So Diddy Kong got nerfed again.

[Orocket]

Like Pazx said, our concern right now should be research on new throws that can combo. What is done is done. There are sure to be more updates in the future, and the meta is not set in stone because of this update, although I am questioning Nintendo's reasoning to nerf diddy more than necessary

Yeah we should start a thread for this if people are serious about trying to figure things out. The best thing to do right now is to just lab with Diddy. I don't think Nintendo or people who main other characters care about what we have to say. People are toxic towards Diddy and I don't think anything will change their mind. We will have to wait until the next patch to see if Diddy gets better or, hopefully not, worse again. We have to work with what we've got. Those of us who main Diddy love him as a character. Those who mained him because he was "EZ" have moved on since the 1.0.6 patch. I'm sure we can continue to make the character great!

 

[Lylo]

Tell me if Im wrong, but I haven't noticed any change about Fair auto-cancel?

 

[W.A.C.]

I don't think fair's auto-cancel was changed. Up air's auto-cancel got messed with a ton though.

 

[Jaylowww]

I don't think fair's auto-cancel was changed. Up air's auto-cancel got messed with a ton though.

Taken from Thinkaman's post:

Uair
all hitboxes
begin frame 3 -> 4
kbg 99 -> 89
bkb 65 -> 64
landing lag window
3-15 -> 0-27

Autocancel window is now at frame 28 instead of frame 16; it's now a massive 12 frames later. Oddly enough, there's no info within the datamine which indicates that fair's autocancel window was changed.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Has ZeRo actually dropped Diddy? I keep hearing rumors that he has... And he's playing as the Devil in Disguise, aka Sheik now.

 

[W.A.C.]

If @ TSM ZeRo drops Diddy Kong at some point, I don't blame him. It's his job to play Smash competitively. Diddy Kong's whole rhythm as a character and his versatility has been wrecked from this balance patch. Even some hardcore Brawl mains of Diddy Kong are dropping him. It's that bad. As much as I love the character and he's been my favorite character in every Smash game that has come out, I'm dropping him in favor of going solo Meta Knight. This isn't a decision I'm making because Diddy's tier standing is considerably worse, it's because he's considerably less fun to play as after this balance patch. I'm not the type of player who obsesses with tiers. King Dedede is my third favorite character with customs enabled and Larry is my third favorite character in the vanilla metagame, and they're no higher than mid tier at absolute best.

If ZeRo loses CEO because of the balance patch, it's going to make the future of Smash 4's meta look really bad because there is no security in who you main. At any point, your best character's viability can get nerfed to the ground from balance patches. If a lot of top players end up losing tournaments and have their financial security jeopardized from balance patches, I wouldn't be surprised if some of Smash 4's best players (such as ZeRo and @Mr-R) quit in favor of Melee. Like imagine if ZeRo focused hardcore on Shiek and she got nerfed to the ground a week or two before EVO began (imagine Shiek's foward air with about as much end lag as post-patch Diddy Kong's up air). Both ZeRo and Mr. R would be put at such an unfair disadvantage that their performances at the biggest Smash tournament of the year would be jeopardized.

 

[TSM ZeRo]

A lot of people give me crap for saying this nerf was addressed at me, but I truly believe it. I won a tournament, with Sakurai watching, with nerfed Diddy Kong, and some Captain Falcon. They changed both of those characters this patch, It's not me estimating myself highly, it's a decent theory.

I think Diddy Kong is currently -really bad- (in terms of winning a national with) and the only way you can make it happen is if you play like a god. They nerfed his spacing, his juggle game, his kill confirms, his setups, and damage output. Dear lord, dude.

And luigi and Sheik? ROFL

 

[W.A.C.]

A lot of people give me crap for saying this nerf was addressed at me, but I truly believe it. I won a tournament, with Sakurai watching, with nerfed Diddy Kong, and some Captain Falcon. They changed both of those characters this patch, It's not me estimating myself highly, it's a decent theory.

I completely agree. As you mentioned in the past, Nietono is also probably the reason why Greninja's competitive viability went to hell. Sakurai probably pays attention to very few tournaments and makes huge game changing balance decisions on the few he sees.

I think Diddy Kong is currently -really bad- (in terms of winning a national with) and the only way you can make it happen is if you play like a god. They nerfed his spacing, his juggle game, his kill confirms, his setups, and damage output. Dear lord, dude.

It's quite awful and a lot of people that don't use the character do not understand why these nerfs are so horrible. There's still just so much salt over his dominance with 1.0.4 and so many people that still used the character with 1.0.6 that a lot of people have really unfair views about the character. I frequently see Twitch commenters complain about seeing Diddy Kong so much because a lot of people just hate watching and playing against the character. We just have to hope Sakurai reverts some of the nerfs in the future. I mean he increased Luma's health after nerfing it in the previous balance patch, so it's not impossible for a nerf to be reverted. Highly unlikely though. Here's hoping he never adds additional end lag to Diddy's forward air, or else his competitive viability will be about as dead as a monkey in a dumpster. He pretty much wrecked Diddy's up air, so who knows if he'll wreck his forward air too. :/

And luigi and Sheik? ROFL

It's unfortunate Luigi and Pikachu ever got buffed since it resulted in the game being more unbalanced in the long run. As for Shiek, about the only nerf I can think of they could give her without wrecking any of her moves is her needles. She's balanced in such a weird way to where she seems to have a positive matchup against every character in the game, yet her kill power is so limited that they can't make it any worse. I don't know why Sakurai thought it would be a great idea to nerf the hell out of Diddy Kong again, yet leave Shiek alone unless he's just really ignorant of his own game's balance.

 

[Dr. Bread]

not gonna lie diddy kong is not so hot right now
you can only get one aerial off of a down-throw now. Yknow who else only gets one aerial off a down-throw? marth. I dont see anyone tryna say marth is top-tier... does he need a banana?

Gonna be serious, diddy's nerfs were somewhat irresponsible.
Pre-pre patch diddy kong's up air was obviously broke, but why exactly? It was a strong combo tool(into itself), it was a frame 3 killmove, low cooldown, it hit very easily, and you could set one up using diddy kong's fantastic grab-game.

Honestly all they had to do was give it some sort of tradeoff, its important that up-air shouldn't be good for everything, but it shouldn't be bad for everything like it is right now. Buffs and nerfs should be part of streamlining the character and making them more fun to play with and against by giving everything a tradeoff that you have to account for, not about making everything bad or everything good.

 

[Orocket]

not gonna lie diddy kong is not so hot right now
you can only get one aerial off of a down-throw now. Yknow who else only gets one aerial off a down-throw? marth. I dont see anyone tryna say marth is top-tier... does he need a banana?

Gonna be serious, diddy's nerfs were somewhat irresponsible.
Pre-pre patch diddy kong's up air was obviously broke, but why exactly? It was a strong combo tool(into itself), it was a frame 3 killmove, low cooldown, it hit very easily, and you could set one up using diddy kong's fantastic grab-game.

Honestly all they had to do was give it some sort of tradeoff, its important that up-air shouldn't be good for everything, but it shouldn't be bad for everything like it is right now. Buffs and nerfs should be part of streamlining the character and making them more fun to play with and against by giving everything a tradeoff that you have to account for, not about making everything bad or everything good.

Yep. This so much. Whoever was in charge of these patches clearly needs to understand that destroying a move is not balancing it. I understand the move still has its uses, but I don't know how a 6% aerial that no longer combos into itself or has the utility it used to is considered decent at all.

 

[Orocket]

A lot of people give me crap for saying this nerf was addressed at me, but I truly believe it. I won a tournament, with Sakurai watching, with nerfed Diddy Kong, and some Captain Falcon. They changed both of those characters this patch, It's not me estimating myself highly, it's a decent theory.

I think Diddy Kong is currently -really bad- (in terms of winning a national with) and the only way you can make it happen is if you play like a god. They nerfed his spacing, his juggle game, his kill confirms, his setups, and damage output. Dear lord, dude.

And luigi and Sheik? ROFL

@ TSM ZeRo Are you going to drop Diddy? I was watching Zinoto play Diddy last night on a stream that had NAKAT and Ally in it and he really made Diddy look like he can still hang in the metagame. But with this nerf there are definitely a lot of bad matchups against higher tier characters.

 

[W.A.C.]

@ TSM ZeRo Are you going to drop Diddy? I was watching Zinoto play Diddy last night on a stream that had NAKAT and Ally in it and he really made Diddy look like he can still hang in the metagame. But with this nerf there are definitely a lot of bad matchups against higher tier characters.

Diddy Kong can still do amazing things because most of his moves range from decent to great, but these nerfs made him go from being a top ten character to a character with a lot of lousy matchups because his up air is now so awful. I don't understand why it was made so horrible. Nerfing its range is one thing (which shouldn't have happened), but the added end lag is unacceptable.

 

[Orocket]

Diddy Kong can still do amazing things because most of his moves range from decent to great, but these nerfs made him go from being a top ten character to a character with a lot of lousy matchups because his up air is now so awful. I don't understand why it was made so horrible. Nerfing its range is one thing (which shouldn't have happened), but the added end lag is unacceptable.

Yeah I know . His upair was a pretty big part of his game. Now when I play I pretty much never use the move except when using it in a combo (like upthrow --> upair). And about what you said earlier, I'm not sure if they will undo the nerfs they've done. The extra hp added back to luma is a very minor thing. But some characters who were nerfed heavily (like greninja) have received buffs recently. So if Diddy gets poor results in the future we may get some buffs but I doubt they will be huge. @ W.A.C.

 

[W.A.C.]

Yeah I know . His upair was a pretty big part of his game. Now when I play I pretty much never use the move except when using it in a combo (like upthrow --> upair). And about what you said earlier, I'm not sure if they will undo the nerfs they've done. The extra hp added back to luma is a very minor thing. But some characters who were nerfed heavily (like greninja) have received buffs recently. So if Diddy gets poor results in the future we may get some buffs but I doubt they will be huge. @ W.A.C.

When I play as Diddy Kong now, unless I use up throw, I feel like I have to treat his up air about as useless as Jigglypuff's up special. It's definitely not THAT bad, but there are so few instances where the move is safe anymore. It's just a scary move to use now. ****ing balance patch.

 

[Orocket]

When I play as Diddy Kong now, unless I use up throw, I feel like I have to treat his up air about as useless as Jigglypuff's up special. It's definitely not THAT bad, but there are so few instances where the move is safe anymore. It's just a scary move to use now. ****ing balance patch.

What I don't understand is why they messed with the frame data of upair. With moves like sheik's fair and luigi's nair, which come out faster than diddy's upair did, I wonder what the reasoning was behind making upair auto cancel later, have more lag, and come out later. Especially because luigis nair can kill and sheik's fair is a great combo tool. It's almost like a slap in the face to Diddy mains hahaha xD.

 

[BlakBlastoise]

I agree with pretty much everything said about the Uair nerf. Although I still use it quite a bit, especially when sharking, or when someone is on a platform above me. In 1.0.6 his amazing aerials allowed him to do pretty much anything in the air without being contested. After 1.0.7 autocancel Fair was the way to go, applying good pressure and being relatively safe. Now every non-special move we have is ****. I feel like diddy should now be played as a ground based character after this patch, but he gets so little from it that I am picking up a completely new character. Im tired of having to get people to 170 to kill them, and having to win neutral like 9001 times to get to that percent (tho banana does make winning neutral easy). Luigi was my secondary, but Nintendo will(should) nerf him eventually. If this were the last patch ever, I would pick up shiek, but I dont think (and I hope) that any of the top tiers are safe from nintendo's master plan to destroy anything in this game that's good.

Nobody seems to really talk about the downtilt nerf though. That has always been my favorite move by far. Even when Upair was the move of the gods, I still loved the quick options i could use with downtilt. Now it does 1% less, but it has like 0 hit stun. When i try to string dtilt to dtilt at low percents most characters are able to just throw out a jab before the next hit, which is super annoying. Even dtilt --> grab is missing sometimes since they can jump out or spot dodge. I cant seem to connect with dtilt --> upsmash anymore either, which was previously one of the best kill options at high percents.

What do you guys think are diddy's losing matchups now?
Obviously Shiek, Pikachu, Rosalina, Mario, Luigi, and Sonic are the worst.
The superior kill power of Fox, Ness, ZSS, Falcon, Metaknight is extremely hard to deal with...
Im having a lot of trouble killing fat characters, so at this point Im thinking DDD and Windkong are new bad matchups, but it might just be my lack of experience against those characters.

 

[Orocket]

I agree with pretty much everything said about the Uair nerf. Although I still use it quite a bit, especially when sharking, or when someone is on a platform above me. In 1.0.6 his amazing aerials allowed him to do pretty much anything in the air without being contested. After 1.0.7 autocancel Fair was the way to go, applying good pressure and being relatively safe. Now every non-special move we have is ****. I feel like diddy should now be played as a ground based character after this patch, but he gets so little from it that I am picking up a completely new character. Im tired of having to get people to 170 to kill them, and having to win neutral like 9001 times to get to that percent (tho banana does make winning neutral easy). Luigi was my secondary, but Nintendo will(should) nerf him eventually. If this were the last patch ever, I would pick up shiek, but I dont think (and I hope) that any of the top tiers are safe from nintendo's master plan to destroy anything in this game that's good.

Nobody seems to really talk about the downtilt nerf though. That has always been my favorite move by far. Even when Upair was the move of the gods, I still loved the quick options i could use with downtilt. Now it does 1% less, but it has like 0 hit stun. When i try to string dtilt to dtilt at low percents most characters are able to just throw out a jab before the next hit, which is super annoying. Even dtilt --> grab is missing sometimes since they can jump out or spot dodge. I cant seem to connect with dtilt --> upsmash anymore either, which was previously one of the best kill options at high percents. Also, what character are you picking up?!?

What do you guys think are diddy's losing matchups now?
Obviously Shiek, Pikachu, Rosalina, Mario, Luigi, and Sonic are the worst.
The superior kill power of Fox, Ness, ZSS, Falcon, Metaknight is extremely hard to deal with...
Im having a lot of trouble killing fat characters, so at this point Im thinking DDD and Windkong are new bad matchups, but it might just be my lack of experience against those characters.

I'm also frustrated about the dtilt knockback. Dtilit to grab and dtilt to upsmash were crucial to Diddy and now they're just gone. And yeah why does Diddy have like zero kill moves. The only way to get a kill before ~200% is to get banana to fsmash (but every single person who has played against Diddy Kong is aware of this). I feel like I'm beating on my opponent and it is only giving them the rage to kill me at early percents. I feel like I outplay my opponents twofold but then I end up dying early to fairs or upairs because they have 170% of rage and I'm struggling for the kill. Am I just bad at netting kills or does Diddy just seriously lack in kill power? I used to be able to get dtilit to upsmash but that doesn't work anymore until stupidly high percents. I don't want to drop Diddy because he's too cool and he's my favorite nintendo character. I loved him the previous patch because people stopped giving me crap for being "braindead" and I could actually show that I had skills and could make the character look diverse... but now I just feel like other characters have such an easy time killing. Sorry for venting so much .

And to answer your question @ BlakBlastoise : Definitely ness now. You can't trade with ness because it's hard to kill him before he just bthrows you at 100% and you die . Idk about fox but I feel Diddy definitely still beats ZSS (although her upair to upb is REALLY good). And falcon has a hard time dealing with Diddy's fair, you can pretty much wall him out, but he is scary to deal with when he has a lot of rage.

 

[W.A.C.]

All of Diddy Kong's best moves in Smash 4 have now been nerfed. What's next, his banana?

 

[Dr. Bread]

All of Diddy Kong's best moves in Smash 4 have now been nerfed. What's next, his banana?

they did nerf his banana, but they nerfed it by reducing the damage, which allowed the banana to maintain its role as a utility punishing tool and combo setup. They streamlined the move by preventing it from being one of the most damaging hits of the hoo-hah, but kept its main purpose.

Thats what they needed to do with up air. First decide if they wanted to make it a kill move, or a combo move, or potentially make it both but make it more technical or harder to land. Instead they made it good for nothing except relatively crappy anti-air.

 

[W.A.C.]

Are there any actual confirmations banana got nerfed at some point? I thought all those claims were proven false.

 

[Dr. Bread]

Are there any actual confirmations banana got nerfed at some point? I thought all those claims were proven false.

pretty sure they nerfed its damage? has it always just been 5%? i thought it used to be more

 

[W.A.C.]

How hard you throw the banana affects its damage output.

 

[Diddy Kong]

U Air is real ****ty now indeed, and I see why people would be dropping Diddy... Since last patch, killing people off was already quite a hassle at times. But at least the damage output was still legendary.

I mean, these two matches where a pain to see...

 

[Quickhero]

@ Diddy Kong Man that grab release to a banana was hype not going to lie haha.

I know Diddy Kong wasn't at an advantaged state at any point of these matches, but he still did quite well and enough for me to actually have thought Diddy could have won lol. It's also worthy to take note that, at least in the first video, Diddy Kong was using his u-air on things like d-throw which thanks to frame 4 (:\) Mario was able to air dodge. U-air might be a bad move, but I still have faith that Diddy Kong will be able to utilize his other aerials and perhaps find other options for damage racking/KOing. Diddy Kong at least has a kill confirm because bananas and that's always a very good thing to have!

 

[Diddy Kong]

I wish Diddy would get some of his Brawl kit back... He had way better off stage presence in Brawl. And I think his Dash Attack was faster to. And now I miss the duo bananas more than ever actually. Maybe it would turn Diddy into a much more campy character, but if it takes campy to be effective so be it. Also would like a range and damage buff to N Air, because if Diddy cannot combo, I at least want him to avoid getting combo'd. Otherwise he might suffer from a similar syndrome as Mewtwo...

 

[Quickhero]

I wish Diddy would get some of his Brawl kit back... He had way better off stage presence in Brawl. And I think his Dash Attack was faster to. And now I miss the duo bananas more than ever actually. Maybe it would turn Diddy into a much more campy character, but if it takes campy to be effective so be it. Also would like a range and damage buff to N Air, because if Diddy cannot combo, I at least want him to avoid getting combo'd. Otherwise he might suffer from a similar syndrome as Mewtwo...

Diddy Kong can still very well be an effective character this game, so no need to bring double bananas back, one of the main reasons why I liked Diddy over any of the other top tiers (minus Sheik because bias) back at around APEX was because he was one of the few top tier characters that was actually offensive and didn't resort to matches taking forever.

What is Mewtwo's syndrome? I thought his syndrome was being tall yet extremely light which plays a huge factor into his viability. I think it's safe to say Diddy doesn't have that issue though so I'm pretty sure you meant something else.

 

[W.A.C.]

U Air is real ****ty now indeed, and I see why people would be dropping Diddy... Since last patch, killing people off was already quite a hassle at times. But at least the damage output was still legendary.

Readjusting to the last balance patch was difficult enough because I practically had to relearn my matchups since his kill power went to hell. Now if I were continue to main Diddy Kong (which I won't), I woould have to go through that bull**** all over again all while having an up air that's complete utter trash. Anyone that doesn't think it's a bad move is wrong. If any character has an up air worse than 1.0.8 Diddy Kong, their up air sucks too.

I wish Diddy would get some of his Brawl kit back... He had way better off stage presence in Brawl. And I think his Dash Attack was faster to. And now I miss the duo bananas more than ever actually. Maybe it would turn Diddy into a much more campy character, but if it takes campy to be effective so be it. Also would like a range and damage buff to N Air, because if Diddy cannot combo, I at least want him to avoid getting combo'd. Otherwise he might suffer from a similar syndrome as Mewtwo...

I think Diddy's neutral air is fine. The problem is they trashed his up air, so suddenly Diddy Kong players have to rely on neutral air a lot now or else they're screwed. I would also love to see Diddy Kong get some of his camp game back from Brawl, but it's not going to happen. We'll be lucky if Diddy Kong ever receives an additional buff in the future, preferably to revert all the 1.0.8 nerfs.

Edit-

Diddy Kong can still very well be an effective character this game, so no need to bring double bananas back, one of the main reasons why I liked Diddy over any of the other top tiers (minus Sheik because bias) back at around APEX was because he was one of the few top tier characters that was actually offensive and didn't resort to matches taking forever.

Diddy's transition from being one of the campiest characters in Brawl to a really offensive character in Smash 4 was jarring to a lot of Brawl players. If I played Brawl competitively, I probably would've been really annoyed Diddy's camp game got nerfed so hardcore. There's times I want to play super campy with the character and just can't because his peanut gun is so slow and he only has one banana with way less versatility than it had in Brawl.

 

[Diddy Kong]

@ W.A.C. That last part makes the issue with Diddy all the more clear, because the transition from Brawl to Smash 4 made Diddy a far more offensive treat compared to Brawl's campy play. But the way Sakurai made Diddy initially was as an ideal rush down character, fast but with power attached to him most noticable in his aerial game. I miss that aerial game, because at least that part stayed the same between Brawl and Smash 4... Now, Diddy is a nerfed mess. His playstyle doesn't work anymore, and his Brawl strategies are non excistant. So, he's both changed in direction of his style of gameplay, and then nerfed now that literally everything feels foreign with Diddy. I don't believe any character has been as messed with as Diddy currently. It's really quite f*cked up.

 

[W.A.C.]

I think making Diddy Kong an insanely strong, aggressive character in Smash 4 was a mistake. When comparing Brawl Diddy Kong to v1.0.4 Diddy Kong, I honestly think he was more interesting to watch in Brawl. Improving his frame data and combo game was a wonderful decision, but his strong kill power made a lot of players not bother much with his defensive tools or even really try to utilize that character to its full potential. Would've been nice if the original 3DS version of Diddy Kong was basically 1.0.6 Diddy Kong with a stronger camp game, but then who knows how much he would've gotten slaughtered from balance patches.

Versions 1.0.4 and 1.0.6 seemed determined to nerf the hell out of any character that seemed amazing by hurting the frame data to a lot of characters and making matches take considerably longer because a lot of characters had lousy kill power. Though with Diddy Kong, considering how he was a character that struggled at killing in Brawl with an amazing camp game, I think a lot of Brawl Diddy Kong mains would've been fine with the transition. Hell, many Brawl Diddy Kong mains were really disappointed with the transition because he only had one banana and some people who mained him in Smash 4 weren't even fond of him in Brawl (example: M2K wasn't a fan of Brawl Diddy Kong). I don't think having two bananas would've automatically made him broken in this game as long as they were only as good as his current Smash 4 bananas. His peanut gun being faster would've been nice too.

...But it's too late for that. The game went in a very different direction for balance patches and any super campy Brawl character either had their camp game nerfed hard (examples: Olimar and Diddy Kong) or they had their frame data messed with in stupid ways (Example: Toon Link). Best we can hope for is to have some of the nerfs reverted and for other character to continue to receive buffs that deserve it (like low and mid tier characters).

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

> When I can't kill with U-Smash on 110% with Rage...

Might as well go Pikachu via risky gimping, aggressively thrown laggy aerials and Banana-spamming.

Despite this, my loyalty on Diddy hasn't died down. I still find him enjoyable after new adjustments to kill as him.

I'm though bit afraid he'll become Marth-awful if only HIGH-LEVEL SKILL is reguired to even pick him up to secure anything close to KOs if next patches will still nerf him because good Diddys can still secure KOs.

Especially when Luigi's double 12% F-Air on frame 3 after D-Throw seems more massively appealing + better hitconfirms to reliable killing options.

Smash Bros 4's patching on metagame might as well become the bane of it's competitive existence overtime. Hate will talk more than good skill because Sakurai keeps appeasing to 'em more than needed.

 

[W.A.C.]

In Melee and Brawl, the biggest upsets happened through hard work and determination.

In Smash 4, it's because of balance patches.

How is this good for the development of a fighting game's meta?

Really hope @ TSM ZeRo doesn't lose CEO because of this balance patch or else it's going to make this game look bad to Melee purists. I've already talked to Melee purists in the past who refuse to pick up Project M because at any point, an update can completely change that game's meta and a lot of competitive fighting game players want security in who they main. Really sucks that two Smash games in a row (Smash 4 and Project M), Diddy Kong got nerfed hard from updates. Poor kong can't get a break. He was insanely OP in Project M 3.02 though. lol Project M 3.02 Diddy Kong made Smash 4 1.04 Diddy Kong seem not that bad, but a lot of characters in Project M 3.02 were unbelievably good, so it wasn't too bad for that game.

 

[Dr. Bread]

diddy is basically a ****ty character with a banana and some spot-dodge punishes right now.
like i know its not that simple but... its not super far from the truth. Although i think diddy was literally 100% fair in 1.0.6, and even in 1.0.5 had characters like mario, luigi, ness, olimar, sheik, and pikachu who had favorable singles matchups against him?

I mean obviously a frame 3 killmove which simultenously functions as your main combo tool is kinda silly but like... now he's just a boring character?

 

[Diddy Kong]

Diddy Kong can still very well be an effective character this game, so no need to bring double bananas back, one of the main reasons why I liked Diddy over any of the other top tiers (minus Sheik because bias) back at around APEX was because he was one of the few top tier characters that was actually offensive and didn't resort to matches taking forever.

What is Mewtwo's syndrome? I thought his syndrome was being tall yet extremely light which plays a huge factor into his viability. I think it's safe to say Diddy doesn't have that issue though so I'm pretty sure you meant something else.

With the Mewtwo syndrome I kind of meant that Diddy, like Mewtwo, has an obvious strenghts in his gameplay but still suffers because this same strenght backfires at them. For Mewtwo, it's KO power, the offset of this strenght is that he's insanely easy to KO himself. Diddy has this with building up damage, he has no problems building up damage but his weight and fallspeed combined make him one of the easier characters to string a combo against. Couldn't find a better way to describe it really.

 

[TSM ZeRo]

They need to buff diddy's bananas, and give him 2 of them. It's the only fair exchange for all the crap he's gotten.

 

[Diddy Kong]

To be honest, what I would like most of all is a better off-stage game for Diddy. Better air speed would also be appriciated, because I don't get why Diddy has such sluggish air speed but DK's is lightning swift. If his initial Up B would just go a little farther, we could throw in F Airs to finish our jobs off-stage so much better. I bet this would make Diddy kill about... 20~30% of damage earlier than now.

 

[Player-1]

personally I'd rather have them not disappear after 2 throws/on hit.

 

[TSM ZeRo]

personally I'd rather have them not disappear after 2 throws/on hit.

that's what im saying, better and more bananas, this would actually let us be creative and have a skill based good thing

 

[W.A.C.]

It's really too bad they nerfed his bananas so much with the transition from Brawl to Smash 4. Bananas being such an amazing projectile in Brawl was a huge part of what made Diddy Kong so interesting in that game.

 

[Dr. Bread]

DIddy is basically carried by banana right now. If you watch diddy players at tournaments they do almost nothing without banana. Id rather see diddy kong return to his pre-patch playstyle than camping with bananas, as long as he doesn't have a killmove that comes out like a jab. Also keep in mind that luigi is destroying right now with a nerfed diddy, and sheik on a national level is starting to look unstoppable to a lot of players. Just privately hoping they dont nerf sheik as irresponsibly as they nerfed diddy.

 

[btb]

Don't give up on the little buddy yet! Complaining won't do anything, I'm trying to do a lot of things many players don't know about Diddy, and will have a video up soon and hopefully we can advance the meta. Do you guys have anything you think you're doing that no other Diddy mains are?