team tactics

[Technical_Knockout]

dedicated doubles thread... share & discuss your favorite team members, combinations, observations & strategies.

two of my favorite chess quotes apply:

"chess (smash 64) is 99% tactics."
"tactics flow from a superior position."

here's a few tips for dual weegies, my current team:

with luigi's floatiness it's possible to hit your partner's shield to strike them off the edge of a platform/stage (good for mobility & quick ledgehogs.)

clashing with your partner's attack is a way to push yourself off (meeting the second hit of his down-smash with the first hit of your own, for example.)

fireball & super-jump punch wake-ups/saves are very useful to minimize partner lag & rescue them from bad situations (like getting ktfo off of dreamland towards a side blast zone).

 

[Sangoku]

I grab you smash.

 

[Combo Blaze]

kirby grab into pika down b for instant kill

gg ************

 

[Shears]

I think top 4 teams characters are pika kirby luigi and samus. I think samus is the most underrated and underused teams character.

 

[Technical_Knockout]

i'd substitute mario for pika & then agree with the entirety of your post instead of just the majority of it...

 

[Tom Bombadil]

i'd substitute mario for pika & then agree with the entirety of your post instead of just the majority of it...

Wait you're saying you don't think Pika is a top 4 teams character?

 

[Technical_Knockout]

starting to think double kirby might be the best team... did you know you can copy a stolen power from your teammate? i think kirby, mario & luigi in some order for the top 3 team members... i think i'd rather have a good samus on my team than a pika, for higher endurance & power issues (important factors in doubles).

good team idea... you can turn your opponent around by hitting him in the back. using that principle you can throw a fireball at your partner while they're standing near the ledge & you'll knock them into a ledgehog.

 

[Sangoku]

Fox and Samus is a good team too.

Funny how two bottom tiers can become good with synergy.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

starting to think double kirby might be the best team... did you know you can copy a stolen power from your teammate? i think kirby, mario & luigi in some order for the top 3 team members... i think i'd rather have a good samus on my team than a pika, for higher endurance & power issues (important factors in doubles).

good team idea... you can turn your opponent around by hitting him in the back. using that principle you can throw a fireball at your partner while they're standing near the ledge & you'll knock them into a ledgehog.

I think you're overestimating how useful hitting your partner into ledgehog is, you talk about it all the time

I mean, I get that it would be really sick to pull off but come on man

Fox and Samus is a good team too.

Funny how two bottom tiers can become good with synergy.

lol

 

[LAS | Wookiee]

All I'm gonna say is, Wookiee and Han Solo form the best team ever. Han Duo. Also we are actually pretty good together. #getrekt

 

[Technical_Knockout]

hey tom either contribute & be positive or get the **** out of my thread.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

hey tom either contribute & be positive or get the **** out of my thread.

Whoa man, why have opinions if you aren't willing to defend them from a little attack?

I think Pikachu and Kirby are easily the best characters in doubles. Luigi and Samus shoot up considerably with respect to the singles tier list but that doesn't mean they can magically win against the top tiers if they get forced into the 1v1 1v1 scenario.

What I think is great about Luigi and Samus is that both of their uairs are solid ways to save teammates who can't recover. But that only really makes a difference if your partner doesn't have a great recovery, so maybe choosing them can enable more freedom for your second pick.

I think an interesting way to play doubles would be to say that only one copy of any character is allowed across both teams. Then characters are drafted to teams A and B in the following way:
- Team A selects a character
- Team B selects a character
- Team B selects a character
- Team A selects a character
This allows you to steal characters from your opponents but also counterpick either their character or their team dynamic with your own. It also rewards people who play multiple characters well which I think is a good thing

 

[sextc]

Jiggs singing glitch with pikachu quick attack to edge hog. Ask unreal all about the ledge he didn't catch @flaoc.xD @SilentShottt

 

[MasterSplinter]

My friends and I were playing double falcon teams. That's a lot of fun if you haven't tried it yet!

 

[Technical_Knockout]

dedicated doubles thread... share & discuss your favorite team members, combinations, observations & strategies.

this is my point... i invited you to my thread to collaborate, not to criticize me with both of your first 2 posts... but now that you're being cool & sharing your own opinions instead of bagging on mine, so far as i'm concerned we're good.

with that being said, my reason for saying anything in this thread is only to show that it's possible... my sharing examples of techniques has nothing to do with me placing undue importance on the ramifications of them. i think of this place more as a repository of ideas, or a tactical lexicon if you will. knowledge is power; the more scenarios we talk about, the faster the meta expands (similar to how a chess grandmaster draws upon a vast reservoir of past games & positions when considering a move.)

found out the other day that kirby's projectile acts like a shockwave that goes through characters... perhaps a good way to save your teammate from a 2-on-1? (don't judge me for not playing much teams & being unaware of that, people.)

additionally, since beginning-of-life invincibility also affects your teammate, any time you both die at the same time, the start of the next stock acts as a nasty combo power-play where you can gang up on one or both opponents without worrying about hitting your partner. could be a good reason to try to stay close to your buddy percentage-wise by taking turns on the front.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

Decided to edit my post, it was too long and ranty

I'll just say that I think Pika is easily a top tier doubles character, just not as dominant as he is in 1v1. The Kirby projectile disruption is an interesting idea. I think we're on the same page overall. I think we're friends

 

[MasterSplinter]

Hey Technical KO hit me up on chess.com sometime. I'm an 1800 USCF rated player and my tag is shoshonte (my rating on chess.com is really low because I usually play on lichess.org)

 

[Technical_Knockout]

I think we're on the same page overall. I think we're friends

here holmes watch this: it's the world record legend of zelda speedrun, the first time ever under 30 minutes... i invented the trick shown at 13:52 called sword-scrolling.
http://www.twitch.tv/lackattack24/c/6446237#/lackattack24/c/6446237

Hey Technical KO hit me up on chess.com sometime. I'm an 1800 USCF rated player and my tag is shoshonte (my rating on chess.com is really low because I usually play on lichess.org)

i'm high 1800's uscf, but i haven't played a rated game in years and my real over-the-board strength is probably over 2000; got a draw playing black vs. hikaru nakamura (current world #4 player) during his simultaneous exhibition at the las vegas us open in 2000... i'm the 2-time & current north olympic peninsula champ in washington state. my friend is the #2 player in my town, plays on chess.com as DavidRMerrikin & also plays smash 64. here's a game i won against a strong fics player (i'm ninjawarrior there.)
http://www.ficsgames.org/cgi-bin/show.cgi?ID=363996920

 

[MasterSplinter]

Cool TKO! I just started playing sophmore year of high-school and improve every tournament. I hope to become an expert in college! Congrats on drawing nakamura. I hope to play you someday if I every go out that way for a National Open some time or for MIllionaire Chess

 

[Shears]

Decided to edit my post, it was too long and ranty

I'll just say that I think Pika is easily a top tier doubles character, just not as dominant as he is in 1v1. The Kirby projectile disruption is an interesting idea. I think we're on the same page overall. I think we're friends

I have to disagree. I think pika is better in teams than in singles. Pika can have some difficult approaches (against fox and falcon and even kirby) and in singles his recovery is a risk free edgeguard. But in doubles, he can still edgeguard the same way and because there is a teammate that can help counter an opponents edgeguard, edgeguarding him isn't risk free. Pikas dash dancing and pivot grabs are really fast, and in doubles I think that grabs and quick dash dance is more important than in singles. In singles an opponent has time to read and bait and punish a dash dance, but you don't have that patience in doubles. Additionally, in singles, if you hit your opponent then you aren't really punished with your lag or landing, but in doubles, a pika can just run up and grab you now and take a stock. Pika has more setups for thunder kills in doubles than in singles. In singles, pika is overrated (this does not mean pika isn't the best) but in doubles I think he really is the best teammate. I would argue that double pika isn't the best team though. Just doesn't have enough ways to take short stocks like pika-kirby, pika-samus, pika-luigi.

 

[Technical_Knockout]

pika makes a stellar team member... since doubles is so tactical my personal preference is to favor the characters with: high endurance, quick meteor smashes (samus), good projectiles, spammable 'b' moves (the bros) & large hitboxes, nasty drill gimps (kirby)--but the rat's recovery, aerials, speed, grab range & power attacks (forward smash & thunder) are all awesome if you play him carefully.

just realized that kirby's down-tilt has such a large range that you can clip through your shielding partner to hit an opponent on the other side... also, as it's possible to tech the second hit of kirby's up + 'b', your partner can take the elevator up to the top of dreamland at the cost of a little damage.

since you can't be damaged at all for a couple seconds after a shield-break, it might be a good last resort to save your partner that's undergoing shield pressure by just finishing breaking his shield, taking care of the opponent, then waking your buddy up with a low-damage attack like a jab or drill.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

I think pika is better in teams than in singles...

I disagree with almost all of this.

In singles HIS recovery is a risk free edgeguard. But in doubles, he can still edgeguard the same way and because there is a teammate that can help counter an opponents edgeguard, edgeguarding him isn't risk free.

Replace the "HIS" with any other character and this is more true of them than of Pikachu

Pikas dash dancing and pivot grabs are really fast, and in doubles I think that grabs and quick dash dance is more important than in singles.

Fox, Falcon, and DK all have faster dash dancing and pivot grabs than pika yet none of them are top tier in teams (unless the player is a character specialist). Additionally, since Pika's dash speed isn't even that good in comparison, it feels like a weird thing to bring up. Pikachu in particular doesn't benefit from the doubles environment any more than other characters do.

Additionally, in singles, if you hit your opponent then you aren't really punished with your lag or landing, but in doubles, a pika can just run up and grab you now and take a stock.

Again, this isn't something unique to pikachu at all. In fact, he's not even that good at it when you compare it to Luigi Up-B or DK backthrow

Pika has more setups for thunder kills in doubles than in singles.

This is true but it also falls prey to the exact thing you said in the previous sentence above: a pikachu in teams has to worry about being punished for a down-B, in singles he doesn't.

In singles, pika is overrated .

Let's be honest, this is a pretty classic statement coming from a pika main. PIkachu literally has everything except tankiness. Best recovery in game, top tier grab, strong "get out of jail free" with Up-B, great combos against almost everyone, exceptional aerial hitboxes, good in air speed, tons of edgeguarding tools, good dash-grab game as you say. In singles, Pika's attributes are top tier, if not the best in almost every category. In doubles, many other characters don't suffer nearly as much from their weaknesses and are able to make it to being top tier picks.

In doubles I think he really is the best teammate. I would argue that double pika isn't the best team though. Just doesn't have enough ways to take short stocks like pika-kirby, pika-samus, pika-luigi.

This I agree with but I think it furthers the point that Pikachu isn't quite as good in doubles as he is in singles

here holmes watch this: it's the world record legend of zelda speedrun, the first time ever under 30 minutes... i invented the trick shown at 13:52 called sword-scrolling.
http://www.twitch.tv/lackattack24/c/6446237#/lackattack24/c/6446237

Nice man, that's sick. Unfortunately I never played this game so it's hard to really appreciate what's going on

 

[Shears]

I disagree with almost all of this.



Replace the "HIS" with any other character and this is more true of them than of Pikachu



Fox, Falcon, and DK all have faster dash dancing and pivot grabs than pika yet none of them are top tier in teams (unless the player is a character specialist). Additionally, since Pika's dash speed isn't even that good in comparison, it feels like a weird thing to bring up. Pikachu in particular doesn't benefit from the doubles environment any more than other characters do.



Again, this isn't something unique to pikachu at all. In fact, he's not even that good at it when you compare it to Luigi Up-B or DK backthrow



This is true but it also falls prey to the exact thing you said in the previous sentence above: a pikachu in teams has to worry about being punished for a down-B, in singles he doesn't.



Let's be honest, this is a pretty classic statement coming from a pika main. PIkachu literally has everything except tankiness. Best recovery in game, top tier grab, strong "get out of jail free" with Up-B, great combos against almost everyone, exceptional aerial hitboxes, good in air speed, tons of edgeguarding tools, good dash-grab game as you say. In singles, Pika's attributes are top tier, if not the best in almost every category. In doubles, many other characters don't suffer nearly as much from their weaknesses and are able to make it to being top tier picks.



This I agree with but I think it furthers the point that Pikachu isn't quite as good in doubles as he is in singles




Nice man, that's sick. Unfortunately I never played this game so it's hard to really appreciate what's going on

So many things wrong with this.

Pika and jiggly are the only characters whos upb doesn't do damage. Considering jiggly doesn't rely on her upb at all, pika is the only upb you can attempt an edgeguard on without risk of being punished or counter edgeguarded. If you are off on your timing against falcon, fox, mario, samus, dk, kirby, etc. they will hit you with their upb which can either kill you, or put you in a position to be counter edgeguarded. If you want, I will gladly go over scenarios how these characters turn a failed edgeguard into a stock in their favor. Pika is easy to edgeguard, if you think otherwise you haven't played enough pikas or you don't play as pika and aren't being aggressive enough in your edgeguard of him.

Pika has a faster dash dance than more than half the cast, making his dash dance more effective. Couple that with his quick grab and how his bthrow is one of the strongest, you do see how pika is more favorable in the dash dance grab game than fox and falcon. DK is the only one that beat him in this but as a top 2 in the category it makes him better in doubles. In singles he is not top 2 as falcon fthrow turns into a stock and DK still has a quicker dash dance and stronger bthrow, because falcon fthrow doesn't lead to stocks in doubles his dash dance grab game isn't as effective.

Because his bthrow is so strong it is valid because its one of the strongest "one hit" moves in the game with the quickest start up and ending lag. So although its not unique, this isn't about uniqueness its about what does the character excel in that is favorable for teams, its one of the best in this category.

I agree, but taking damage is worth taking an opponents stock. Its the same argument for jiggs downb which is still a favorable trade. Because the setup comes from the teammate its likely the teammate can defend the punish.

In singles pika has some tough matchups and can be counterpicked with falcon. But in doubles, those tough matchups are even easier since characters he has difficulty approaching, or matching up against, aren't good doubles characters and therefore separating him even more. Pika has weaknesses whether or not you want to admit it just because they aren't as heavy or apparent as other characters, but in teams those weaknesses are nullified and his only short coming is not having a spike or something to take a short stock without combo.

I think any best team needs a pika, which I would argue strengthens him. The reason I don't have pika-pika as the best is because pika-samus takes such quick stocks with samus dair and samus upb sets up traps for pika to punish DI out of and pika-luigi sets up for tons of upb kills. I just think that ability to take stocks even quicker with the same approach advantages and everything else pika offers is better. Adding a second pika doesn't add anything else to the team, but adding a samus or luigi does.

 

[Technical_Knockout]

nes loz is probably the best game ever made...

if you haven't watched the entire video, you're missing out on an absolutely epic speedrun.

i'd rank the top 6 doubles partners (in this order) as kirby, luigi, mario, samus, pika & yoshi... fox, falcon, dk & ness have potential but are just so easy to gimp in teams.

kirby for being a death-dealing borg juggernaut, the bros. for solid recovery, 0-frame crowd control & excellent projectiles, samus for tankiness, up + 'b', charge shot, tether grab, back throw, b-air & d-air.

 

[Shears]

nes loz is probably the best game ever made...

if you haven't watched the entire video, you're missing out on an absolutely epic speedrun.

i'd rank the top 6 doubles partners (in this order) as kirby, luigi, mario, samus, pika & yoshi... fox, falcon, dk & ness have potential but are just so easy to gimp in teams.

kirby for being a death-dealing borg juggernaut, the bros. for solid recovery, 0-frame crowd control & excellent projectiles, samus for tankiness, up + 'b', charge shot, tether grab, back throw, b-air & d-air.

I can support a lot of your last paragraph, but please define why pika isn't a top character. If this is a teams discussion then an explanation should be included. A team should have pika and a supplementary character like samus or luigi. Kirby can be substituted for either but not both.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

So many things wrong with this.

Pika and jiggly are the only characters whos upb doesn't do damage. Considering jiggly doesn't rely on her upb at all, pika is the only upb you can attempt an edgeguard on without risk of being punished or counter edgeguarded. If you are off on your timing against falcon, fox, mario, samus, dk, kirby, etc. they will hit you with their upb which can either kill you, or put you in a position to be counter edgeguarded.

Ah, I see what you mean by "risk-free" now. I will grant you that Pikachu will never directly kill you with upB. But you can certainly get put in a position to be counter edgeguarded if you go offstage and Pika gets around you with upB to edge or ledgecancel and now you're offstage and he can punish.

Pika is easy to edgeguard, if you think otherwise you haven't played enough pikas or you don't play as pika and aren't being aggressive enough in your edgeguard of him.
.

I've never seen a Pikachu get consistently wrecked offstage in the same way that a fox, falcon, DK, or ness does. So I think calling him "easy to edgeguard" is really pushing it.

In singles pika has some tough matchups and can be counterpicked with falcon.

"Counterpicked" into the only Pika matchup which is even

Because his bthrow is so strong it is valid because its one of the strongest "one hit" moves in the game with the quickest start up and ending lag. So although its not unique, this isn't about uniqueness its about what does the character excel in that is favorable for teams, its one of the best in this category.

In singles pika has some tough matchups and can be counterpicked with falcon. But in doubles, those tough matchups are even easier since characters he has difficulty approaching, or matching up against, aren't good doubles characters and therefore separating him even more. Pika has weaknesses whether or not you want to admit it just because they aren't as heavy or apparent as other characters, but in teams those weaknesses are nullified and his only short coming is not having a spike or something to take a short stock without combo.

I think that Pikachu is the best character in doubles, a lot of your arguments do a great job supporting this. But to be stronger in doubles than in singles he would have to benefit more from a doubles environment than other characters so that you increase the power gap. You make a good point that Falcon's dash grab game is not nearly as strong in doubles thus making Pika comparatively stronger. However, I would argue that lots of other characters benefit from the grab spam and lack of conventional spacing in doubles more than Pikachu does. Because of this, I feel that PIka's power gap above the other characters decreases slightly in doubles instead of increasing.

But honestly, I don't really care that much. Pika is still the top character in any situation. If you think he's better in doubles then that's an interesting perspective and I'll keep thinking about it

 

[Shears]

Ah, I see what you mean by "risk-free" now. I will grant you that Pikachu will never directly kill you with upB. But you can certainly get put in a position to be counter edgeguarded if you go offstage and Pika gets around you with upB to edge or ledgecancel and now you're offstage and he can punish.


I've never seen a Pikachu get consistently wrecked offstage in the same way that a fox, falcon, DK, or ness does. So I think calling him "easy to edgeguard" is really pushing it.



"Counterpicked" into the only Pika matchup which is even



I think that Pikachu is the best character in doubles, a lot of your arguments do a great job supporting this. But to be stronger in doubles than in singles he would have to benefit more from a doubles environment than other characters so that you increase the power gap. You make a good point that Falcon's dash grab game is not nearly as strong in doubles thus making Pika comparatively stronger. However, I would argue that lots of other characters benefit from the grab spam and lack of conventional spacing in doubles more than Pikachu does. Because of this, I feel that PIka's power gap above the other characters decreases slightly in doubles instead of increasing.

But honestly, I don't really care that much. Pika is still the top character in any situation. If you think he's better in doubles then that's an interesting perspective and I'll keep thinking about it

I can settle on that. I do think he is better in doubles than in singles but I understand if you think the other way. Food for thought, if the game was as popular or as developed as melee (I'm claiming this game is severely underdeveloped) could you imagine a top player winning a tournament without pika in singles but could you imagine a top team winning doubles without pika? For me, yes on the former no on the latter.

 

[Technical_Knockout]

my position on pika in teams is that he's a bit lightweight & his power moves (f-smash & down-b) too laggy for my liking... no hitbox on the up + 'b' & a bad projectile are also demerits. i think that kirby's entire moveset is more suited to a doubles environment & also more effective... being able to turn around in the air on command is also extremely useful within a fast-paced, hectic game.

i might be ok with switching pika & samus on my list, but really believe the top 3 spots should belong to kirby & the bros. (solid & balanced overall: top-tier recoveries, great projectiles, good edgeguards/gimps & their 0-frame crowd control is very nice for dealing with 2-on-1 scenarios)... i will say that pika's ability to get anywhere on the stage quickly is a huge asset, though.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

I can settle on that. I do think he is better in doubles than in singles but I understand if you think the other way. Food for thought, if the game was as popular or as developed as melee (I'm claiming this game is severely underdeveloped) could you imagine a top player winning a tournament without pika in singles but could you imagine a top team winning doubles without pika? For me, yes on the former no on the latter.

That's a very interesting question. And I think my gut is to agree with you which definitely goes against my thoughts that Pika is better in singles.

That being said, maybe the fact that smash is so underdeveloped (this I definitely agree on) is the reason we can imagine a non-Pikachu winning. Because whenever Isai loses the first thing everyone says is "well if he was playing Pikachu...". So maybe if it was more developed then you would have to at least play Pikachu as a secondary. Who knows.

Not that I'm complaining about this not currently being the ase though. That wave a year or so ago when every East coast tournament was 90% Pikachu was so ****ing boring. But that has more to do with dittos than Pikachu to be fair.

my position on pika in teams is that he's a bit lightweight & his power moves (f-smash & down-b) too laggy for my liking... no hitbox on the up + 'b' & a bad projectile are also demerits. i think that kirby's entire moveset is more suited to a doubles environment & also more effective... being able to turn around in the air on command is also extremely useful within a fast-paced, hectic game.

i might be ok with switching pika & samus on my list, but really believe the top 3 spots should belong to kirby & the bros. (solid & balanced overall: top-tier recoveries, great projectiles, good edgeguards/gimps & their 0-frame crowd control is very nice for dealing with 2-on-1 scenarios)... i will say that pika's ability to get anywhere on the stage quickly is a huge asset, though.

Air speed is really important though and Pikachu's is far better than Kirby's. Being able to actually move horizontally to punish your opponent is a strong attribute. Imagine if you're playing against a Kirby Luigi team and you accidentally rest on the other side of the map as Jiggly. Who cares, you won't get punished. Obviously there are more exciting examples like Ness healing from his partner or Kirby grabbing his Fox partner's laser. Against a faster team, stuff like this isn't realistic unless they die at the same time.

 

[Capos]

That being said, maybe the fact that smash is so underdeveloped (this I definitely agree on) is the reason we can imagine a non-Pikachu winning. Because whenever Isai loses the first thing everyone says is "well if he was playing Pikachu...". So maybe if it was more developed then you would have to at least play Pikachu as a secondary. Who knows.

I can't speak for anyone else, but anytime I've ever thought that, it's really meant, "pikachu, or kirby, or fox"

 

[BananaBolts]

I usually play Samus, Luigi, or Falcon in teams. Samus kills, offstage/onstage saves, and passes well. Luigi passes, kills, and saves well. Falcon passes, kills, and wins neutral well.

I feel like Luigi needs a partner that wins the neutral well because Luigi is offstage for long periods of time and he traverses the stage at mind-numbing speeds. Luigi passes and kills well enough as long as he's onstage. Good partners for him are Falcon, Pika, Kirby, and maybe Mario.

Samus needs a partner that racks up damage quickly. Her best passing game is done with the opponent at high percent so it's important for them to reach that percent quickly. For that reason, I think Falcon is her best partner. Falcon fits better with Samus' neutral play than Kirby or Pika, imo. Kirby racks up damage quickly too but something about his combo/passing game doesn't allow Samus the same variety needed to receive passes and send them back. Kirby often has to utilt and then nair or bair from almost the same area above himself whereas Falcon racks up damage from a throw + various aerials depending on position, leaving the trajectory in more dynamic flight paths. Pika is probably Samus' 2nd best partner. Pika's damage racking and passing fit fairly well with Samus.

Falcon is overall great but I think he lacks good offstage saves. His onstage presence in teams is great because he wins neutral easily, he saves teammates from combos quickly, and he passes well at all percents (although it's much harder at really high percents so he might as well just take an easy kill via bair or whatever). He's definitely the top 3 in teams, I think. His grab game alone makes him a big threat. Falcon needs to be paired with a character that either finishes really well or passes really well. A character that can save Falcon is great.

That's not an extensive list of good partners but that's my general impression of the three that I play. (I do think that DK and Link are the to worst teammates though)

It's hard to list single characters in tiers because every character has strengths and weaknesses that can be paired in ways that amplify those attributes in good and bad ways. I think that's why dittos aren't usually good as teammates.

 

[Kirbstomper]

Ask @syPHILys about how good my DK is in teams. He will likely disagree with you

 

[Shears]

Falcon is awful in teams. I will agree that dittos are a bad team tactic. Its like incest, you're keeping the same gene pool and all of its weaknesses meaning more of a chance for faults to be maximized and exposed.

 

[$$$ Jim $$$]

super surprised there's been barely a mention of yoshi. has a bunch of quick, powerful attacks to control stage (dsmash, usmash, dashattack) along with high survivability, even in teams. definitely in the top 6

 

[The Star King]

Pika is easy to edgeguard, if you think otherwise you haven't played enough pikas or you don't play as pika and aren't being aggressive enough in your edgeguard of him.

lol jesus

things only a pikachu main would say #PikaPrivelege

 

[Beesy]

I'm quite the fan of Mario and luigi for Dubs. Bowl uses luigi with me often.

Also, I'm a chess player. Chess.com is mrman2244 approx 1900 otb, been playing in city instead of traveling for tournaments so my uscf is lower. I'd enjoy getting some games with you guys. Also, you should hit up david wyde, he's an NM pk player from Austin.

Texas got that smash strength AND the chess strength. Maybe we could try doubles smash/bughouse sometime vs any other state at the next tourney?

 

[Technical_Knockout]

oh man i love bughouse--unfortunately, none of my chess-playing friends are into those variants, but crazyhouse & bughouse have just got to be the best ones... i liken them to being comparable to horrifying wars where you're capturing the opposition, brainwashing them & then forcing them to fight for your side.

they're also excellent methods of working on: tactics, strategy, king safety, speed-of-thought, teamwork(!) & creativity otb...

i also really like the bros. for a team... mario sets up luigi nicely for some easy death combos & they're just terrifying if it gets down to 2-on-1. their fireballs in particular work in tandem very well to lock the opponent up tight.

look up my good friend DavidRMerrikin on chess.com; he's quite a talented player & is very active with postal/speed... he's probably hovering around 2000 (i tend to win most of our games together but he's pretty solid overall) & he's legitimately one of the top players in my area, placing 2nd behind me during both of the last 2 north olympic peninsula opens in washington state.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-umlELe4tQ.../HLR5Xzh0qQ4/s320/2013-02-08_11-47-14_131.jpg

this is the epic game that i was playing in that pic, the pivotal one in the most recent championship that netted me first place (i was playing the top player from the next town over, a former montana state champ):

1.e4 c5 2.Nc3 e6 3.g3 d5 4.d3 d4 5.Ne2 e5 6.Bg2 Bd6 7.f4 f6 8.Nf3 Ne7 9.0-0 Nd7 10.c3 Nc6 11.f5 b5 12.cxd4 cxd4 13.g4 Qb6 14.Ng3 Nc5 15.Nh5 Rg8 16.g5 Be7 17.Rf2 Bb7 18.a3 a5 19.Bf1 a4 20.Rg2 0-0-0 21.b4 axb3 e.p. 22.Rb2 fxg5 23.Bxg5 Bxg5 24.Nxg5 g6 25.Nf6 gxf5 26.Nxg8 Rxg8 27.Rg2 b2 28.Rb1 Na4 29.Qh5 Qd8 30.Nf7 Rxg2+ 31.Bxg2 Qe7 32.Qxh7 Qxa3 33.Qxf5+ Kc7 34.h4 Nc3 35.Rxb2 Qxb2 36.h5 Ne2+ 37.Kh2 Nf4 38.Qg5 Nxh5 39.Qxh5 Qd2 40.Qh7 Qf4+ 41.Kg1 Kb6 42.Nd6 Ba6 43.Ne8 Qc1+ 44.Kh2 Qf4+ 45.Kg1 Qf8 46.Nc7 b4 47.Nd5+ Kc5 48.Qc7 Qb8 49.Qd7 b3 50.Nc7 Qxc7! 51.Qxc7 b2 52.Bh3 b1(Q)+ 53.Kh2 Qc2+ 54.Kg1 Qd1+ 55.Kh2 Qe2+ 56.Kg1 Qe3+ 57.Kh2 Qf2+ 58.Kh1 Bxd3 59.Qh7 Qe1+ 60.Kh2 Bxe4 61.Qh8 Qf2+ 0-1

my java has been screwy lately but i'll try to fix it to be able to play online again--it'd be fun to get some games in with some of you guys!

 

[Kirbstomper]

oh man i love bughouse--unfortunately, none of my chess-playing friends are into those variants, but crazyhouse & bughouse have just got to be the best ones... i liken them to being comparable to horrifying wars where you're capturing the opposition, brainwashing them & then forcing them to fight for your side.

they're also excellent methods of working on: tactics, strategy, king safety, speed-of-thought, teamwork(!) & creativity otb...

i also really like the bros. for a team... mario sets up luigi nicely for some easy death combos & they're just terrifying if it gets down to 2-on-1. their fireballs in particular work in tandem very well to lock the opponent up tight.

look up my good friend DavidRMerrikin on chess.com; he's quite a talented player & is very active with postal/speed... he's probably hovering around 2000 (i tend to win most of our games together but he's pretty solid overall) & he's legitimately one of the top players in my area, placing 2nd behind me during both of the last 2 north olympic peninsula opens in washington state.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-umlELe4tQ.../HLR5Xzh0qQ4/s320/2013-02-08_11-47-14_131.jpg

this is the epic game that i was playing in that pic, the pivotal one in the most recent championship that netted me first place (i was playing the top player from the next town over, a former montana state champ):

1.e4 c5 2.Nc3 e6 3.g3 d5 4.d3 d4 5.Ne2 e5 6.Bg2 Bd6 7.f4 f6 8.Nf3 Ne7 9.0-0 Nd7 10.c3 Nc6 11.f5 b5 12.cxd4 cxd4 13.g4 Qb6 14.Ng3 Nc5 15.Nh5 Rg8 16.g5 Be7 17.Rf2 Bb7 18.a3 a5 19.Bf1 a4 20.Rg2 0-0-0 21.b4 axb3 e.p. 22.Rb2 fxg5 23.Bxg5 Bxg5 24.Nxg5 g6 25.Nf6 gxf5 26.Nxg8 Rxg8 27.Rg2 b2 28.Rb1 Na4 29.Qh5 Qd8 30.Nf7 Rxg2+ 31.Bxg2 Qe7 32.Qxh7 Qxa3 33.Qxf5+ Kc7 34.h4 Nc3 35.Rxb2 Qxb2 36.h5 Ne2+ 37.Kh2 Nf4 38.Qg5 Nxh5 39.Qxh5 Qd2 40.Qh7 Qf4+ 41.Kg1 Kb6 42.Nd6 Ba6 43.Ne8 Qc1+ 44.Kh2 Qf4+ 45.Kg1 Qf8 46.Nc7 b4 47.Nd5+ Kc5 48.Qc7 Qb8 49.Qd7 b3 50.Nc7 Qxc7! 51.Qxc7 b2 52.Bh3 b1(Q)+ 53.Kh2 Qc2+ 54.Kg1 Qd1+ 55.Kh2 Qe2+ 56.Kg1 Qe3+ 57.Kh2 Qf2+ 58.Kh1 Bxd3 59.Qh7 Qe1+ 60.Kh2 Bxe4 61.Qh8 Qf2+ 0-1

my java has been screwy lately but i'll try to fix it to be able to play online again--it'd be fun to get some games in with some of you guys!

This post was so dumb I reported you to the mods. The only people who play chess are middle schoolers who can't make any friends

 

[Shears]

This post was so dumb I reported you to the mods. The only people who play chess are middle schoolers who can't make any friends

Are you going to smash con? If you're as funny in person as you are on the boards it would be fun. Oh and we still need to hear in detail the night you got arrested wearing a samus outfit and woke up naked (that was you right?).

 

[Sangoku]

How about stopping the feud and getting back on topic?

As a reminder the thread is about team tactics in smash 64.

This is a general warning, don't make me infract anyone or close the thread