it match. xD
Got punished for it but you better believe I still tried my hardest to set that up.

I felt like it was a good build that more enforces coming in more.
Which if we are staying with the single Din from now on, makes more sense to have these characteristics

I hope others experiment with it.
9/10 for Otheus. why 9? i suppose b/c she wasn't overpowered ;P
Edit: Holy crap this looks really long

 

[otheusrex]

A longer Wavedash grants a small amount
of ground mobility to our beloved.
As per the Downward draft's idea? Her kicks
resembleth downward down-air via a
thundering sweetspot nestled in between
a larger, weaker, yet not feeble hitbox.
And smiting he who would transgresseth to
assaileth Zelda from above with taunting
to Heaven's height shall their persons and
thy spirits lift Skyward bemused and smirking
Now go all ye and seeth the desires
of the sisters @ Downdraft and the @ WhiteCrow

http://www.mediafire.com/download/q68m85qxt9jruxm/long_wavedash_and_dairlike_bair.rar

​

 

[flying_tortoise]

As per the Downward draft's idea? ​

​

Including a question? You're slipping otheus. I kid, I actually really like seeing these descriptions.​

 

[Downdraft]

A longer Wavedash grants a small amount
of ground mobility to our beloved.
As per the Downward draft's idea? Her kicks
resembleth downward down-air via a
thundering sweetspot nestled in between
a larger, weaker, yet not feeble hitbox.
And smiting he who would transgresseth to
assaileth Zelda from above with taunting
to Heaven's height shall their persons and
thy spirits lift Skyward bemused and smirking
Now go all ye and seeth the desires
of the sisters @ Downdraft and the @ WhiteCrow

http://www.mediafire.com/download/q68m85qxt9jruxm/long_wavedash_and_dairlike_bair.rar

​

Thank you. That b-air is amazing. I went to training and could kill stationary DK under 70% from Final Destination. He died from b-air under 100% reliably, and the sound effect makes it so much better.