Meta Set Ph1r3 To The Rain - Roy Matchup Discussion [Zelda, Mario, Sheik 7.26.15-8.6.15]

[Sora66]

I feel like the MU vs Ness is pretty difficult for Roy. Due to Ness' weight, there's a much smaller range of % that Roy can combo Dthrow to Blazer. Not only that, but double edge dance is a lot more difficult to combo on Ness, because he floats out of it easily.

Ness also seems to be able to edgeguard Roy quite easily, with Pk Thunder and combos him very well due to Roy's weight. I'd love to hear more thoughts on this MU, and to be honest, just how to deal with Ness in general, haha.

I have the same feeling about lucas. Lucas spacing his fairs is very hard to get in on. Also it does pretty good damage to your shield. When i approach him if sh nair, I usually get hit by pk fire or get shield grabbed. And someone please talk about his jab! Its so annoying and fast, haha

 

[Xinc]

I think Roy does really well against fast fallers. I've been in the lab for training v characters like Falcon and Fox. He has enough mobility and good moves that link to his down throw (namely jab and falling up air at lower percents). Those strings are really melee esque and have enough stun to give the opponent some trouble. BF might be a good stage for Roy, since sometimes the up air can send a bit too far, and he can platform chase. (I'm not sure if up throw at low percents can SAFELY lead to an up air on FD)

Characters who give Roy trouble aren't floaties but characters who can safely defend from a distance, namely Rosalina. for that battle, it's mainly a matter of getting in and staying inside. Ness and Lucas are probably similar due to their good projectiles and possible ability to give Roy a headache due to his fast-falling nature with combos.

 

[Solutionme]

ftilt? strong n'quick

F-smash is pretty quick too if you catch them using a dash attack.

 

[sparkaura]

Played my day 2 roy in a tourney today. Was loads of fun, I was hype just playing the character! C.falcon and Fox seem like pretty good MU's for Roy. I actually took a game off of one of our best players here in Columbus and he mains fox. I think spacing characters will be where he struggles.

 

[Macchiato]

Imo the characters roy seems to struggle with are

 

[Solutionme]

Imo the characters roy seems to struggle with are

I honestly do agree with most of these, just not Marth or Lucina, Roy just seems like he can combo them easily and trade hits in a fair enough matter. Though I feel Marth does a better job than Lucina due to the tipper. Also Marth and Lucina have weaker combos though i'm not sure about setups, still might hold true.

 

[A_Phoenix_Down]

Roy has advantage over Marth. Marth's got proper spacing tools but Roy can get in and pull combos much better. Lucina is practically The same. The only thing those two have over Roy is range.

 

[Solutionme]

Also something to keep in mind that Roy has over Marth is that his neutral b no matter how far he has charged it has very very little ending lag which is really OP since he can make his landing very safe. Even if he doesn't hit you with flare blade he will just end spam mashing another move quickly, most of the time his up B if he is in a punishable situation. Keep in mind that this also makes the move extra good at gimping since it has good range and very little lag so if the opponent air dodges you can just hit them once they finish the animation. In fact the only downside Roy has over Marth is the recovery distance, everything about Roy seems to be better so far. Only a few MUs with Marth over Roy are reasonable such as Sheik and Rosalina and maybe Diddy to punish OoS banana throws and even then Marth can't combo those characters well unlike Roy. So technically speaking if you get past the ease of being comboed by other players, the only MU arguable Marth has better is against Rosalina due to the better range and Shield Breaker to punish Rosa's defensive play when pressured. Roy seems to get walled out easily by Rosa anyways.

Edit: Changed opinion on a later post after some matches.

 

[WakerofWinds]

I'm going to reiterate what a lot of you have said already: characters that want to keep Roy out will have a pretty good time doing so. However, at least with Link, once I was able to get in, he had a hard time getting rid of me. It really is all about patience in those matchups.

I don't think Roy has trouble with Roy or Lucina, though. It's true you have to worry about Marth's tipper and your sour spots, but (from what I read) your F-Smash out-ranges his anyway. The matchup feels pretty even, but I think it's slightly in Roy's favor.

 

[Macchiato]

Just know that Marth's sweetspot isn't safe on shield either, it just has hitlag. You have to get a tipper 1/3 of the time to be even with Lucinas damage output. If you can't get a tipper Fsmash on your opponent, you'll be killing 30% later than because her Fsmash is strong. We call Lucina, Fsmash: The charracter for a reason. IMO Lucina beats Roy very slightly, and Marth is probably even.

 

[A_Phoenix_Down]

Lucinas F-smash is kind of weak. It's also important to note that Roy's F-smash kills much earlier than Lucina. Roy can kill Lucina at around 85% while Lucina typically kills around 115%. That's a huge gap. Roy also has a superior throw that can combo into a lot of his moves. I've gotten a d-throw to blazer against Fox and killed him. Roy definitely gives Fox a tough time.

I'd say 55/45 Roy v Marth and 60/40 Roy v Lucina

 

[Macchiato]

Lucinas F-smash is kind of weak. It's also important to note that Roy's F-smash kills much earlier than Lucina. Roy can kill Lucina at around 85% while Lucina typically kills around 115%. That's a huge gap. Roy also has a superior throw that can combo into a lot of his moves. I've gotten a d-throw to blazer against Fox and killed him. Roy definitely gives Fox a tough time.

I'd say 55/45 Roy v Marth and 60/40 Roy v Lucina

LOL NO IT KILLS ROY AT 90% FROM THE MIDDLE OF FD.

 

[Suiko]

I think Roy is not that good against Robin because Robin can distance properly and stop his approach easily- it's harder for Roy to get at him. Also, his aerial range with the Levin Sword can beat out Roy's (or at least that's what I found) so he can defend his air space pretty well.

 

[Macchiato]

Robin is really slow and can't really keep up with us

 

[Emblem Lord]

lol.

Roy does not beat Marth. He has to take risks all day to hit him or rely on reads. Empty jumping is mad good with him though. BTW their frame data is basically equal and the way Roy plays he is far more unsafe then Marth. And Roy being a fast faller makes it easy for Marth to get real follow ups vs him.

Roy beats Marth in combos and overall mobility.

Nothing else. Marth is safer, with more range, better recovery and edge guarding. Trap game is basically equal.

We not even going to get into custom Marth, who obliterates Roy.

 

[Macchiato]

lol.

Roy does not beat Marth. He has to take risks all day to hit him or rely on reads. Empty jumping is mad good with him though. BTW their frame data is basically equal and the way Roy plays he is far more unsafe then Marth. And Roy being a fast faller makes it easy for Marth to get real follow ups vs him.

Roy beats Marth in combos and overall mobility.

Nothing else. Marth is safer, with more range, better recovery and edge guarding. Trap game is basically equal.

We not even going to get into custom Marth, who obliterates Roy.

Marth's moves aren't safe either, it has more hitlag but is not safe whatsoever.

 

[WakerofWinds]

LOL NO IT KILLS ROY AT 90% FROM THE MIDDLE OF FD.

I was completely unable to reproduce this. With proper vectoring/DI, even with rage, an uncharged F-Smash didn't kill Roy until around 110%/115% from the center of FD.

Roy does not beat Marth. He has to take risks all day to hit him or rely on reads. Empty jumping is mad good with him though. BTW their frame data is basically equal and the way Roy plays he is far more unsafe then Marth. And Roy being a fast faller makes it easy for Marth to get real follow ups vs him.

So they have about equal frame data. Marth isn't particularly safe, though, so I'm not sure about him being "safer."

Roy beats Marth in combos and overall mobility.

Nothing else.

Those seem like pretty great areas to be better in, to me.

Marth is safer, with more range, better recovery and edge guarding. Trap game is basically equal.

We not even going to get into custom Marth, who obliterates Roy.

Again, I'm not certain about Marth being safer, given equal frame data. Roy's F-Smash, Nair, and Bair seem to out-range Marth's by the slightest of margins (by my extremely informal testing). For everything else Marth's is slightly longer range, and he has tipper. Range is definitely in favor of Marth.

Not to sure about Edge guarding and the trap game. Flare Blade has almost no recovery, making it great at both. Blazer is also an amazing tool that Marth doesn't have.

No comments on custom Marth. I know almost nothing about him.

 

[Suiko]

Robin is really slow and can't really keep up with us

Mobility doesn't matter when the opponent can't get close enough for hits.

 

[Nabbitnator]

Mobility doesn't matter when the opponent can't get close enough for hits.

Robin's projectiles are rather on the slow side. It shouldnt be much of a problem for roy to get in. If Robin's projectiles were quick and had less cool down then mobility wouldnt matter as much.

 

[BTMWorldstar]

Mobility doesn't matter when the opponent can't get close enough for hits.

If that was the case, then Sheik would be irrelevant (ignoring her needles and such)
Point is, looking at Roy's Actual Range, he has more range with his sour spot than does Marth with this tipper ironically. Range is BTFO.
As for Marth's safety, he has longer landing lag on his aerials and his smash attacks, which makes him much less safe. All the tipper does is allow rewards for spacing, which in this game is much harder to do than previous itterations.
Roy can punish characters like Diddy and Sheik if well played since these characters need to get up close to do work. A well timed smash can land said foes at his sweet spot at the hilt and allow Roy to flourish.

As for bad match ups, any character with fast frame data and little lag after moves to punish Roy are big threats. Sheik and Falcon come to mind. But they're not impossible thanks to Roy's punish potential.

Thanks to these changes, I think Roy is the only tourney viable itteration of the Marth 'line'. Especially when his Up-B is amazing for combo'ing, horizontal recovery, and turning his down-throw into a potential kill throw. Though his vert recovery is sad :[

 

[Emblem Lord]

Marth's moves aren't safe either, it has more hitlag but is not safe whatsoever.

Safe as in can't be punished on block. Jab is safe, so is nair and d-tilt.

Roy only has d-tilt really as a safe poke move.

@ BTMWorldstar - You are incorrect and ignored my post. Their frame data is essentially the same. What makes him safer then Roy is how they are played. Roy is MEANT to be unsafe. His gameplan is high risk/high reward.

Also wtf did that gif prove? That Roy can get a non threatening smash attack for 12%? That was so inconsequential and meaningless.

Roy has more range on about 4 moves. D-tilts are equal. But why would you want to play at that range vs Marth? Do you have a death wish? You are asking to get tippered.

Roy loses this match because his main advantages do nothing to mitigate Marths and him having a sword doesnt mean much to Marth. Not saying Roy cant win. I'm saying Roy has to rely heavily on making the right reads and his higher mobility and cant rely on his disjoint because Marth has one too and can get more opportunities to punish due to the nature of Roys style. Roys style plays into what Marth wants.

 

[Macchiato]

Safe as in can't be punished on block. Jab is safe, so is nair and d-tilt.

Roy only has d-tilt really as a safe poke move.

@ BTMWorldstar - You are incorrect and ignored my post. Their frame data is essentially the same. What makes him safer then Roy is how they are played. Roy is MEANT to be unsafe. His gameplan is high risk/high reward.

Also wtf did that gif prove? That Roy can get a non threatening smash attack for 12%? That was so inconsequential and meaningless.

Roy has more range on about 4 moves. D-tilts are equal. But why would you want to play at that range vs Marth? Do you have a death wish? You are asking to get tippered.

Roy loses this match because his main advantages do nothing to mitigate Marths and him having a sword doesnt mean much to Marth. Not saying Roy cant win. I'm saying Roy has to rely heavily on making the right reads and his higher mobility and cant rely on his disjoint because Marth has one too and can get more opportunities to punish due to the nature of Roys style. Roys style plays into what Marth wants.

Yeah, only 3 of marths moves are safe and nair is pretty laggy. He's not safe.

 

[Emblem Lord]

You are still ignoring me.

Marth confirmed 12 frames landing recovery on nair.

Same as Roy.

How can we have intelligent discussion if we don't actually read?

 

[Macchiato]

You are still ignoring me.

Marth confirmed 12 frames landing recovery on nair.

Same as Roy.

How can we have intelligent discussion if we don't actually read?

What I was the one that said that Roy loses in the first place, I was just stating that his moves aren't safe. Which they aren't.

 

[Emblem Lord]

D-tilt is def safe. Nair is now safe. Full jump fair is definitely safe. Marth does more shield pushback when he tippers. So when you fast fall a nair he gives his opponent more shield stun and shield push back. His tippers also give him more hitlag but the landing will nullify that allowing to maximize the effect of the tipper. Thats why its safe. Before it wasnt as it had alot of cooldown. This is no longer the case. Just so we are clear Sheiks fair has 10 frames of cooldown and that is safe. When you consider Marths range and the extra pushback, no one can get free damage off a blocked nair.

 

[WakerofWinds]

Honestly, Marth's range over Roy's amounts to some pixels on most moves, it's extremely close. "Range" isn't really a factor as much as tipper vs sour spot. That said, I have yet to feel like getting inside of Roy's ideal range is difficult against Marth, due to Roy's speed.

 

[JesseMcCloud]

In other news, I got utterly rekt today by an extremely skilled Luigi. His up-tilt juggles Roy into the mid-fifties.

 

[Freelance Spy]

Roy has longer disjoints than her though and she suffers a lot against long ranged disjoints

Yeah but you have a lot of sourspot, not safe on shield I'm pretty sure. Zelda can use her range as well.

 

[Freelance Spy]

I feel like the MU vs Ness is pretty difficult for Roy. Due to Ness' weight, there's a much smaller range of % that Roy can combo Dthrow to Blazer. Not only that, but double edge dance is a lot more difficult to combo on Ness, because he floats out of it easily.

Ness also seems to be able to edgeguard Roy quite easily, with Pk Thunder and combos him very well due to Roy's weight. I'd love to hear more thoughts on this MU, and to be honest, just how to deal with Ness in general, haha.

Be Marth vs ness, easier to escape PK fire IF you ever get hit by it. The rest is jabbing when he goes for grabs and making him scared of DB due to its transcendent priority. Treat DB like falco lasers and you'll do great. Also countering a PK thunder is hilarious and easy. Marth gimps ness all day. Don't get grabbed.

Then again, this is the Roy forum so I'll have to contribute... While Marth can counter at any point during PK fire, Roy can't. Roy needs to be WAY more careful in this MU. You get comboed more, you get punished more, hell, you even get edgegaurded more.

I never had problems with ness until I played as Roy. Remember, side b are like falco lasers. Make sure you are being respected. Get in his face after you avoid fire. More patience less rushdown I'd say.

Roy is -1 right now imo, only reason I don't say lower is because he is still new. Maybe I just don't know the MU enough...

 

[Solutionme]

lol.

Roy does not beat Marth. He has to take risks all day to hit him or rely on reads. Empty jumping is mad good with him though. BTW their frame data is basically equal and the way Roy plays he is far more unsafe then Marth. And Roy being a fast faller makes it easy for Marth to get real follow ups vs him.

Roy beats Marth in combos and overall mobility.

Nothing else. Marth is safer, with more range, better recovery and edge guarding. Trap game is basically equal.

We not even going to get into custom Marth, who obliterates Roy.

Not sure tbh, I'd say it is 45-55 Roy to Marth respectively just because of what you point out but with proper conditioning and mind games you can punish a dash cancel shield with shield breaker, which btw is a gimmick Marth players need to learn to use properly. Why I say it is unslightly unfavorable is rather obvious besides one point I am going to provide in my opinion. Roy's only advantages are the absurd combo game which leads into more of a aggressive style of play meaning if you get Marth pushed to some unfavorable conditions, he will kill him due to the better kills and combos. His flare blade also has almost no frames of ending lag, meaning it is good for gimping and baiting. Despite that, Roy's stats, **** recovery and Marth's tipper and superior range beat Roy in a logical manner. Similar set-ups on both as well, similar everything really, just that Marth is supposed to bait and has safer moves while Roy has a high risk and reward factor.

As for Custom Marth, that is pretty harsh for Roy. Just because of Cresent Slash alone and not counting the OP lai counter can Marth easily gimp Roy and kill him at the early percents Roy does as well, not to mention extending some combos by 1 hit that deals 12 ffing percent. Dashing Assault seems like garbage now that Marth lost jab reset, at this point shield breaker was solidly more useful anyways.

P.S. Roy will have to borrow Marth tactics and vice versa due to being clones to be played to the max, baiting with Roy seems viable due to his incredible speed but it won't be as effective as Marth due to the higher lag and lack of a sweetspot at the tip.

Edit: On a side note, Roy is going to be high tier, reason being because the top tiers juggle him in the most silly of manners, but he has his strengths of comboing very well and just killing, along with having good strings as well. I could see him beating Mii Brawler and Luigi, just not Rosaluma, Sheik, Pika and Villager. Luigi because he can zone him out due to luigi's poor traction and Mii Brawler because it isn't too difficult to combo him along with the easy gimps and reliable zoning.

 

[HoodsxX]

This is just my opinion on the Sheik vs Roy MU I recently faced a Sheik main in my scene who I feel is a competent Sheik and from my fundings of the match I'd say it's honestly close to even between the two, Sheik is indeed a very fast character but Roy is able to keep up with her fairly well through the use of spaces fairs, nairs and empty jumps to mix up his approach. His run speed and low lag grounded moves also work fairly well as well. As for needles, that's imo the biggest issue for him in the MU as both can edgeguard each other fairly well. Sheik with needles (though she can't sliding needles anymore) and Roy through the use of Counter and Blazer though I admit Sheik still has an easier time. Combo wise they're both able to rack up a good amount of % on each other but Roy still has the upperhand imo in terms of killing Sheik earlier on stage.

 

[DunnoBro]

I think Roy vs Sheik is dependent on the stage.

Anywhere she can needle camp and force your approaches more consistently, she wins. Anywhere that exposes her weakness of people being below her more consistently, it's even or she loses.

Also, with days of experience with custom ganon vs chudat's sheik, I think blazer OoS and pre-emptively to cover her aggressive landings are key in the MU. It seems to have the same major applications as dark fist, which was the only way I could slow sheik down by making her respect it.

 

[adom4]

I think Roy vs Sheik is dependent on the stage.

Anywhere she can needle camp and force your approaches more consistently, she wins. Anywhere that exposes her weakness of people being below her more consistently, it's even or she loses.

Also, with days of experience with custom ganon vs chudat's sheik, I think blazer OoS and pre-emptively to cover her aggressive landings are key in the MU. It seems to have the same major applications as dark fist, which was the only way I could slow sheik down by making her respect it.

With custom Ganon i like to use Dark fists to escape & punish Fair pressure on shield, i imagine Blazer can work like that too.

 

[BTMWorldstar]

Safe as in can't be punished on block. Jab is safe, so is nair and d-tilt.

Roy only has d-tilt really as a safe poke move.

I stopped reading after that. Short-hop F-air, N-air, and F-tilt are all relatively safe if executed well. On top of this, Roy's throws are better than Marth's and can juggle the **** out of him with his weight thanks to down throw into up-tilt/up-b.

If we're talking about landing lag, Roy wins with the N-air (15 vs 16) and F-air (16 vs 18) landing lag games for sure. Check the actual data, though it doesn't seem like much with a few frames,combine it with his mobility and it gives much more life to these attacks.

Marth does win in verticle recovery, though his horizontal is lacking with side-b being risky as **** and customs not the in the picture. Roy's up-b is not only a kill move and follow up, but can imitate a the customs of Marth with directional input alone. And in a no-customs match, that ****'s cash (though I admit your right that Marth win's with recovery options especially with customs in the picture).

In terms of play style, Roy shouldn't be high risk really. His combo options from his grabs are in the same vein of reliability as mario with the down throw options. His kill options both early and later are much more vast than Marth's, and they both have the ~157% up throw kill for cheese.

When fighting, Marth has to rely on spacing and punishing poor smashes/tilts/etc. with tipers and other moves. Most of the other options Marth has lack follow-up on their own, and can be read for days. Roy doesn't need to rely on that against Marth or anyone else thanks to his speed and combo potential.

If Marth wasn't garbage, I would be agreeing with you. But times have changed, and Roy is the boy now

 

[Freelance Spy]

I stopped reading a
If Marth wasn't garbage, I would be kagreeing with you. But times have changed, and Roy is the boy now

Marth doesn't lose based on landing lag, remember these discussions are based upon the characters being played to their UPMOST potential. Not played by some brawl scrub who still thinks fair is Marth's best option. Marth wins because he can control the pace of the match. Roy doesn't beat Marth in neutral, and Marth can combo roy,. Any character Marth can actually combo is in for the fight of their life.

You just ignored the biggest advantage Marth has in the placement of his sweet spot. Tippers zone out hilts. Marth isn't that much slower than Roy, and a good Marth will keep Roy in tipper rang all day with no problems. Getting baited by flare won't happen at high level play as any good Marth has actually played as Roy and knows the trick.

One of the few high tiers Marth has the edge on. The very edge

 

[WakerofWinds]

You just ignored the biggest advantage Marth has in the placement of his sweet spot. Tippers zone out hilts. Marth isn't that much slower than Roy, and a good Marth will keep Roy in tipper rang all day with no problems. .

Players make mistakes. Because of Roy's combo potential, I think the matchup is even.

After playing the match more, I have to agree with DunnoBro that it feels stage dependent.

 

[Emblem Lord]

I stopped reading after that. Short-hop F-air, N-air, and F-tilt are all relatively safe if executed well. On top of this, Roy's throws are better than Marth's and can juggle the **** out of him with his weight thanks to down throw into up-tilt/up-b.

If we're talking about landing lag, Roy wins with the N-air (15 vs 16) and F-air (16 vs 18) landing lag games for sure. Check the actual data, though it doesn't seem like much with a few frames,combine it with his mobility and it gives much more life to these attacks.

Marth does win in verticle recovery, though his horizontal is lacking with side-b being risky as **** and customs not the in the picture. Roy's up-b is not only a kill move and follow up, but can imitate a the customs of Marth with directional input alone. And in a no-customs match, that ****'s cash (though I admit your right that Marth win's with recovery options especially with customs in the picture).

In terms of play style, Roy shouldn't be high risk really. His combo options from his grabs are in the same vein of reliability as mario with the down throw options. His kill options both early and later are much more vast than Marth's, and they both have the ~157% up throw kill for cheese.

When fighting, Marth has to rely on spacing and punishing poor smashes/tilts/etc. with tipers and other moves. Most of the other options Marth has lack follow-up on their own, and can be read for days. Roy doesn't need to rely on that against Marth or anyone else thanks to his speed and combo potential.

If Marth wasn't garbage, I would be agreeing with you. But times have changed, and Roy is the boy now

You havent been paying attention. Marth is confirmed to have 12 frames of landing recovery on nair. He also received other buffs.

You are correct though. We are basically done here. Since all you did was repeat what I already said and didnt use any evidence at all that wasn't previously known.

Gonna argue Roys fair is not safe on block vs Marth, but I would need to hardcore test it. F-tilt hell no it isnt. Thats a free Dancing Blade on block or JC fair.

 

[Xuan Wu]

Since a match-up thread for Roy vs. Ike was recently created, I'm going to post my thoughts of it here.

A fun match-up, in my opinion. I main Ike and use Roy as a secondary. I'll start by comparing their attributes from a Roy player's perspective. ^-^

+ Roy has better ground and possibly better aerial mobility than Ike
+ Many of Roy's attacks, both in air and on ground, have faster start-up and less ending lag.
+ Roy has a stronger Counter than Ike; 1.35x damage multiplier as opposed to 1.2x.
+ Blazer is an amazing OoS kill move.
* Both have a vertical KO throw at around 170% - 185%; both will kill earlier with rage.
* Both characters' recoveries are linear, predictable, and gimpable.
- Many of Ike's attacks, both in air and on ground, out-range Roy's; Roy needs to close the distance to maximize his damage output.
- Roy lacks SH auto-cancelled aerials, compared to Ike.
- Roy is a fast faller, making him highly susceptible to Ike's throw combos.
- Roy is lighter than Ike; the latter can survive longer and make better use of rage.

Both characters can combo and Counter themselves to death. They both also benefit from rage with their already powerful attacks. Obviously, for Ike, he would want to keep his distance and space his aerials to stay out of Roy's sweet-spots; this means an Ike can play the match-up similarly to how a Marth would. Like against other characters, being able to combo out of D-throw from low to KO percents is critical for Roy. Roy's best aerial approach option is to use N-airs as it has the least landing lag of his aerials; for ground approaches, probably D-tilt and Double-Edge Dance. Roy can use his superior mobility and faster aerials to weave in back and forth around Ike. Ike would have to use his smashes more sparingly due to Roy's powerful Counter.

On the other hand, Ike has become more menacing as of the 1.0.8. update. He now has a Dash Attack that can KO many characters, like Roy, near ledges at around 100% - 110% without proper DI, landing lag reductions to his aerials, hitbox fixes, and more. Ike's U-throw to F-air is a kill confirm on Roy near the ledge at around 110% to 115%.

With good reads on both sides, this match could go either way. All things considered, I think it is 50:50 at the moment. Keep in mind that these are just my initial impressions as I have yet to face a formidable Roy, and that the match-up could possibly be further explored. Do correct me if I'm wrong with anything, just in case I end up spreading misinformation.

 

[Freelance Spy]

Since a match-up thread for Roy vs. Ike was recently created, I'm going to post my thoughts of it here.

A fun match-up, in my opinion. I'll start by comparing their attributes from a Roy player's perspective. ^-^

+ Roy has better ground and possibly better aerial mobility than Ike
+ Many of Roy's attacks, both in air and on ground, have faster start-up and less ending lag.
+ Roy has a stronger Counter than Ike; 1.35x damage multiplier as opposed to 1.2x.
+ Blazer is an amazing OoS kill move.
* Both have a vertical KO throw at around 170% - 185%; both will kill earlier with rage.
* Both characters' recoveries are linear, predictable, and gimpable.
- Many of Ike's attacks, both in air and on ground, out-range Roy's; Roy needs to close the distance to maximize his damage output.
- Roy lacks SH auto-cancelled aerials, compared to Ike.
- Roy is a fast faller, making him highly susceptible to Ike's throw combos.
- Roy is lighter than Ike; the latter can survive longer and make better use of rage.

Both characters can combo and Counter themselves to death. They both also benefit from rage with their already powerful attacks. Obviously, for Ike, he would want to keep his distance and space his aerials to stay out of Roy's sweet-spots; this means an Ike can play the match-up similarly to how a Marth would. Like against other characters, being able to combo out of D-throw from low to KO percents is critical for Roy. Roy's best aerial approach option is to use N-airs as it has the least landing lag of his aerials; for ground approaches, probably Double-Edge Dance. Roy can use his superior mobility and faster aerials to weave in back and forth around Ike. Ike would have to use his smashes more sparingly due to Roy's powerful Counter.

On the other hand, Ike has become more menacing as of the 1.0.8. update. He now has a Dash Attack that can KO many characters, like Roy, near ledges at around 100% - 110% without proper DI, landing lag reductions to his aerials, hitbox fixes, and more. Ike's U-throw to F-air is a kill confirm on Roy near the ledge at around 110% to 115%.

With good reads on both sides, this match could go either way. Do correct me if I'm wrong with anything, just in case I end up spreading misinformation.

From a Roy mains perspective you certainly build up Ike's arsenal. If ike can out range and space like Marth can I'd give him the advantage. Sure maybe Roy has the speed, but if he's getting comboed by ike then how can he hope to stand up?

I'd have to actually see this MU before I can really judge. Been a while since I've even heard of a decent ike main...

 

[HoodsxX]

I'd honestly say it's even between Ike vs Roy. Before this patch I'd waver more around 60-40 Roy, but now it's definitely 50-50. Ike got A LOT of amazing buffs in this patch to make his approach safer and kill options more lethal on top of his throw game which was already pretty decent I think he has the tools to keep up with Roy. Don't think either of them hage a significant advantage ovee the other.