Smash UK Discussion Thread - Check first post for tournaments, facebook info and videos!

[Willz]

GP gon be the WWE champ in a few years dayum

 

[Jolteon]

I also strongly advise against attempting to modify ELO to make it better suit our needs.

Seems you have a lot of experience with this, Aura. We'll do it on an individual game basis. I was thinking of implementing a system where your points deteriorate if you become inactive, but this last point is making me think otherwise. :/ Could maybe do something where it only temporarily effects your points? i.e. if you miss the last 3-4 events you are considered inactive and your points are halved (temporarily), your former ELO is reinstated when you return.

GP: Nothing is really wrong with it on your end, it's just how fb is.

 

[Teh-Shlurpie]

ELO decay is a thing.

for current systems it starts off small and increments with each absence

so if you miss one tournament or so there could be no decrease to a very small decrease
but if you miss two or three tournaments the amount of rating you lose starts to significantly increase

 

[SnareRush]

Lol, Willz your response after Aura's post just reminded me of this >_<

Spoiler

@Aura
While I agree that recording the results of each inidividual game would give more accurate results in terms of pure, objective skill, I think that ignores the fact that that isn't the game we currently play.
Being good at the game (in it's current state) means being able to win those tight sets and put your skill to work when it matters. You say that that introduces subjectiveness into an objective system, but I think that sort of tournament mindset is really pretty core to the whole system. It's an important part of anything competitive. Something has to be on the line to bring the best out of a player.

I guess it depends on what we want the rankings to represent. Straight up skill, or tournament success.

Either way, looking forward to this getting set up and working my way up the ladder.

 

[Heartstring]

Seems you have a lot of experience with this, Aura. We'll do it on an individual game basis. I was thinking of implementing a system where your points deteriorate if you become inactive, but this last point is making me think otherwise. :/ Could maybe do something where it only temporarily effects your points? i.e. if you miss the last 3-4 events you are considered inactive and your points are halved (temporarily), your former ELO is reinstated when you return.

GP: Nothing is really wrong with it on your end, it's just how fb is.

He does have a lot of experience with it, remember that power ranking that happened like 3 years ago? according to aura, that was a modified ELO system and every raged against it when it was put out. for the sake of everything and not making the same mistake twice, lets not mess with that system.

And yeah, i'm aware it's pretty cluttered, I might start deleting messages where people just post 'does anyone live near X?' because there's the location document for that lol

 

[Aurareus]

SnareRush makes an excellent point, it really comes down to whether the rankings should represent tournament success or actual skill.

I'm in favor of skill, because I think the purpose of tournaments anyway is to measure skill.
But if you want to measure tournament success then just ranking match results is the better option.

ELO Decay is a feature added by a few implementations of ELO, like LoL.
I don't think it really makes much sense as an addition, especially in the smash community.
I think a solution that doesn't really affect rankings would be better, like just having a cut-off point where a player is considered inactive.
Like if a player is absent from smash for over 6 months or a year they get removed from the system.

And yea GP, the only problem with the facebook group is that it's on facebook.

 

[Jolteon]

ELO decay is a thing.

for current systems it starts off small and increments with each absence

so if you miss one tournament or so there could be no decrease to a very small decrease
but if you miss two or three tournaments the amount of rating you lose starts to significantly increase

Oh right, awesome! Seems like I have my work cut out for me, then.

edit: Just saw your post aura, what issues do you think ELO decay has? For the record, I do remember a really old ranking system having an "inactivity" cut-off point and it did work well.

He does have a lot of experience with it, remember that power ranking that happened like 3 years ago? according to aura, that was a modified ELO system and every raged against it when it was put out. for the sake of everything and not making the same mistake twice, lets not mess with that system.

And yeah, i'm aware it's pretty cluttered, I might start deleting messages where people just post 'does anyone live near X?' because there's the location document for that lol

Ooh yeah, I vaguely remember this. So vanilla ELO is the best way to go then it seems.

Anyway sb has a few advantages I like over fb, it's much better for lengthier posts/discussions (on fb like 1-2 paragraph posts look "really long"), posts drown there way too easily, you can only have 1 sticky, there's no front page post for newcomers and it's harder to have multiple sections for each region (like we have currently with the scottish/WM threads. I also think it helps people mingle with the international smash community more and post more in discussion/character threads and there's no harm in having the largest smash database ever on the same forum you discuss things in. I have no problems using both though.

 

[Calzum!]

The Facebook group need to be modded better by whoever is mod ( guessing GP is one of them ) it does just seem far to cluttered by a lot of posts that don't really have a point

Plus smash boards does have a better layout for this kinda **** because it's a forum obv unlike Facebook.

Real talk,
GP please tell me you wrestle in My Little Pony trunks I'd pay $$$ to see that **** daymmmm

 

[Heartstring]

yeah i'm one of the mods. It's just an awkward scenario because half the people complain about being too lenient and the rest complain abotu deleting light hearted things.

No, I don't have MLP trunks, thank god

 

[Jolteon]

I don't see a problem with you not deleting stuff if the content is not in bad faith, like I said I think it's just a problem with how facebook works for discussion groups. <_<

 

[Calzum!]

If you think it's in bad faith removing things off there then that's why I suggested SmashUK should become more of a social group(post videos, help on something, new people asking about the scene and anything else that wouldn't require a thread on smashboards) while smashboards would cater for everything else.

But what do I know I'm just a scrub \o_O/

 

[S2rulL]

@Jolteon: I have an Elgato Game Capture HD

@G~P: It's not necessarily that it's bad, it's just that it's very cluttered.

@Aurareus: Too long, did not read.

 

[Heartstring]

I guess so. I just feel there's a lot of people who are a bit...lazy when it comes to looking for things, if its not handed straight to them then they won't look for it which was ultimately the purpose of making a facebook group all those years ago lol.

Speaking of which, gonna announce a tournament date later tonight, so yay

 

[Jolteon]

Oh nice, better than the Dazzle I usually use lmfao. Wouldn't be able to help you with setting it up then, unless you had issues on getting streaming software to work properly.

@GP: Awesome!

edit: While facebook is easier for networking if you meet people IRL and was the main reason for the move I feel we didn't take into account the downsides of it, a facebook group can be hidden/obscure/hard to find while smashboards is the "main" hub of smash so anyone interested in the game will find it, plus it's easier to remember an alias for me. >.> Using both seems like the best solution to me, and that way you wouldn't have to worry about having to moderate the content to make the page clean.

 

[Heartstring]

@GP: Awesome!

edit: While facebook is easier for networking if you meet people IRL and was the main reason for the move I feel we didn't take into account the downsides of it, a facebook group can be hidden/obscure/hard to find while smashboards is the "main" hub of smash so anyone interested in the game will find it, plus it's easier to remember an alias for me. >.> Using both seems like the best solution to me, and that way you wouldn't have to worry about having to moderate the content to make the page clean.

Agreed, there's only positives to using both, with perhaps a slight downside to the conversation being split between the 2 sites. But it should be Okay, I'll add this thread into the smashUK description in a bit, and probably make a 'general stupid question thread' on smashUK too, in order to save on everyone asking the same thing like a million times

 

[Jolteon]

Good ideas, the FAQ should help a lot.

 

[S2rulL]

@G~P: If I miss this tournament I'm gonna lose my ****, I swear to God

This Jiggs Ditto MM in Brawl is HAPPENING

 

[Heartstring]

you had better come down for it then. This **** is happening one way or another

 

[Jolteon]

Jiggs ditto Brawl MM?...


............
....................
...............................
.................














Sounds hype!

 

[S2rulL]

Jiggs ditto Brawl MM?...
Sounds hype!

YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW





LOOK AT HER. THE HYPE IS REAL.

 

[Heartstring]

Yeah, this gon b gud.

Actually, any way someone can take charge of the OP in this thread? it hasnt been updated since may ಠ_ಠ

 

[Jolteon]

With the old forum software, a moderator could change the thread owner (this was done for me and the Smash UK info thread that Aiko originally created). Not sure if it's still possible but I can ask Yeniths or Fuzzy.

 

[Heartstring]

cool, if you could do that, it would be good so it can stay updated regularly

 

[Jolteon]

All right. Do you want to take charge of it? If not, then I can do it.

 

[Heartstring]

I'd rather not thanks, I'm already spread a little bit thin

 

[Jolteon]

Haha okay, that's fine. I'll do it.

 

[S2rulL]

So Jolteon is admin of this and Tom looks after the FB page?

 

[Jolteon]

SmashUK has other admins as well. There's GP, Dami, Alpha Dash and myself. Tom does the most out of all of us, though.

hiii smakis I see you lurking. :>

edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aBA612pEmg

 

[Heartstring]

SmashUK has other admins as well. There's GP, Dami, Alpha Dash and myself. Tom does the most out of all of us, though.

hiii smakis I see you lurking. :>

edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aBA612pEmg

Well, pretty much, Dami, Dash and you all do their fair share of it. However because I'm the owner, people seem to assume I'm the guy who deletes everything lol.

 

[Jolteon]

Yeah, that's true, I've never been accused of deleting posts before loool. Except when I actually went and deleted a bunch of Kyoshi's.

 

[Calzum!]

Except when I actually went and deleted a bunch of Kyoshi's.

has anybody actually cared about Kyoshi's posts though, all he does is badly try and troll looool

 

[Jolteon]

Not really, at least no one has considered them to be of any value.

 

[Heartstring]

Yeah, I received like a dozen separate PM's asking me to delete his messages, and I was like 'guys, I'm not here'
still, I deem this relevant:

 

[Jolteon]

lmfao, I remember that picture. It's really surprising how accurate it is...

 

[Heartstring]

Well, I made it, so I'd hope it was accurate

Also, currently writing the thread for the next tournament get hype

 

[Heartstring]

Okay lads, Blastzone 4 is up! Go check out the thread/Event page:

http://smashboards.com/threads/blastzone-4-brawl-melee-project-m-tournament-november-23rd-2013-london-united-kingdom.341816/https://www.facebook.com/events/1410242219209237/

 

[Jolteon]

Nice, see you all there. I'm gonna practice Melee REAL hard for this one.

 

[Aurareus]

edit: Just saw your post aura, what issues do you think ELO decay has? For the record, I do remember a really old ranking system having an "inactivity" cut-off point and it did work well.

ELO Decay affects rankings despite there being no new data.

If a highly ranked player was to stop playing the game for a long period of time and his ranking were to decay, then he came to an event again and was still very good, his low ranking from decay will mean that the players he plays against will lose a lot of points from being defeated by somebody with an artificially low score that doesn't match their skill level, which will throw off the accuracy of their rankings.
But then I guess this isn't a major problem because an ELO system will always correct itself over time.

@Jolteon: I have an Elgato Game Capture HD

Nice, those are godly.

@Aurareus: Too long, did not read.

That's exactly why I put a tl;dr lol


As for moving some of the smash discussion back to smashboards...
I would absolutely love to use smashboards again, Jolteon nicely summed up all the reasons why this place is a vastly superior place for discussion than facebook.
But to be honest I just don't see it happening, too much of the community prefers to use facebook out of convenience and so long as the majority is using facebook, that's where the discussion will just naturally happen.
Not that we shouldn't try to bring to community back here, hopefully if we just just keep trying to post discussions here instead of facebook people will start posting more here.

 

[Jolteon]

I just want a system that encourages people to attend stuff consistently. But I do see your point about a low-rank-but-high-skill player being able to skew results in a short term manner very quickly.

Also this is the most discussion this forum has had in a long time, I think we can make it work out.

 

[Hao]

Myself, Tamoo & another new-ish player (Jin) are playing Melee again

Willz is here in Birmingham too but I've yet to meet up with him, whoops