Some guy just said to me...

[Nowaytoeatatater]

Why is Falco at the Top of EVERY TIER LIST? Seriously, His Reflector is crap, His recovery is shorter than Fox's, and above all, He lacks KO moves. His blaster sucks, The only good part about him is his smashes.

I lol'd. Hard.

 

[linkw00t]

Wow. Falco hasn't been fully developed that's for sure, but some cool stuff is starting to surface with him. The CG night not require that much precision, but it can be tricky with some characters.

Falco takes a lot of familiarization with all the characters to play well IMO.

Or Final Desination.

 

[BEES]

Reflector - good for spacing
Recovery - horizontal recovery is just as good as Fox's
KO moves - he is overly reliant on dair and bair, but a lack of kill moves is a problem with most of the cast
Blaster - hahahaha
Smashes - I think the other spacies are better in this category, but at least the upsmash can be dash boosted

 

[bowz10190]

Falco's forward smash is insane. It can kill at 80ish if your by the edge of FD, which isn't to hard set up. I think he has the best projectile in the game. I think is over b is farther than fox's and it has a weak spike.

 

[Nowaytoeatatater]

Keep in mind that this guy also thinks that Marth has crappy aerials and mediocre ground and special moves.

 

[BEES]

Can't you see this is a call for help? Get this man some help.

 

[J4pu]

Sadly he isn't currently top tier, or even all that close for that matter
Wolf is actually ahead of him and fox isn't far behind
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=165954
at least we recently passed Pit back up for 11th

but the blaster does not suck, that guy shouldn't talk about smash if he's never played it before

 

[Exousia]

omg I saw someone say the same thing but I forgot where!! >_<

it must've been those scrubs at gamefaqs no doubt.

 

[DKKountry]

Bird. Birdie, Birdie, Birdie.

 

[Exousia]

Sadly he isn't currently top tier, or even all that close for that matter
Wolf is actually ahead of him and fox isn't far behind
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=165954
at least we recently passed Pit back up for 11th

but the blaster does not suck, that guy shouldn't talk about smash if he's never played it before

That is tournament character ranking. That doesn't necessarily count because its based on tournament winnings on the amount of people that use that specific character.

The last tournament I went to, there were only 3 or 4 Falco's including myself compared to the 50 or so people that used Snake(obviously), Metaknight(see snake), Luigi, Fox(too many), Kirby, Marth and Wario. (other characters were used but those were all the most common).

The reason Falco and Wario have risen up is because more people are using them and now are winning. That's why Forward got his thread locked becuz gimpyfish hatz falco and Forward's c.o.c.k.

(the last paragraph was a joke FYI)

 

[J4pu]

Sadly he isn't CURRENTLY top tier, or even all that close for that matter
Wolf is actually ahead of him and fox isn't far behind
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=165954
at least we recently passed Pit back up for 11th

but the blaster does not suck, that guy shouldn't talk about smash if he's never played it before

That is tournament character ranking. That doesn't necessarily count because its based on tournament winnings on the amount of people that use that specific character.

The last tournament I went to, there were only 3 or 4 Falco's including myself compared to the 50 or so people that used Snake(obviously), Metaknight(see snake), Luigi, Fox(too many), Kirby, Marth and Wario. (other characters were used but those were all the most common).

See the bolded and underlined currently
for now that is the tier list, because it is too early to make any assumptions based on metagame and other in depth stuff, so we base it on who is actually winning tournaments since that is straight fact

 

[Nowaytoeatatater]

This guy is indeed a poster on GameFAQs, and is one of the ones that make us, especially the Brawl board, look like a cesspool of stupidity.

...Though that is what the Brawl boards are. I like it that way, though.

He's also a furry, which explains a lot.

 

[zamz]

See the bolded and underlined currently
for now that is the tier list, because it is too early to make any assumptions based on metagame and other in depth stuff, so we base it on who is actually winning tournaments since that is straight fact

Then doesn't it make more sense to rank characters based on highest # of wins...as opposed to the most people who finish high? If we measured characters who actually WON tournements, this would rule out some of the inconsistancies.

The way the Character Rankings List is set up, a Snake can take 1st place, 2nd place and 5th place...and end up with 1 win, 1 top4 and 1 top8 from one tournement. But for Falco, there are usually only a handful (if that) in any given tournement. The most points he'll ever get out of a tournement is 1 win. And there isn't always a falco in every tournement. Falco doesn't stand a chance in a list that measures popularity only.

Lets look at the tournement board in a slightly different way:

1. 1 Snake (53 top8, 49 top4, 33 wins, 338.5 pts)
2. 2 Meta Knight (55 top8, 63 top4, 16 wins, 296.5 pts)
3. 5 Wario (10 top8, 14 top4, 16 wins, 127 pts)
4. 3 King Dedede (23 top8, 32 top4, 15 wins, 182.5 pts)
5. 7 Mr. Game & Watch (32 top8, 21 top4, 8 wins, 119 pts) <6>
6. 8 Donkey Kong (12 top8, 15 top4, 7 wins, 86 pts)
7. 6 ROB (28 top8, 25 top4, 6 wins, 119 pts) <7>
8. 11 Falco (17 top8, 11 top4, 6 wins, 71.5 pts) <12>
9. 13 Lucario (7 top8, 10 top4, 6 wins, 63.5 pts)
10. 10 Pikachu (5 top8, 15 top4, 5 wins, 72.5 pts)
11. 12 Pit (10 top8, 13 top4, 5 wins, 69 pts) <11>
12. 4 Marth (35 top8, 34 top4, 4 wins, 139.5 pts)
13. 9 Wolf (18 top8, 17 top4, 3 wins, 75 pts)
14. 14 Fox (9 top8, 13 top4, 3 wins, 58.5 pts)
15. 16 Ike (13 top8, 9 top4, 3 wins, 48.5 pts)
16. 22 Zelda (6 top 8, 5 top4, 3 wins, 33 pts)
17. 23 Sonic (6 top8, 4 top4, 3 wins, 30 pts)

Notice where Fox, Wolf and Marth are on this list. Falco is doing very well even though he has far less tournement representation than all three of those characters. There is no debate that Marth sees more tournement than Falco. This alone should be grounds to suggest Falco is a very good character. With low representation, he still places high. If Falco had higher representation, he has the potential of being very high on the list.

 

[Exousia]

This guy is indeed a poster on GameFAQs, and is one of the ones that make us, especially the Brawl board, look like a cesspool of stupidity.

...Though that is what the Brawl boards are. I like it that way, though.

He's also a furry, which explains a lot.

First rule of fur ***gotry: YOU DON'T RECOVER!!!

Someone seriously needs to shut down GameFAQs becuz those guys piss me off to no end.

Then doesn't it make more sense to rank characters based on highest # of wins...as opposed to the most people who finish high? If we measured characters who actually WON tournements, this would rule out some of the inconsistancies.

The way the Character Rankings List is set up, a Snake can take 1st place, 2nd place and 5th place...and end up with 1 win, 1 top4 and 1 top8 from one tournement. But for Falco, there are usually only a handful (if that) in any given tournement. The most points he'll ever get out of a tournement is 1 win. And there isn't always a falco in every tournement. Falco doesn't stand a chance in a list that measures popularity only.

Notice where Fox, Wolf and Marth are on this list. Falco is doing very well even though he has far less tournement representation than all three of those characters. There is no debate that Marth sees more tournement than Falco. This alone should be grounds to suggest Falco is a very good character. With low representation, he still places high. If Falco had higher representation, he has the potential of being very high on the list.

This was the point I was trying to make earlier. Thanks bro. *gives him bread courtesy of Falco*

 

[J4pu]

It sort of seems like you forget the fact that most people go to tournaments with the idea of winning in mind, and therefore pick the character they are best at. If a lot of people are better at snake than any other character it shows that it is "easier" to be good with snake thus making his increased chances of getting points logically viable.
For example take melee, it was "easy" to be good with sheik so many people played her, then through whatever way tiers were measured she ended up high on the tier lists, it was also difficult to be good with say Pichu or Young Link and less people played them, conclusion: they ended up low on the tier lists. If you think this was merely coincidence then you are in a sort of denial, character representation gives insight to character potential, even if it is in an indirect sort of way. So ruling out this list because some characters are more represented isn't all that intelligent of an idea.
So back to my first statement, currently this is good indication of where Falco stands on the tier lists.

 

[old king coal]

It sort of seems like you forget the fact that most people go to tournaments with the idea of winning in mind, and therefore pick the character they are best at. If a lot of people are better at snake than any other character it shows that it is "easier" to be good with snake thus making his increased chances of getting points logically viable.
For example take melee, it was "easy" to be good with sheik so many people played her, then through whatever way tiers were measured she ended up high on the tier lists, it was also difficult to be good with say Pichu or Young Link and less people played them, conclusion: they ended up low on the tier lists. If you think this was merely coincidence then you are in a sort of denial, character representation gives insight to character potential, even if it is in an indirect sort of way. So ruling out this list because some characters are more represented isn't all that intelligent of an idea.
So back to my first statement, currently this is good indication of where Falco stands on the tier lists.

just because a character is easier to be good at, doesn't mean that it higher on the tier list. tier list measures the potencial of a character. that is why fox was the highest at the last melee tier list. although many characters were easier to pick up (ie: sheik), fox when mastered had the highest "roof". the only reason it took longer for fox players to become recognised and start winning tournaments was because he was more difficult to master, however when mastered he was the best. when the first tier list came out for melee link was considered high tier. people learned how to deal with him and he slipped in the ranks

as much as i hate to say it: IT IS TOO EARLY TO TELL
yes, we can admit that snake/meta are gonna be up there, and that, lets say yoshi will be low, but to judge falco..... i think falco has alot of untapped potencial and will be high tier. but, as i said, IT IS TOO EARLY TO TELL. wait till another wavedashing comes, and we will see the tier list turned upsidedown (maybe not)

tier is about the "roof" of a character!!!!

 

[Exousia]

Although tournaments do play a role in tier lists, it disregards tournament representation or how many times a certain character is on top 16, Top 8, or whatever. If this were true, I think Kirby or Mario would be in top tier instead Fox xD

Regarding what Coal said was that the current tier list of melee (which has not changed for 2 years) shows Falco had jump 3 spots from Upper tier to God tier and is considered the second best character right under Fox. (When i started Smash, Falco was Upper tier bellow Captain Falcon and Peach and the rest of the God tiers I believe and Fox was right under sheik)

These jumps represent the new findings of each character and their increased potential and effectiveness. I think "Forward's C.O.C.K." or "Soldier of Fortune" videos represent Falco's untapped powers in Melee (got to love those waveshine combos ) and the evidence to back up his spot on the tier list.

If I recall correctly, Wario didn't rise up to Rank A or B until he won a major tournament in the UK and demonstrated his technique in front of many smashers. After that, Wario sky-rocketed several rankings because of his new findings and skills were taken much more seriously.

Tier lists change and thats a fact, but the current way we are deciding the tiers is Flawed and should not be accountable by the most played character but instead to the most effective and potential holding like it has been in Smash 64 and Melee.