train computers?

[krisk]

I found this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EyUc-E4deIk&feature=channel

I tried to do this with Toon Link and I'm not sure if he really got better or if it was only me getting brainwashed by this theory.

Anyways, I want to hear your opinions about this theory



EDIT:

I'm going to paste quotes that everyone should read here

I red somewhere that the computers "learn" in a sense that they will perform moves that are used more often and with a higher success rate more.

As in, Ganon will not use warlock punch alot unless I use it alot with success. Ganon will likely stomp due to thunderstormers, but the cpu cannot perform the whole thunderstorm trick really. Just like they might use the koopa claw, but they cant do the infinite jump even though thats where they see that move used alot.

People have reported Snake's spamming dash attack-> upsmash, and Peaches spamming Roll-> throw turnips, so if it true, its likely that they only learn the general move sequence and can't get the actual frame-dependent ATs down.

...

In the vid the reason the lucas cpu short hops so much is because...
Well, if the CPU is trying to attack you...and youre a lucas shorthopping....it only makes sense to shorthop.


...

 

[Kishin]

Cool stuff. Now I'm going to go make the CPU metaknight a mach tornado, D-smash, Shuttle loop spammer. Then I'll make snake a tilt spammer. Then Ike a jab *****.

 

[Super Shadow Brawler 99]

I think this is actually pretty interesting. If you do this a couple of times, I can see how you can get a better CP to fight and also maybe improve the way you play. I haven't heard of this before, thanks for sharing.

 

[Dantarion]

You guys honestly believe this?

In the vid the reason the lucas cpushort hops so much is because...
Well, if the CPU is trying to attack you...and youre a lucas shorthopping....it only makes sense to shorthop.


If you could train CPU's, all the data from training would have to be sent with each replay, and it isn't.

 

[ufo90]

I have tried to train my CPUs and it seems to work. A simple test to see if it works is try something that has no point. I taught my bowser to shorthop then turn around and breath fire as he lands. The CPU uses it and it has no reason too except it learned it from me.

 

[Nihongo-ookami]

Sounds plausible.

XD it could become a game on its own.

Brawl: The Virtual Pet Edition!

 

[Nintendevil]

I found it interesting that everyone who believes this has less than a few hundred posts.... or less than a hundred.

 

[pure_awesome]

I have tried to train my CPUs and it seems to work. A simple test to see if it works is try something that has no point. I taught my bowser to shorthop then turn around and breath fire as he lands. The CPU uses it and it has no reason too except it learned it from me.

Everyone's Bowser does that.


Training CPU's is Brawl's version of Melee's "OMG UNLOCK SONIC AND TAILS!"

 

[litlwing]

I read somewhere that the computers "learn" in a sense that they will perform moves that are used more often and with a higher success rate more.

As in, Ganon will not use warlock punch alot unless I use it alot with success. Ganon will likely stomp due to thunderstormers, but the cpu cannot perform the whole thunderstorm trick really. Just like they might use the koopa claw, but they cant do the infinite jump even though thats where they see that move used alot.

 

[CRASHiC]

If someone can teach Snake Dashing, then I will believe it.

 

[XienZo]

If someone can teach Snake Dashing, then I will believe it.

People have reported Snake's spamming dash attack-> upsmash, and Peaches spamming Roll-> throw turnips, so if it true, its likely that they only learn the general move sequence and can't get the actual frame-dependent ATs down.

 

[DKKountry]

Get a video of a cpu Kirby doing the Fgrab > Uair > regrab combo and I'll believe cpus learn. The closest thing to a plausible theory I have ever heard about cpu learning is that they repeat tactics that lead to KOs. I still don't believe it though.

 

[cookieM0Nster]

This isn't true. CPU's do not learn. If a LV9 Lucas Zap Jumps, THEN I will believe it.

 

[TriforceMaster5282]

Online?

Idk, I don't use my pit very much, but my best friend plays as him constantly, and i see my level 9 pit act like him a lot! and hes by far the hardest cpu on my roster!

 

[Likeness101]

My ganondorf CPU glide tossed. Does that count?

 

[*JuriHan*]

I found this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EyUc-E4deIk&feature=channel

I tried to do this with Toon Link and I'm not sure if he really got better or if it was only me getting brainwashed by this theory.

Anyways, I want to hear your opinions about this theory



EDIT:

I'm going to paste quotes that everyone should read here

yes, cpus do learn. I taught my Meta knight cpus to crouch spam after taunting or as a taunt. I even have a replay of this if anyone would like to see it.

 

[XienZo]

yes, cpus do learn. I taught my Meta knight cpus to crouch spam after taunting or as a taunt. I even have a replay of this if anyone would like to see it.

Sorry, but crouch spam is one of the pre-programmed actions that CPUs do. People have seen it since day 1. Dumb Sakurai.

 

[*JuriHan*]

Sorry, but crouch spam is one of the pre-programmed actions that CPUs do. People have seen it since day 1. Dumb Sakurai.

o_O really? After a taunt or KO? I've only seen my Metaknights do it.

 

[Dantarion]

I believe the crouch spam is because the CPU has no reason to move, because they have no target, so they do the only motion that isn't moving, or an attack, or an dodge. They only seem to taunt RIGHT after you die.

 

[Jupz]

My DDD chaingrabbed me once

(Just one dthrow->regrab)

 

[Underload]

Just spam Warlock Punch for two hours.

 

[pure_awesome]

I borrowed my friends Wii, who hadn't unlocked Wolf yet, and played 50 matches where I only KO'd with Downsmash.

It didn't make one iota of difference to the CPU Wolf. They don't learn. People have video instances of Melee CPUs wavelanding, SuperWavedashing, and other nonsense. So either this has been around since Melee and has been extremely well hidden in the game, or we can chalk a couple up to just being coincidence.

Brawl AIs are just built very loosely so as to mimic the seemingly random behaviour of humans. It's pretty obvious that this would cause hiccups every once in a while.

 

[kingcobra9]

i'm pretty sure this isn't possible due to the way the game was programmed the end

 

[Mr. Escalator]

They do learn to do the Grosser actions after seeing/having it performed on them. To illustrate this, a simple test would to Down Throw with Yoshi and then Down B. Without prior experience, they will get hit. Do it a couple more times and they will always avoid it. They learn the right way to DI, they learn how to avoid tech chases when you do the same thing over and over. CPUs do learn.

They don't really learn the Finer actions you do, so don't expect them to start Snakedashing and brick walling you.

The game keeps track of what moves you hit with and the ones you miss with, as evidenced by the results screen and the stats under nicknames etc. It's not far fetched to assume CPUs utilize this somehow.

If anything, they may not mimic you, but they do at least make good intelligent sandbags breaking out of your overused tactics.

 

[Kewkky]

They do learn to do the Grosser actions after seeing/having it performed on them. To illustrate this, a simple test would to Down Throw with Yoshi and then Down B. Without prior experience, they will get hit. Do it a couple more times and they will always avoid it. They learn the right way to DI, they learn how to avoid tech chases when you do the same thing over and over. CPUs do learn.

They don't really learn the Finer actions you do, so don't expect them to start Snakedashing and brick walling you.

The game keeps track of what moves you hit with and the ones you miss with, as evidenced by the results screen and the stats under nicknames etc. It's not far fetched to assume CPUs utilize this somehow.

If anything, they may not mimic you, but they do at least make good intelligent sandbags breaking out of your overused tactics.

YAH SO TRUE! That's why, when I use snake and dthrow computers near the edge, they roll towards the edge, whereas I can regrab and dthrow them yet again, which leads to ye another rolling towards the edg, regrab, dthrow, regrab... until 999% or the timer runs out.

They DO learn! My example doesn't count, because a normal human would obviously learn and roll towards the edge and get regrabbed yet again!

 

[=)@MePlz]

So far, no, I don't believe it. It's just how the game was programmed.

 

[Xebenkeck]

guys it is stupid to deny that the computers learn in some fashion. It is fairly noticeable with whoever you main. When you play a CPU on your wii; who is your main, in my case is ness, they are clearly better then a CPU on a different game. The ness on my game is a lot harder to play against then the ness on my friends wii, he mains mario, and the mario on his wii ***** me, and i mean ***** where on my wii i regularily beat lvl 9 marios. If you have a friend who mains someone different then you try it yourself, it is fairly noticeable.

Whether this way is the way it's actually taught is debatable, but the AI does pick up on the inputs you do most often. I.E. my ness constantly does SH nairs/fairs.

 

[JOE!]

my yoshi has done the pivot grab a few times on me....


*edited for spelling...*

 

[Sph34r]

My Falco SHL (not SHDL) occasionally... he definitely does not do that out of the box.

 

[comboking]

I am so going to do this!

I wish we could make CPUs edgeguard. my ike will now jab cancel use only upb to recover and many more. NAIR to Jab any1?

 

[Xebenkeck]

umm i doubt it'll learn jab cancel, any ATs probably can't be taught. Take lucas zap jump for example. the inputs are literally double jump and side b at the same time, save like 2-3 frames. the computer would read DJ, then Pk fire, making it useless to try to teach.

 

[comboking]

Thats what I was afraid of.

 

[Dantarion]

No offense, but you guys are idiots.

CPU's don't learn.

The data would have to be sent with each replay, and people have already decoded the replay format...and...well..it isn't.

 

[sasook]

My level 7 Link (dunno about 9) jab cancels, pivot boosts, zedges, and gale guards. Pretty sure that wasn't registered into the game.

 

[Shining Blitz]

No offense, but you guys are idiots.

CPU's don't learn.

The data would have to be sent with each replay, and people have already decoded the replay format...and...well..it isn't.

Why would the data have to be sent with the replay? Aren't CPU moves recorded as inputs or actions or whatever, just like a human's? Or did I miss something

 

[bobson]

Why would the data have to be sent with the replay? Aren't CPU moves recorded as inputs or actions or whatever, just like a human's? Or did I miss something

No, the CPUs are just put into the match normally. You can prove this by saving a replay with game-altering codes on and then playing it without them on. The CPUs will act normally, even taunting after you die.

 

[Geist]

If computers could learn, then why do they still suck?
Why do they keep running into my charged smashes?

 

[saviorslegacy]

Well... that would explain why the CPU Sheik PWNS. lol j/k (Now I would be impressed if I got gimped.)

Umm... I use to be a Pit main and I would of course use the arrow technique. ak spam
Now the CPU spams. So I believe this.

 

[ph00tbag]

Why do people keep spreading these lies? More importantly, why do people continue to believe them? If you watch that video, the CPU Lucas was doing nothing new when he KO'd the person posting the vid. He had been doing the same thing at the very beginning of the video.

CPUs don't learn. I've been playing ZSS since the game came out and have even dittoed several CPU ZSSes, and CPU ZSSes are still as completely ******** as they were when I first got the game. Get this through your skulls, people.

 

[One_With_Sumthing]

Why do people keep spreading these lies? More importantly, why do people continue to believe them? If you watch that video, the CPU Lucas was doing nothing new when he KO'd the person posting the vid. He had been doing the same thing at the very beginning of the video.

CPUs don't learn. I've been playing ZSS since the game came out and have even dittoed several CPU ZSSes, and CPU ZSSes are still as completely ******** as they were when I first got the game. Get this through your skulls, people.

To be sure, was it on training mode?

As to my own belief, I am uncertain (not that any of you care ).