Smash 4 at EVO?

[STiCKYBULL3TZ]

Hey guys!

With new games and iterations like Ultra Street Fighter IV, Mortal Kombat X, and Tekken 7 coming to EVO and other large tournaments shortly after release do you think there's an opportunity for Smash to come to EVO 2015 or 2016? I know this would be dependent on the community and how big Smash 4 gets competitively, but do you think it could happen with a good reception from the competitive community? Or do you guys think Melee will go one more year?

 

[dezeray112]

I think it is possible that Smash 4 could potentially get in the EVO line-up next year.

 

[TJ-Works]

I hope it does. No offense to Melee competitors, but I'd hate to see the most recent Smash get snubbed out by a decade old game.

I understand how Brawl was unfit for the scene, but if Smash 4 has a promising chance, I don't see why it shouldn't have a place. Nintendo DID sponsor this recent EVO, after all.

 

[Morbi]

I am honestly surprised that Nintendo did not announce this at EVO. I thought that that was the predominant reason that they were going to sponsor... especially given Reggie's video.

 

[pizzapie7]

I highly doubt Nintendo would let a 13 year old game upstage their newest release. Can't say I'd be a fan of the idea, but it's looking incredibly likely, for better or for worse.

 

[Jiggly]

I feel for EVO 2015, it will have smash 4, due to it being the newest game, and gettin lots of attention. 2016 depends on the support smash 4 receives. It is possible that Melee will come back, but I hope that smash 4 will be in the competitive scene longer than brawl.

 

[STiCKYBULL3TZ]

Yeah I hear that. But Nintendos presence at EVO bodes well for everyone. This plus the E3 Invitational looks very good for an evolving competitive scene. I understand Smash 4 won't be Melee but I'm really looking forward to a new game with a new meta and new characters.

 

[dezeray112]

Guess we'll wait until sometime next year to find out whether SSB4 makes it in the line-up.

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

I would be legitimately very surprised if it wasn't (EVO has a long history of giving new high profile fighting games a go-round on year one), but EVO games aren't announced until the new year has actually begun.

 

[L9L]

I think it largely depends on how much Nintendo pushes it. Community support is important too, but Nintendo's sponsorship means a lot.

 

[Andrex]

For one, EVO had Brawl for 2008, so at the very least I believe Smash 4 will be there at 2015.

Whether it continues beyond that is a question of how the competitive community develops and whether they embrace it or shun it. Smash 4 probably has a far better chance of sticking around than Brawl did, if only because Nintendo's a sponsor now and they'll likely be pushing hard to have the latest game front and center.

 

[Cactusblah]

Now that Nintendo is involved, Smash 4 will definitely be at EVO 2015. They won't allow Melee again. It will be 4 or nothing.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm scared to read any comments in this thread.

 

[xerui]

I posted this on another site, but I'll post it again here.

Smash Bros 4 will be big at EVO 2015, possibly as big as Melee, simply because it will be new and players will still be discovering new things within the game.

Recall that Brawl was also quite popular among competitive players for about a year after it's release.

However, unless some major changes are made to Smash 4 prior to it's release (which doesn't appear likely), it's fate will likely end up the same as Brawl's within the Smash competitive scene. The majority of competitive players have criticized Smash 4 for its limited movement options, and control options that feel quite similar to Brawl. PPMD even said that the characters felt "trapped in the game's engine" and that it was "kinda sad".

If changes aren't made, then it's going to be interesting in a few years at EVO and other major tournaments when Melee is still the big Smash game being played and the newly released Smash 4 is on the sidelines.

I can just imagine the execs at Nintendo scratching their heads and asking Sakurai why a 13+ year old game is the dominant Smash game at major tournaments while Smash 4, their crown jewel of the Wii U, which they obviously want to be promoted, is nowhere to be found.

 

[Niala]

I am honestly surprised that Nintendo did not announce this at EVO. I thought that that was the predominant reason that they were going to sponsor... especially given Reggie's video.

This was my suspicion as well. With the recent success of the demo tournament and all the promotion the game is generating for itself and the company, it seemed the logical outcome.

 

[yahooda]

While I think that Smash 4 looks like it's worthy of some of the spotlight, I don't think that it will replace Melee, it will probably have around the same level of attention as 64 in a few years. In other words, the competitive scene won't be dead, but it certainly won't be huge, either.

 

[SmashChu]

Hey guys!

With new games and iterations like Ultra Street Fighter IV, Mortal Kombat X, and Tekken 7 coming to EVO and other large tournaments shortly after release do you think there's an opportunity for Smash to come to EVO 2015 or 2016? I know this would be dependent on the community and how big Smash 4 gets competitively, but do you think it could happen with a good reception from the competitive community? Or do you guys think Melee will go one more year?

It will if the community can let go of Melee and support the newest game. EVO is going to allow it if it draws a crowd which it wont if the split community happens again.

 

[Pazzo.]

I am honestly surprised that Nintendo did not announce this at EVO. I thought that that was the predominant reason that they were going to sponsor... especially given Reggie's video.

Too early maybe. Give people time to get used to the game.

I'd love to see Melee and Smash 4 at EVO 2015.

 

[Ginger Hail]

I'm almost positive that this new game will be at EVO 2k15 instead of Melee as long as Nintendo remains a sponsor. Unless the community backlash towards the game is that overwhelmingly negative, it's pretty much guaranteed that we'll see the next iteration of each fighter that comes out.

 

[Halfhead]

I really hope that both Melee and 4 are there. Honestly, however, if it could only be one of the two, I hope it's Melee. That would really drive home to Nintendo the idea that air dodge, ending lag, and hitstun stuff is still super important to the Smash scene and shouldn't be overlooked.

 

[STiCKYBULL3TZ]

I thought it was clear that Sakurai's Melee was a "beautiful accident" and though Nintendo is starting to back the competitive scene, Sakurai is still more or less against it.

At the same time, a lot of people who grew up with Melee have the mindset of "Melee or nothing". This means that if Smash 4 isn't close to Melee when it comes to the fighting mechanics then it will be dismissed quickly by a large chunk of the community.

I agree that we'll probably see it next year but I hope it can live up to the hype and become the next premier Smash game. I hope to see it at many EVOs.

I've played a lot of Smash since 64 came out but I'm just now deciding to really focus on my game and become a serious competitor. Looking forward to growing with the Smash 4 community from the get go.

 

[Frank Weast]

I honestly that this game gains a huge fanbase just incase the melee guys do reject this game so atleast we can see this game at evo instead of melee.

 

[D-idara]

I really hope we have Smash4 at EVO next year so I can actually have a fun game to watch, and they should still run Melee so it acts like light to bugs, keeping the toxic diehards as far from the new game as possible.

 

[STiCKYBULL3TZ]

I really hope we have Smash4 at EVO next year so I can actually have a fun game to watch, and they should still run Melee so it acts like light to bugs, keeping the toxic diehards as far from the new game as possible.

I loved watching EVO this year and the hype was real but I gotta admit that I did start to get tired of seeing the usual characters (Fox, Captain Falcon, Falco). I can't wait to see this game progress. I'm ready to see some new characters in action.

 

[SKM_NeoN]

I'd like to see Project M at EVO 2015, personally. Melee is phenomenal but I'm getting tired of seeing the same characters over and over again.

 

[RascalTheCharizard]

I'm just hoping that the meta will have evolved (excuse the pun) enough that we can make the gameplay look as exciting as possible. It certainly would suck to have players fumble around on the big stage.

But that said, I feel like the metagame will advance VERY quickly. We've got plenty of competitors willing to try the game out, over a decade's worth of experience with Smash (yeah I know it's a new game but still) and if this site's any indication, a boatload of people eager to find and test every single tiny thing to do with the game as soon as possible.

 

[Coonce]

Turnout and reception, people. Sponsorship has nothing to do with it. Smash 4 will probably get a freebie into Evo 2015, but if the turnout isn't great or it isn't well received (by the FGC or by the viewers), it probably won't make it to Evo 2016.

If you're sour that Melee might be favored over Smash 4, then sorry? You can't force people to like something.

 

[pizzapie7]

Turnout and reception, people. Sponsorship has nothing to do with it. Smash 4 will probably get a freebie into Evo 2015, but if the turnout isn't great or it isn't well received (by the FGC or by the viewers), it probably won't make it to Evo 2016.

Turnout and reception mean nothing if the company wants to pay for the game to get in (see: Injustice and KI, games that very few people wanted in and many would like to see replaced). Nintendo could very easily force Smash 4 in, but I personally would rather the game get in on its own merits.

I really hope we have Smash4 at EVO next year so I can actually have a fun game to watch, and they should still run Melee so it acts like light to bugs, keeping the toxic diehards as far from the new game as possible.

How can you possibly say that Smash 4 is going to be a fun game to watch competitively when the game isn't even out yet and has been played "competitively" in any sense exactly once?

Two Smash games in Evo is laughable guys, come on now. These aren't traditional fighting games, the FGC (as much as I'd hate to group them all as one) is very iffy and hit or miss about Smash in general. Few of the mechanical skills transfer over and the differences between essentially genres can be jarring to watch if you don't know what's going on in one of the games. Project M has no shot, let's be real here. So it's either going to be Smash 4 or Melee, and if Nintendo has any say at all it will be Smash 4. I'd love to see Smash 4 exist competitively grow into its own beforehand to see if its truly up to snuff to be playable competitively. What I don't want is for a Smash game to be forced into Evo by a company and be the worst game there. Hopefully it wouldn't be, but this is the same guy who made Brawl. And everyone knows how Brawl at Evo turned out. 2015 is honestly a better date because the scene will have time to grow normally and not be rapidly thrown together for a huge pot halfway through the game's first year of existence. But Nintendo seems to be planning on pushing this game competitively down our throats whether it tastes good or not.

 

[Coonce]

Turnout and reception mean nothing if the company wants to pay for the game to get in (see: Injustice and KI, games that very few people wanted in and many would like to see replaced). Nintendo could very easily force Smash 4 in, but I personally would rather the game get in on its own merits.

Unless Nintendo wants the internet to explode on them again the way they did for Evo 2013, I doubt they'll be forcing any game onto them. And injustice wasn't a main stage game while this was KI's first year. So I don't think they're great examples.

 

[Ulevo]

This is a funny thread.

 

[bkslider]

I am all for both Melee and Smash 4 being part of Evo 2015. I would hate to see Melee get bumped though, but I will remain cautiously optimistic.

 

[Frank Weast]

This is a funny thread.

How so it is merely discussing smash 4 and evo

 

[Ulevo]

How so it is merely discussing smash 4 and evo

I know, it's genuinely funny.

 

[Frank Weast]

I know, it's genuinely funny.

mmmhhmmmm if you say so

 

[pizzapie7]

Unless Nintendo wants the internet to explode on them again the way they did for Evo 2013, I doubt they'll be forcing any game onto them. And injustice wasn't a main stage game while this was KI's first year. So I don't think they're great examples.

Injustice was a main game. It wasn't a side tournament. It just had it's finals on Saturday because it would not have pulled the viewer numbers any game on Sunday did. It was also a main game last year, and was the "definition of anti-hype" according to most people who watched. KI was essentially this year's Injustice, albeit with slightly more hype, in my opinion. If a fighting game guy wasn't complaining about Smash, you can bet that they were complaining about one of those two.

 

[Senario]

If people find enough competitive value in it then Smash 4 will likely be played at EVO maybe in a year, maybe in two years. If not then we will have to just let it be upstaged by melee. There are two ways this could go based on how the game is designed and balanced. 1) It is the game that everybody wants that can be played both ways, competitively and not. The competitive scene will in part move on and new players will join in to become pros eventually. This leads to a good community and attendance at EVO for the newest game.
2) The game doesn't have basics needed for competition and people will spend a year trying to figure out the game and still come up with not enough to foster a good scene. The scene will live but not at big events like EVO and might slowly die down depending on how bad it is with everybody reverting back to Melee because it properly rewards skill.

I'm not going to go all fanboy and tell EVO to put a game that it doesn't consider to have enough competition on their list of tournaments. It is up to EVO but it is also up to Nintendo, if they can successfully persuade Sakurai to implement competitive mechanics then the game will be a huge success for years to come. If they cannot well...I can't say I blame EVO for not wanting it. You need the foundation for a competitive community for something to be competitive. Either that or a lot of money thrown at EVO organizers, Nintendo isn't going to do that.

 

[D-idara]

If people find enough competitive value in it then Smash 4 will likely be played at EVO maybe in a year, maybe in two years. If not then we will have to just let it be upstaged by melee. There are two ways this could go based on how the game is designed and balanced. 1) It is the game that everybody wants that can be played both ways, competitively and not. The competitive scene will in part move on and new players will join in to become pros eventually. This leads to a good community and attendance at EVO for the newest game.
2) The game doesn't have basics needed for competition and people will spend a year trying to figure out the game and still come up with not enough to foster a good scene. The scene will live but not at big events like EVO and might slowly die down depending on how bad it is with everybody reverting back to Melee because it properly rewards skill.

I'm not going to go all fanboy and tell EVO to put a game that it doesn't consider to have enough competition on their list of tournaments. It is up to EVO but it is also up to Nintendo, if they can successfully persuade Sakurai to implement competitive mechanics then the game will be a huge success for years to come. If they cannot well...I can't say I blame EVO for not wanting it. You need the foundation for a competitive community for something to be competitive. Either that or a lot of money thrown at EVO organizers, Nintendo isn't going to do that.

Because Brawl totally doesn't reward skill *Sigh* Geez, Brawl hate makes less sense every day.
And I already said it, on a perfect world, Smash4 and Project M would be the main Smash games, with Melee and Brawl left on the past, but Project M has two things going againist it, being a mod and some Melee people hating it because the game's not as ludicrously hard as Melee. And I don't know what you mean by ''competitive mechanics'' the game needs a few tweaks to landing lag and throw distance and it'll be absolutely perfect.

Nintendo will push Smash4 and if they push enough, then the Big N might even override the great poison and finally end the Brawl Vs. Melee wars. They've done their fair share of saving entire communities and industries, so it wouldn't surprise me.

How can you possibly say that Smash 4 is going to be a fun game to watch competitively when the game isn't even out yet and has been played "competitively" in any sense exactly once?

Smash4 seems to be right between Brawl+ and Project M, and that sounds like a whole lot of fun to me.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

I know a lot of people want to see the competitive scene move on from melee, especially now that we have Smash 4 on the way, but the way I see it it will only get to EVO if it has good support from the players. As it is, if the competitive scene doesn't like Smash 4 for tournament, the majority will most likely not make the switch, most of them already felt burned by Brawl. A very important part of EVO is that a large amount of people show up to play the game, and that people actually tune in to watch, there is a lot of money that goes into this. Nintendo sponsoring doesn't hurt its chances, and I'm positive a lot of people will at least give it a try, but I still think that the game will need a lot of backing to make it to EVO

 

[PCHU]

I don't know if anyone's brought this up, but in regards to hype in general...

Let's say this game ends up borrowing some pages from Melee's book and Brawl's book (crouch cancel from dash, dashdancing, RAR, B-reversals) but it still ends up playing similar to the demo in regards to general speed.
Will Melee still overcome it?
After all, SSFIV is ridiculously slow (if you've watched Marvel or BlazBlue, you'd see how drastically different it is) and can end up camp-heavy at times due to chip damage, but people still get super hyped over it (myself included, and I've hardly played the game besides a few rounds with T. Hawk).

Melee outshined Brawl but SF3 didn't outshine SFIV (or USFIV in this case), so how much does Melee's technicality matter?
Like, it's faster and less "constricted" in general than Brawl, but Brawl can still get very interesting to watch.
Do you think Smash 4 might pull a SFIV and take Melee's spot regardless of tech and speed?

 

[AzureFlame4]

I honestly don't see Smash 4 ever taking a spot away from melee even if it ends up being the best thing ever. There are just too many die hard melee fans that will end up pushing 4 to the side regardless of how good it might be. The only way I see 4 overcoming melee is to bring in an entirely new group of competitive players that is larger than the competitive melee community ever was. It's not impossible considering Nintendo is now sponsoring the competitive community, but I guess we shall see how it all plays out in the next year.