"The Aura is Mine!" Lucario Social Thread! (With More Moderators!)

[RT]

Keep in mind, DI was non-existent/incorrect before the patch. This probably isn't a huge impact, but it probably had a small impact.

Alternatively, stages just seem bigger on Wii U overall.

 

[The Goldenbrawler]

Defintely Greninja. Mainly due to popularity, I suppose. But dang, is he good! I tried him out because of the previous Conquest, and I appreciated is playstyle. You can call me crazy, but he feels a little bit like... Melee. That's how I feel. But if you have the potential to master Greninja, he'll be a beast. Also, falling N-air combos are really good, and you can even follow-up with a fully charged Water Shuriken. Like Fully Charged WS -> Up-Smash for 31%. For a SSB4 character, its like the possibilities are almost limitless. So yeah, Greninja is good. Lucario's a bit more defensive and slower, but still has a plethora of combos.
I fight scrubby Greninjas extremely often. Its a bit rare for me to fight an actually good player. Either I get scrubs, or people who just make no sense. :/

I probably should've clarified, as I haven't seen either online at all (besides Yoshiller, who mains Lucario, but at the same time I've only seen him on YouTube) and was wondering about how many skilled Greninja mains are out there. I know there are some, I just don't know for certain who I should go with, and one small detail I like is having a main that's underused (at least at a competitive level). Also figured I'd mention, I've posted on both here and the Greninja boards, that way I can get fresh perspectives on both characters.

 

[Sparky15]

OK, now that I finally remember: in SSB4, does vertical knockback depend on fast falling speed or weight? I swear, everytime I launch a heavyweight character (Bowser, DK, King Dedede) in the air, they live up to 200%. I'm REALLY confused, because I could've sworn that in Melee and PM, vertical knockback was dependant on fast falling speed. But SSB4, absolutely no clue!

 

[RT]

So, I did some quick testing and yes, Aura is still affected by stocks. Fully charged AS at 190% no stock deficit did 30% with freshness bonus. When done with two stock deficit at 190%, it did 32% with freshness bonus. When done with two stock advantage, it did 27% with freshness bonus.

So there you go, Aura is still affected by stocks both ways. With no numbers to compare with pre-patch, hard to say if it was nerfed. I can only assume knockback is affected as well, but again with no numbers...

Anubis is alive and well.

 

[Kami~]

So, I did some quick testing and yes, Aura is still affected by stocks. Fully charged AS at 190% no stock deficit did 30% with freshness bonus. When done with two stock deficit at 190%, it did 32% with freshness bonus. When done with two stock advantage, it did 27% with freshness bonus.

So there you go, Aura is still affected by stocks both ways. With no numbers to compare with pre-patch, hard to say if it was nerfed. I can only assume knockback is affected as well, but again with no numbers...

Anubis is alive and well.

Thanks for testing. I still know it's nothing like the 3ds but my word means nothing without proof of course.

 

[RT]

Yeah, I'm sure someone will eventually do the whole breakdown with damage/knockback with Aura. I won't because I'm lazy.

 

[|RK|]

So, I did some quick testing and yes, Aura is still affected by stocks. Fully charged AS at 190% no stock deficit did 30% with freshness bonus. When done with two stock deficit at 190%, it did 32% with freshness bonus. When done with two stock advantage, it did 27% with freshness bonus.

So there you go, Aura is still affected by stocks both ways. With no numbers to compare with pre-patch, hard to say if it was nerfed. I can only assume knockback is affected as well, but again with no numbers...

Anubis is alive and well.

So that's what that cryptic tip meant!

It's weird that many of us didn't notice, but I suppose it is a relatively small effect. I guess we're both stronger and weaker than we thought.

Played a Falco on FG earlier. ****ed up and got gimped by lasers alone + not recovering correctly. He taunts, and he's at 0%. So, I go in. He keeps hitting his reflector, trying to kill me with my AS. Nothing doing - I play a little bit more carefully around reflectors. I end up taking his first stock, then building damage in the second. Around 140% for me and 67% for him, he uses his shield a little too much. I let go of the AS and his shield snaps.

Hilarious.

 

[Karnu]

That amiboo peach has no respect haha

 

[Braxton2011]

Fwuark anyone with a Reflector or Absorber.
Fwuark short characters.
Why is it so hard to hit with Nair and Dair?
One day I'll git gud.

Anyway how's everyone doing?

 

[WolfieXVII ❂]

Fuuuck anyone with a Reflector or Absorber.
Fuuuck short characters.
Why is it so hard to hit with Nair and Dair?
One day I'll git gud.

Anyway how's everyone doing?

Censor dodge breh, quick change it

 

[Braxton2011]

We still on censors? Gross.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

So 4v4 with Lucario is silly.

 

[Kami~]

Fwuark anyone with a Reflector or Absorber.
Fwuark short characters.
Why is it so hard to hit with Nair and Dair?
One day I'll git gud.

Anyway how's everyone doing?

Nair is his only good aerial spacer now, it's hard to land at first but it's his only good neutral game aerial. It's deceptive but it has the most range if you do it directly horizontal and you can make it safe on shield. Dair should only be used for punishes that you know both hits will land, like people rolling behind you or something. Trash move now since you can even the land the first hit and be punished because the 2nd hit missed

 

[RT]

So 4v4 with Lucario is silly.

Pretty much. If you lose a stock...almost guaranteed max Aura next stock. If FF is off, ooooooooooh boy.

Nair is his only good aerial spacer now, it's hard to land at first but it's his only good neutral game aerial. It's deceptive but it has the most range if you do it directly horizontal and you can make it safe on shield. Dair should only be used for punishes that you know both hits will land, like people rolling behind you or something. Trash move now since you can even the land the first hit and be punished because the 2nd hit missed

Nair is probably Lucario's best overall aerial because it lingers and has good coverage. And agree for dair, it's only good for reading spotdodges or punishing whiffs.

 

[Kami~]

Pretty much. If you lose a stock...almost guaranteed max Aura next stock. If FF is off, ooooooooooh boy.

Nair is probably Lucario's best overall aerial because it lingers and has good coverage. And agree for dair, it's only good for reading spotdodges or punishing whiffs.

Yeah it's the best overall for him but it doesn't linger. There's a quick hitbox in the front and then it disappears immediately. Then about a half second/second later there's a weaker hitbox behind you. It's really just 2 immediate hits that don't linger at all. It has the same effects as robin or marths nair honestly.

 

[RT]

Right, thanks for the correction. That is what I meant, derp.

 

[Kami~]

lol oh. I wish it did linger though, having to change your timing for fast fall nairing smaller chars is extremely annoying.

 

[RT]

I have been trying to use more nair lately, especially when coming from the ledge or when chasing someone in the air. It's a good aerial because of how the hitboxes come out and the range on the initial hitbox is kind of deceptive. Could use more killpower, but uh...Lucario has enough of that already with uair and bair.

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

lol oh. I wish it did linger though, having to change your timing for fast fall nairing smaller chars is extremely annoying.

It's even more annoying with timing BAir on shorties.

I think I have an idea that anyone could do to test for frame and hitstun data with at most a few frames margin of error.

Three controllers, Vs. mode, one character must be Marth/Lucina, one must be Lucario, and the character you want to test. Aura Sphere charge damage then Dolphin Slash out of hitstun and save replay then do math to figure out how long it took on the timer.

I may try this.

 

[Rysir]

Man, landing a back air on an Olimar who is on the ground makes me feel like a champion. Why is this not part of the challenge section? It should be.

 

[RT]

Watching amiibos you've trained is weird.

 

[Karnu]

So 4v4 with Lucario is silly.

I need to see this

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I need to see this

Sorry not uploaded when we won this when I played Lucario, but it was dumb when my aura got ridiculous.

 

[Karnu]

Sorry not uploaded when we won this when I played Lucario, but it was dumb when my aura got ridiculous.

Awww, bugger. Oh well

 

[Steam]

won two tourneys this week, one on tuesday and one on thursday. :T

http://challonge.com/smashbros4wiiiuu

 

[Karnu]

OH YEAH, GO STEAM

 

[Browny]

all lucario steam? I hope theres some vids

Also, I like how Denver, a city twice as small as my city, gets more entrants on a weekday tourney than our once-a-year major does

sigh aus is so goddam backwards, its up to me to fix it.

 

[Steam]

all lucario steam? I hope theres some vids

Also, I like how Denver, a city twice as small as my city, gets more entrants on a weekday tourney than our once-a-year major does

sigh aus is so goddam backwards, its up to me to fix it.

that tourney was actually in a much smaller city and was completely free so I used lucina for most of the tournament til GFs. the one on tuesday I was luc for. Also today there was a huge smash 4 tourney in denver I couldn't go to bc I'm out of town. http://challonge.com/SBWiiU

 

[Browny]

Hmm that bracket you linked for the tourney you won

44 sets were 2-0 or 3-0
8 were 2-1 or 3-1

Thats a bit odd dont you think? Was there like a big skill disparity between regulars are casuals there? I've never seen anything like that.

 

[Steam]

Hmm that bracket you linked for the tourney you won

44 sets were 2-0 or 3-0
8 were 2-1 or 3-1

Thats a bit odd dont you think? Was there like a big skill disparity between regulars are casuals there? I've never seen anything like that.

well it's early in the scene. Also people don't always record set wins in the bracket like that.

 

[Karnu]

all lucario steam? I hope theres some vids

Also, I like how Denver, a city twice as small as my city, gets more entrants on a weekday tourney than our once-a-year major does

sigh aus is so goddam backwards, its up to me to fix it.

South Australia though

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

that tourney was actually in a much smaller city and was completely free so I used lucina for most of the tournament til GFs. the one on tuesday I was luc for. Also today there was a huge smash 4 tourney in denver I couldn't go to bc I'm out of town. http://challonge.com/SBWiiU

So you use Luke and Lucy too, huh?

Does your state still think Lucario is the best character in the game?

If you want I'd like to practice Weefees with you to see how far you've come since Brawl.

Kami is the best Lucario I've played since Smash 4 came out. I'm curious how good you are now, Steamy.

 

[Jay-kun]

Pretty much. If you lose a stock...almost guaranteed max Aura next stock. If FF is off, ooooooooooh boy.

Nair is probably Lucario's best overall aerial because it lingers and has good coverage. And agree for dair, it's only good for reading spotdodges or punishing whiffs.

Eh? Dair is good for hard reads on moves like monkey flip, raptor boost, you know..

 

[Steam]

So you use Luke and Lucy too, huh?

Does your state still think Lucario is the best character in the game?

If you want I'd like to practice Weefees with you to see how far you've come since Brawl.

Kami is the best Lucario I've played since Smash 4 came out. I'm curious how good you are now, Steamy.

I'd love to once I have my wiiU again, but I'm currently out of town for the holidays and can't play.

 

[Kami~]

RT, how did you test stock aura that one time you told me it increased with lower stocks? No matter how many stocks im down all my moves do the same % as they did when I was on even stocks with the cpu.

 

[Space thing]

@ Kami~

Are you testing it on the Wii U or 3ds version? I personally couldn't find any change on the 3ds, but I found a clear difference on the wii u one immediately (SD'ing twice and then shooting a fully charged aura sphere did 13% instead of the usual 11% and when the opponent SD'd twice it did 10%).

 

[RT]

RT, how did you test stock aura that one time you told me it increased with lower stocks? No matter how many stocks im down all my moves do the same % as they did when I was on even stocks with the cpu.

Go to VS mode

Got Lucario to 180%, fire a fully charged AS, it did 30%.

Killed Lucario three times (I know it's two stocks max but just in case), made sure to use 10 other attacks just in case to remove any sort of last used buffer (I know it resets, but just for the sake of testing I did it anyways)

Got Lucario to behind two stocks and 180% again, fire a fully charged AS, it did 32%.

Got Lucario to ahead two stocks and 180%, fire a fully charged AS, it did 27%

So yeah, unless it's different in the 3DS version, that is what is happening for me.

For reference, Mega Lucario does 32% with a fully charged AS at equal stocks. This matches up with the whole always at max Aura claim about his Final Smash, but I didn't test for stock differences.

You would need two 3DS to perfectly replicate I guess, unless you are not taking the stale move/bonus damage effect...or the 3DS is different.

 

[Kami~]

Go to VS mode

Got Lucario to 180%, fire a fully charged AS, it did 30%.

Killed Lucario three times (I know it's two stocks max but just in case), made sure to use 10 other attacks just in case to remove any sort of last used buffer (I know it resets, but just for the sake of testing I did it anyways)

Got Lucario to behind two stocks and 180% again, fire a fully charged AS, it did 32%.

Got Lucario to ahead two stocks and 180%, fire a fully charged AS, it did 27%

So yeah, unless it's different in the 3DS version, that is what is happening for me.

For reference, Mega Lucario does 32% with a fully charged AS at equal stocks. This matches up with the whole always at max Aura claim about his Final Smash, but I didn't test for stock differences.

You would need two 3DS to perfectly replicate I guess, unless you are not taking the stale move/bonus damage effect...or the 3DS is different.

I don't use 3ds.

Went to Versus. Picked 200% since 180 isnt an option. Fully charged AS does 30% on even stocks. I sd twice so i'm down to one stock while the cpu has 3. Fully charge AS does 30% again.

CPU is ganon. I did other tests and they show absolutely no sign of stock aura. Also I think it takes more than 10 moves to get around the staling, It seems to last so long, could've confused you. Someone else should do this and tell me what they find

I just also killed the cpu twice. Then shot aura sphere and still 30..lol.

 

[Jaxas]

Also I think it takes more than 10 moves to get around the staling, It seems to last so long, could've confused you. Someone else should do this and tell me what they find

Not sure if it'll help, but...
My old (unfinished...) thread on Stale Move Negation

 

[RT]

I don't know what to tell you, unless you don't gain Aura from stocks vs CPU or I did something incredibly wrong and stupid. I can upload a vid if you want, but I suspect it has something to do with CPUs...which is weird if true.

But not as weird as seeing the Rival trophy getting killed round 1 in Classic mode by another random CPU.

Nothing about this game is consistent, I swear.

EDIT: Wait, you're using Handicaps? I am doing it by hand manually in vanilla VS to simulate real world situation. I wonder if Handicaps affect Aura? What is going on...?