The Art of Patience; What I Can Do To Improve

[Katzwinkel]

Please forgive me if there's another popular topic in which this is discussed or if this doesn't warrant its own topic, but I feel like it's important to talk about and I could use some help.

I'm a Sm4sh player who's been dabbling in competitive ever since the end of Brawl's life cycle. I would like to say that I have a pretty good handle on how to play the game, but now I'm not so sure. I have matches where I can play competently, but a vast majority of the time, I lose. And if you were to ask me why I lost, I couldn't honestly tell you before now, but I realize what it is; I'm impatient.

I make a lot of hasty decisions. I press too many buttons. I live vicariously in this mindset of, "I've seen this in a video, this is how this character should be played" and try to implement it into my play style, only to find it didn't work. And because of that, I get frustrated. In a set of three, I'll do well enough the first match (though most of my kills are lucky or done through hard reads), but come the next two matches, I get downloaded immediately and the opponent will run through me. For a good example of this, here's a set of three that I played with a MGAW player on For Glory to show what I mean:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0Cu7sHoZxg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_zoxFCMpmw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffnfwfxdleU

I realize For Glory isn't always the best way to practice, and I've made more of an effort to add people from my local scene and fight them one on one, but I'm still not playing as well as I could be.

In an attempt to figure out what I'm doing wrong, I always, ALWAYS save replays of every match I do, and watch them over again. Sometimes, I even upload them to show my friends who also play competitive Sm4sh so that I can get feedback from them on how to improve. Through this, and playing with them, I've realized that I have quite a few bad habits. Attacking someone's shield, not waiting for openings, rolling into obvious attacks or rolling back to get away, only to be punished by someone reading the roll and either grabbing or dash attacking me. I KNOW what it is I'm doing wrong. It's my fundamentals that suck.

And yet, I still can't wrap my head around how it is I'm supposed to improve. I'm too impatient with the fact that I've put in all this work and not much has come out of it, and while the remedy may come from practicing more or just "gitting gud", there's something in my mentality that needs to change, and I can't for the life of me figure it out on my own.

So I have to ask; what can I do to improve my patience? What do I need to be able to tell myself in order to overcome this road block? Of course there isn't going to be this "snake oil" cure that will make me miraculously better at the game, but I could use some guidance.

EDIT: Something of a PS that I think should be noted; I don't really have a main right now, but Mario is the character that I feel I perform the best with. I have a lot of characters that I know I like to use, but I have a hard time focusing on one and getting good enough with them before getting bored and moving on to someone else. I feel like that's detrimental to my growth as well. The great thing about Smash (or Sm4sh, at least) is that skills through characters are almost always transferable, but I feel as though sitting down with one character I'm comfortable with and playing them exclusively, learning the match ups and so on, will help my fundamentals. But that's just the way I see it. I'm begging for someone to correct me if I'm wrong, because I can't help but feel I am.

 

[Jaxas]

Please forgive me if there's another popular topic in which this is discussed or if this doesn't warrant its own topic, but I feel like it's important to talk about and I could use some help.

I'm a Sm4sh player who's been dabbling in competitive ever since the end of Brawl's life cycle. I would like to say that I have a pretty good handle on how to play the game, but now I'm not so sure. I have matches where I can play competently, but a vast majority of the time, I lose. And if you were to ask me why I lost, I couldn't honestly tell you before now, but I realize what it is; I'm impatient.

I make a lot of hasty decisions. I press too many buttons. I live vicariously in this mindset of, "I've seen this in a video, this is how this character should be played" and try to implement it into my play style, only to find it didn't work. And because of that, I get frustrated. In a set of three, I'll do well enough the first match (though most of my kills are lucky or done through hard reads), but come the next two matches, I get downloaded immediately and the opponent will run through me. For a good example of this, here's a set of three that I played with a MGAW player on For Glory to show what I mean:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0Cu7sHoZxg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_zoxFCMpmw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffnfwfxdleU

I realize For Glory isn't always the best way to practice, and I've made more of an effort to add people from my local scene and fight them one on one, but I'm still not playing as well as I could be.

In an attempt to figure out what I'm doing wrong, I always, ALWAYS save replays of every match I do, and watch them over again. Sometimes, I even upload them to show my friends who also play competitive Sm4sh so that I can get feedback from them on how to improve. Through this, and playing with them, I've realized that I have quite a few bad habits. Attacking someone's shield, not waiting for openings, rolling into obvious attacks or rolling back to get away, only to be punished by someone reading the roll and either grabbing or dash attacking me. I KNOW what it is I'm doing wrong. It's my fundamentals that suck.

And yet, I still can't wrap my head around how it is I'm supposed to improve. I'm too impatient with the fact that I've put in all this work and not much has come out of it, and while the remedy may come from practicing more or just "gitting gud", there's something in my mentality that needs to change, and I can't for the life of me figure it out on my own.

So I have to ask; what can I do to improve my patience? What do I need to be able to tell myself in order to overcome this road block? Of course there isn't going to be this "snake oil" cure that will make me miraculously better at the game, but I could use some guidance.

EDIT: Something of a PS that I think should be noted; I don't really have a main right now, but Mario is the character that I feel I perform the best with. I have a lot of characters that I know I like to use, but I have a hard time focusing on one and getting good enough with them before getting bored and moving on to someone else. I feel like that's detrimental to my growth as well. The great thing about Smash (or Sm4sh, at least) is that skills through characters are almost always transferable, but I feel as though sitting down with one character I'm comfortable with and playing them exclusively, learning the match ups and so on, will help my fundamentals. But that's just the way I see it. I'm begging for someone to correct me if I'm wrong, because I can't help but feel I am.

What's helped me be more patient in different matches is to remember Isai's quote of "Don't get hit". (It's also short enough that you can kind of repeat it in your head throughout a match to keep you focused)

Basically, there are 2 'core' things you need to do to win a match:
1) Remove all your opponents stocks and
2) Prevent your opponent from removing your stocks

Most players will go into a match focusing on #1 and thinking "okay, how do I hit them so I can <insert combo>?", while you should really be thinking "okay, how do I avoid being hit until the opponent screws up and lets me punish them?".

Now obviously you need to hit your opponent at some point, but basically you should have "Don't get hit" as a higher priority than "Hit your opponent" (especially while practicing). While you're focusing on avoiding damage, it lets you see situations in a different light and eventually get an even better grasp on what's punishable and isn't, letting you then safely go in and blow your opponent up.


Hope this (makes sense and) helps!

 

[1FC0]

Play R.O.B. and start camping a lot. R.O.B. is good at chip damage so it may teach you to be patient until the damage racks up enough for a kill which takes ages since the Big Nerf in 1.0.6.

 

[Katzwinkel]

@ Jaxas Yeah, that sounds like a solid strategy. All I'd need to do while thinking that is keep an eye out for openings, watch for their habits, etc, while resisting the urge to stay absolutely still unless necessary.

@ 1FC0 I'm not exactly sure how I feel about that advice. I'm sorry if this comes off as condescending at all, but I feel like playing a character like that will make me rely on some sort of spammable move that will make me predictable and send me into panic mode when things don't work out. From what I've seen and read, Ganondorf and Marth are the two best characters to learn the patience game with. Ganon doesn't have a lot of spammable moves like the other heavies do (DDD's Gordo, for example) and he relies on good spacing and hard reads to get damage and kills. Marth, too, relies on good spacing, and luring the opponents into traps. R.O.B.'s projectile game could force the opponent to be impatient and make them advance, which I totally understand, so maybe I'll give it a shot.

 

[33percentgod]

I have a similar problem as you. Sometimes I just run in balls to the wall. I wouldn't same I'm as impatient as I am a player who likes to press offense and keep pressure. I can't stand playing against people who just short hop on the opposite side of the stage. It's like watching an MMA match where people just toss out light jabs and grapple on the ground for a half hour.

It's a fighting game, I came to FIGHT.

 

[Nobie]

I have a similar problem as you. Sometimes I just run in balls to the wall. I wouldn't same I'm as impatient as I am a player who likes to press offense and keep pressure. I can't stand playing against people who just short hop on the opposite side of the stage. It's like watching an MMA match where people just toss out light jabs and grapple on the ground for a half hour.

It's a fighting game, I came to FIGHT.

It turns out, though, what you describe as "not fighting" is actually what fighting looks like.

 

[1FC0]

I have a similar problem as you. Sometimes I just run in balls to the wall. I wouldn't same I'm as impatient as I am a player who likes to press offense and keep pressure. I can't stand playing against people who just short hop on the opposite side of the stage. It's like watching an MMA match where people just toss out light jabs and grapple on the ground for a half hour.

It's a fighting game, I came to FIGHT.

How can they SH at the other end of the stage if you like to keep pressure? Sounds to me like your problem is that you are very bad at keeping pressure.

 

[Tito Maas]

How can they SH at the other end of the stage if you like to keep pressure? Sounds to me like your problem is that you are very bad at keeping pressure.

lol sneak diss

 

[Wintropy]

I am in the same situation as your good self, friend, so just know that you're not alone. We're in this together, you and I~ ;3

With that in mind, the following tips have helped me improve my game, maybe they will work for you too:

- Focus on your opponent's character rather than your own character. You should know what you're doing when you do it, so what you really need to keep an eye on is the other guy: how does he move? How does he approach? What moves does he use to pressure you? How does he react to pressure? Study this and get a feel for how people play. When you can read your opponent and know what they will do next, you will be prepared to react in the optimal fashion.

- Consider the macro scheme of the match. It's very easy, perhaps even comforting, to just take things as it comes, to just focus on what your next move is going to be. That will work up to a point, but you will only get so far with that methodology. When faced with an opponent who knows how to read you and will react to your every move, you need to consider the big picture. Before you commit to a move, consider how it will affect you: is it going to connect? Where will the opponent be if they're hit; will their percent and / or your rage affect the trajectory and distance? If it misses, what's your contingency plan? How can you followup or capitalise on your opponent's disadvantage? This is quite difficult to do at first, since you do need to discern the best way to crawl before you can commit to walking, but when you get the hang of it, you can keep the momentum going instead of just panicking and whiffing your next move. Remember: neutral, advantage, disadvantage!

- Know the character's matchups. This can be as simple as studying the theory behind the matchup, or as in-depth as contacting a friend and engaging in regular training sessions to practice with different characters. Even if you don't have a singular main, you know who works for you, so get in there and do your homework! Discern which character you have the most difficult with and go to that character's board to discuss the matchup, watch top-level players fight that character, get a friend to play that character in your training sessions, understand how that characters works inside and out. Know which of your moves can beat out that character's moves and which work best in the different states of the game. I find that playing as another character, even just in training mode, can help determine how that characters works, what their strengths are and what weaknesses you can exploit. I don't think there's such a thing as an unwinnable matchup, but sometimes you can become flustered and panic if you fight a character you don't know or you have difficulty with. Understanding how that character works and how best to fight them can improve your confidence and thereby help you play with patience and distinction.

- Most importantly, treat every defeat as a means to get better. If your personality is similar to mine, then you're the kind of person who gets discouraged and frustrated when they find themselves outplayed, especially when you know you can do better and didn't play to the best of your strength. Instead, focus on why you lost instead of the fact that you did. If you lost, it's because you were outplayed, you made a mistake, or very often, a combination of both. Discover what you did wrong and what you can improve on, then work to make it better. Even when you win, focus on what worked and what didn't, then refine and polish your technique until you can play with confidence!

It's a very difficult road and it will take time and patience to get there, but I know it's absolutely feasible if you commit to it. Practice whenever possible, go to training mode and do lab work with your characters, play with friends, and most importantly, never get discouraged: just keep at it, you will improve every match if you just find the right frame of mind and decide you will get better!

 

[Katzwinkel]

I am in the same situation as your good self, friend, so just know that you're not alone. We're in this together, you and I~ ;3

With that in mind, the following tips have helped me improve my game, maybe they will work for you too:

- Focus on your opponent's character rather than your own character. You should know what you're doing when you do it, so what you really need to keep an eye on is the other guy: how does he move? How does he approach? What moves does he use to pressure you? How does he react to pressure? Study this and get a feel for how people play. When you can read your opponent and know what they will do next, you will be prepared to react in the optimal fashion.

- Consider the macro scheme of the match. It's very easy, perhaps even comforting, to just take things as it comes, to just focus on what your next move is going to be. That will work up to a point, but you will only get so far with that methodology. When faced with an opponent who knows how to read you and will react to your every move, you need to consider the big picture. Before you commit to a move, consider how it will affect you: is it going to connect? Where will the opponent be if they're hit; will their percent and / or your rage affect the trajectory and distance? If it misses, what's your contingency plan? How can you followup or capitalise on your opponent's disadvantage? This is quite difficult to do at first, since you do need to discern the best way to crawl before you can commit to walking, but when you get the hang of it, you can keep the momentum going instead of just panicking and whiffing your next move. Remember: neutral, advantage, disadvantage!

- Know the character's matchups. This can be as simple as studying the theory behind the matchup, or as in-depth as contacting a friend and engaging in regular training sessions to practice with different characters. Even if you don't have a singular main, you know who works for you, so get in there and do your homework! Discern which character you have the most difficult with and go to that character's board to discuss the matchup, watch top-level players fight that character, get a friend to play that character in your training sessions, understand how that characters works inside and out. Know which of your moves can beat out that character's moves and which work best in the different states of the game. I find that playing as another character, even just in training mode, can help determine how that characters works, what their strengths are and what weaknesses you can exploit. I don't think there's such a thing as an unwinnable matchup, but sometimes you can become flustered and panic if you fight a character you don't know or you have difficulty with. Understanding how that character works and how best to fight them can improve your confidence and thereby help you play with patience and distinction.

- Most importantly, treat every defeat as a means to get better. If your personality is similar to mine, then you're the kind of person who gets discouraged and frustrated when they find themselves outplayed, especially when you know you can do better and didn't play to the best of your strength. Instead, focus on why you lost instead of the fact that you did. If you lost, it's because you were outplayed, you made a mistake, or very often, a combination of both. Discover what you did wrong and what you can improve on, then work to make it better. Even when you win, focus on what worked and what didn't, then refine and polish your technique until you can play with confidence!

It's a very difficult road and it will take time and patience to get there, but I know it's absolutely feasible if you commit to it. Practice whenever possible, go to training mode and do lab work with your characters, play with friends, and most importantly, never get discouraged: just keep at it, you will improve every match if you just find the right frame of mind and decide you will get better!

Thanks so much for this. It means a lot to know someone else can empathize with me on this.

- I DO tend to focus a lot on my character so I can get a good idea of their placement and where moves will be when I throww them out, keeping the opponent in my peripheral while I chip away at him with my normals and specials. That doesn't always work for me, though, because I often get blindsided when an enemy runs me down, and my mind goes immediately to, "oh my god, where did THAT come from?! TIME TO PANIC"

- I think one of my biggest weaknesses as a player is that I get highly paranoid and anticipate things to happen all too often, and it makes me jumpy, so I press a lot of buttons, which the opponent can then end up shielding/evading and punishing me for it. I just hopped on For Glory with Marth, and I can't tell you how many F-Smashes I whiffed in an effort to "space out the opponent" or as a "read". In reality, it only staled the move, and made me predictable and punishable.

- Yeeeah, I think I'd benefit a lot from focusing on one, two, maybe even three characters at the moment. Like I said before, Mario is probably the character I perform the best with, but I fall to bad habits all too often. The other characters I'm considering using are Pit and Marth. Pit, because I have fun with him and he's very beginner friendly; and Marth, while tougher, teaches me proper spacing and how to trap opponents, and rewards playing patiently. (Lucina is a bit more beginner friendly, but idk if she really runs on the patient waiting game all that much...)

- This is something I struggle with a lot. I wish there were a way to pause, rewind, and edit recordings of Smash so you can see just what it is you did wrong and when. That's why I'm thankful that you can upload matches to Youtube. It makes it a lot easier to slow things down and see where you need to improve, and it's also easier to show recordings to friends so they can spot things you haven't.

Again, thanks for leaving such a well thought out response. Maybe we should play sometime and try to practice our patience.

 

[smokebomb12]

my main requires patients or else he gets rekt. Some characters require more and less patience then others.

 

[Wintropy]

Thanks so much for this. It means a lot to know someone else can empathize with me on this.

No problem! I feel the same way, heh~ ;3

- I DO tend to focus a lot on my character so I can get a good idea of their placement and where moves will be when I throww them out, keeping the opponent in my peripheral while I chip away at him with my normals and specials. That doesn't always work for me, though, because I often get blindsided when an enemy runs me down, and my mind goes immediately to, "oh my god, where did THAT come from?! TIME TO PANIC"

Yeah, it can be tricky to shift your focus at first, but trust me, it will become second nature very quickly. When you understand a character in greater depth, you can tell on instinct where their moves will come out. The trick, then, is to focus so much on your opponent that you can do the same for their moves. Start off with basic reads (shield on reaction, punish a whiffed move, etc) and work your way up to more technical stuff in due time.

- I think one of my biggest weaknesses as a player is that I get highly paranoid and anticipate things to happen all too often, and it makes me jumpy, so I press a lot of buttons, which the opponent can then end up shielding/evading and punishing me for it. I just hopped on For Glory with Marth, and I can't tell you how many F-Smashes I whiffed in an effort to "space out the opponent" or as a "read". In reality, it only staled the move, and made me predictable and punishable.

I do the same thing. A very good Robin player that I am friends with told me that he punished most of my options when I got close because "I panicked and just hit buttons". He's absolutely right. A good opponent will sense that frustration and get easy punishes from it. What helped me here is to remember that you have other options besides whichever option you feel most comfortable with: instead of f-smash, try to use f-tilt or d-tilt instead, or even n-air or f-air if you feel confident! When you can comfortably mix up your tactics and keep the opponent guessing, you can space more efficiently and play to whatever tempo makes you most comfortable.

- Yeeeah, I think I'd benefit a lot from focusing on one, two, maybe even three characters at the moment. Like I said before, Mario is probably the character I perform the best with, but I fall to bad habits all too often. The other characters I'm considering using are Pit and Marth. Pit, because I have fun with him and he's very beginner friendly; and Marth, while tougher, teaches me proper spacing and how to trap opponents, and rewards playing patiently. (Lucina is a bit more beginner friendly, but idk if she really runs on the patient waiting game all that much...)

I'd definitely suggest you focus on one or two characters for now, at least 'til you feel confident in your fundamentals. I think Pit is the best character to get to grips with fundamentals, because his moves have such diverse applications and you can play on reaction when you figure out his options. That said, it can be beneficial to experiment with other characters when you feel comfortable in your skill, especially if that character teaches you how to focus on different playstyles (Ganondorf teaches you to read and punish, Villager teaches you how to work with and beat projectiles, etc).

- This is something I struggle with a lot. I wish there were a way to pause, rewind, and edit recordings of Smash so you can see just what it is you did wrong and when. That's why I'm thankful that you can upload matches to Youtube. It makes it a lot easier to slow things down and see where you need to improve, and it's also easier to show recordings to friends so they can spot things you haven't.

Yup, study is good! If the option is available to you, share your replays with a friend or people on the character's board to get objective feedback. I know I benefit much more if somebody tells me what I need to improve on, because then I can pick up on details I'd otherwise miss. You seem open to constructive criticism, which is definitely a good thing if you want to improve!

Again, thanks for leaving such a well thought out response. Maybe we should play sometime and try to practice our patience.

I'd love that!

Best of luck, friend~

 

[outfoxd]

I have a similar problem as you. Sometimes I just run in balls to the wall. I wouldn't same I'm as impatient as I am a player who likes to press offense and keep pressure. I can't stand playing against people who just short hop on the opposite side of the stage. It's like watching an MMA match where people just toss out light jabs and grapple on the ground for a half hour.

It's a fighting game, I came to FIGHT.

As an mma fan that wishes more fights were grappling-centric, i don't feel a slower paced and countercentric game isn't fighting.

Hell, mayweather made a boxing empire out of defensive and elusiveness. Partially by wrestling at every opportunity.

 

[V4n1sh]

Instead of focusing on 1 character, focus on yours and your opponent.This may seem a bit tricky at the start (especially in doubles), but you will get a catch of both yours and their habits.This can also help you what recovery option to use, etc.Also, aggression doesn't mean go in and mash buttons. Nairo for example plays crazy aggressive, but still keeps note on followups, options,punishes,optimal mixups, etc. Mindless aggression and button pressing never works.Example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xr9tNugI-SI



As for getting jumpy, you should also pay attention to your opponent's options.A lot of options that you may get paranoid of might not even be in the opponents mind because it can be punished too hard, etc. Picking up other characters can also teach you things such as pressure, spacing, etc.