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Rate their Chances: the DLC Edition. Day: 192: The final day
- Thread starter colder_than_ice
- Start date
D
Deleted member
Guest
Zael
Chances : 17%
Want : 97%
Prediction : Bayonetta = 21%
Doesn't look good, captain.
Nominations
Jin Kazama ( Tekken ) = x3
Black Shadow ( F-ZERO ) = x2
Chances : 17%
Want : 97%
Prediction : Bayonetta = 21%
Doesn't look good, captain.
Nominations
Jin Kazama ( Tekken ) = x3
Black Shadow ( F-ZERO ) = x2
FancySmash
Smash Lord
Zael - Shulk's Luigi (A.K.A. his shadow)
Chance
5% - I suppose having a trophy in the game can account for something. However, just because his series isn't represented, doesn't mean he gets a boost in chance. The only two I feel that have that going for them are Snake and the Ice Climbers, primarily because they're hardened Smash Veterans. Otherwise, characters like Zael aren't gonna get a boost from not being represented. Otherwise, his game is very obscure, especially when comparing it to it's brother, Xenoblade, and I don't think there's much support for the character. Heck, does Zael even have his own support thread? (Actually kinda serious about that, does he?)
Want
Yeah, I'm sorry. I just can't find myself to be interested in him. I actually didn't even know Shulk was a thing before Smash Bros., so I'm assuming he was relatively obscure before Smash as well, much less did I know about Zael. Plus, another sword user. I'm going to admit, Link is probably my favorite sword user, just because of the fact that he doesn't only use the sword, but a mix of bombs, arrows, boomerangs, and sword. While the Mii Swordsman/woman isn't the best Mii, it's unique. Then we get to Fire Emblem, and... ugh, it's all swords. Marth, sword. Lucina, sword. Roy (soon to be I suppose), sword, and all three are extremely similar. I'm OK with Ike, because he's at least unique, and a heavy hitter (rare for sword users). That's why I thoroughly enjoyed Robin's inclusion over Chrom. Yes, Robin has a sword, but he's extremely unique. Shulk is OK, but honestly, I'm just sick of sword users, I feel that they're tapped out.
...of course, with Shulk, Robin, Mii Sword user, and Link being unique, I suppose that doesn't mean Zael can't be...
Alright, I'll give him 5%.
Prediction: Bayoneta - Oh boy, is this day going to be hilarious. Bayoneta is on the completely opposite side of the M spectrum that Snake is on, very opposite indeed. How about 7.46%
Nominations:
Meowth X5
Chance
5% - I suppose having a trophy in the game can account for something. However, just because his series isn't represented, doesn't mean he gets a boost in chance. The only two I feel that have that going for them are Snake and the Ice Climbers, primarily because they're hardened Smash Veterans. Otherwise, characters like Zael aren't gonna get a boost from not being represented. Otherwise, his game is very obscure, especially when comparing it to it's brother, Xenoblade, and I don't think there's much support for the character. Heck, does Zael even have his own support thread? (Actually kinda serious about that, does he?)
Want
Yeah, I'm sorry. I just can't find myself to be interested in him. I actually didn't even know Shulk was a thing before Smash Bros., so I'm assuming he was relatively obscure before Smash as well, much less did I know about Zael. Plus, another sword user. I'm going to admit, Link is probably my favorite sword user, just because of the fact that he doesn't only use the sword, but a mix of bombs, arrows, boomerangs, and sword. While the Mii Swordsman/woman isn't the best Mii, it's unique. Then we get to Fire Emblem, and... ugh, it's all swords. Marth, sword. Lucina, sword. Roy (soon to be I suppose), sword, and all three are extremely similar. I'm OK with Ike, because he's at least unique, and a heavy hitter (rare for sword users). That's why I thoroughly enjoyed Robin's inclusion over Chrom. Yes, Robin has a sword, but he's extremely unique. Shulk is OK, but honestly, I'm just sick of sword users, I feel that they're tapped out.
...of course, with Shulk, Robin, Mii Sword user, and Link being unique, I suppose that doesn't mean Zael can't be...
Alright, I'll give him 5%.
Prediction: Bayoneta - Oh boy, is this day going to be hilarious. Bayoneta is on the completely opposite side of the M spectrum that Snake is on, very opposite indeed. How about 7.46%
Nominations:
Meowth X5
D
Deleted member
Guest
Yes, he does, but it was never very active, it didn't last very long, and it's currently locked. I wasn't exaggerating when I stated earlier that Zael suffers from minuscule ballot support, even among his own fanbase.
http://smashboards.com/threads/bear...-outsider-zael-for-super-smash-bros-4.335986/
Yomi's Biggest Fan
See You Next Year, Baby
- Joined
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- Takamaru64
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Brb going to tell a certain Grass Type Pokemon to unlock the thread.
I'll give my ratings on him later since I have to spend some time with my girlfriend for now.
FancySmash
Smash Lord
Gee, didn't know that. Well, perhaps his supporters will be more active now that we've rated him in Rate their chances...
I mean, I might not be enthusiastic for him, but that doesn't mean others aren't and would like a place to discuss him. Maybe things have changed and he'll get more attention from his fans...
I messaged the creator of that thread, Scoliosis Jones, and it is now unlocked.
Drason
Smash Journeyman
Zael
Chances: 15%
Want:10%
I have no input
Nominations:
TalimX5(SoulCalibur)
Chances: 15%
Want:10%
I have no input
Nominations:
TalimX5(SoulCalibur)
BandanaWaddleDee
Smash Lord
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- 1,744
- Location
- There
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- bdon25
- 3DS FC
- 1633-4187-3079
- Switch FC
- 2967-5142-5603
Zael
Chance: .1%
It doesn't seem like people really care about this guy
Want: 0%
I have no reason to want him. He looks generic and I never played his game
Bayonetta Prediction: 12%
There's going to be a heck of a lot of overrating.
Nominations:
Leon Powalski x5
Chance: .1%
It doesn't seem like people really care about this guy
Want: 0%
I have no reason to want him. He looks generic and I never played his game
Bayonetta Prediction: 12%
There's going to be a heck of a lot of overrating.
Nominations:
Leon Powalski x5
DukeofShorts
Smash Journeyman
Zael chance : 5%
Zael want: 2%
Bayonetta prediction: 32.01%
Anthony Higgs x4
Groose x1
Zael want: 2%
Bayonetta prediction: 32.01%
Anthony Higgs x4
Groose x1
Yomi's Biggest Fan
See You Next Year, Baby
- Joined
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- 26,203
- Location
- Chicago, Illinois
- NNID
- Takamaru64
- 3DS FC
- 1375-7346-9605
- Switch FC
- SW-8277-6509-2593
Sigh, going to get this over with since tonight's going to get very busy with the retro games. This is what happens when you meet someone very clingy. :/
Zael
Chance: 5%
Little ballot support, his game was nowhere near Xenoblade levels of popularity, and he was lucky to get a trophy. Such a shame since he seems like a cool character from a great game.
Want: Abstain
Haven't played played all of The Last Story to really want him, but he seems like a character that would fit in well. And let me tell you that he at least has some interesting abilities to be more than an ordinary swordsman.
Prediction: Bayonetta: 30%
Nomination: Takamaru x5 #SlashtheVote
Zael
Chance: 5%
Little ballot support, his game was nowhere near Xenoblade levels of popularity, and he was lucky to get a trophy. Such a shame since he seems like a cool character from a great game.
Want: Abstain
Haven't played played all of The Last Story to really want him, but he seems like a character that would fit in well. And let me tell you that he at least has some interesting abilities to be more than an ordinary swordsman.
Prediction: Bayonetta: 30%
Nomination: Takamaru x5 #SlashtheVote
Leafeon523
Smash Ace
Zael:
Chance: 1%
Want: 60%
Can't say I know much about this guy. I'm certainly alright with another swordfighter though.
Predicting Bayonetta at overrated%
Nominating Owainx3
Shin Megami Tensi Character x2
Chance: 1%
Want: 60%
Can't say I know much about this guy. I'm certainly alright with another swordfighter though.
Predicting Bayonetta at overrated%
Nominating Owainx3
Shin Megami Tensi Character x2
Erureido
Smash Hero
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- Erureido
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- 5301-1552-4121
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- SW-4754-8756-2004
Chance: 10%
Zael has a trophy in Smash Bros WiiU, and he is from a video game developed by a second party that has ties with Nintendo. Just by looking at him, one can already tell he has fighting potential too. All of these reasons help maintain his chances from reaching 0%.
As for everything else? Well, The Last Story isn't as recognized as its brother game, Xenoblade Chronicles. It's apparent to the point that his demand for Smash Bros was nowhere as high as Shulk's was in the days leading up to Smash Bros's release, and even to this day, his support for Smash Bros still isn't that high. However, if The Last Story continues in the years to come and becomes even more popular, I think Zael could have a shot in Smash Bros 5 if things work out.
Want: 25%
The truth is, I don't know a lot about The Last Story because I haven't played it yet. It's because of that he isn't one of my most wanted newcomers for Smash Bros. Just by looking at him, however, I will admit he looks pretty cool for an anime swordsman, so I wouldn't be entirely annoyed if he did join Smash Bros.
Nominations:
Jean Descole (Professor Layton): x4
Gallade (Pokemon): x1
Zael has a trophy in Smash Bros WiiU, and he is from a video game developed by a second party that has ties with Nintendo. Just by looking at him, one can already tell he has fighting potential too. All of these reasons help maintain his chances from reaching 0%.
As for everything else? Well, The Last Story isn't as recognized as its brother game, Xenoblade Chronicles. It's apparent to the point that his demand for Smash Bros was nowhere as high as Shulk's was in the days leading up to Smash Bros's release, and even to this day, his support for Smash Bros still isn't that high. However, if The Last Story continues in the years to come and becomes even more popular, I think Zael could have a shot in Smash Bros 5 if things work out.
Want: 25%
The truth is, I don't know a lot about The Last Story because I haven't played it yet. It's because of that he isn't one of my most wanted newcomers for Smash Bros. Just by looking at him, however, I will admit he looks pretty cool for an anime swordsman, so I wouldn't be entirely annoyed if he did join Smash Bros.
Nominations:
Jean Descole (Professor Layton): x4
Gallade (Pokemon): x1
4theRECORD
Smash Journeyman
Zael (The Last Story)
Chance:10%
Want:50%
Bayonetta prediction:13%
nomination:Slime (Dragon Quest) x5
Chance:10%
Want:50%
Bayonetta prediction:13%
nomination:Slime (Dragon Quest) x5
PK_Wonder
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Jun 19, 2010
- Messages
- 1,179
Zael - 1%
Not gonna happen even if we get 8 or 9 slots. There's just no ballot support, and too much obscurity. You can't have both of those roadblocks.
Want - 50% One of many characters where I loved the game and want to see more of him and his series, but he isn't exactly deserving for Smash yet. I highly recommend The Last Story for any jrpg fans here.
Predict - 9%
Alexandra Roivas (Eternal Darkness) x5
Not gonna happen even if we get 8 or 9 slots. There's just no ballot support, and too much obscurity. You can't have both of those roadblocks.
Want - 50% One of many characters where I loved the game and want to see more of him and his series, but he isn't exactly deserving for Smash yet. I highly recommend The Last Story for any jrpg fans here.
Predict - 9%
Alexandra Roivas (Eternal Darkness) x5
Zael
Chance: 1.8%
I don't think a character like this is best suited for DLC. He's very obscure, and as far as I know he wouldn't be promoting anything coming from his franchise in the near future like Shulk is for Xenoblade X. I'll give The Last Story's protagonist a score of 1.8%.
Only if Sakurai wants to give us someone really unknown...
Want: 5%
I don't really care for his design, and I'd rather see other characters.
Prediction - Bayonetta: 7.8%
Nominations:
x3 !Rerate: Inklings
x2 Tails the Fox
Chance: 1.8%
I don't think a character like this is best suited for DLC. He's very obscure, and as far as I know he wouldn't be promoting anything coming from his franchise in the near future like Shulk is for Xenoblade X. I'll give The Last Story's protagonist a score of 1.8%.
Only if Sakurai wants to give us someone really unknown...
Want: 5%
I don't really care for his design, and I'd rather see other characters.
Prediction - Bayonetta: 7.8%
Nominations:
x3 !Rerate: Inklings
x2 Tails the Fox
Icedragonadam
Smash Master
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- 4,093
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- SW-5227-6397-6112
Zael:
Chance: 2.5% Unfortunately he pretty much got overshadowed by Xenoblade and Shulk and isn't very requested much.
Want:ABSTAINED
Prediction
Bayonetta: 15.5%
Nominate
Mother 3 Stage x3
Lloyd Irving x2
Chance: 2.5% Unfortunately he pretty much got overshadowed by Xenoblade and Shulk and isn't very requested much.
Want:ABSTAINED
Prediction
Bayonetta: 15.5%
Nominate
Mother 3 Stage x3
Lloyd Irving x2
BluePikmin11
Akko is my dear daughter!
Smasher 101
Smash Lord
Zael's chances: 0.5%
Very obscure and rarely requested. Not a good combination when you're vying to be extra content.
Want: 30%
Haven't played his game, not really interested in it, but I wouldn't mind him that much.
Bayonetta prediction: 15.38%
Nominations: Karate Joe x5
Very obscure and rarely requested. Not a good combination when you're vying to be extra content.
Want: 30%
Haven't played his game, not really interested in it, but I wouldn't mind him that much.
Bayonetta prediction: 15.38%
Nominations: Karate Joe x5
colder_than_ice
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Jan 7, 2013
- Messages
- 1,331
Well seeing as that concept is already very close to the top I can grant an exception. I suppose the the best plan would be to make Friday a double ratings day and rate both Rob's eye bug fix and whatever's at the top of the nominations list.Nominate R.O.B. eye bug fix x5
Anyone else want to help me out so we rate this before the weekend? Or at least before we start the E3 rating
(please)
EDIT: @colder_than_ice I just realized. This almost NEEDS to be done before the Lucas update, because if they fix it during the update, all my hard work nominations will be wasted. PLEASE can we rate this on my Friday, Three days from now (Two and a half)
Yes we probably should do that.Hey, @
1. for at least one DLC stage other than Miiverse
and 2. for the packs.
Zael
Chance: 1% - Not requested, not popular.
Want: 70% - I'm only rating him this high because of how cool he looks. I'm so shallow!!
Bayonetta prediction: 8%
Nominations: Aqua x5
DAY OVER
PLEASE WAIT WHILE I CALCULATE THE RESULTS
PLEASE WAIT WHILE I CALCULATE THE RESULTS
BluePikmin11
Akko is my dear daughter!
(Like in the Young Link analysis, I recommend to not skip ahead and rate anyway)
Thanks to @PushDustIn and @Spazzy_D for editing!
(I am using every argument I can recall in the Official Character Discussion thread and the 35 Factors to Consider for DLC for this analysis, which I recommend using)
(I also rechecked many times to make sure I'm not flaming anyone here)
Warning: a load of pictures, videos, and gifs incoming!
Music to enjoy reading
Bayonetta Chance:
25%
Bayonetta, is currently the one of the most debated characters right now when it comes to Smash DLC. People bring up her over-sexualization and non-iconicness against her. However, is it really a problem for her to get in? Like Young Link, I have encountered nearly every single argument against her, so I will show that there are positives for Bayonetta and that she can overcome the negative aspects. With that, let's get started and I recommend to NOT IGNORE and read every inch of this before you rate:
SUPER RATING SAIYAN ACTIVATE!
+A highly requested character.
Ever since this the ballot was announced, Bayonetta support skyrocketed, most notably within the Tumblr and Twitter communities. If Sakurai didn't plan her pre-ballot, her high amount of votes should get Sakurai to consider her.
+Platinum Games support for her.
Like any other third-party company, PG and Kamiya are currently advocating for her inclusion.
Kamiya has said multiple times to stop spamming his twitter, but that won't stop him from including her if Sakurai approached him and he wouldn't let the fans get the worst of him. He has said years ago he would be more than happy to include her if Sakurai wanted to:
Based on the many tweets Platinum Games has had with Sakurai:
There are also tweets regarding Platinum Games here too.
I think it's safe to assume that these guys are pretty close friends, as close as Kojima is with Sakurai, so Kamiya could easily approach and ask about adding one of his characters.
The game studio itself even has its own article for Iwata Asks too. Nintendo has helped out with promoting Bayonetta 2 by teaming up with Playboy and putting her as one of the advertised characters for Women's History Month (Being one of the few 3rd parties included). That should tell you how close Nintendo and PG are currently, and how easy it is to just ask for Bayonetta to be playable.
+She comes from a decently popular third-party franchise that has a new audience to cater to.
Her franchise manages to top nearly a total of 3 million in sales, making it a well known franchise to many recent gamers and PS3/Xbox 360 fans alike (a new audience that Nintendo can try to bring through her inclusion); with each installment having high critical reception. It also managed to get an anime film and its own merchandise in the form of CDs and books, definitely something other minor third-parties don't have. This gives Bayonetta therown edge. It's a notable enough franchise for Sakurai to approve her inclusion. She's one of PG's most well beloved characters and she made many cameo appearances in other Platinum games like Wonderful 101 and Anarchy Reins.
+++Bayonetta by far has the most interesting and distinct moveset potential out of all candidates!
And it is by far the most beneficial advantage Bayonetta has. The first step in how Sakurai decides third-parties is if they have unique stand-out characteristics that make them distinct from characters in the cast right now.
I strongly believe that she would be the most distinct addition to Smash since Snake back in Brawl. Out of all characters I have seen suggested (and trust me, I seen every one of them during my time on Smashboards for over two years), she is definitely one of the most unique characters who can provide loads of moves that fit the context of Smash well. You will be convinced that she has a load of potential once you read the moveset analyses and moves fans have worked hard and provided to show you that. Do not ignore and skip lightly!
_______________________
Moveset Analysis made by @Smash Daddy :
Where to begin? Lets start from the basics: Bayonetta has dozens of weapons she can use to have a range of attacks from all distances and on every input. The ones I can immediately remember from the first game are a sword, a giant pair of claws and a whip. These all have more versatility than you'd immediately think, they have dozens of attacks on their own. But that's only the start. Bayonetta has a variety of guns to attach to her heels, to start she uses a pair of pistols, but can find or buy shotguns, revolvers and other firearms to take their place. In short, she has a tremendous amount of projectiles on top of melee.
That is not even touching upon all the other things she can do. She has hand-to-hand combat that can easily be its own moveset all on its own, except it also summons monsters to synchronize her attacks with giant boots, punches and stomps that come through humongous portals. She can summon torture machines at will to execute monsters on the fly if they're weak enough. For the finale on a boss, she has an assortment of huge demons to summon that are obvious final smash fodder, but surely could be used to inspire a move or two.
If you want a simple basis for a moveset, it's not as if it's intimidating to create one. She has an obvious standard projectile in her pistols she carries around normally, that can be rapid-fired at all times in the first game to whittle down a foe's health. Bayonetta transforms into various animals, including a bird and panther for an obvious recovery. Multiple mid-air jumps can be purchased in the game as well as defensive measures or items that have a variety of unique effects. Bayonetta can even walk on walls and ride missiles to name a couple of many, many inane abilities of the character.
I almost forgot to add how she can stop time. I'm sure I missed a huge amount in this long summary that are obvious to a big Bayonetta fan.
_______________________
Here's a moveset with attacks that come from Bayonetta 2.
Moveset by @Ixbran (Bless him greatly for providing gifs of the moves)
MOVESET
First off, Moveset for the Wonderful Witch her self. Rather than giving her different attacks based off her various weapons, I feel all of her attacks, outside of Animal Transformations, should focus on what she can use with just her guns.
Yes she is a capable fighter with any weapon, but since her guns are her most iconic weapon, I feel they should be the only ones she’d use in her smash bros appearance. Note if the move she performs in a .gif has a name, it will be listed. If it doesn’t, a name describing the ability will be listed instead.
Note: as a Special Gimmick, when attacking with her standard attacks, holding down the attack button after pressing it will cause her to shoot magical bullets, just like in the Bayonetta series.
SPECIALS
Infernal Demon Summon:Omne The Controller of Creation
Even then, there are still a load of other moves that have not been mentioned by supporters here that could be used for moves. Her potential is almost infinite. (And yes I showed you a load of gifs on purpose because I want to emphasize that uniqueness is her strongest point to her inclusion)
_____________
It's time to take a break..... DANCE! Let your eyes relax through this gif!
Ready to read some more, let's keep going! You'll survive don't worry!
_____________
Arguments Against Bayonetta:
As far as I'm concerned, there are only a few arguments that come up all the time when it comes to her inclusion, however I think these flaws can be potentially overcome with the positives in her favor:
Bayonetta is too sexualized in combat and in personality to be in Smash! If Tharja couldn't get in as a trophy, she has no chance!
Special thanks to this reddit post for addressing these issues:
Reasons Bayonetta is NOT too adult for Super Smash Bros
Thanks to this tumblr post, I can tell you in good detail on her default appearance on how far she strips off her clothes in Bayonetta 2, and it's not that bad:
This is her default appearance without her attacking. Is it really that controversial as Tharja's trophy?
She covers pretty much most of her body here. She isn't controversial with her default appearance, making her ok to put in even as a potential trophy.
This is her when she's pulling off a full on attack on an enemy. And honestly it's not that bad, it covers what is needed to be suitable for Smash. The only bit iffy parts is her chest, but Sakurai could easily just cover it up so it's not a huge problem. She'd still be able stay true to her arousing personality, but only cover what's necessary. Even then, it is a minor detail that lasts less than a second during combat and is pretty hard to notice during gameplay. People are overexaggerating the problem here.
Kamiya and Sakurai would know (and are smart enough to know) that she would have to be toned down in terms how far she strips down her clothes and how far she would go in terms of personality in order for her to get in the game while still being true to Bayonetta.
Look here too:
Thanks to @Megadoomer for the video:
Other appearances (developed by Platinum themselves) show that it's entirely possible to tone her down while still staying in character. So really is it a problem here?
___________
HE'S NOT AS SUPER ICONIC AS RYU, MARIO, MEGAMAN, SONIC, AND PAC-MAN! He can't be in Smash ever.
Yet, there is no specific criteria rules other than the interview in Famitsu in October and his "special case" criteria, which Sakurai is very vague. We don't know if Sakurai will just strictly add just super famous icons as DLC, for all we know, he could just change his mind even though Sakurai said things against certain characters like "no fighting game characters aloud" pre-Smash 4. And him allowing any video game character to be voted suggests to me that he's open to more choices that aren't just icons as long as they have convincing qualities that make for a great fighter. If the rules can be broken for fighting game characters, the unconfirmed rules can be potentially broken for 3rd parties too.
___________
But the guns! They are the essential part of Bayonetta's character, no real life guns aloud!
I have to say when small guns like the above fire at a ridiculous rate with a fashionable colorful design, they actually feel less closer to a real life gun and more like a fantasy weapon, for the most part her weapon is ok. If her weapon was a rifle, then I would be concerned, but as far as it goes, it's not and can be implemented in Smash. If Sakurai doesn't want the bullets to be shown here, then just make the guns shoot muzzle flashes and make the shots nearly unseeable, like with Sheik's needles.
This looks and acts nowhere close to the average gun you would see in real life:
____________
There would be other SEGA characters that would be prioritized before her!
I do not believe that many SEGA IPs have been notably close to Nintendo like Bayonetta aside from Sonic. The only other notable SEGA characters being requested right now are Tails, Knuckles, and Shadow; that's really Bayonetta's only competition. In my opinion, though they are pretty iconic characters, the other Sonic characters do not have much of a merit with moveset potential to make them as good of a choice as Bayonetta. Plus the fact she caters to a new audience (and not just the Sonic fanbase) makes her one of the better choices for DLC.
____________
Kamiya doesn't want them in!
Even though Kamiya has said multiple times to stop spamming his Twitter, that won't stop him from including her if Sakurai approached him. He has said years ago he would be more than happy to include her if Sakurai wanted to.
She doesn't fit Smash very well!
Probably the least important factor Sakurai has stated. There are very rare cases in which a character can feel out of place visually, but most newcomers fit in just fine. They blend in the game in a different distinct way, like with Snake.
____________
I believe that Bayonetta has a pretty good shot overall. In my opinion, the major negative factors hindering her chances is other noteworthy SEGA characters and being a third-party since more has to be done than a Nintendo character. Sakurai has added third-party trophies in the games from different companies without a problem. I think that if he has no problem with this, he shouldn't have a problem with Bayonetta either. I'm confident Sakurai knows Bayonetta well enough to address the issues fans bring up so she can be in the game, especially with how close PG games is with Nintendo right now.
Bayonetta Want:
101%
Let me just get this out of the way.
I desperately want Bayonetta to happen. My want stems back in the uniqueness tier list thread (Which I am the thread creator of), back when I had 0% interest in buying the game when Bayonetta 2 was announced When the moveset potential analysis for Bayonetta began, a notable amount of people brought up that she had an extreme load of potential and gave her an analysis, @Smash Daddy created an analysis that intrigued me into checking out her support thread. For some reason though, I had a strange good feeling she would get in the game someday as DLC, though I didn't really get to pinpoint that feeling until much later.
Months later, I got the game for my Christmas money, though I didn't play it yet because I lost my Wii U Gamepad for a temporary while and mainly I was playing through and grinding through Bravely Default (Which took over my life for a while). Honestly, I thought I would lose my interest quickly when I started up the original Bayonetta. And holy cow was I really surprised. The very smooth gameplay, the many cool stylish attacks Bayonetta can do with her, and her unique personality, it was unlike any other game I played. The more moves that I unlocked throughout my play through, the more I realize how large her moveset potential is. I want her in this game so badly... and it's exciting to know which attacks will be implemented in the game because there is so many of them if you count the other weapons she buys and unlock throughout the game if Sakurai were to add her in.
Her not being added would be a truly missed opportunity for Sakurai, because when it comes to moveset potential, she shines brilliantly, and that's what I really like about her more than any positive I listed in the Chance rating.
____________
Nominations:
x5 Isabelle
____________
(READ ABOVE FIRST! EVERYONE SHOULD DO SO AND NOT SKIP!)
These are only times where I go all out on rating a character, I would appreciate if you look back and read the rating.
Thanks to @PushDustIn and @Spazzy_D for editing!
(I am using every argument I can recall in the Official Character Discussion thread and the 35 Factors to Consider for DLC for this analysis, which I recommend using)
(I also rechecked many times to make sure I'm not flaming anyone here)
Warning: a load of pictures, videos, and gifs incoming!
Music to enjoy reading
- Fly Me to The Moon (Climax Mix)
- Moon River ∞ Climax Mix
- Mysterious Destiny
- Retro Version
- Tomorrow is Mine
- After Burner (Climax Mix)
- Let’s Dance Boys!
- Blood and Darkness (vs. Jeanne)
- You May Call Me Father (vs. Balder)
- Alurane - Whispers of Dimentia
- The Greatest Jubilee
- Aesir
- Night, I Stand
- Let’s Dance, Boys! 2nd Climax Ver
Bayonetta Chance:
25%
Bayonetta, is currently the one of the most debated characters right now when it comes to Smash DLC. People bring up her over-sexualization and non-iconicness against her. However, is it really a problem for her to get in? Like Young Link, I have encountered nearly every single argument against her, so I will show that there are positives for Bayonetta and that she can overcome the negative aspects. With that, let's get started and I recommend to NOT IGNORE and read every inch of this before you rate:
SUPER RATING SAIYAN ACTIVATE!
+A highly requested character.
Ever since this the ballot was announced, Bayonetta support skyrocketed, most notably within the Tumblr and Twitter communities. If Sakurai didn't plan her pre-ballot, her high amount of votes should get Sakurai to consider her.
+Platinum Games support for her.
Like any other third-party company, PG and Kamiya are currently advocating for her inclusion.
Apparently Bayo 2 ended with severe head trauma. RT @xnescorex: #BayonettaforSmash #platinumgames #SuperSmashBros pic.twitter.com/3oXqV51BIk
— JP Kellams (@synaesthesiajp) April 6, 2015
+Platinum Games relationship with Nintendo.
Based on the many tweets Platinum Games has had with Sakurai:
Cuz he was cute. RT @LimpSwagger: are you allowed to say why Sakurai was caught in Platinum Games earlier this year?
— 無職? 神谷英樹 Unemployed? Hideki Kamiya (@HidekiKamiya_X) September 17, 2012
Sakurai gave it to me. ;) http://t.co/xSq01hWzdP RT @ZeldaPrime If u like starfox and funny games, u should get Kid Icarus Uprising on 3ds!
— 無職? 神谷英樹 Unemployed? Hideki Kamiya (@HidekiKamiya_X) March 27, 2013
I think it's safe to assume that these guys are pretty close friends, as close as Kojima is with Sakurai, so Kamiya could easily approach and ask about adding one of his characters.
The game studio itself even has its own article for Iwata Asks too. Nintendo has helped out with promoting Bayonetta 2 by teaming up with Playboy and putting her as one of the advertised characters for Women's History Month (Being one of the few 3rd parties included). That should tell you how close Nintendo and PG are currently, and how easy it is to just ask for Bayonetta to be playable.
+She comes from a decently popular third-party franchise that has a new audience to cater to.
Her franchise manages to top nearly a total of 3 million in sales, making it a well known franchise to many recent gamers and PS3/Xbox 360 fans alike (a new audience that Nintendo can try to bring through her inclusion); with each installment having high critical reception. It also managed to get an anime film and its own merchandise in the form of CDs and books, definitely something other minor third-parties don't have. This gives Bayonetta therown edge. It's a notable enough franchise for Sakurai to approve her inclusion. She's one of PG's most well beloved characters and she made many cameo appearances in other Platinum games like Wonderful 101 and Anarchy Reins.
+++Bayonetta by far has the most interesting and distinct moveset potential out of all candidates!
And it is by far the most beneficial advantage Bayonetta has. The first step in how Sakurai decides third-parties is if they have unique stand-out characteristics that make them distinct from characters in the cast right now.
I strongly believe that she would be the most distinct addition to Smash since Snake back in Brawl. Out of all characters I have seen suggested (and trust me, I seen every one of them during my time on Smashboards for over two years), she is definitely one of the most unique characters who can provide loads of moves that fit the context of Smash well. You will be convinced that she has a load of potential once you read the moveset analyses and moves fans have worked hard and provided to show you that. Do not ignore and skip lightly!
_______________________
Moveset Analysis made by @Smash Daddy :
Where to begin? Lets start from the basics: Bayonetta has dozens of weapons she can use to have a range of attacks from all distances and on every input. The ones I can immediately remember from the first game are a sword, a giant pair of claws and a whip. These all have more versatility than you'd immediately think, they have dozens of attacks on their own. But that's only the start. Bayonetta has a variety of guns to attach to her heels, to start she uses a pair of pistols, but can find or buy shotguns, revolvers and other firearms to take their place. In short, she has a tremendous amount of projectiles on top of melee.
That is not even touching upon all the other things she can do. She has hand-to-hand combat that can easily be its own moveset all on its own, except it also summons monsters to synchronize her attacks with giant boots, punches and stomps that come through humongous portals. She can summon torture machines at will to execute monsters on the fly if they're weak enough. For the finale on a boss, she has an assortment of huge demons to summon that are obvious final smash fodder, but surely could be used to inspire a move or two.
If you want a simple basis for a moveset, it's not as if it's intimidating to create one. She has an obvious standard projectile in her pistols she carries around normally, that can be rapid-fired at all times in the first game to whittle down a foe's health. Bayonetta transforms into various animals, including a bird and panther for an obvious recovery. Multiple mid-air jumps can be purchased in the game as well as defensive measures or items that have a variety of unique effects. Bayonetta can even walk on walls and ride missiles to name a couple of many, many inane abilities of the character.
I almost forgot to add how she can stop time. I'm sure I missed a huge amount in this long summary that are obvious to a big Bayonetta fan.
_______________________
Here's a moveset with attacks that come from Bayonetta 2.
Moveset by @Ixbran (Bless him greatly for providing gifs of the moves)
MOVESET
First off, Moveset for the Wonderful Witch her self. Rather than giving her different attacks based off her various weapons, I feel all of her attacks, outside of Animal Transformations, should focus on what she can use with just her guns.
Yes she is a capable fighter with any weapon, but since her guns are her most iconic weapon, I feel they should be the only ones she’d use in her smash bros appearance. Note if the move she performs in a .gif has a name, it will be listed. If it doesn’t, a name describing the ability will be listed instead.
Note: as a Special Gimmick, when attacking with her standard attacks, holding down the attack button after pressing it will cause her to shoot magical bullets, just like in the Bayonetta series.
SPECIALS
- Neutral Special: Charge Bullet
• Default: Charge energy to fire several rapid fire shots.
• Variation 1: Charges a massive orb of magic energy in her gun then fires it. Functions similarly to Samus’s Charge Shot.
• Variation 2: Instantly rapid fire small magic orbs from her gun. Functions similarly to Palutena’s Autoreticle. - Side Special: Panther Within
• Default: Transforms into a panther and dashes forward at double standard speed. Press the button again to perform a slashing claw attack.
• Variation 1: Transforms into a panther and dashes forward at triple standard speed. Transformation lasts only a short period of time, no slash attack.
• Variation 2: Transforms into a panther and dashes a short distance before performing a powerful slash attack. - Up Special: Crow Within
• Default: Transforms into a crow and gains height as if from a 3rd jump. She will slowly descent while in crow form, and players are able to maneuver her as she descends. Functions similarly to Palutena’s Jump Glide.
• Variation 1: Transforms into a crow and feather darts will float around her forming a damaging shield as she descends. Functions similarly to Megaman’s Lief Shield.
• Variation 2: Transforms into a crow and darts in player generated direction. Functions similarly to Pikachu’s Quick Attack. - Down Special: Witch Time
• Default: Strikes a pose, and if struck, Bayonetta will both counter the attack and the enemies movement will slow down if the attack hits, as if under the effect of the Timer item, for a short period of time.
• Variation 1: Strikes a pose, and if struck, Bayonetta will vanish then appear behind opponent and perform a meteor smash on the enemy from behind. Functions similarly to Lucario’s Double Team.
• Variation 2: Strikes a pose, and gains a temporary boost in movement and attack speed, at the cost of strength.
- Jab Attack: Standard Punch Combo
- Dash Attack: Stiletto
- Ledge Recovery Attack: Arching Heel Stomp
- Ground Recovery Attack: Rising Spin Kick
- Forward Tilt: Tetsuzanko
- Up Tilt: High Kick
- Down Tilt: Sweeping Spin Kick
- Side Smash: Straight Punch Wicked Weave
- Up Smash: Uppercut Punch Wicked Weave
- Down Smash: Stomping Heel Wicked Weave
- Neutral Aerial: Rotating Heel Gun Kick
- Forward Aerial: After Burner Kick
- Back Aerial: Three-Hit Kick Combo
- Up Aerial: Witch Strike
- Down Aerial: Long Fall Heel Drop
- Pummel: Back and Forth Toss Torture Attack
(a.k.a.”Bayonetta Smash!”)
- Forward Throw: Spin and Throw Torture Attack
- Up Throw: Air Bear Trap Torture Attack
- Back Throw: Iron Maiden Torture Attack
- Down Throw: Anarchy Reigns Heel Confetti Stomp
- Dodge Animation: Bat Within Technique
Infernal Demon Summon:Omne The Controller of Creation
Even then, there are still a load of other moves that have not been mentioned by supporters here that could be used for moves. Her potential is almost infinite. (And yes I showed you a load of gifs on purpose because I want to emphasize that uniqueness is her strongest point to her inclusion)
_____________
It's time to take a break..... DANCE! Let your eyes relax through this gif!
Ready to read some more, let's keep going! You'll survive don't worry!
_____________
Arguments Against Bayonetta:
As far as I'm concerned, there are only a few arguments that come up all the time when it comes to her inclusion, however I think these flaws can be potentially overcome with the positives in her favor:
Bayonetta is too sexualized in combat and in personality to be in Smash! If Tharja couldn't get in as a trophy, she has no chance!
Special thanks to this reddit post for addressing these issues:
Reasons Bayonetta is NOT too adult for Super Smash Bros
- Bayonetta does not need to be any more revealingly dressed than Zero Suit Samus. Sure, in the Bayonetta games, her clothes come off for some attacks, but this is actually a relatively minor detail in the games, which could easily be omitted while still doing proper justice to the character. If they left that out, then she actually shows off less skin than bikini ZSS and swimsuit Shulk.
- Bayonetta would not be the first character with M-Rated games to make Super Smash Bros. The (only) other is Snake. To be sure, the Metal Gear Solid series and Bayonetta series got M-Ratings for very different reasons, but both were clearly not geared towards children. Both games feature guns, violence, coarse language, and more. Plus I think the Metal Gear Solid series is a lot darker thematically.
- If her inclusion doesn't cross any boundaries that Nintendo hasn't already crossed with bikini ZSS or Snake representing M-Rated games, then it's hard to see how concerns like these could outweigh the many great reasons to include her.
Thanks to this tumblr post, I can tell you in good detail on her default appearance on how far she strips off her clothes in Bayonetta 2, and it's not that bad:
This is her default appearance without her attacking. Is it really that controversial as Tharja's trophy?
She covers pretty much most of her body here. She isn't controversial with her default appearance, making her ok to put in even as a potential trophy.
This is her when she's pulling off a full on attack on an enemy. And honestly it's not that bad, it covers what is needed to be suitable for Smash. The only bit iffy parts is her chest, but Sakurai could easily just cover it up so it's not a huge problem. She'd still be able stay true to her arousing personality, but only cover what's necessary. Even then, it is a minor detail that lasts less than a second during combat and is pretty hard to notice during gameplay. People are overexaggerating the problem here.
Kamiya and Sakurai would know (and are smart enough to know) that she would have to be toned down in terms how far she strips down her clothes and how far she would go in terms of personality in order for her to get in the game while still being true to Bayonetta.
Look here too:
Thanks to @Megadoomer for the video:
___________
HE'S NOT AS SUPER ICONIC AS RYU, MARIO, MEGAMAN, SONIC, AND PAC-MAN! He can't be in Smash ever.
Yet, there is no specific criteria rules other than the interview in Famitsu in October and his "special case" criteria, which Sakurai is very vague. We don't know if Sakurai will just strictly add just super famous icons as DLC, for all we know, he could just change his mind even though Sakurai said things against certain characters like "no fighting game characters aloud" pre-Smash 4. And him allowing any video game character to be voted suggests to me that he's open to more choices that aren't just icons as long as they have convincing qualities that make for a great fighter. If the rules can be broken for fighting game characters, the unconfirmed rules can be potentially broken for 3rd parties too.
___________
But the guns! They are the essential part of Bayonetta's character, no real life guns aloud!
I have to say when small guns like the above fire at a ridiculous rate with a fashionable colorful design, they actually feel less closer to a real life gun and more like a fantasy weapon, for the most part her weapon is ok. If her weapon was a rifle, then I would be concerned, but as far as it goes, it's not and can be implemented in Smash. If Sakurai doesn't want the bullets to be shown here, then just make the guns shoot muzzle flashes and make the shots nearly unseeable, like with Sheik's needles.
This looks and acts nowhere close to the average gun you would see in real life:
____________
There would be other SEGA characters that would be prioritized before her!
I do not believe that many SEGA IPs have been notably close to Nintendo like Bayonetta aside from Sonic. The only other notable SEGA characters being requested right now are Tails, Knuckles, and Shadow; that's really Bayonetta's only competition. In my opinion, though they are pretty iconic characters, the other Sonic characters do not have much of a merit with moveset potential to make them as good of a choice as Bayonetta. Plus the fact she caters to a new audience (and not just the Sonic fanbase) makes her one of the better choices for DLC.
____________
Kamiya doesn't want them in!
Even though Kamiya has said multiple times to stop spamming his Twitter, that won't stop him from including her if Sakurai approached him. He has said years ago he would be more than happy to include her if Sakurai wanted to.
____________
She doesn't fit Smash very well!
Probably the least important factor Sakurai has stated. There are very rare cases in which a character can feel out of place visually, but most newcomers fit in just fine. They blend in the game in a different distinct way, like with Snake.
____________
I believe that Bayonetta has a pretty good shot overall. In my opinion, the major negative factors hindering her chances is other noteworthy SEGA characters and being a third-party since more has to be done than a Nintendo character. Sakurai has added third-party trophies in the games from different companies without a problem. I think that if he has no problem with this, he shouldn't have a problem with Bayonetta either. I'm confident Sakurai knows Bayonetta well enough to address the issues fans bring up so she can be in the game, especially with how close PG games is with Nintendo right now.
Bayonetta Want:
101%
Let me just get this out of the way.
I desperately want Bayonetta to happen. My want stems back in the uniqueness tier list thread (Which I am the thread creator of), back when I had 0% interest in buying the game when Bayonetta 2 was announced When the moveset potential analysis for Bayonetta began, a notable amount of people brought up that she had an extreme load of potential and gave her an analysis, @Smash Daddy created an analysis that intrigued me into checking out her support thread. For some reason though, I had a strange good feeling she would get in the game someday as DLC, though I didn't really get to pinpoint that feeling until much later.
Months later, I got the game for my Christmas money, though I didn't play it yet because I lost my Wii U Gamepad for a temporary while and mainly I was playing through and grinding through Bravely Default (Which took over my life for a while). Honestly, I thought I would lose my interest quickly when I started up the original Bayonetta. And holy cow was I really surprised. The very smooth gameplay, the many cool stylish attacks Bayonetta can do with her, and her unique personality, it was unlike any other game I played. The more moves that I unlocked throughout my play through, the more I realize how large her moveset potential is. I want her in this game so badly... and it's exciting to know which attacks will be implemented in the game because there is so many of them if you count the other weapons she buys and unlock throughout the game if Sakurai were to add her in.
Her not being added would be a truly missed opportunity for Sakurai, because when it comes to moveset potential, she shines brilliantly, and that's what I really like about her more than any positive I listed in the Chance rating.
____________
Nominations:
x5 Isabelle
____________
(READ ABOVE FIRST! EVERYONE SHOULD DO SO AND NOT SKIP!)
These are only times where I go all out on rating a character, I would appreciate if you look back and read the rating.
Oh, wow. Lots of reading all of a sudden. Here we go...
Leafeon523
Smash Ace
Bayonetta:
Everyone, prepare yourselves!
Before I post my rating, everyone gather round for embarrassing story time!
So I had been meaning to play Bayonetta 2 for a while now, but I could never figure out a way to try it out without drawing the suspicions of my parents. But recently I was able to slip it in along with some other books and video games I was renting from the local library. But I got invested into Tekken Tag Tournament 2, and I didn't play it immediately. Then wile playing some smash with my friend, he noticed the game and asked if it has multiplayer. I was quite sure it didn't, but he insisted on loading up Bayonetta 2 and making sure for himself. After watching him play the tutorial level, we got to e opening cutscene, where literally all hell broke loose. Swearing, stripping, slaughter, you name it. Afterwards I returned the game, my friend picked it up the day afterwords, and I won't soon be able to live this event down. Point of the story being, I'm quite sure that Bayonetta could never be within a ten-foot stripper's pole of any E10+ rated game. Want is far more simple to explain. If she got in, I would never hear the end of it from my friend. So I've decided to give Bayonetta double zeros. I know that's the kind of score usually awarded to Yarne and Owain tag team and B.B. Bandit Trio nominations, but it's my honest opinion on the matter.
And now for some counter arguments:
1. "Nintendo saved Bayonetta 2 from cancellation and published it themselves!"
Since when does one game = viable smash candidate? The only modern series with only one game to receive a character is Monado Boy Chronicles, and Nintendo acquired the Studio that made the game.
2. "But we had Snake in Brawl!"
Brawl was a Teen rated game, wile Smash 4 has obtained an E10+ rating, which really harms Bayonetta's chances. Keep in mind sexualization is far more harshly rated by the ESRB than violence. Not to mention Snake is far different from Bayonetta. Snake slits people's necks, not clothes.
3. "But we are getting Ryu!"
I personally don't think we are, but that is besides the point. Here's my list of third party characters I made for Jibanayn, but with Bayonetta.
Pac Man: Probably the most recognizable character in all of video gaming, and has been a cultural icon for 35 years.
Sonic: A former rival to Mario that was Sega's mascot in the Sega vs. Nintendo conflict of old, but has since become a staple of Nintendo platforms.
Mega Man: A character that has been a staple on Nintendo platforms for over twenty-five years, and one of the most heavily requested characters to enter the smash scene.
Ryu?: Reinvented the entire fighting genre with Street Fighter II, and has continued the series up until present day.
Bayonetta: Had one moderately well-selling game package as a Wii U exclusive.
She just doesn't fit in with the rest of our third-party characters.
4. "They could always tone down Bayonetta's moves"
But toning down a character removes them from what they are, and that is clearly not something Sakurai is interested in. From what I've seen in reviews the story of the games isn't what draws people in, so the focus of the game is clearly the stylized combat system. If they felt like taking a character out of the context the game puts them in for the sake of playability, you have one guess as to what purple character we would see on our selection screen.
If you read the whole thing, congrats to you! Feel free to leave a counter-argument and enjoy this Celebi
Nominating Owain x5
Everyone, prepare yourselves!
Before I post my rating, everyone gather round for embarrassing story time!
So I had been meaning to play Bayonetta 2 for a while now, but I could never figure out a way to try it out without drawing the suspicions of my parents. But recently I was able to slip it in along with some other books and video games I was renting from the local library. But I got invested into Tekken Tag Tournament 2, and I didn't play it immediately. Then wile playing some smash with my friend, he noticed the game and asked if it has multiplayer. I was quite sure it didn't, but he insisted on loading up Bayonetta 2 and making sure for himself. After watching him play the tutorial level, we got to e opening cutscene, where literally all hell broke loose. Swearing, stripping, slaughter, you name it. Afterwards I returned the game, my friend picked it up the day afterwords, and I won't soon be able to live this event down. Point of the story being, I'm quite sure that Bayonetta could never be within a ten-foot stripper's pole of any E10+ rated game. Want is far more simple to explain. If she got in, I would never hear the end of it from my friend. So I've decided to give Bayonetta double zeros. I know that's the kind of score usually awarded to Yarne and Owain tag team and B.B. Bandit Trio nominations, but it's my honest opinion on the matter.
And now for some counter arguments:
1. "Nintendo saved Bayonetta 2 from cancellation and published it themselves!"
Since when does one game = viable smash candidate? The only modern series with only one game to receive a character is Monado Boy Chronicles, and Nintendo acquired the Studio that made the game.
2. "But we had Snake in Brawl!"
Brawl was a Teen rated game, wile Smash 4 has obtained an E10+ rating, which really harms Bayonetta's chances. Keep in mind sexualization is far more harshly rated by the ESRB than violence. Not to mention Snake is far different from Bayonetta. Snake slits people's necks, not clothes.
3. "But we are getting Ryu!"
I personally don't think we are, but that is besides the point. Here's my list of third party characters I made for Jibanayn, but with Bayonetta.
Pac Man: Probably the most recognizable character in all of video gaming, and has been a cultural icon for 35 years.
Sonic: A former rival to Mario that was Sega's mascot in the Sega vs. Nintendo conflict of old, but has since become a staple of Nintendo platforms.
Mega Man: A character that has been a staple on Nintendo platforms for over twenty-five years, and one of the most heavily requested characters to enter the smash scene.
Ryu?: Reinvented the entire fighting genre with Street Fighter II, and has continued the series up until present day.
Bayonetta: Had one moderately well-selling game package as a Wii U exclusive.
She just doesn't fit in with the rest of our third-party characters.
4. "They could always tone down Bayonetta's moves"
But toning down a character removes them from what they are, and that is clearly not something Sakurai is interested in. From what I've seen in reviews the story of the games isn't what draws people in, so the focus of the game is clearly the stylized combat system. If they felt like taking a character out of the context the game puts them in for the sake of playability, you have one guess as to what purple character we would see on our selection screen.
If you read the whole thing, congrats to you! Feel free to leave a counter-argument and enjoy this Celebi
Nominating Owain x5
BandanaWaddleDee
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Jul 16, 2014
- Messages
- 1,744
- Location
- There
- NNID
- bdon25
- 3DS FC
- 1633-4187-3079
- Switch FC
- 2967-5142-5603
I don't want to belittle your thing because you put a lot of work into it. Just know that I'm belittling it in my mnd.(Like in the Young Link analysis, I recommend to not skip ahead and rate anyway)
Thanks to @PushDustIn and @Spazzy_D for editing!
(I am using every argument I can recall in the Official Character Discussion thread and the 35 Factors to Consider for DLC for this analysis, which I recommend using)
(I also rechecked many times to make sure I'm not flaming anyone here)
Warning: a load of pictures, videos, and gifs incoming!
Music to enjoy reading
- Fly Me to The Moon (Climax Mix)
- Moon River ∞ Climax Mix
- Mysterious Destiny
- Retro Version
- Tomorrow is Mine
- After Burner (Climax Mix)
- Let’s Dance Boys!
- Blood and Darkness (vs. Jeanne)
- You May Call Me Father (vs. Balder)
- Alurane - Whispers of Dimentia
- The Greatest Jubilee
- Aesir
- Night, I Stand
- Let’s Dance, Boys! 2nd Climax Ver
Bayonetta Chance:
25%
Bayonetta, is currently the one of the most debated characters right now when it comes to Smash DLC. People bring up her over-sexualization and non-iconicness against her. However, is it really a problem for her to get in? Like Young Link, I have encountered nearly every single argument against her, so I will show that there are positives for Bayonetta and that she can overcome the negative aspects. With that, let's get started and I recommend to NOT IGNORE and read every inch of this before you rate:
SUPER RATING SAIYAN ACTIVATE!
+A highly requested character.
Ever since this the ballot was announced, Bayonetta support skyrocketed, most notably within the Tumblr and Twitter communities. If Sakurai didn't plan her pre-ballot, her high amount of votes should get Sakurai to consider her.
+Platinum Games support for her.
Like any other third-party company, PG and Kamiya are currently advocating for her inclusion.
Kamiya has said multiple times to stop spamming his twitter, but that won't stop him from including her if Sakurai approached him and he wouldn't let the fans get the worst of him. He has said years ago he would be more than happy to include her if Sakurai wanted to:Apparently Bayo 2 ended with severe head trauma. RT @xnescorex: #BayonettaforSmash #platinumgames #SuperSmashBros pic.twitter.com/3oXqV51BIk
— JP Kellams (@synaesthesiajp) April 6, 2015
+Platinum Games relationship with Nintendo.
Based on the many tweets Platinum Games has had with Sakurai:
Cuz he was cute. RT @LimpSwagger: are you allowed to say why Sakurai was caught in Platinum Games earlier this year?
— 無職? 神谷英樹 Unemployed? Hideki Kamiya (@HidekiKamiya_X) September 17, 2012There are also tweets regarding Platinum Games here too.Sakurai gave it to me. ;) http://t.co/xSq01hWzdP RT @ZeldaPrime If u like starfox and funny games, u should get Kid Icarus Uprising on 3ds!
— 無職? 神谷英樹 Unemployed? Hideki Kamiya (@HidekiKamiya_X) March 27, 2013
I think it's safe to assume that these guys are pretty close friends, as close as Kojima is with Sakurai, so Kamiya could easily approach and ask about adding one of his characters.
The game studio itself even has its own article for Iwata Asks too. Nintendo has helped out with promoting Bayonetta 2 by teaming up with Playboy and putting her as one of the advertised characters for Women's History Month (Being one of the few 3rd parties included). That should tell you how close Nintendo and PG are currently, and how easy it is to just ask for Bayonetta to be playable.
+She comes from a decently popular third-party franchise that has a new audience to cater to.
Her franchise manages to top nearly a total of 3 million in sales, making it a well known franchise to many recent gamers and PS3/Xbox 360 fans alike (a new audience that Nintendo can try to bring through her inclusion); with each installment having high critical reception. It also managed to get an anime film and its own merchandise in the form of CDs and books, definitely something other minor third-parties don't have. This gives Bayonetta therown edge. It's a notable enough franchise for Sakurai to approve her inclusion. She's one of PG's most well beloved characters and she made many cameo appearances in other Platinum games like Wonderful 101 and Anarchy Reins.
+++Bayonetta by far has the most interesting and distinct moveset potential out of all candidates!
And it is by far the most beneficial advantage Bayonetta has. The first step in how Sakurai decides third-parties is if they have unique stand-out characteristics that make them distinct from characters in the cast right now.
I strongly believe that she would be the most distinct addition to Smash since Snake back in Brawl. Out of all characters I have seen suggested (and trust me, I seen every one of them during my time on Smashboards for over two years), she is definitely one of the most unique characters who can provide loads of moves that fit the context of Smash well. You will be convinced that she has a load of potential once you read the moveset analyses and moves fans have worked hard and provided to show you that. Do not ignore and skip lightly!
_______________________
Moveset Analysis made by @Smash Daddy :
Where to begin? Lets start from the basics: Bayonetta has dozens of weapons she can use to have a range of attacks from all distances and on every input. The ones I can immediately remember from the first game are a sword, a giant pair of claws and a whip. These all have more versatility than you'd immediately think, they have dozens of attacks on their own. But that's only the start. Bayonetta has a variety of guns to attach to her heels, to start she uses a pair of pistols, but can find or buy shotguns, revolvers and other firearms to take their place. In short, she has a tremendous amount of projectiles on top of melee.
That is not even touching upon all the other things she can do. She has hand-to-hand combat that can easily be its own moveset all on its own, except it also summons monsters to synchronize her attacks with giant boots, punches and stomps that come through humongous portals. She can summon torture machines at will to execute monsters on the fly if they're weak enough. For the finale on a boss, she has an assortment of huge demons to summon that are obvious final smash fodder, but surely could be used to inspire a move or two.
If you want a simple basis for a moveset, it's not as if it's intimidating to create one. She has an obvious standard projectile in her pistols she carries around normally, that can be rapid-fired at all times in the first game to whittle down a foe's health. Bayonetta transforms into various animals, including a bird and panther for an obvious recovery. Multiple mid-air jumps can be purchased in the game as well as defensive measures or items that have a variety of unique effects. Bayonetta can even walk on walls and ride missiles to name a couple of many, many inane abilities of the character.
I almost forgot to add how she can stop time. I'm sure I missed a huge amount in this long summary that are obvious to a big Bayonetta fan.
_______________________
Here's a moveset with attacks that come from Bayonetta 2.
Moveset by @Ixbran (Bless him greatly for providing gifs of the moves)
MOVESET
First off, Moveset for the Wonderful Witch her self. Rather than giving her different attacks based off her various weapons, I feel all of her attacks, outside of Animal Transformations, should focus on what she can use with just her guns.
Yes she is a capable fighter with any weapon, but since her guns are her most iconic weapon, I feel they should be the only ones she’d use in her smash bros appearance. Note if the move she performs in a .gif has a name, it will be listed. If it doesn’t, a name describing the ability will be listed instead.
Note: as a Special Gimmick, when attacking with her standard attacks, holding down the attack button after pressing it will cause her to shoot magical bullets, just like in the Bayonetta series.
SPECIALS
STANDARD
- Neutral Special: Charge Bullet
• Default: Charge energy to fire several rapid fire shots.
• Variation 1: Charges a massive orb of magic energy in her gun then fires it. Functions similarly to Samus’s Charge Shot.
• Variation 2: Instantly rapid fire small magic orbs from her gun. Functions similarly to Palutena’s Autoreticle.- Side Special: Panther Within
• Default: Transforms into a panther and dashes forward at double standard speed. Press the button again to perform a slashing claw attack.
• Variation 1: Transforms into a panther and dashes forward at triple standard speed. Transformation lasts only a short period of time, no slash attack.
• Variation 2: Transforms into a panther and dashes a short distance before performing a powerful slash attack.- Up Special: Crow Within
• Default: Transforms into a crow and gains height as if from a 3rd jump. She will slowly descent while in crow form, and players are able to maneuver her as she descends. Functions similarly to Palutena’s Jump Glide.
• Variation 1: Transforms into a crow and feather darts will float around her forming a damaging shield as she descends. Functions similarly to Megaman’s Lief Shield.
• Variation 2: Transforms into a crow and darts in player generated direction. Functions similarly to Pikachu’s Quick Attack.- Down Special: Witch Time
• Default: Strikes a pose, and if struck, Bayonetta will both counter the attack and the enemies movement will slow down if the attack hits, as if under the effect of the Timer item, for a short period of time.
• Variation 1: Strikes a pose, and if struck, Bayonetta will vanish then appear behind opponent and perform a meteor smash on the enemy from behind. Functions similarly to Lucario’s Double Team.
• Variation 2: Strikes a pose, and gains a temporary boost in movement and attack speed, at the cost of strength.
Tilt Attacks
- Jab Attack: Standard Punch Combo
- Dash Attack: Stiletto
- Ledge Recovery Attack: Arching Heel Stomp
- Ground Recovery Attack: Rising Spin Kick
Smash Attacks
- Forward Tilt: Tetsuzanko
- Up Tilt: High Kick
- Down Tilt: Sweeping Spin Kick
Aerial Attacks
- Side Smash: Straight Punch Wicked Weave
- Up Smash: Uppercut Punch Wicked Weave
- Down Smash: Stomping Heel Wicked Weave
Throws
- Neutral Aerial: Rotating Heel Gun Kick
- Forward Aerial: After Burner Kick
- Back Aerial: Three-Hit Kick Combo
- Up Aerial: Witch Strike
- Down Aerial: Long Fall Heel Drop
Misc
- Pummel: Back and Forth Toss Torture Attack
(a.k.a.”Bayonetta Smash!”)
- Forward Throw: Spin and Throw Torture Attack
- Up Throw: Air Bear Trap Torture Attack
- Back Throw: Iron Maiden Torture Attack
- Down Throw: Anarchy Reigns Heel Confetti Stomp
Final Smash
- Dodge Animation: Bat Within Technique
Infernal Demon Summon:Omne The Controller of Creation
Even then, there are still a load of other moves that have not been mentioned by supporters here that could be used for moves. Her potential is almost infinite. (And yes I showed you a load of gifs on purpose because I want to emphasize that uniqueness is her strongest point to her inclusion)
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It's time to take a break..... DANCE! Let your eyes relax through this gif!
Ready to read some more, let's keep going! You'll survive don't worry!
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Arguments Against Bayonetta:
As far as I'm concerned, there are only a few arguments that come up all the time when it comes to her inclusion, however I think these flaws can be potentially overcome with the positives in her favor:
Bayonetta is too sexualized in combat and in personality to be in Smash! If Tharja couldn't get in as a trophy, she has no chance!
Special thanks to this reddit post for addressing these issues:
Reasons Bayonetta is NOT too adult for Super Smash Bros
I know that Bayonetta can look very controversial when it comes to the camera angles in the games' cutscene, but that's not going to translate into Smash Bros. gameplay anyway since it's obvious the camera is not going to zoom towards her parts. That's not what Smash Bros. is about.
- Bayonetta does not need to be any more revealingly dressed than Zero Suit Samus. Sure, in the Bayonetta games, her clothes come off for some attacks, but this is actually a relatively minor detail in the games, which could easily be omitted while still doing proper justice to the character. If they left that out, then she actually shows off less skin than bikini ZSS and swimsuit Shulk.
- Bayonetta would not be the first character with M-Rated games to make Super Smash Bros. The (only) other is Snake. To be sure, the Metal Gear Solid series and Bayonetta series got M-Ratings for very different reasons, but both were clearly not geared towards children. Both games feature guns, violence, coarse language, and more. Plus I think the Metal Gear Solid series is a lot darker thematically.
- If her inclusion doesn't cross any boundaries that Nintendo hasn't already crossed with bikini ZSS or Snake representing M-Rated games, then it's hard to see how concerns like these could outweigh the many great reasons to include her.
Thanks to this tumblr post, I can tell you in good detail on her default appearance on how far she strips off her clothes in Bayonetta 2, and it's not that bad:
This is her default appearance without her attacking. Is it really that controversial as Tharja's trophy?
She covers pretty much most of her body here. She isn't controversial with her default appearance, making her ok to put in even as a potential trophy.
This is her when she's pulling off a full on attack on an enemy. And honestly it's not that bad, it covers what is needed to be suitable for Smash. The only bit iffy parts is her chest, but Sakurai could easily just cover it up so it's not a huge problem. She'd still be able stay true to her arousing personality, but only cover what's necessary. Even then, it is a minor detail that lasts less than a second during combat and is pretty hard to notice during gameplay. People are overexaggerating the problem here.
Kamiya and Sakurai would know (and are smart enough to know) that she would have to be toned down in terms how far she strips down her clothes and how far she would go in terms of personality in order for her to get in the game while still being true to Bayonetta.
Look here too:
Thanks to @Megadoomer for the video:
Other appearances (developed by Platinum themselves) show that it's entirely possible to tone her down while still staying in character. So really is it a problem here?
___________
HE'S NOT AS SUPER ICONIC AS RYU, MARIO, MEGAMAN, SONIC, AND PAC-MAN! He can't be in Smash ever.
Yet, there is no specific criteria rules other than the interview in Famitsu in October and his "special case" criteria, which Sakurai is very vague. We don't know if Sakurai will just strictly add just super famous icons as DLC, for all we know, he could just change his mind even though Sakurai said things against certain characters like "no fighting game characters aloud" pre-Smash 4. And him allowing any video game character to be voted suggests to me that he's open to more choices that aren't just icons as long as they have convincing qualities that make for a great fighter. If the rules can be broken for fighting game characters, the unconfirmed rules can be potentially broken for 3rd parties too.
___________
But the guns! They are the essential part of Bayonetta's character, no real life guns aloud!
I have to say when small guns like the above fire at a ridiculous rate with a fashionable colorful design, they actually feel less closer to a real life gun and more like a fantasy weapon, for the most part her weapon is ok. If her weapon was a rifle, then I would be concerned, but as far as it goes, it's not and can be implemented in Smash. If Sakurai doesn't want the bullets to be shown here, then just make the guns shoot muzzle flashes and make the shots nearly unseeable, like with Sheik's needles.
This looks and acts nowhere close to the average gun you would see in real life:
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There would be other SEGA characters that would be prioritized before her!
I do not believe that many SEGA IPs have been notably close to Nintendo like Bayonetta aside from Sonic. The only other notable SEGA characters being requested right now are Tails, Knuckles, and Shadow; that's really Bayonetta's only competition. In my opinion, though they are pretty iconic characters, the other Sonic characters do not have much of a merit with moveset potential to make them as good of a choice as Bayonetta. Plus the fact she caters to a new audience (and not just the Sonic fanbase) makes her one of the better choices for DLC.
____________
Kamiya doesn't want them in!
Even though Kamiya has said multiple times to stop spamming his Twitter, that won't stop him from including her if Sakurai approached him. He has said years ago he would be more than happy to include her if Sakurai wanted to.
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She doesn't fit Smash very well!
Probably the least important factor Sakurai has stated. There are very rare cases in which a character can feel out of place visually, but most newcomers fit in just fine. They blend in the game in a different distinct way, like with Snake.
____________
I believe that Bayonetta has a pretty good shot overall. In my opinion, the major negative factors hindering her chances is other noteworthy SEGA characters and being a third-party since more has to be done than a Nintendo character. Sakurai has added third-party trophies in the games from different companies without a problem. I think that if he has no problem with this, he shouldn't have a problem with Bayonetta either. I'm confident Sakurai knows Bayonetta well enough to address the issues fans bring up so she can be in the game, especially with how close PG games is with Nintendo right now.
Bayonetta Want:
101%
Let me just get this out of the way.
I desperately want Bayonetta to happen. My want stems back in the uniqueness tier list thread (Which I am the thread creator of), back when I had 0% interest in buying the game when Bayonetta 2 was announced When the moveset potential analysis for Bayonetta began, a notable amount of people brought up that she had an extreme load of potential and gave her an analysis, @Smash Daddy created an analysis that intrigued me into checking out her support thread. For some reason though, I had a strange good feeling she would get in the game someday as DLC, though I didn't really get to pinpoint that feeling until much later.
Months later, I got the game for my Christmas money, though I didn't play it yet because I lost my Wii U Gamepad for a temporary while and mainly I was playing through and grinding through Bravely Default (Which took over my life for a while). Honestly, I thought I would lose my interest quickly when I started up the original Bayonetta. And holy cow was I really surprised. The very smooth gameplay, the many cool stylish attacks Bayonetta can do with her, and her unique personality, it was unlike any other game I played. The more moves that I unlocked throughout my play through, the more I realize how large her moveset potential is. I want her in this game so badly... and it's exciting to know which attacks will be implemented in the game because there is so many of them if you count the other weapons she buys and unlock throughout the game if Sakurai were to add her in.
Her not being added would be a truly missed opportunity for Sakurai, because when it comes to moveset potential, she shines brilliantly, and that's what I really like about her more than any positive I listed in the Chance rating.
____________
Nominations:
x5 Isabelle
____________
(READ ABOVE FIRST! EVERYONE SHOULD DO SO AND NOT SKIP!)
These are only times where I go all out on rating a character, I would appreciate if you look back and read the rating.
Burruni
Smash Hero
Ha-HA.
Bayonetta.
I'll try to be concise on this one.
Chance: 1%
+ Moderately requested
+ Good recent usage by Nintendo
- Third Party without Legacy
- Started exclusive to Sony/Microsoft
- Created to be a power fantasy for women, by a woman, sexualization and cussing is at the heart of her character
- Transformations in mid-moveset have been very simple up to this point.
- Probably not even in the top 10 of requests
Elaborated: Bayonetta probably isn't going to make major enough of a splash in the ballot to be looked at. If she does? Then we have a flowchart: Third party character with two games? No. So the introduction of her WiiU exclusive game has a sexualized pan up her body before you get to gameplay? No. So she's a very agile combo-heavy fighter with bdsm styled finishers whose outfit gets thinner and thinner the more heavy you go into combos... it'd be unfitting to her character to "tone her down" into an E10 game.
Want: 10%
I loved her games, but a lot of the playstyle that would be gotten out of her is gotten with how plays imo. Her music would be more welcoming as an addition.
Bayonetta.
I'll try to be concise on this one.
Chance: 1%
+ Moderately requested
+ Good recent usage by Nintendo
- Third Party without Legacy
- Started exclusive to Sony/Microsoft
- Created to be a power fantasy for women, by a woman, sexualization and cussing is at the heart of her character
- Transformations in mid-moveset have been very simple up to this point.
- Probably not even in the top 10 of requests
Elaborated: Bayonetta probably isn't going to make major enough of a splash in the ballot to be looked at. If she does? Then we have a flowchart: Third party character with two games? No. So the introduction of her WiiU exclusive game has a sexualized pan up her body before you get to gameplay? No. So she's a very agile combo-heavy fighter with bdsm styled finishers whose outfit gets thinner and thinner the more heavy you go into combos... it'd be unfitting to her character to "tone her down" into an E10 game.
Want: 10%
I loved her games, but a lot of the playstyle that would be gotten out of her is gotten with how
plays imo. Her music would be more welcoming as an addition.
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colder_than_ice
Smash Lord
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ZAEL
CHANCE: 4.86%
WANT: 27.78%
As far as JRPG characters go, Zael is considered less likely than Elma and Cross here. Next up we're rating Bayonetta and predicting what score the concept of new palutena's guidance conversations will get.CHANCE: 4.86%
WANT: 27.78%
BluePikmin11
Akko is my dear daughter!
You didn't play the game long enough my boy.Bayonetta:
Everyone, prepare yourselves!
Before I post my rating, everyone gather round for embarrassing story time!
So I had been meaning to play Bayonetta 2 for a while now, but I could never figure out a way to try it out without drawing the suspicions of my parents. But recently I was able to slip it in along with some other books and video games I was renting from the local library. But I got invested into Tekken Tag Tournament 2, and I didn't play it immediately. Then wile playing some smash with my friend, he noticed the game and asked if it has multiplayer. I was quite sure it didn't, but he insisted on loading up Bayonetta 2 and making sure for himself. After watching him play the tutorial level, we got to e opening cutscene, where literally all hell broke loose. Swearing, stripping, slaughter, you name it. Afterwards I returned the game, my friend picked it up the day afterwords, and I won't soon be able to live this event down. Point of the story being, I'm quite sure that Bayonetta could never be within a ten-foot stripper's pole of any E10+ rated game. Want is far more simple to explain. If she got in, I would never hear the end of it from my friend. So I've decided to give Bayonetta double zeros. I know that's the kind of score usually awarded to Yarne and Owain tag team and B.B. Bandit Trio nominations, but it's my honest opinion on the matter.
And now for some counter arguments:
1. "Nintendo saved Bayonetta 2 from cancellation and published it themselves!"
Since when does one game = viable smash candidate? The only modern series with only one game to receive a character is Monado Boy Chronicles, and Nintendo acquired the Studio that made the game.
2. "But we had Snake in Brawl!"
Brawl was a Teen rated game, wile Smash 4 has obtained an E10+ rating, which really harms Bayonetta's chances. Keep in mind sexualization is far more harshly rated by the ESRB than violence. Not to mention Snake is far different from Bayonetta. Snake slits people's necks, not clothes.
3. "But we are getting Ryu!"
I personally don't think we are, but that is besides the point. Here's my list of third party characters I made for Jibanayn, but with Bayonetta.
Pac Man: Probably the most recognizable character in all of video gaming, and has been a cultural icon for 35 years.
Sonic: A former rival to Mario that was Sega's mascot in the Sega vs. Nintendo conflict of old, but has since become a staple of Nintendo platforms.
Mega Man: A character that has been a staple on Nintendo platforms for over twenty-five years, and one of the most heavily requested characters to enter the smash scene.
Ryu?: Reinvented the entire fighting genre with Street Fighter II, and has continued the series up until present day.
Bayonetta: Had one moderately well-selling game package as a Wii U exclusive.
She just doesn't fit in with the rest of our third-party characters.
4. "They could always tone down Bayonetta's moves"
But toning down a character removes them from what they are, and that is clearly not something Sakurai is interested in. From what I've seen in reviews the story of the games isn't what draws people in, so the focus of the game is clearly the stylized combat system. If they felt like taking a character out of the context the game puts them in for the sake of playability, you have one guess as to what purple character we would see on our selection screen.
If you read the whole thing, congrats to you! Feel free to leave a counter-argument and enjoy this Celebi
Nominating Owain x5
LIQUID12A
Smash Modder
Hey hey hey! Time to put your mettle to the test now! (ba ba ba do!) Hey hey hey, don't ya know you're messing with the best now?
(I'll admit I'm rating Bayonetta partly to post that song)
Chances: 15%
The reality is that third-parties have stiff competition for a spot in Smash as of now. Ryu is the hot thing right now due to the sound leak, and characters such as Snake and Rayman are highly requested due to a variety of reasons. Bayonetta lacks that extra kick that helps the other characters; she's not as prominent as most third-parties.
Yes, Blue, I read your wall of text and it's well constructed, but there is a reality to be seen.
Want: 40%
Okay, I don't have Bayonetta 2, much less a Wii U(yet), but I have indeed played the first one. The concept of a stylish moveset akin to Dante in UMVC3 is honestly intriguing to me.
Extra Palutena's Guidance convos prediction: 30%
After Mewtwo I don't see this happening.
Nominate: Sylux x5
(I'll admit I'm rating Bayonetta partly to post that song)
Chances: 15%
The reality is that third-parties have stiff competition for a spot in Smash as of now. Ryu is the hot thing right now due to the sound leak, and characters such as Snake and Rayman are highly requested due to a variety of reasons. Bayonetta lacks that extra kick that helps the other characters; she's not as prominent as most third-parties.
Yes, Blue, I read your wall of text and it's well constructed, but there is a reality to be seen.
Want: 40%
Okay, I don't have Bayonetta 2, much less a Wii U(yet), but I have indeed played the first one. The concept of a stylish moveset akin to Dante in UMVC3 is honestly intriguing to me.
Extra Palutena's Guidance convos prediction: 30%
After Mewtwo I don't see this happening.
Nominate: Sylux x5
Icedragonadam
Smash Master
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Bayonetta:
Chance: 30% What BluePikmin11 said. Also the sexualization isn't an issue as DLC isn't rated by the ESRB I believe.
Want:75% That moveset I've seen is very impressive.
Prediction:
New Palutena's Guidance: 46% It could happen(mainly because the unknown fighters thing doesn't make sense with characters like Lucas and Wolf). But I'm leaning towards not happening.
R.O.B Eye Fix: 88.88%
Nominate
Lloyd Irving x5
Chance: 30% What BluePikmin11 said. Also the sexualization isn't an issue as DLC isn't rated by the ESRB I believe.
Want:75% That moveset I've seen is very impressive.
Prediction:
New Palutena's Guidance: 46% It could happen(mainly because the unknown fighters thing doesn't make sense with characters like Lucas and Wolf). But I'm leaning towards not happening.
R.O.B Eye Fix: 88.88%
Nominate
Lloyd Irving x5
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CaptainAmerica
Smash Master
I apologize in advance, but I have to do this...
...no, not really, but this gif made me laugh my *** off, and I've been dying to use it somewhere.
Seriously, though: I get that you may be excited for a character, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but I don't know if this is really the place for a fully-fleshed out moveset proposal - that might be better for her individual support thread. We've got a lot going on in this one as it is, and I can see this being a very flamey day...
Anyway, on to the main topic...
Bayonetta
Chance: 10%
Nom: Stage Packs x5
...no, not really, but this gif made me laugh my *** off, and I've been dying to use it somewhere.
Seriously, though: I get that you may be excited for a character, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but I don't know if this is really the place for a fully-fleshed out moveset proposal - that might be better for her individual support thread. We've got a lot going on in this one as it is, and I can see this being a very flamey day...
Anyway, on to the main topic...
Bayonetta
Chance: 10%
So, she's got a lot of the same issues as pretty much every other third-party we've hit thus far, so I'm not going to rehash tired arguments. However, one thing she definitely has going for her is name recognition. She's hotly requested on the ballot, and loads of people like her. Despite having only two games under her belt, she's pretty well known - and not all in a good way.
And therein lies one of her major problems - her character is all about the sexualization. And with as sensitive of a culture as we've become, someone would be up in arms if this ended up in an E rated game (because nobody pays attention to the "Online interactions are not reated by the ESRB" clause). Toning that down would help, but that would severely be false to the character herself, and we know Sakurai hates to do that (but then again, he's ok with being false to any character other than Ridley, so that might just be a lame excuse, honestly).
Want: 40%And therein lies one of her major problems - her character is all about the sexualization. And with as sensitive of a culture as we've become, someone would be up in arms if this ended up in an E rated game (because nobody pays attention to the "Online interactions are not reated by the ESRB" clause). Toning that down would help, but that would severely be false to the character herself, and we know Sakurai hates to do that (but then again, he's ok with being false to any character other than Ridley, so that might just be a lame excuse, honestly).
I really have no strong pull one way or the other, which is strange for me and third-parties. The only drawback is I'd like other chracters, but this wouldn't be the worst thing for me.
Guidance Convos: 10.0%
Nom: Stage Packs x5
BluePikmin11
Akko is my dear daughter!
Like I said, the moveset potential is the most key factor within her inclusion, hence why I posted a whole moveset. I provided gifs to ones who have never heard of Bayonetta and are rating her right now.I apologize in advance, but I have to do this...
...no, not really, but this gif made me laugh my *** off, and I've been dying to use it somewhere.
Seriously, though: I get that you may be excited for a character, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but I don't know if this is really the place for a fully-fleshed out moveset proposal - that might be better for her individual support thread. We've got a lot going on in this one as it is, and I can see this being a very flamey day...
Yomi's Biggest Fan
See You Next Year, Baby
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So no third party inclusion would be worse than Bubsy the Bobcat? I mean, what could possibly go wrong?
Bayonetta:
Chance: 20%
Bayonetta, while popular, doesn't exactly have a lot going for her. Her latest game wasn't exactly a success commercially, and she's not exactly the most iconic third party out there. She has a lot of competition at the moment. While her sexualization isn't exactly THAT big of an issue to most, something tells me a character like her wouldn't exactly be pushed for by Nintendo. Sure, Zero Suit Samus' costumes exist, but they don't play as much of an importance to her character or abilities like Bayonetta. Her sexualization is a big part of who she is.
Want: 80%
Nowhere near my most wanted third party, but I would not object at all if she were added. She's a fun character, and she could have one of the craziest movesets in the game. The music and stages she could bring would be amazing as well. The only reason why I don't have her higher is because Rayman exists, tbh. But if given the opportunity, I would add her.
Prediction:
New Palutena Guidance: 10%
Edit:
Since I get extra nominations...
Yoshimitsu x2
Chance: 20%
Bayonetta, while popular, doesn't exactly have a lot going for her. Her latest game wasn't exactly a success commercially, and she's not exactly the most iconic third party out there. She has a lot of competition at the moment. While her sexualization isn't exactly THAT big of an issue to most, something tells me a character like her wouldn't exactly be pushed for by Nintendo. Sure, Zero Suit Samus' costumes exist, but they don't play as much of an importance to her character or abilities like Bayonetta. Her sexualization is a big part of who she is.
Want: 80%
Nowhere near my most wanted third party, but I would not object at all if she were added. She's a fun character, and she could have one of the craziest movesets in the game. The music and stages she could bring would be amazing as well. The only reason why I don't have her higher is because Rayman exists, tbh. But if given the opportunity, I would add her.
Prediction:
New Palutena Guidance: 10%
Edit:
Since I get extra nominations...
Yoshimitsu x2
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Troykv
Smash Master
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Anyway, time to rate Kamiya's Girl
Bayonetta
Chance: 5%
I mean... Seriously? She looks like a Pr0nstar (?) But... she actually has some little connections with Nintendo and fan support in the ballot... It's something.
Want: 50%
She looks cool... But I don't care.
Predictions: Palutena's Guidance
Chance: 33%
Nominations:
Micaiah x5
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BandanaWaddleDee
Smash Lord
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Might as well get it out the way
Bayonetta
Chance: 0%
The reality is it won't happen. She had one exclusive game, and it didn't even sell that greatly.
She's too sexualized for an E10 game. Snake was an exception, because all he did was use explosives, which are totally fine in Smash.
She's nowhere close to as iconic as the other 3rd party characters, and isn't a hugely popular character in any country.
There are more logical choices for a 2nd Sega character, or another 3rd party in general.
Want: 0%
She needs to stay as far away from Smash as possible. This addition makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, and I do not want this at all.
New Palutena Guidances Prediction: 55%
Fixing R.O.B's eye glitch: 98.99%
Nominations:
Leon Powalski x5
Bayonetta
Chance: 0%
The reality is it won't happen. She had one exclusive game, and it didn't even sell that greatly.
She's too sexualized for an E10 game. Snake was an exception, because all he did was use explosives, which are totally fine in Smash.
She's nowhere close to as iconic as the other 3rd party characters, and isn't a hugely popular character in any country.
There are more logical choices for a 2nd Sega character, or another 3rd party in general.
Want: 0%
She needs to stay as far away from Smash as possible. This addition makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, and I do not want this at all.
New Palutena Guidances Prediction: 55%
Fixing R.O.B's eye glitch: 98.99%
Nominations:
Leon Powalski x5
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BluePikmin11
Akko is my dear daughter!
I'm going to have a fun debate tomorrow.
D
Deleted member
Guest
Bayonetta
Chance: Negligible (Approximately 0%)
A hyper-sexualized M-rated character in an E10+-rated game? Not very plausible regardless of her ballot support. Yes, I read Blue's comparison to existing characters in Brawl and Smash 4, but those are tame in comparison. She would only join the fray if Sakurai and his team tone her down drastically, thus removing one of her main appeals.
Want: 75%
I have yet to play her eponymous series, but I'd probably enjoy her playstyle regardless of censorship.
Prediction:
New Super Paper Palutena's Guidance XL Turbo Champion Edition U Plus Alpha 64 DS - 50%
R.O.B. Eye Fix - 95%
Nomination: Owain x5
Chance: Negligible (Approximately 0%)
A hyper-sexualized M-rated character in an E10+-rated game? Not very plausible regardless of her ballot support. Yes, I read Blue's comparison to existing characters in Brawl and Smash 4, but those are tame in comparison. She would only join the fray if Sakurai and his team tone her down drastically, thus removing one of her main appeals.
Want: 75%
I have yet to play her eponymous series, but I'd probably enjoy her playstyle regardless of censorship.
Prediction:
New Super Paper Palutena's Guidance XL Turbo Champion Edition U Plus Alpha 64 DS - 50%
R.O.B. Eye Fix - 95%
Nomination: Owain x5
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PK_Wonder
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Jun 19, 2010
- Messages
- 1,179
@
colder_than_ice
@8-bit Man
If we wanna go ahead and have a Double Day tomorrow w/ Palutena Guidance Conversations and rate "*Concept: Fixing R.O.B.'s visual glitch involving his eye," I'll tackle the latter?
colder_than_ice
@8-bit Man If we wanna go ahead and have a Double Day tomorrow w/ Palutena Guidance Conversations and rate "*Concept: Fixing R.O.B.'s visual glitch involving his eye," I'll tackle the latter?
StormC
Smash Hero
- Joined
- Oct 29, 2014
- Messages
- 8,299
Chance: 15%. This could definitely be doubled if Smash 4 was T and not E10. Snake already might be pushing good taste for Smash 4, I definitely think Bayonetta would make Nintendo second guess themselves. Other than that, she's pretty popular, but not enough compared to Sonic for Brawl and Mega Man for 4. If she gets in, I suspect Sakurai and Kamiya's relationship will play the major role in that.
Want: 40%. She would certainly be a unique fighter in Smash. But characters need to offer more than just "they'd be cool."
Beast Ganon 10x
Palutena Guidance prediction: 10%
R.O.B. eye glitch patch prediction: 90%
Want: 40%. She would certainly be a unique fighter in Smash. But characters need to offer more than just "they'd be cool."
Beast Ganon 10x
Palutena Guidance prediction: 10%
R.O.B. eye glitch patch prediction: 90%
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False Sense
Ad Astra Per Aspera
- Joined
- Jan 17, 2014
- Messages
- 8,332
- NNID
- FalseSense
- 3DS FC
- 3368-2599-3209
Oh dear...
Bayonetta
Chance: 1%
+Has a fair amount of popularity
+Recent release on the Wii U that has received critical acclaim
+Unique potential
- - - -Third Party
-Has only two games in her entire series
-Doesn't have overwhelming demand
- - - -Character is defined my extremely mature elements not fit for Smash
I don't see this happening. Not only is Bayonetta a minor Third Party character without massive demand, but the character herself, as well as her series, is entirely based around her rather extreme sexualization. Controversial, to say the least. I don't believe Bayonetta has enough going for her to not only stand out amongst potential DLC candidates (let alone Third Party DLC candidates), but also to overcome her major flaws as a character choice.
Want: 0%
Bayonetta
Chance: 1%
+Has a fair amount of popularity
+Recent release on the Wii U that has received critical acclaim
+Unique potential
- - - -Third Party
-Has only two games in her entire series
-Doesn't have overwhelming demand
- - - -Character is defined my extremely mature elements not fit for Smash
I don't see this happening. Not only is Bayonetta a minor Third Party character without massive demand, but the character herself, as well as her series, is entirely based around her rather extreme sexualization. Controversial, to say the least. I don't believe Bayonetta has enough going for her to not only stand out amongst potential DLC candidates (let alone Third Party DLC candidates), but also to overcome her major flaws as a character choice.
Want: 0%