Smash 4 Tier List

[Stompu]

So not really a tier list because that'd be ridiculous at this stage, but who do you expect to be the top-tier characters in Smash 4?
My guess is will be an absolute BEAST, and will definitely be way way up there because she seems like her combo game is strong as hell
I don't think they'll be top tier but both and look really strong as well.

I think will also be way up there too with his new aura changes, can only see him being stronger

What do you guys think?

 

[Con0rrrr]

It was an incomplete version of the game. We don't know what'll change and what won't. There's no reason to make a tier list as it'll be irrelevant in 2 months time

 

[Stompu]

It was an incomplete version of the game. We don't know what'll change and what won't. There's no reason to make a tier list as it'll be irrelevant in 2 months time

As I said "not really a tier list because that'd be ridiculous at this stage"
I just mean who you people think will be the strongest, judging by the build/other info

 

[Con0rrrr]

As I said "not really a tier list because that'd be ridiculous at this stage"
I just mean who you people think will be the strongest, judging by the build/other info

Well I get what you're saying, but whatever predictions we're making will be irrelevant so what's the point? They're gonna change stuff. The only correct answer right now is Shiek since her fair auto cancels.

 

[Stompu]

Well I get what you're saying, but whatever predictions we're making will be irrelevant so what's the point? They're gonna change stuff. The only correct answer right now is Shiek since her fair auto cancels.

for fun/because its interesting
I also find it hard to believe that this build will change that much from the final release, barring the releasing off new content

 

[Con0rrrr]

for fun/because its interesting
I also find it hard to believe that this build will change that much from the final release, barring the releasing off new content

E3 build is very old. As evidenced by the detail in Megamans Final Smash, it's at least older than April or March. I bet a lot has changed. Remember, Brawl's E3 demo still had L-canceling

 

[Starbound]

For the heck of it:

S-tier:
A-tier:
B-tier:
C-tier:
D-tier:

 

[Spinosaurus]

Sonic, Mario and DK are looking damn good now to be that low.

Olimar and Marth...not so much

 

[Masonomace]

I'm not too sure about a early-staged Tier List now, but for Lucario's input he's at least B or A tier. In doubles his role in the Tier list will skyrocket to S tier if his past Anubis mechanics remain & he indeed is buffed, Guaranteed.

 

[Halfhead]

Y'all are certainly overlooking Kirby. I thought that Kirby was an obvious choice for top contender after watching HBox play and reading ZeRo's teir list that puts Kirby on top.

Also, everyone DID hate Rosalina at the convention, but she seems like a character that gets better with age anyway.

 

[skstylez]

For the heck of it:

S-tier:
A-tier:
B-tier:
C-tier:
D-tier:

Something tells me you have extreme bias towards a certain character.

 

[Makaronileo]

Tier:
A Tier:
B Tier:
C Tier:
D Tier:

 

[andimidna]

I've been working on a list like this for a while. It's a demo list + Lucina, because she is a clone with a few changes that have already been said, so I think we know how she plays well enough to guess.

/
/
/



:'(

I don't think I need to give explanations. This was mostly based off what I've heard the majority of the community thinks.

Something tells me you have extreme bias towards a certain character.

It's not all that uncommon to bet Rosalina will be close to the top.
#1? Well, I can't agree with that unless people are able to find ways to abuse the Luma mechanic and turn her into a monster.

 

[Stompu]

For the heck of it:

S-tier:
A-tier:
B-tier:
C-tier:
D-tier:

Nice! Definitely agree with your S-tier, they all look so damn strong
Really really curious as to where Little Mac will fit in to the tier list - I know he gets so much love as it is but I just think he's such a cool character because he'll be so matchup/stage dependent

I'm not too sure about a early-staged Tier List now, but for Lucario's input he's at least B or A tier. In doubles his role in the Tier list will skyrocket to S tier if his past Anubis mechanics remain & he indeed is buffed, Guaranteed.

I was thinking the same, definitely A-B
Noob question, why is he so good in doubles?

 

[Masonomace]

Noob question, why is he so good in doubles?

http://www.ssbwiki.com/Lucario_(SSBB)#Anubis_combo

Anubis combo
In team play, the strength of Lucario's aura is based on the amount of stocks it has compared to all of the other players, including its teammates. The aura grows stronger when Lucario has less stocks than everyone else, and weaker when it has more. A Lucario can be at very high power if it has only one stock remaining but its teammate has three. The stock count and high damage can combine to provide maximum power to Lucario's aura. This phenomenon is known as the Anubis combo. In doubles matches where the Anubis combo is exploited, the Lucario is usually the aggressor, dealing high amounts of damage and knockback as the aura grows stronger after losing stocks, while the other player camps and avoids combat, holding onto their stocks for as long as possible. Mew2King (Meta Knight) and Trela (Lucario) were a notorious team at SKTAR that utilized this strategy, winning the doubles tournament after being knocked into losers' bracket.

It's still early for me to create a 'For Fun' Tier list, but in Doubles will be S tier, then again I don't know if there will be a Doubles Tier List that differs from a Singles Tier List, or a Singles Tier List that factors in the character's potential in Doubles..

 

[Stompu]

http://www.ssbwiki.com/Lucario_(SSBB)#Anubis_combo

It's still early for me to create a 'For Fun' Tier list, but in Doubles will be S tier, then again I don't know if there will be a Doubles Tier List that differs from a Singles Tier List, or a Singles Tier List that factors in the character's potential in Doubles..

holy hell, had no idea Lucario worked that way in teams, thats insane
he will be beastly

 

[Reila]

D-tier:

Just putting my expectations in check. If they suck, I will be prepared to deal with it

 

[TitanTeaTime]

Honestly, I don't know why I'm here I never cared for tier lists and trying to do one when not all characters have even been shown in proper battles is a little bit useless.
We haven't even seen gameplay footage of Captain Falcon yet aside from him being hit, so obviously that means he's G tier. [/sarcasm]

 

[Stompu]

Honestly, I don't know why I'm here I never cared for tier lists and trying to do one when not all characters have even been shown in proper battles is a little bit useless.
We haven't even seen gameplay footage of Captain Falcon yet aside from him being hit, so obviously that means he's G tier. [/sarcasm]

i know the title is "smash 4 tier lists" but thats only because it sounds better than "strongest smash 4 characters"
not really bothered about people posting actual tierlists or not, mostly just curious as to how good certain characters will be compared to others

 

[NintenRob]

Uper powerful better then EVERYONE ELSE-
Other- everyone else

 

[Stompu]

Uper powerful better then EVERYONE ELSE-
Other- everyone else

what makes you say ROB and game and watch?
btw nice list haha, I actually think itll somewhat be like that
90% of chars mid-tier, with the rest being very slight outliers

 

[FastWheels]

SWAG ULTRA TIER -
who cares these guys will suck -
screw you -

So, what do you all think? No bias here!

 

[CamZ]

 

[Capybara Gaming]

I think Villager will be at least A tier

 

[Masonomace]

As far as Tier List speculation, will be higher in the list at first as a "easy to play, no risk or reward", due to her being a novice-skill level . When she's mastered in decent hands, that's when it's time to main the "harder to play, harder to master, better reward" character.

Edit:

holy hell, had no idea Lucario worked that way in teams, thats insane
he will be beastly

Definitely, if his Anubis tactic is exploitable like it was in Brawl he will surely be a S Tier character no questions asked.

 

[Leafeon523]

The only thing Pit was lacking in Brawl was a powerful KO attack. Now that he has one, I think he will be at least A-tier for sure. Considering Zelda was nerfed in the demo, I think she may become the new Ganondwarf, as in so bad she needs her own tier. I actually see Megaman and Little mac ending up near the bottom of the tier list. I have no clue about what to think on Robin and Wii fit's tiers.

 

[HeavyLobster]

Overreaction Tier List:

S tier:
A tier:
C tier: Everyone else
Z tier:

 

[L9999]

SS Tier:
Good Tier:
Middle Tier:
Lowest of the low:

 

[Halfhead]

So, I played at the 3DS tournament at Comic-Con yesterday and I have some updates.

To the Bowser-doubters out there: shut your face. Bowser is far and away the best character in the current cycling demo. This, unfortunately, means that he will most likely be nerfed in between now and release. He a grappling, hard-hitting, comboing machiene that don't need no man at the moment.

Kirby and Toon Link are other contenders for the top spot and I think the three of them make up the top teir. I've noticed that Toon Link isn't really being talked about at the moment, but he should be. Almost every match I played had at least one Bowser, one Toon Link, and probably one Kirby. Little Mac, Mega Man, and Sonic were all also very frequently played, but they really weren't winning that often.

Based on the tournament (AND THE TOURNAMENT ALONE), this is what I would say the teir list is:

S:
A:
B:
F:

Keep in mind, this was a tournament with players that had little to no practice where the format was whatever stage Nintendo picked for you (Every match in the first round was on Spirit Train and every match in the second was on Prism Tower and so forth. I now hate Spirit Train with a passion.) and was mostly free-for-alls with items on. This will not be indicative of the final product in any way.

EDIT: I feel uneasy about Luigi's and Donkey Kong's placement, but I've decided that that is where they best lie. It's probably just a matter of them not being able to be utilized in that small of an amount of time, but I don't really see any cohesive strategies with them. Maybe they'll prove me wrong later.

 

[☆Jazz☆]

Tier predictions, for the heck of it. (Don't take these too seriously, not based on the demo)
S Tier:
A Tier: *⁴*⅝
B Tier: /
C Tier: *¹*²
D Tier: Ganondorf*³


*¹ Link seems as if he has been buffed nicely, so I expect him to be C-Tier.

*² Same Goes for Zelda, New Techniques could be discovered to work in her favor (that, and along with her 'buffs') Could possibly be D Tier still.

*³ if Ganondorf doesn't get a new moveset (or a buff to make his attacks faster/run faster), i'm afraid he shall stay bottom tier.

*⁴ Sakurai has stated before that Samus is pretty powerful in this Smash, and since he said that, I expect her to be .A Tier....finally.

*⅝ Bowser will be a force to reckon with, given now that he stands upright and is more pwerful, said Sakurai.

 

[Halfhead]

So I played a lot more today at Comic-Con and have updated my opinions. I had previously ranked Sheik too high, Marth and Sonic too low, and made the mistake of only having 4 tiers.

While keeping in mind that this is JUST the 3DS E3 build, here is the updated list after an additional day of play (and after realizing that I forgot quite a few characters... My bad):

Top:
High:
Middle High:
Middle:
Middle Low:
Low:
Bottom:

I had a very drastic change of opinion in the low tiers. Crazy what playing for more than one day does to you!

Zelda: she is a serious balance issue in my opinion. She's just so unusable. It's hard to explain, but even when she hits hard, it FEELS wrong.

Mega Man: he is bad, but it won't really matter. Everyone will use him anyway.

Sheik: worse than I had thought. Most of his Melee tools are quite different and he's quite vulnerable after just about every move.

Samus: I accidentally left her out completely last time! Oops. Much better than Brawl, possibly as good if not better than Melee.

Greninja: you either click with Greninja or you don't. There is no middle ground. I don't really click with him that much, but I respect its ability to destroy free-for-alls if need be.

Sonic: Sonic might have been my most egregious error in my last list. He wrecks when the player understands his rhythm.

Bowser: broken tier for free-for-alls. He is the best character for the format.

 

[Anop]

Poor Zelda.. she needs to be more like her Project M counterpart..

 

[PrimalCarnage]

I think Zelda hasn't been tested thoroughly enough to say how she falls yet. We're still finding out a lot of stuff in the Zelda forums little by little. Probably nothing enough to get her to high tier, but she could still be in range of mid.

 

[Halfhead]

I think Zelda hasn't been tested thoroughly enough to say how she falls yet. We're still finding out a lot of stuff in the Zelda forums little by little. Probably nothing enough to get her to high tier, but she could still be in range of mid.

I don't know. She's nerfed even from Brawl where she was bottom tier. It's hard to describe what happened to her. She's just broken.

 

[PrimalCarnage]

I don't know. She's nerfed even from Brawl where she was bottom tier. It's hard to describe what happened to her. She's just broken.

Would you describe yourself as a Zelda main? For an outline, here's some stuff we discovered (subject to change as everything about the demos and we learn more stuff about her)
+ nair buff, more hitsun and less chance of escaping, can combo into utilt on big characters like bowser (don't know if it works on small)
+ naryu's seem to have less recovery lag and have a bigger hitbox
+ FW is a really powerful kill move, capable of killing in the low 30% on lightweights. Also much faster.
+ dash attack combos into itself at low percents, has more priority, has a 'sweetspot'
+ dspecial can serve as meatshield, now lots of people have been saying it sucks, but I think it's just way too early. We did see a 2 sec charge phantom really batter a shield, might serve as a nice way of whittling it down from a safe range (considering it has less recovery lag than din's)
+ usmash pulls in characters and has a faster animation, giving less chance to DI and SDI
+ overall system changes is good for her, as she has lots of multihit moves

+/- uair seems faster but has way less knockback, may serve as a combo move
+/- utilt no longer kill move, but can combo into itself possibly

- dtilt now longer stuns
- dsmash has less range, though it's still very fast and safe
- din's fire has a 'sweetspot' but has way less range and it's hitbox isn't as deceptive, so whiffing and sourspots seem like their going to happen more often

But yeah, seems buffed to me overall.

 

[Novice_Brave]

High:
High-Middle:
Middle:
Low Middle:
Low:

EHHH not too accurate probably but based on what I have seen (or haven't seen) this is what I would say. Mega Man has never succeeded anywhere that I've seen. Like, ever. Pit's new side-special looks pretty meh and his arrows are really slow. Zelda moved up to low middle because as PrimalCarnage says, the Zelda forums are rife with finding buffs both large and small for her. Little Mac's air game and recovery are too abhorrently horrible for me to really believe his ground game can make up for that... but its possible, I suppose. Fox being able to jump out of side special now is nice, but he looks... a lot weaker, in general.

HOWEVER, I will say, I honestly don't think that even the "low" tier seems outright terrible. The difference between the lower sections and higher sections is much less extreme than Brawl, I think. Looks much more balanced in general.

 

[HeavyLobster]

Mega Man: he is bad, but it won't really matter. Everyone will use him anyway.

Such a shame Rock comes in as a projectile-based character in the game projectiles get nerfed. I was considering maining him, but I guess I'll just stick with Puff/Wolf/Ganondorf/Lucina.

 

[Novice_Brave]

Would you describe yourself as a Zelda main? For an outline, here's some stuff we discovered (subject to change as everything about the demos and we learn more stuff about her)
+ nair buff, more hitsun and less chance of escaping, can combo into utilt on big characters like bowser (don't know if it works on small)
+ naryu's seem to have less recovery lag and have a bigger hitbox
+ FW is a really powerful kill move, capable of killing in the low 30% on lightweights. Also much faster.
+ dash attack combos into itself at low percents, has more priority, has a 'sweetspot'
+ dspecial can serve as meatshield, now lots of people have been saying it sucks, but I think it's just way too early. We did see a 2 sec charge phantom really batter a shield, might serve as a nice way of whittling it down from a safe range (considering it has less recovery lag than din's)
+ usmash pulls in characters and has a faster animation, giving less chance to DI and SDI
+ overall system changes is good for her, as she has lots of multihit moves

+/- uair seems faster but has way less knockback, may serve as a combo move
+/- utilt no longer kill move, but can combo into itself possibly

- dtilt now longer stuns
- dsmash has less range, though it's still very fast and safe
- din's fire has a 'sweetspot' but has way less range and it's hitbox isn't as deceptive, so whiffing and sourspots seem like their going to happen more often

But yeah, seems buffed to me overall.

Pretty much all of this. Dash attack sweetspot kills fairly early, too. I also believe FW snaps to ledges while invisible now too, but I'm not 100% on that. Ftilt/utilt also come out and finish quite a bit faster, though both are reduced in knockback (which may actually be a good thing for her, considering she's lacking in combo moves moreso than kill moves). Quicker on her feet, and most of her moves look like they come out a good bit faster. Also, this is probably just my eyes being weird, but she looks... shorter, still fairly tall, but.. shorter, which would probably help in the long run, since her being tall was always more of a detriment.

The only big nerf I've seen is - to my eyes - her Din's. Looks... quite bad. Didn't have much to lose there regardless, though, so I'd rather that get nerfed for the multitude of buffs she's been given. Odd thing is that Sakurai seems to think Din's is improved. I don't see it.

 

[Depressed Gengar]

Bowser's going to be high tier at last!
All hail the king!

 

[JFM2796]

*⁴ Sakurai has stated before that Samus is pretty powerful in this Smash, and since he said that, I expect her to be .A Tier....finally.

She was A tier in Melee