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SSBWU/3DS Luigi Fireball Lock

Do you believe in Luigi zero-to-deaths after this thread?


  • Total voters
    19

Dire Creeper

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As many of you readers may already know, Luigi's fireballs in Smash 4 were greatly buffed, gaining better range, travel speed and being able to act out of the animation earlier. All this led me to discover what I call the Luigi Fireball Lock. before I explain what it is, take a look at these GIFs:




Note: This is a follow-up for a non-teched ending of Luigi's chain grab.



Take note of how far away Luigi can be for it to still be performed.

--------------------------------

As you can see, the Luigi Fireball Lock enables Luigi to lock the opponent with 1 to 3 fireballs as a punish for not teching and even land an easy up special as a finisher (if they're at high enough percentage), kind of like Falco's laser lock in Brawl, but allows a finishing move afterward. While this may sound extremely useful, it completely depends on the opponent missing a tech or not even teching. It's also pretty situational since many players who are falling to the ground would most likely choose to tech or air dodge onto the ground rather than falling. That being said, the best thing to do for setting this up is a chain grab (when they slam on the ground after down air).

Note: The less fireballs you use, the safer, but less damage from fireballs. The more fireballs you use, the most risky, but extra damage from extra fireball(s).

To summarize things, here's how to perform it naturally:

1. Wait for opponent to fall (or almost fall) on the ground.
2. Throw out fireballs at the fastest rate possible. If they don't tech, they'll get locked. If they tech, you should be safe even after one fireball. If they air dodge, you'll land a free fireball. To react properly, watch the opponent as you shoot the first fireball so you don't accidentally shoot an unintended fireball and possibly get punished.
3. IMMEDIATELY after your last intended fireball, go in for the finisher (up special being the best and most reliable). If you're close enough, you'll have enough time to run up and land it.

Note: If you feel you're just too far away, try using an initial dash and start your fireballs out of that. You can see Luigi do this before he locks Bowser above.

To use it as a follow-up for the chain grab (see lock against Fox above for a visual example):

1. Down throw to down air at high enough percentage so they will slam if they don't tech.
2. Begin fireball(s) AS SOON as you land.
3. Finish appropriately (up special is most reliable).

Final Note: You don't have to finish with an up special. You can try predicting their next move off the ground with an attack or even a re-grab.

If you enjoy my findings, please experiment more with this as much as your Luigi-loving hearts want.
 

gameonion

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I need to try this out right now. This seems pretty over-powered!

Anyways, great find!
 

Dire Creeper

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Thank you. But it's certainly not overpowered since its so situational, but basically landing a fireball on a non-techer = guaranteed up b follow-up.
 

Yonder

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Thank you. But it's certainly not overpowered since its so situational, but basically landing a fireball on a non-techer = guaranteed up b follow-up.
I agree, it's not OP. Techs at a higher level are common, so someone missing a tech is pretty rare. And like the chaingrab, fireball lock hasn't been seen in tournament play.

But these are pretty cool, thanks for sharing! I can't pull off the chaingrab so hopefully this is easier...does character weight play any factors into the lock?
 

Dire Creeper

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I agree, it's not OP. Techs at a higher level are common, so someone missing a tech is pretty rare. And like the chaingrab, fireball lock hasn't been seen in tournament play.

But these are pretty cool, thanks for sharing! I can't pull off the chaingrab so hopefully this is easier...does character weight play any factors into the lock?
Weight and percentage are factors on how many fireballs can lock and at what percentages they do. I plan to research this more and post the percentages for each character.
 

Dire Creeper

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Well, here it is! The full stats for each character. For certain characters who can't be locked with more than one fireball, it's mostly due to their small width (such as Luigi, Sheik and Greninja). Nevertheless, Luigi can still follow up with anything on everybody.

* - Safest to wait for the forced get-up to follow up.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

KEY

Character

Earliest Percentage?

More Than One Fireball?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mario

19%

Y

Dr. Mario

19%

Y

Luigi

19%

N

Bowser

56%

Y

Peach

18%

Y

Bowser Jr.

20%

Y

Rosalina

17%

Y

Donkey Kong

22%

Y

Diddy Kong

19%

Y

Pikachu

17%

Y

Lucario

19%

Y

Jigglypuff

15%

Y

Greninja*

19%

N

Charizard

21%

Y

Link

20%

Y

Zelda

18%

N

Sheik*

18%

N

Toon Link

19%

Y

Ganondorf

21%

Y

Shulk

20%

Y

R.O.B.

20%

Y

Ness

19%

Y

Fox

17%

Y

Falco

17%

Y


Kirby

17%

Y

Meta Knight

17%

Y

King Dedede

22%

Y

Sonic

19%

Y

Wii Fit Trainer

19%

N

Captain Falcon

20%

Y

Yoshi

20%

Y

Samus

20%

Y

Zero Suit Samus*

17%

N

Marth

18%

N

Ike

20%

Y

Robin

19%

Y

Lucina

18%

N

Villager

19%

Y

Mega Man

20%

N

Pac-Man

19%

Y

Little Mac

17%

Y

Mr. Game & Watch

16%

Y

Olimar

17%

Y

Wario

20%

Y

Pit

19%

Y

Dark Pit

19%

Y

Palutena

18%

Y

Duck Hunt Dog

18%

Y
 
Last edited:

Takezo

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Ha ha! Non-techers beware! Luigi has my respect. o . o
 

hey_there

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But at what percent does each character start bouncing off the stage instead of simply staying in hitstun? With that question in mind I hit the lab a while ago (like early January) to find out and this seems like as good a thread as any to post the percents. These results come from training mode on 3DS. Feel free to correct any mistakes. Luigi's down throw does 6% fresh, so -6% if used after down throw:
Mario: 58%
Luigi: 57%
Peach: 55%
Bowser: 68%
Yoshi: 60%
Rosalina: 51%
Bowser Jr.: 62% (Clown Car); 60% (Bowser Jr.)
Wario: 61%
Mr. Game & Watch: 50%
Donkey Kong: 66%
Diddy Kong: 56%
Link: 60%
Zelda: 53%
Sheik: 53%
Ganondorf: 62%
Toon Link: 56%
Samus: 61%
Zero Suit Samus: 52%
Pit: 57%
Palutena: 55%
Marth: 55%
Ike: 61%
Robin:57%
Kirby: 51%
King Dedede: 65%
Meta Knight: 52%
Little Mac: 52%
Fox: 51%
Falco: 52%
Pikachu: 51%
Charizard: 63%
Lucario: 58%
Jigglypuff: 47%
Greninja: 56%
Duck Hunt: 55%
R.O.B.: 60%
Ness: 56%
Captain Falcon: 60%
Villager: 57%
Olimar: 51%
Wii Fit Trainer: 57%
Dr. Mario: 58%
Dark Pit: 57%
Lucina: 55%
Shulk: 59% (Normal), 57 (Jump), 59% (Speed), 96% (Shield), 58% (Buster), 49% (Smash)
Pac-Man: 57%
Mega Man: 59%
Sonic: 57%
 

Dire Creeper

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But at what percent does each character start bouncing off the stage instead of simply staying in hitstun? With that question in mind I hit the lab a while ago (like early January) to find out and this seems like as good a thread as any to post the percents. These results come from training mode on 3DS. Feel free to correct any mistakes. Luigi's down throw does 6% fresh, so -6% if used after down throw:
Mario: 58%
Luigi: 57%
Peach: 55%
Bowser: 68%
Yoshi: 60%
Rosalina: 51%
Bowser Jr.: 62% (Clown Car); 60% (Bowser Jr.)
Wario: 61%
Mr. Game & Watch: 50%
Donkey Kong: 66%
Diddy Kong: 56%
Link: 60%
Zelda: 53%
Sheik: 53%
Ganondorf: 62%
Toon Link: 56%
Samus: 61%
Zero Suit Samus: 52%
Pit: 57%
Palutena: 55%
Marth: 55%
Ike: 61%
Robin:57%
Kirby: 51%
King Dedede: 65%
Meta Knight: 52%
Little Mac: 52%
Fox: 51%
Falco: 52%
Pikachu: 51%
Charizard: 63%
Lucario: 58%
Jigglypuff: 47%
Greninja: 56%
Duck Hunt: 55%
R.O.B.: 60%
Ness: 56%
Captain Falcon: 60%
Villager: 57%
Olimar: 51%
Wii Fit Trainer: 57%
Dr. Mario: 58%
Dark Pit: 57%
Lucina: 55%
Shulk: 59% (Normal), 57 (Jump), 59% (Speed), 96% (Shield), 58% (Buster), 49% (Smash)
Pac-Man: 57%
Mega Man: 59%
Sonic: 57%
Ahh, I've been meaning to do this for a while. Thanks for this, it'll help a lot!
 

TriTails

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So this is basically...

1. Get opponent grounded
2. Fireballs! ASAP and AFAP! And let them bounce like bouncing fish (No pun intended)
3. Punish

Nice find! Sadly, people really don't like themselves getting downed, they all are like '**** this tumbling I'm pressing R'. But still nice! This means people should EVEN more beware on not getting grounded :D.

And... the range of this tech seem to be half of FD, which is cool.

And by the way... I see that dirty Up-Taunt you did in the first GIF there :p.
 

Dire Creeper

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So this is basically...

1. Get opponent grounded
2. Fireballs! ASAP and AFAP! And let them bounce like bouncing fish (No pun intended)
3. Punish

Nice find! Sadly, people really don't like themselves getting downed, they all are like '**** this tumbling I'm pressing R'. But still nice! This means people should EVEN more beware on not getting grounded :D.

And... the range of this tech seem to be half of FD, which is cool.

And by the way... I see that dirty Up-Taunt you did in the first GIF there :p.
Lol thanks. The range of how far away you can do it depends on your opponents percentage: the less damage (or least possible damage), the farther away possible. If he/she is at high percentage, you'll want to be as close to them as possible and go for just one fireball if you won't end up too close.

Lol oh yeah that taunt. After all I like to live dangerously.
 

MrTeddyBear

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I've seen someone do this before, except that he only used one fireball and then a down-taunt followed by an Up-B. I guess that's for style points though, this seems easier to do and more reliable.
 

ArcGale

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Nice Find! Could be used as a possible kill combo as long as they don't miss the tech. Anyways, can someone link me to the Luigi ChainGrab Thread?
 
Last edited:

CAN-ACTION

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Wow, this is some really great information- thank you for sharing! Tested it out myself and worked like a charm.
 
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