Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

[Gune]

*sigh* again, you mis interpet what I mean. -_-

I do not have Zoroak there as a rep for gen 5 even though his inclusion reps it no matter what. Zoroak can replace Lucario as a spiritual succesor and add a new gimmick. Where did I state in my post that it was so he could rep gen 5? Sheesh, I hate it when people put words into my mouth.

The main reason people autimatically think about gen representation is that in Zoroark's case he has no real reason for him to be in smash other than that, He wasnt all that popular still isnt, hasnt been advertised for his gen except for one movie and event that was it, Not to mention he was overall over shadowed by other gen pokemon in his own generartion His inclusion is overall unnecessary and we would be better off with Lucario or *sigh*....Sylveon...

 

[Autumn ♫]

Nobody seems to want to critique my roster? O-ok, I'm ok with that. *starts crying in corner*

 

[Gune]

[Post Removed]

 

[Reznor]

While it's only relevant to the first few posts of this page, Excitebiker was never "considered".
He was just on a list of various NES stars that went through process of elimination to decide which one would be in Melee.
Excitebiker was just one of the four Sakurai mentioned by name and used him as an example of how eliminations were administered.

damn you Internet for lying to me

 

[TheBakonBitz]

The only reason Sakurai chose the Ice Climbers over the Excite Bike Racer was because he couldn't find a logical way for him to jump...

 

[Reznor]

So, how do you guys like my newest roster?

If Sakarai can't solve the Ice Climber's problem than Chrom and Lucina are out

5 Zelda character is too many
Toad and not Waluigi
4 FE reps is too much

every thing else looks good to me

 

[mimgrim]

The main reason people autimatically think about gen representation is that in Zoroark's case he has no real reason for him to be in smash other than that, He wasnt all that popular still isnt, hasnt been advertised for his gen except for one movie and event that was it, Not to mention he was overall over shadowed by other gen pokemon in his own generartion His inclusion is overall unnecessary and we would be better off with Lucario or *sigh*....Sylveon...

Ok really thats just biased right there. .-.

There are other reasons.

He has popularity, not as much as Lucario but it is still there and there is no denying it.
He adds a new gimmick to the game.
He can be considered a spiritual successor of Lucario, just like how Lucario is considered a spiritual successor of Mewtwo.

And I'm sure there are more. e_e

 

[Good Guy Giygas]

I'd say only have 3 Star Fox characters and lose 1 FE character 4 is too many
every thing else is cool love the Excite Bike guy

Which Star Fox characters should I keep? I don't really know which ones will most likely stay/be removed.

There is definitely some improvement, but I personally feel as if Mario and Pokemon should be even in reps. They're the biggest franchises in the world, by far, and with that knowledge they should be evenly represented. I'm not sure whether or not Zelda needs to match, but it should always be the second biggest repped franchise if not tied for the biggest with Mario and Pokemon. Also, four newcomers for Fire Emblem is a bit much, the same with Starfox.

Yea, I felt like 4 for FE and Star Fox was pushing it. I was just basing it off what I've seen people request. I'll also try to fix the number of Mario and Pokemon too.

 

[Arcanir]

I think with Ike it's a little different than that. The way I usually see Fire Emblem being repped in every game they've appeared in is that you have the main mascot of the series (Marth) and a recent, or soon to be, protagonist. (Roy and Ike) It's basically wanting to keep the balance between the more modern characters and the classic characters, which has always been apparent with Fire Emblem in Smash Bros. It's for these reasons I can see Ike going, but it depends on whether or not Sakurai would give three spots to Fire Emblem when I'm sure he knows that there are series' that need representation more than Fire Emblem does.

As for Lucario...all I can say is that Pokemon is always changing, never before have we had more than two of the same characters from Pokemon in each game, which were the veterans who appeared first in the original Smash Bros. Who knows, we may not see Pokemon Trainer OR Lucario to always keep bringing in something new, that way you could have say Mewtwo, Genesect AND Sylveon, either way, Pokemon is a tricky franchise to handle, but going off of what's been done before, we may be getting three new reps if they decide to go up to five per huge franchise. It's all speculation, but I'm sure that no matter what happens, people will definitely be happy with it.

I can see that being a problem for FE, unlike Pokémon the lords typically don't reoccur after their story is done (though Ike got lucky with Priam) so it's a bit harder to fully represent that franchise without circulating.

Pokémon, I'm not too sure I agree. Yeah it has shifted but not by intent, while Pichu disappeared Mewtwo was still intended to be in and just didn't make the cut so theoretically we could've had three reoccurring members rather then two for Brawl. For that reason I'm skeptical that Pokémon (at least for right now) follows that rule and it's entirely possible that if time permits it Sakurai will go the Brawl roster+Mewtwo but of course that's also going into theory.

Also, considering what happened with Mewtwo I don't think any cuts will go over well, some more then others but still there will be a backlash no matter what.

 

[Reznor]

Which Star Fox characters should I keep? I don't really know which ones will most likely stay/be removed.

Star Fox and Falco you should keep
I can't think of who is more important Wolf or Krystal so either

 

[Deleted member]

The only reason Sakurai chose the Ice Climbers over the Excite Bike Racer was because he couldn't find a logical way for him to jump...

There was likely other reasons. Aside from the jump issue (which is ironic coming from the man who made Wheelie jump), the whole idea of fighting while on a bike is quite unfeasible.
Aside from that, he didn't hand pick the Ice Climbers, they were just the remaining option not yet eliminated.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Star Fox and Falco you should keep
I can't think of who is more important Wolf or Krystal so either

Star Fox? You mean, Fox, Falco, Slippy, Peppy, and Krystal? Seems to be a bit overkill.

 

[TheBakonBitz]

That's a hard choice. I believe Fox, Falco, and Wolf are staying, Sakurai has to declone Falco and Wolf more. Making Falco faster, giving him stronger aerial moves, and an arwing would be a good start. I like the concept of Krystal though, having a magical staff and the power to talk to dinosaurs is really unique.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

How is Lucario a spiritual successor of Mewtwo? Aside from being two legged Pokemon that can talk they are nothing alike.

 

[Reznor]

Star Fox? You mean, Fox, Falco, Slippy, Peppy, and Krystal? Seems to be a bit overkill.

opps my bad
but Fox calling in his team as a final smash would be cool

 

[Good Guy Giygas]

Okay, so I think it's fixed now to what people are saying here. I also added Takamaru to this version just because I had one more spot to fill to make it look even.

​

 

[mimgrim]

That's a hard choice. I believe Fox, Falco, and Wolf are staying, Sakurai has to declone Falco and Wolf more. Making Falco faster, giving him stronger aerial moves, and an arwing would be a good start. I like the concept of Krystal though, having a magical staff and the power to talk to dinosaurs is really unique.

Wolf is not a clone. e_e Falco is barely a semi-clone.

How is Lucario a spiritual successor of Mewtwo? Aside from being two legged Pokemon that can talk they are nothing alike.

In Smash Lucario is considered a spiritual successor of Mewtwo, I didn't mean in Pokemon. And I don't mean that Lucario is a clone of Mewtow. But there are certain similarities in Smash that they share that can be considered as spiritual. various atacks of Mewtwo have a dark aroura, all of Lucario's move have an aoura. Both of the neutral Bs have a simmilar animation to each other that differs from Samus' neutral B. Both have a slightly simmaler way of moving to an extent. The simmilarities are there, they are jsut subtle. And again let me point out that spiritual successor does not mean clone.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Okay, so I think it's fixed now to what people are saying here. I also added Takamaru to this version just because I had one more spot to fill to make it look even.

​

​

So while I disagree with Chrom over Roy, that's personal preference so, I won't hold that against the roster.

I honestly can't see anything wrong with this roster aside from possibly being too big. Even then, it's within the realm of possibility.

9.5/10

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

Are we still on the topic of retro characters, whining about Noah, or about StarFox?


I'm
So
Lost.......


Aside from Takamaru, I would love to see Mach Rider, Prince Sable, Lip, or Sheriff as Retros. I personally think we will just get one but who knows.

And I do think the Mac is a rebooted Retro.

 

[TheBakonBitz]

Anyone want to rate mine?
http://smashboards.com/entries/bakons-ssb4-roster-and-move-set-changes.4739/

 

[Hotfeet444]

I can see that being a problem for FE, unlike Pokémon the lords typically don't reoccur after their story is done (though Ike got lucky with Priam) so it's a bit harder to fully represent that franchise without circulating.

Pokémon, I'm not too sure I agree. Yeah it has shifted but not by intent, while Pichu disappeared Mewtwo was still intended to be in and just didn't make the cut so theoretically we could've had three reoccurring members rather then two for Brawl. For that reason I'm skeptical that Pokémon (at least for right now) follows that rule and it's entirely possible that if time permits it Sakurai will go the Brawl roster+Mewtwo but of course that's also going into theory.

Also, considering what happened with Mewtwo I don't think any cuts will go over well, some more then others but still there will be a backlash no matter what.

There will always be backlash no matter what happens, and I know Sakurai knows this. I'm sure there are people that were sad Pichu was cut...even though he was terrible, but people will always learn to love a character no matter what setbacks they may have.

Mewtwo is more obvious though, he's one of the big three faces of Pokemon, next to Eevee. Mewtwo should have been there, so fixing that error is simple, but what else is represented is almost unknown. Aside from Pokemon Trainer not really needing to be there, I think that the next thing to represent is the Eevee family and the only pokemon that's truly evil due to it's created for that purpose, Genesect. However, there is one way I can see The Pokemon Trainer be included that would make it look as if he's not a cheap excuse for Charizard. A HeartGold/SoulSilver pokemon trainer using Totodile, Grovyle and Charizard, three big pokemon from three different generations. Many would find this clumsy, but it's not out of the realm of possibility as you can easily start with Totodile and obtain a Treecko and Charmander in the after-game after defeating Red. At least that way they'd be doing something different with the pokemon representation without making a cheap excuse for Charizard to stay.

 

[Opossum]

Okay, so I think it's fixed now to what people are saying here. I also added Takamaru to this version just because I had one more spot to fill to make it look even.

​

Wow, I really like this roster now. The ExciteBiker is definitely a surprising, but interesting choice. Definitely something that could be interesting. And while I would prefer Roy over Chrom, I like them both very much, so that doesn't really bother me, haha. I'd give this roster a thumbs up.

 

[FlareHabanero]

So anyway, that Noah guy was talking about characters being unfamiliar to commoners not deserving to be in Super Smash Bros., correct? If that's the case, let me just state this briefly.

To a commoner, their standards as to what is considered logical is something like Sora, or Goku, or Master Chief. Basically, more illogical stuff that clashes with the theme with a Nintendo crossover, which is of course not a good thing and should really not be taken into consideration. Not to mention to a commoner, practically 70% of the roster is not familiar to them (you'll be surprised how many people don't know who "Metroid" is) anyway, so why should that be a concern now? It's not like anything in particular bad happens when lesser known content is introduced, in fact it causes the contrary by introducing people to a much more broad library of games. Basically, a stepping stone crossover titles typically employ.

 

[Arcanir]

There will always be backlash no matter what happens, and I know Sakurai knows this. I'm sure there are people that were sad Pichu was cut...even though he was terrible, but people will always learn to love a character no matter what setbacks they may have.

Mewtwo is more obvious though, he's one of the big three faces of Pokemon, next to Eevee. Mewtwo should have been there, so fixing that error is simple, but what else is represented is almost unknown. Aside from Pokemon Trainer not really needing to be there, I think that the next thing to represent is the Eevee family and the only pokemon that's truly evil due to it's created for that purpose, Genesect. However, there is one way I can see The Pokemon Trainer be included that would make it look as if he's not a cheap excuse for Charizard. A HeartGold/SoulSilver pokemon trainer using Totodile, Grovyle and Charizard, three big pokemon from three different generations. Many would find this clumsy, but it's not out of the realm of possibility as you can easily start with Totodile and obtain a Treecko and Charmander in the after-game after defeating Red. At least that way they'd be doing something different with the pokemon representation without making a cheap excuse for Charizard to stay.

Point taken, I'm just not keen on Lucario leaving since I think he has enough reason to stick around.

Eevee I agree would be an good choice for Smash, it's just trying to figure out what could work to represent every Eeveelution without just focusing on one or two. As for the PT suggestion I'd wouldn't mind seeing that either though I would be disappointed to see Squirtle and Ivysaur leave. Having said that, the only clumsy choice I'd say would be Totodile as Grovyle's one of the more popular middle forms and Charizard goes without saying and even then I think it's popular enough. Also, I don't think Genesect's truly evil, at least not anymore then Mewtwo was intended to be.

 

[8-peacock-8]

Anyone want to rate mine?
http://smashboards.com/entries/bakons-ssb4-roster-and-move-set-changes.4739/

Looks good.

However, separating Shiek and Zelda and separating Zero Suit Samus and Samus bugs me. I also dislike how you removed Mr. Game & Watch and ROB.

 

[Starbound]

two... hours... later

i think i put way too much thought into these >_>

Lucario is the only cut. 48 slots + 6 transformations = 54.

I think having lines poke out makes it look nicer than a square box.

[collapse=Reasoning]
Bowser Jr: Paintbrush makes him really unique. So would several Mario minions that he'd use as his specials.

Paper Mario: Applying stickers to himself gives him a lot of moves to choose from and it makes him stick out.

King K. Rool: We've yet to see a pirate in Smash, nor have we seen someone with canonballs. We now do.

Palutena: The staff is a key part in making her unique. We've also got light rays.

Takamaru: Ninja stars, fireballs, ninja smoke.

Mach Rider: Retro character with a lot of source material. Fighting on a bike could prove to be interesting. Easily the most replaceable character on the list though.

Shulk: Sword user that attacks at range makes him much different from the FE characters. Won out over Isaac due to Japanese popularity.

Karate Joe: After seeing Wii Fit Trainer, he just looks like he fits in so well. Karate poses would help set him apart from WFT's yoga. Won out over Little Mac due to having more material to draw from.

Prince Sable: No other character in Nintendo's history can transform into animals, as far as I'm aware. For simple programming, he transforms for attacks, and then reverts back to a human for idling.

Chrom+Lucina. Once they know how to make Ice Climbers work, adding a second character who functions would be really easy. These two are set apart from the other cast due to revolving around the mechanic "Pair Up" and have the ability to switch their leader.[/quote]

 

[shinhed-echi]

So this is a generic roster people want but we probably wont get.....

I admit this is the roster I like the most from the past 5 pages. Though 52 Characters may be a tiny stretch, I don't see it outside the realm of possibilities.

It has: Little Mac, Isaac, (Sonic), (Pokemon Trainer), Takamaru, and Classic Link. Definitely approved.

... just a bit disgusted by the lack of Saki love. j/k it's all good either way. XD

 

[8-peacock-8]

I admit this is the roster I like the most from the past 5 pages. Though 52 Characters may be a tiny stretch, I don't see it outside the realm of possibilities.

It has: Little Mac, Isaac, (Sonic), (Pokemon Trainer), Takamaru, and Classic Link. Definitely approved.

... just a bit disgusted by the lack of Saki love. j/k it's all good either way. XD

But it's 47 characters......

Lol. I also want Saki. (i love SIn & Punishment)

 

[Autumn ♫]

5 Zelda character is too many
Toad and not Waluigi
4 FE reps is too much

every thing else looks good to me

May I ask why 5 Zelda is too many and how Waluigi has more importance to Mario than Toad does?

 

[Hotfeet444]

Point taken, I'm just not keen on Lucario leaving since I think he has enough reason to stick around.

Eevee I agree would be an good choice for Smash, it's just trying to figure out what could work to represent every Eeveelution without just focusing on one or two. As for the PT suggestion I'd wouldn't mind seeing that either though I would be disappointed to see Squirtle and Ivysaur leave. Having said that, the only clumsy choice I'd say would be Totodile as Grovyle's one of the more popular middle forms and Charizard goes without saying and even then I think it's popular enough. Also, I don't think Genesect's truly evil, at least not anymore then Mewtwo was intended to be.

Sticking with Sylveon is probably the best course of action due to its bows allow it to be a prominent fighter while still being a quadruped, perhaps calling out the other forms for a final Smash so that everyone in the family is represented at least a little bit. Totodile is pretty popular however, and fits the role of the Pokemon Trainer starting out with a Pokemon from his own region. And I wouldn't say that. Mewtwo wasn't created for the purpose of being evil, it just became that way thanks to experimentation. Genesect, however, was created to be the pawn of a villainous team, and thanks to it being a machine, its mind is programmed to follow their every order, making it probably alot more evil than that of Mewtwo in the sense of actually supposed to be evil rather than on accident. But Mewtwo does have the one-up on Genesect, being the only Pokemon we know that has actually killed people.

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

Anyone want to rate mine?
http://smashboards.com/entries/bakons-ssb4-roster-and-move-set-changes.4739/

Looks alright but I'm highly doubtful that Zelda/Shiek and Samus/ZSS will be separated. I would keep them together and free up some space.

Not a huge fan of Waluigi but that's just bias.
I'm surprised not to see Chrom but Roy is a great alternate with a lot of popularity.

One thing I'm concerned about is the lack of new franchises aside from Mega Man, Wii Fit, and Animal Crossing. You only have 4 while SSBB had 5. I personally think we may even see more than 5 this time around.

As well, I'm concerned about a lack of a Retro character. Takamaru is viewed as highly likely.

While I'd love to see Samurai Goroh or Black Shadow as a 2nd rep, Im doubtful F-Zero will get a 2nd rep.

Finally, while I can see Lucas getting axed, I question why you took out MGW and ROB - both unique and proven characters -especially MGW. They are staying or at least MGW is.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

If we get a new Mario rep, it's either going to be Toad and/or Bowser Jr. because of their importance in the main games or Paper Mario to show off the Mario RPGs.

Waluigi and Geno (and pretty much anyone else from the Mario franchise) doesn't have a good shot.

 

[Gune]

Ok really thats just biased right there. .-.

There are other reasons.

He has popularity, not as much as Lucario but it is still there and there is no denying it.
He adds a new gimmick to the game.
He can be considered a spiritual successor of Lucario, just like how Lucario is considered a spiritual successor of Mewtwo.

And I'm sure there are more. e_e

I wasnt trying to be biased but ill admit i am kind off bias towards Zoroark to some degree that being said I was just being blunt. Im sorry if I sounded like an *** though I didnt mean it like that...

 

[shinhed-echi]

But it's 47 characters......

Lol. I also want Saki. (i love SIn & Punishment)

What? Man my eyes deceived me!

For a 47 slot roster... it's more than fine. :O
I really hope that's the one we get.

Though I'm a bit confused on Classic Link. I mean, I really like it, despite me hating the idea of a single character being represented twice (except if it has an alter-ego like Zelda/Sheik, or a case like Samus/ZSS)
Would he be short like in the game? Or will he be as tall as regular Link due to his artwork?

(I admit I rather have no 2nd Link, but if he HAS to, Classic Link for me please).

 

[8-peacock-8]

What? Man my eyes deceived me!

For a 47 slot roster... it's more than fine. :O
I really hope that's the one we get.

Though I'm a bit confused on Classic Link. I mean, I really like it, despite me hating the idea of a single character being represented twice (except if it has an alter-ego like Zelda/Sheik, or a case like Samus/ZSS)
Would he be short like in the game? Or will he be as tall as regular Link due to his artwork?

(I admit I rather have no 2nd Link, but if he HAS to, Classic Link for me please).

He'd probably be like how he is in game. That way he wont look exactly link regular Link.

 

[Rebellious Treecko]

So, how do you guys like my newest roster?

If Sakarai can't solve the Ice Climber's problem than Chrom and Lucina are out

-You have at least 3 FE reps. I'm fine with this.

-5 Mario and Pokemon reps, and you have Toad. I'm fine with this. You have the whole original cast of Super Mario Bros.

-Either remove Dixie Kong and replace her with Isaac, or pair her up with Kiddy Kong and make her Dixie & Kiddy to make her stand out more from Diddy. (of course, there's the Ice Climber problem)

-Not sure about Vaati or Impa. Impa seems more likely than Vaati due to being a supporting character in the series since the start.

One of the best rosters I've seen so far.

 

[Hotfeet444]

Wait a second...I can't believe I didn't think of this...

While I will easily say that Kirby does not need another rep, what if there was one more? Well, most would assume a Waddle Dee right? Well...what about this guy?

It's be interesting to see what they could do with Galacta Knight. And if they don't put him in...at least give us that incredible battle music...

Personally, I'd be more disappointed in the music not making it in than the character.

 

[Morbi]

Wait a second...I can't believe I didn't think of this...

While I will easily say that Kirby does not need another rep, what if there was one more? Well, most would assume a Waddle Dee right? Well...what about this guy?


It's be interesting to see what they could do with Galacta Knight. And if they don't put him in...at least give us that incredible battle music...



Personally, I'd be more disappointed in the music not making it in than the character.

He is already an alternate color for Metaknight.

No seriously though. I would love his song to make it in the game. If create-a-stage comes back... this would be the only song I would use.

 

[jaytalks]

5 Zelda character is too many
Toad and not Waluigi
4 FE reps is too much

every thing else looks good to me

May I ask why 5 Zelda is too many and how Waluigi has more importance to Mario than Toad does?

5 Zelda reps is not too many provided Pokemon and Mario both have 5 reps.
Toad is better rep than Waluigi, as Toad has actually been in the platforming Mario games. Also, you could have the whole Mario 2 roster.

With retro characters, they don't need to have a moveset that is solely from their game. I think that is the whole point of a redesign. Look at Ice Climbers and Pit for Sakurai's approach to how to give a retro design a more viable moveset. The Ice Climbers can control ice and the cold, while Pit gained the ability to split up his bow into blades. So I don't think a lack of a viable moveset would hamper someone like Lip.

 

[Frostwraith]

It's not like anything in particular bad happens when lesser known content is introduced, in fact it causes the contrary by introducing people to a much more broad library of games. Basically, a stepping stone crossover titles typically employ.

Just wanted to say how much I agree with this and one of the main reasons I like crossover games.