Specific Characters Match-up: Pikachu vs Luigi

[Felth]

I know that there's a Matchup Thread. But I don't like that the information is spread among different pages because the discussion can be changed to different characters and that could be a little messy. To avoid this, I suggest the following idea: one post for each character. Following some general points I'll organize all the post in a very simple way.

I propose to study in this post the Luigi MU. If you want to discuss other Matchup and you liked my idea just write a post following this idea. Suggestions of any type are welcome (I'm not an expert of Smash so it's probably that you know more than me about this).

Luigi:

• Neutral Game:

• Stage selection and Ban:

• Specific Situations:
  • Ground - Ground:
  • Ground - Air:
  • Air - Air:
  • Off Stage:
  • Some situation to punish or to look (Situations that are advantageous to pikachu vs this character)
  • Situations to avoid?

Extra information:
​

• I don't want to lose all the information that the community has discovered at this point. Most of this theory it's in the MU Thread.

• You can read the document made by the User Umbreoff which summarizes the previous post. Click here to see the document. I'm transcribing this document into a pdf version with access to new options. If you want to check the progress of this document I'll invite you to see the PDF Online Version.

• With respect to the Killing Section: add Good Set-ups to perform the killing (not just the final attack). Set-ups performed in specific Stages are also welcome.

• With respect to the Stage Selection Section: we should discuss what stages to avoid and what stages are good for Pikachu. The Smash Player Esam made a Depth Analysis on each Stage. Recall that some stages could be good for Pikachu but are even better for other character that's the reason for why we should discuss this kind of things here (one example is Halberd: IMO is good for Pikachu but not against Meta Knight).

• With respect to the Difficulty Section we should discuss how difficult is this MU for Pikachu. If it's possible it would be good to associate a measure to this difficulty. I think that this section should be completed once we developed a lot of theory in the corresponding MU, otherwise is just speculation.

• With respect to the Specific Situations Section we should discuss what to do in both scenarios.

 

[NobleClamtasm]

This matchup favors Pikachu IMO. For one, Luigi is highly rewarded from landing a grab. Downthrow can convert to massive 40-50% damage combos at low percent, and can easily convert to kills above 110% because of the Luigi Cyclone follow up. Pikachu's damage output flat-out pales in comparison. Not only do Pikachu's attacks do less damage overall, but Luigi's Nair and Jab can hinder Pikachu's damage output even more, as they stuff out a lot of Pikachu's potential follow ups. In this matchup, be aware that you must be conservative when racking up damage. On the other hand, Pikachu has the upper hand when it comes to attack range. The most optimal way to fight Luigi (IMO) is to keep out of Luigi's grab range with intelligent use of Pikachu's thunder jolt, Dtilt and F-Smash. These attacks can zone Luigi out and prevent him from landing his grab.

One very important tidbit that you should be aware of is that Luigi's shield is not reliable at all in terms of converting into punishes. Luigi inherently has bad traction, meaning that upon shielding an attack, he will slide backwards depending on the strength of the attack. This makes it nearly impossible for him to punish certain attacks on shield like Pikachu's FSmash (unless he perfect shields). A smart Luigi will get around this by using fox-trots, spot dodges, and aggressive rolls to punish whiffed attacks. These options can be punished using a mix of thunder jolts and d-tilts. U-tilts should be used in anticipation of roll-ins.

It's not advisable to play rushdown against Luigi for a number of reasons. By being the aggressor, you are putting yourself in range of his dangerous grab game. Additionally, many of your combos and follow ups can be negated by Luigi's Nair or jab. The jab is something in particular to watch out for, as it is extremely quick, stuffs your ground approaches, and converts into an easy grab. His Smash attacks are also very scary. They are all very quick, and can kill relatively early. It is common for Luigi to utilize retreating Up-Smashes defensively to catch aerial approaches, as well as ground approaches from behind. His F-Smash and D-Smash are also potent in catching ground-based approaches and roll-ins.

Overall, it's best to hang back and methodically rack up damage using pokes and thunder jolts. If you play the zoning game correctly, it can definitely be an uphill battle for Luigi. Just try not to be predictable with your attacks. Mix up your options, anticipate roll-ins, and play the punish game.

EDIT: Also, don't get hit by fireballs. They help Luigi confirm into grabs

 

[Felth]

This is from Esam post 259 of the Pikachu Matchup Thread.


Quick synopsis: Both combo the hell out of each other. Luigi kills better on stage, Pikachu edgegaurds really easily. Pikachu can play VERY evasive and avoid luigi fairly easily. Luigi cannot punish good QAs. Careful approaches help a lot because of luigi's no traction. Pika controls the entire pace of the game

Ground-Ground: Pikachu DEFINITELY wins this part of the MU. Luigi NEEDS to powershield to get in, whereas we can just kinda...do what we want. If Luigi is on the ground just dtilt because he will slide back and not be able to punish. Any hit immediately causes pressure due to luigi NOT wanting to go offstage vs Pikachu. Also, d-tilt trip combos into QA which leads to everything else. Luigi's grab game is scary, but as long as you control space correctly you should be fine.

Ground-Air: Most rising aerials will hit luigi, such as rising fair or instant dair. Both of these lead into long long combos and luigi typically has to have aggressive ground move spacing in order to hit you like f-tilt or utilt. However, this is REALLY bad in the ground-ground game so if you frustrate them with that it'll be hard for them to hit you.

In terms of luigi in the air, anti air up-angled f-tilt is amazing vs luigi. It might trade with nair, but he will probably not be able to combo out of this regardless. Luigi is going to want to SH A LOT in this MU to overcome our ground game so we will have a lot of opportunity to anti-air him period. Also, if you expect a commit to a landing aerial, you can pivot backwards F-smash (OR HSB with customs on) to get big punishes and land kills.

Air-Air : Pikachu really wants to be under luigi if in the air because it is really easy to bait out nairs and air dodges. Being anywhere else and pika essentially just wants to get back to the ground because IF YOU COULDN'T TELL BEING ON THE GROUND IS AMAZING IN THIS MATCHUP

Off-stage: lelelelelelelelelelelele. Force him low with just your presence and they get scared. If they are already low, t-jolt and run off fair/bair. He can't really edgeguard you because QA 2gud. ALso if you get the bair FF multihit spike when he doesn't have a jump he dies regardless. yaaaay

Killing: Luigi obviously has more general kill potential, but it is pretty easy to push luigi off the stage. Also, pika forces characters to air dodge or throw out moves defensively so it's pretty easy to F-smash/U-smash that.

 

[Underhill]

This MU is worse for Pikachu than with Mario. Customs, I have no answer to that so I don't know.

: Get Luigi off stage, gimp him, and he's gone. Because of his bad air speed and linear recovery, Pikachu won't make it easy for the man in green to come back with thunder jolts, thunder off stage, b-air for stage spikes, d-airs, and f-airs. Also, forward smash is involved for baiting air dodges or giving him in a bad position. D-tile, forward-tile, forward smash, and pivoting are useful against Luigi so he doesn't try to approach for free and get a grab on you. Thunder jolt camp him to bait shields, rolls, and spot dodges, but not too much because he can perfect shield and n-air through it. F-airs to out-range Luigi's f-airs(maybe). You can juggle him with up-tiles, SH up-air(platforms), up-smash, pivot, and jolts, but not as easily because of Luigi's n-air and tornado so mix them up and punish his landings. Use Luigi's low traction to your favor since he slides farther and won't get a free punish if he doesn't power shield. Watch out for the N-air while comboing Luigi. Do not be aggressive on Luigi and play the patient and bait like you do against Mario.

: Don't take on his up-smash with your air attacks while landing. Damage output, Koing, air game, Luigi wins. All you can do when Luigi down-throw you is mix up your di and try to n-air out of it if you can, but otherwise, thats it. Luigi's up-smash beats all of Pikachu's air attacks so stay away from him, QA away, and only attack if you need space. N-air, forward air, and up-smash beats QA so be careful recovering against Pikachu. Also, if you mess up on QA with landing lag and he smells it with your percent on 65% or higher, then its a free kill for him with Fire jump punch. Unless you get him off stage, then you'll gonna have a tough time killing him on stage because not only he can comeback with his superior damage output, but also rage helps him more and he's heavier than you. Also, he can kill better than you since Pikachu is light and Luigi has back throw, down-throw to tornado, n-air, and back-air. His down-throw is better since Luigi can combo better and has more options than Pikachu. N-air to break up Pikachu's combos.

 

[NogGoggler]

Just like Esam has said in multiple videos of his, this is pika's worst matchup. Luigi's main weakness is being outspaced hard, but thats the one thing pika is bad at. Pika can combo luigi that hard because of his frame 2 nair, can quick attack well because of how good luigi's nair is, and also can't tjolt spam because luigi has the faster fireballs.

Pikachu can do some decent ground spacing with dtilt and ftilt, and can mixup with SH dair, but his options get limited when fighting him.

I'd say it's 35:65 or 40:60 in Luigi's favor.

 

[Jmacz]

I'm not to great at the game but I'll share anyways because I have a lot of experience with this MU as the only time I play is at a friends house and he mains Luigi.

• Approaching:

This can be a bit scary, but we do have a bit of an advantage here. The problem is if we slip up and make the slightest mistake we are usually punished by a grab which is what we want to avoid. We have to use our speed to gain an advantage, and try to get Luigi to slide around to gain an advantage. D-Tilt and QA are our friends, but Luigi does have answers for it if he wises up to when you like to use it so be careful and don't abuse them.

• Edeguarding:

We can edgeguard him with Nair, Thunder and T-Jolt, but with three different moves to recover with it can be a little tough to predict what Luigi is going to do. Missing any of these moves off-stage can also result in you eating a D-air and losing a stock so be careful and know when to use what moves.

• Recoverying:

The one spot we have a clear advantage, just stay away from using skull bash to recover. Maybe it's just me but every time I try and my friend has time to react I get Dair'd.

• Gameplan:

We have to play a hit and run style and not over extend on our combo's. Get only what you know you can get then get the hell out of there before you get grabbed. Don't over extend on your combo's or you will eat a nair for your troubles. Something I like to do is

Utilt
Uair
Drop, bait nair.
Shield Grab
Repeat

Sometimes you can get the second Uair in, but a lot of the times it's just better to reset.

• Neutral:

T-Jolt trades with fireball so it gains us little advantage here. We need to either get in with a quick attack or bait him on on a grab and hit him with a D-Tilt and try and follow up. Avoid be grabbed at all cost and don't be afraid to run away.

• Killing Options:

Your best bet is going to get him offstage and gimp him which can be easier said than done if the Luigi knows what they are doing. Fsmash is also a decent option due to it's range combined with Luigi's bad traction it can be tough for Luigi to punish if spaced correctly (unless he power shields.) Those are going to be your two best options as most players know how to DI Uthrow to thunder, and going for a Usmash against Luigi can be scary because you never wanna be that close. It would be best to only use Usmash when Luigi is landing or getting up from a tech/missed tech.

• Stage Selection:

Lylat, Dreamland, and to a lesser degree Battlefield are our best bets. I personally don't think Battlefield is that great because Luigi is good with platforms, Dreamland is a better option though due to being able to QAC on the ground and not just the platforms. Lylat is the best option imo, as it makes recovering a bit harder on Luigi as well as giving us multiple angles and platforms to QAC on.

• Difficulty:

I would say it's 65:35 in Luigi's favor, I picked up Roy specifically for this MU and have had much much much better results in my first game with him than I ever did with Pikachu.

 

[Angiance]

Against Luigi: be very aggresive and don't let up; you want to gain momentum against him and then hold onto it until the very end. You do NOT want Luigi to gain momentum-if he does, do your best to either reverse the momentum or jump away and skull bash offstage and make your way to the ledge for ledgeplay

 

[Gibbs]

I did some testing on this, if timed and spaced correctly, pika's dair will always beat Luigi's nado. The trick is you have to hit him right in the head, dead center. If you hit his hands, the hit will either trade or lose outright.

 

[Thor]

Luigi nerfs made his throw game a little less scary [bthrow still kills but it's not gonna kill from anywhere on the stage, unlike the dthrow cyclone]. Fsmash is even safer on shield now, and I think our retreating SH dair might be nigh-impossible for him to punish on shield, never mind the fair buffs and how safe dtilt is now. This MU might be worth re-evaluating in light of 1.1.1.

Also, fun fact that appears to not have been mentioned... with some odd spacing, you can quick attack through fireballs [as in, you clank with the fireball, but keep going with your hitbox and everything]. This lets you instantly get in on a Luigi in lag, and at high enough percents, you can then get a utilt [or shield an obvious nair] and then get a combo going from there.

One other important thing: Our uair outranges his nair, and I believe our fair barely outranges his nair, although the spacing on that is very tight. So yes, Pikachu can juggle him, but the spacing is very tight horizontall, and if you aren't used to it/practiced in the MU he will likely combo break you.