Top Tier Peach good?

[Dark.Pch]

I figured the moving back and moving in was risky, but I usually dont have a problem landing and grabing my opponents out of a falling dair that has been shielded

I hope you know they can attack before you get that grab or move out the way for that matter.

 

[Gea]

Aka if the Snake knows Peach... the entire match is a guessing game against you (survivability).

At least you still have good CP stuff. Its like a free win on Cruise.

 

[BurtonEarny]

in my experiance... they do not. Difference in the level of play we are facing I suppose.

 

[deepseadiva]

So, uh, the official SBR Tier List is out:

The Offical SBR Brawl Tier List

Top
Meta Knight
Snake
King Dedede
Mr. Game & Watch
Falco
R.O.B.

High
Marth
Wario
Lucario
Donkey Kong
Diddy
Pikachu
Ice Climbers
Kirby
Pit
Wolf

Middle
Toon Link
Olimar
Fox
Zelda
Zero Suit Samus
Bowser
Luigi
Peach
Ike
Shiek

Low
Lucas
Ness
Mario
Pokémon Trainer
Samus
Yoshi
Sonic
Jigglypuff
Ganondorf
Link
Captain Falcon

Happy? I am.

 

[BentoBox]

Bowser is higher than Peach, I'm surprised lol.

 

[Morrigan]

Bowser is higher than Peach, I'm surprised lol.

Yep, that's surprising.

 

[BurtonEarny]

Yep, that's surprising.

I dont believe it really. I play both of them and bowser can be shut down relativly easily. Peach always has an option.

 

[Dark.Pch]

Aka if the Snake knows Peach... the entire match is a guessing game against you (survivability).

At least you still have good CP stuff. Its like a free win on Cruise.

No it is not. That is not a stage you wanna take Snake too. I have even been counter picked that stage, he can camp you easy, he has no need to chase you there and he can kill you easy on that stage. That is one stage you want to avoid. It does not mater about his recovery. Thats one thing you have on him compared to the other he has on you on that stage.

 

[Gea]

No it is not. That is not a stage you wanna take Snake too. I have even been counter picked that stage, he can camp you easy, he has no need to chase you there and he can kill you easy on that stage. That is one stage you want to avoid. It does not mater about his recovery. Thats one thing you have on him compared to the other he has on you on that stage.

I disagree. Snake is FORCED to move on this stage. It is one of the few stages where he cannot camp stationary and his C4/mines are fairly useless on the stage. Here's the thing:

Snake never has to chase you on any stage. That's what I don't get with all these snakes you guys play that are so agressive against you. What suddenly makes him need to chase you on BF, FD, Lylat? He NEVER does. But he does HAVE to move on Cruise. Moving meaning jumping. Jumping for snake means holes in his game.

Every grab you get on Cruise opens amazing possibilities.

He can kill you easy on ALOT of stages. He can die easy here (and Japes/Frigate).

See, as I see it there are two options that shut down snake well.

1. Gimp him. Good luck gimping a good snake without a good spike.

1. Avoid his tilts. This one is REALLY hard for alot of characters to do well (Peach for example, is an obvious one as we're sitting here discussing safe ways to approach and disagreeing because he has so many options out of shield) but its part of the reason Wario does so amazingly well.

Another part of avoiding tilts falls down to either outcamping him, which he has the tools to outcamp you (range and rushdown as you pull turnips), or keeping him in the air, where if he whiffs you CAN punish quite well.

What is Snake's weakness? Aerials.

 

[Dark.Pch]

Peach has one thing on that stage over Snake, that's his recovery.

Snake does not need to move around so much to do damage to you. And can attack you from better distance than you can. also if you are on the top Part or on the sides, Snake can kill you easy. You are easy to kill as it is for snake, there is no need to go there where his killing options on you are better.

You play a smart snake that won't be gimp so easy, you are done. You are depending on one thing to beat snake. gimping, which is not even reliable. Snake has more than one option there to kill you. If you think thats a safe risk and are a god a gimping smart people then you go for it and call me in the morning.

 

[Gea]

I'm not even talking about gimping there. I'm talking about forcing Snake to actually move around instead of sitting still. Snake is vulernable in the air. That's pretty much agreed upon as his greatest weakness. Abuse it.

 

[gantrain05]

well heres a few examples of how i play peach, im not a big combo player either, i just like to look for opportunities and take advantage of them

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgAAZNG14rM me(peach) vs andy(Wario)

and this one is me(peach) vs broly(snake)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oj_UKR3oFhg i did alot of stupid things in this one, and the snake player wasn't exactly the best, but i usually play alot better snakes and do pretty decent, if i don't win i will always get them down to at least 1 stock at a pretty high percent

 

[Dark.Pch]

Sankes does not have to move that much. Stage is not really fast. This one snake I play on there Just tanked. I had to aproach him all the time, And he ended up getting Good kills on me. He would not come to me and just tanked with use of cooked grenades.and the F-B move he has.

Also when in certain spots (like the carpet) Not much space for me to move, and I can be pressured or even eat an Utilt of Ftilt. Peach can be killed easy on that stage by snake. Thats a risk I will not take.

 

[Sky`]

Peaches Dair...
Literally bends snake over. I'm super Srs.

 

[Praxis]

And Praxis. I disagree with the fact that Peach counters Snake. I don't care what Snakes you beat Pro or not. I could Beat M2K's Meta in a tournament. Now for beating him I will not sit here and say Peach counters Meta cause I beat him. Same goes for any good Meta. But for the position that Peach is in this game, she does good against Snake. But as for a counter, No she does not counter snake.

I didn't claim she counters him- I said she has the advantage, as in, the matchup is slightly in her favor.

"she does good against Snake", as you said.

 

[cutter]

Just for reference:

Snake's jab comes out frame 3
Ftilt on frame 4
Utilt on frame 6

And G&W's Dtilt comes out frame 6 -_-

 

[EdreesesPieces]

I figured the moving back and moving in was risky, but I usually dont have a problem landing and grabing my opponents out of a falling dair that has been shielded

It's not risky. Just don't get into the range of his moves. If you are good at spacing you are not taking a risk. It doesn't matter how good Snake is at the spacing because he's grounded. He has to walk, stop, then tilt so space. You just need to float forward and back and can change the timing of your aerials by such a small degree. You can float back and aerial forward or even float forward and aerial back. Peach has way more control for spacing in the air then Snake does on the ground so Peach has the spacing advantage in this match IMO.

Honestly if you float just out of the range of his tilts, what are Snake's options? He can jump at you with an aerial (LOL) or he can dash attack or mortar slide, which in case your down air will just intercept him. (I space while whoring down air) The second he pulls a grenade or plants a mine I attack him. He doesn't really have that many options against Peach. Once he hits her it does wayyyyyy damage and he can kill her early, she has to rack up mondo damage to get the kill.

The reason I'm discussing this isn't to talk about Snake VS Peach, its to point out the way I too think about this game. I look at it as options and reactions, not frames, priority and range. I look at what options do I have, and what options does the other person have, and whose options are better. When I look at a perfect Peach vs a perfect snake, I see Peach having more options and a better abillity to punish and approach and defend, honestly. And that's how I think you should look at matchups more.

 

[TKD]

Snake vs Peach talk? Only MK ***** Peach, Snake ranges at most from 60/40 to 40/60.

Peach won't be top tier. You can win tournaments by maining her though, if you're that good. But you've gotta have something else against MK too, I guess.

 

[Dark.Pch]

If the only character I gotta worry about losing to is meta, than thats fine with me. I like that.

 

[PRINCESS PEACH777]

I would like to see her in top tier but i don't think that's going to happen.

 

[Praxis]

On the topic of Rainbow Cruise, it depends on the Snake's style. I've seen Snakes that auto-lose on that stage, and I've seen Snakes that counterpicked it on me. The Snakes that know the stage will plant explosives on key parts of the stage that you are forced to cross and really give you trouble, and he can utilt you near the top for super low % kills.


For the SBR tier list...huh. ROB in top tier is weird to me. Lucario so high is kind of weird too. And Peach below Bowser and ZSS and Zelda...

We'll show them

lol, your kidding right? peach totally shuts down DDD and G&W, and easy 50/50 maybe 45/55 snake matchup. not to mention you can't exactly punish a perfectly spaced Fair, since she can autocancel and go into many other options when she hits the ground, AA, Dsmash, Ftilt, Dash attack, Sidestepdodge, or Roll. its not as easy to punish that move as alot of people think.

Absolutely no way. G&W is possibly Peach's worst matchup IMO. Peach has no way to counter turtle- it even peirces toad. His dsmash comes out so fast it messes you up when you're trying to punish him and his small size and slow speed means you almost never land usmash. His insanely high aerial priority means you get slammed in the air a lot.

A good G&W can really mess up Peach.

 

[Dark.Pch]

Absolutely no way. G&W is possibly Peach's worst matchup IMO. Peach has no way to counter turtle- it even peirces toad. His dsmash comes out so fast it messes you up when you're trying to punish him and his small size and slow speed means you almost never land usmash. His insanely high aerial priority means you get slammed in the air a lot.

A good G&W can really mess up Peach.

Praxis Talk to your friend Valdens. I think after him playing me he tell you other wise. and even said so himself. this match is not that much hell as you make it out to be. But don't take my word for it. Go talk to him ;D

 

[Niko_K]

B-air is by far GaW's most easily escaped move. Just SDI upwards and behind him and you will get out on the 2nd or 3rd hit and can bair him. Or if you have a float after you SDI out you can float dair and take control that way.

As Dark.Pch said, the match up isn't as hellish as you make it out to seem. Just because you have trouble with it doesn't make it the be all end all for that match up.

Just throwing that out there.

 

[Morrigan]

This just turned into a matchup thread lol

 

[Dark.Pch]

This just turned into a matchup thread lol

Only on the Peach boards.

 

[EdreesesPieces]

I think the snake discussion we have here is on par with the one in the matchup thread i might link to this thread LOL

 

[Sky`]

Sky did something good! =D YUSH.

 

[Airgemini]

I doubt she'll ever be high tier unless some game changing AT comes out that'll really help her game out. She's more likely to be mid - high mid at least.

Anyways, even if she was high tier I dont think it'll do much harm. The more people who play a character the more chance that new discoveries will be made and et cetera.

 

[Valdens]

Praxis Talk to your friend Valdens. I think after him playing me he tell you other wise. and even said so himself. this match is not that much hell as you make it out to be. But don't take my word for it. Go talk to him ;D

No offense, but other than the first match where you made a comeback where I was ahead an entire stock, I managed to beat you pretty easily. >_> Just saying.

I am of the opinion that the matchup is pretty skewed in GnW's favor, 65:35 I think.

 

[Praxis]

Praxis Talk to your friend Valdens. I think after him playing me he tell you other wise. and even said so himself. this match is not that much hell as you make it out to be. But don't take my word for it. Go talk to him ;D

I probably exaggerate the difficulty (it's not IMPOSSIBLE) as I've figured out matchup since and gotten a lot better against him, but I STILL usually lose. I just get him to 100% last stock, but he always gets the last kill.

I'm convinced it's one of Peach's worst matchups alongside Falco though. I have more trouble with G&W than Falco, but I see why Edrees feels Falco is the worst.

I'd like to add in Meta, but I simply have almost no experience against Metaknights. Eggz is the only decent one in WA and I've only fought him once. (though brdy's moving back up here so I'll get some practice soon) I also fought DSF's once...wasn't pretty for me. LOL

 

[EdreesesPieces]

Hehe, always funny how Praxis will link Valdens to the thread ;D I c what u did ther

 

[Rockin]

Even if Peach was top tier and everyone play and main her, the fact of the manner is that you play Peach. whether she fits your style, your favorite character, or any of that stuff, all you have to worry about is you. I mean, I'm facing this issue with Meta Knight (who I wanted to main ever since mention of the game). I thought he'd be at least mid tier due to lack of kill moves and such, but he turned out to be the devil's plague. T_T In anycase, I was hoping to main Peach as well, but she sadly went to secondary recently. No worries, I still play her a lot more then my other secondaries.

Also, ED, don't give up on unlocking Geno. I know you can do it =D

**** Mallow! XDD

 

[Dark.Pch]

No offense, but other than the first match where you made a comeback where I was ahead an entire stock, I managed to beat you pretty easily. >_> Just saying.

I am of the opinion that the matchup is pretty skewed in GnW's favor, 65:35 I think.

If you wanna take it like that, the second and third match I rushed you. Thats why you beat me THAT easy. When I was losing I decided to go defensive. And bait your bair and mostly let you throw the first punch. Peach is not suppose to Rush G&W, there is no need to be aggresive against him.

When I was patient I got you, when I was not, I ended up getting beat horrible. I am not a stupid player, despite if you wanna get cocky for that win. If I showed you the respect, done turn the other cheek.

Reason I brought you up was to prove G&W is not that much hell as Praxis goes on about. And I played you both ways, defensive and aggresive.

Defensive = Win

aggresive = Lost

 

[ADHD]

If you wanna take it like that, the second and third match I rushed you. Thats why you beat me THAT easy. When I was losing I decided to go defensive. And bait your bair and mostly let you throw the first punch. Peach is not suppose to Rush G&W, there is no need to be aggresive against him.

When I was patient I got you, when I was not, I ended up getting beat horrible. I am not a stupid player, despite if you wanna get cocky for that win. If I showed you the respect, done turn the other cheek.

Reason I brought you up was to prove G&W is not that much hell as Praxis goes on about. And I played you both ways, defensive and aggresive.

Defensive = Win

aggresive = Lost

No johns take it like a man

 

[Dark.Pch]

No johns take it like a man

How did I know someone like you would come here and say something like that. The trolls of the boards. Tired of these smash groupies.

Valdens beat me 2-1. I am explaining that. They way to beat the character is not not rush him And the match with me and him proves how you suppose to handle G&W. I don't care for losing to him. It's Peach vs G&W, go figure. Its like going crazy for a ganon losing to a snake. No need to get mad about it, the match up is a mess.

Learn the difference between a john and explaining a match up/ using it as an example. Only reason I played Valdens was to see what Praxis was talking about. And from what Praxis and even Valdens says, I don't agree with it.

So can you get off my case and be gone?

 

[Praxis]

It's Peach vs G&W, go figure. Its like going crazy for a ganon losing to a snake. No need to get mad about it, the match up is a mess.

So, then, you agree that G&W has the advantage in the matchup? Because that's all I'm trying to get at. The matchup is hardly impossible, I just think it requires extreme precision on the part of the Peach and every slipup costs greatly, and is just very difficult.

I'm actually curious Dark- what's your worst matchup? Everyone has good and bad matchups. My best matchups are Snake, ROB, Lucario, Fox, Wolf (and I think Lucario and Wolf have the advantage, but I still know the matchups well enough to call them good)...my worst matchups are Marth, Falco, Metaknight, and G&W.

IIRC, Edrees' bests include Marth and Meta, worst is Falco. Right?

 

[Vista]

Dark.Pch, no johns. Seriously, by making excuses like that, it's as if you are trying to discredit the winner of the match, saying that you are better and that if (Whatever) didn't happen, you would have easily won.

nojonzplz

 

[gantrain05]

i agree with drk.peach actually, one match doesn't prove ****, i've destroyed many game and watch with my peach, maybe valdens is just the better player, maybe peach was playing sloppy, i don't know, but i do know that its not really all that hard of a matchup for peach, i'd give it 50/50 probably.

 

[Dark.Pch]

Dark.Pch, no johns. Seriously, by making excuses like that, it's as if you are trying to discredit the winner of the match, saying that you are better and that if (Whatever) didn't happen, you would have easily won.

nojonzplz

What the hell is up with you people? You are not getting this at all.

I never said if I was to play defense in all the matches I would have won now did I? he is going about how he beat me so EASY. And I told him why, and he even said so himself that me going the defensive was working on him and was harder to deal with. And he knows the last 2 matches I rushed him. We talked about this after our matches were done.

I am not saying if I would have kept going defensive that he would have not beat me. I still could have lost my match. But at the same time he would have not beat me so EASY as we discuss after our match is done.

He beat me, big deal why am I gonna deny a player of his win. Her is a good player so I got no need to make up anything to make me look on top. He beat me 2-1. Nothing is gonna change that.

PEEEEEEEEEEEEEEASE for the love of god, tell me someone gets what I am talking about.

To answer Praxis question - my worst match ups are:

DK
Wolf
somewhat pikachu

 

[DeadlyTurnip]

This thread fails in so many ways.

For once the last 6 pages are off topic.

Plus, we have already discussed this same stuff so many times it's getting redundant.

Just a question that I wanted to ask you guys.

If peach really did get top tier, and we keep placing well with her... would that be a good thing?

People will begin to ***** her, to be honest, a lot of people randomly joined the Peach community. I'm guilty of joining the Peach community when brawl came out, but I did play her in Melee.
But I'm talking about random people just coming in and flooding the boards with topics and posts and garbage like that... Have you seen the MK boards?

If there was such a thing as Peach being top tier:

I guess it would be really selfish of us to try to keep the Peach rank lower just because we don't want spam on the boards. Like Edreese said more people = more metagame. I mean, aside from Edress there are not many impressive Peaches (No offense to anyone) sharing stuff on the boards. For once she has a low rank (I haven't checked in that) so you can expect less people using the boards to share their stuff.

You are thinking that only random people will care enough to look at Peach. Why couldn't good players take a look at Peach. In reality Brawl is more about experience than anything else, many have said that you can pretty much pick up a character in one day and be decent with it, unlike Melee where you had to put some mad effort into it.

If people are smart enough they will apply the knowledge they know with their other characters into Peach. My brother, DJpwn1423, used Peach today when I said "Why is it such a pain to kill with Peach" when he was using C.Falco, me having him at 200%+, he running around, and me failing at killing the little ****er.

I must have a preeeeeetty bad Peach if he won using her against me, when he's only used her 5 times before. In my brother's words:

"OMG, [DT], why do you suck with such an awesome character?"

"Oh, so she's good now?"

"Hell no, she's still bad."

People who are active in Brawl can Pick up Peach and bring their own knowledge into the mix. If there is more awareness about this 'awesome character' I don't see why we should care about the boards, if we can make Peach better.

(I f*cking hate Peach Dittos)

Me too.