Snake Flow Chart

[SuSa]

Ok now, seriously.......... I was thinking of making a serious flow chart. But how would it be done? It'd probably have to be done dependant on the character. I can add certain stage influences like "Is there a platform" "Do you have a C4 on a platform" and such into it, and if No it just goes into another option. This would negate having to do one for each stage.

But then for each matchup, this could be a neat way of looking at matchups. If x and y then z. Or if x and not y then z.

The flow charts would get HUGE, but I feel could be beneficial. It could help newer players (and maybe even the more advanced ones) be able to look at a matchup in a new way.

Imagine facing a D3 and just having a flow chart printed out. Look at it a bit before the match, memorize the important details. Play the matchup, not have to be CONSTANTLY thinking about your most EFFICIENT options.

Thoughts?

/thinks its a stupid idea.

 

[etecoon]

it sounds like a good idea but in practice I'd think it'd highly unpractical as it could be bewilderingly complex given the number of variables, and in many cases what the "best" option available is may vary from player to player

 

[SuSa]

There is almost always a "best" option given any scenario.

It would also be amazing large and complex.

Here is an example for SF:

http://mizuumi.net/blah/aliceflowchart.png

 

[Black_Heretic]

I like the idea, I really do, but we have problems running a simple stage discussion, and something this complicated would take an amazing amount of effort and I'm just not sure if we're up to that as a board

 

[etecoon]

There is almost always a "best" option given any scenario.

opponent leaves themselves open for a grab or ftilt, do you take the 21% guaranteed damage or 12% and possibility of a follow up? I think the tech chase is better but it's not quantifiable, it's subjective...

edit: for that matter a lot of the times here you could also dair for even more damage but they could potentially DI out, probability depending on character and maybe if you know how good they are at DIing attacks like that, it's not universal...

 

[SuSa]

Flow chars. They can split up.

"Did you ftilt" "did you grab" "what did they do after the grab" "you can do x y and z"

"Did you dair" "did they DI out? yes, No?"

Flow charts are awesome, you should look at some. They show OPTIONS. ALL OPTIONS. Pretty much.

However Syx is probably right....we can barely keep matchup/stage discussion going.

 

[etecoon]

well if we were to do this, just as a recommendation after looking at the above chart, the arrows should be different colors when they cross over so it's easier to not get lost lol

 

[SuSa]

I did the arrows wrong. LOL

I also would make the arrows using the arrow tool instead of the line tool.

I would also organize my work base to have "used" and "unused" folders with "arrows, blocks, circles" in each to keep myself organized.

It'd be relatively easy to update. This fake one took me like 10 minutes tops to make. It'd be faster with drag and drop arrows + transform tool, and it'd look neater.

I would need to space things out a bit more however, but color changing on crosses is probably a no.. but it'd be easier to see cross-overs (which I try to avoid)

Thanks to the data that we have collected over time (<3 Snake testers) we have enough data to know our options in most scenarios.

We'd cover the more obvious ones. Simply because "is the D3 approaching with a charged down-B?" is just stupid and shouldn't be happening. -_-

We'd cover a TON of options, but only the more "viable" ones. Much like a matchup discussion.

Think of it like a visual matchup that can help people organize thoughts.

I think it'd be neat, but again Syx is right.. we just lack the determination..
[/color]

 

[Zajice]

It seems like a good idea, but after looking at the example you gave, it seems like it'd be a lot to take in. If I were just coming into brawl and saw a giant freakin' flowchart, I'd be kind of turned away.

It might be more useful to people who are more familiar with the game, but most people already know their options, and if not, they can figure out everything they can do from guides and other discussions going around on the boards.

I think just regular match up discussion would be more productive, since we haven't even covered ALL our matchups when a lot of boards are already rediscussing old matchups.


I guess I kinda agree with Syx too. We're a little lazy in here. >_>

 

[nevershootme]

You might as well do it for specific stages where mechanics are different

and really... keep it professional, gimmie a month or 2 and i could get one done on Microsoft Visio but i'm too lazy to do it!

I can cover a few matchups and stage specifics

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

I guess I kinda agree with Syx too. We're a little lazy in here. >_>

I think it'd be neat, but again Syx is right.. we just lack the determination..
[/color]

However Syx is probably right....we can barely keep matchup/stage discussion going.

I like the idea, I really do, but we have problems running a simple stage discussion, and something this complicated would take an amazing amount of effort and I'm just not sure if we're up to that as a board

Agreed 110% We have the syndrome of starting things, but never actually finishing them. Let's see if we can get the motivation to get things completed. Also we need more people to comment on the stage discussion. The match-up discussions NEED to be summarized and next weeks match-ups continued. The one with Kirby is pretty much done.

I think once we start doing that for a good month and nothing is faultering I believe we can have good success with a Flow Chart

*PSST!! Needs more Utilt and Tech Chasing!

 

[Panix]

I will help with a flow chart, I'm actually intrigued by this enough.
If you ever get started on this I can do most of the option's and you can proof read and fix it. Just send me a message and the format or program used to make this. (probably microsoft?)

 

[saviorslegacy]

Sheik flow chart > Snake flow chart


IMO... your flow chart is way to uncomplicated. Nothing in there about tactical ability and combo's.

 

[etecoon]

it was more of a joke, hence why it has funny loops like

did they get hit?

no

spam ftilt

did they get hit?

no

spam ftilt

etc.

glancing at it without really looking at it at all the sheik chart looks just like a snake chart, ftilt is at the center and every situation leads back to it <_<

 

[-Ran]

I was going to write a massive flow chart one day for Snake. I was going to call it the GENOME of a Super Solider. I just would always delete it after I got to the second page of text. Lmao.

 

[saviorslegacy]

it was more of a joke, hence why it has funny loops like
glancing at it without really looking at it at all the sheik chart looks just like a snake chart, ftilt is at the center and every situation leads back to it <_<

#1 reason
Sheik and Snake have the best f-tilt's in the game without a doubt

 

[Black_Heretic]

What about D3, DK, Rob, and MK? They have great ftilts too

 

[saviorslegacy]

What about D3, DK, Rob, and MK? They have great ftilts too

Not as good. MK has a nice f-tilt though.
The reason why I say Sheik and Snake are:

Sheiks can be used as a lock, in the Swan and Saltus Combo'', and in most of her combo.

Snakes is like a long ranged two hit brick wall.

 

[etecoon]

Snakes is like a long ranged two hit brick wall.

that does 21% and could kill if by some freakish chance you haven't staled it.

 

[Black_Heretic]

Not as good. MK has a nice f-tilt though.
The reason why I say Sheik and Snake are:

Sheiks can be used as a lock, in the Swan and Saltus Combo'', and in most of her combo.

Snakes is like a long ranged two hit brick wall.

everybody I listed have more range than Snake's brick wall so they can be used to outspace Snake's 2 hit brick wall