Rankings Suggestions

[Neo Zero]

If you have any suggestions for the ranking system or how it's handled, please leave them here.

 

[Captain Faceroll]

I think there should be a place where all of the TOs uploaded brackets are consolidated. Right now, if I want to search for all my brackets, it's super convoluted and I can't do it without using the specific individual URLS.

It kind of seems silly that I can see all the brackets I'm a part of, but not all of the brackets that I've uploaded. I hope this makes sense. Basically I want to be able to click on my profile, and see a tab or something that says "brackets uploaded", and it'll have a list of all the brackets I've uploaded.

Thanks in advance!

 

[Neo Zero]

I think there should be a place where all of the TOs uploaded brackets are consolidated. Right now, if I want to search for all my brackets, it's super convoluted and I can't do it without using the specific individual URLS.

It kind of seems silly that I can see all the brackets I'm a part of, but not all of the brackets that I've uploaded. I hope this makes sense. Basically I want to be able to click on my profile, and see a tab or something that says "brackets uploaded", and it'll have a list of all the brackets I've uploaded.

Thanks in advance!

So basically, something akin to like the player ranking pages where it shows the brackets they were in, only this page is for TO's only and displays anything they've submitted and had approved correct?

 

[Dissent]

TO's in New England don't really bother uploading these and won't due to laziness/Facebook. If we could get past the Challonge API restrictions with the option of a batch text dumping, that would encourage me to add them for the TO's instead. So for instance, if I copy paste this...

Supreme Champion:     LingLing
Worthy Adversary:     Dissent
Maybe Next Time:     Jakamu
4th place:     6:00AM
5th place tie:     Steinway
Murdabito
7th place tie:     Ant
Keezer
9th place tie:     NAViBOY
Twizy
I Can't Win
Inferno
13th place tie:     N64
Axel
Iron
Tsori
17th place tie:     Enker
Garrek
ZDPastaMan
Lilium
Nboss
Riney
Luis
Slips
25th place tie:     Prina
VG | Markis
WPI | Natendo
Ian
Jobin
Deku
NFOH
Thram
33rd place tie:     NickB
Nikku
Player-2
Nuggets
DoctorProf#
SOLI
Ber
TopSquid
215 God

...it would add them in order with their respective rankings.

Also, some TO's don't finish off their bracket in GF's, so being able to paste and adjust from the in-progress Standings page would be great.

 

[Captain Faceroll]

So basically, something akin to like the player ranking pages where it shows the brackets they were in, only this page is for TO's only and displays anything they've submitted and had approved correct?

Yep, although it might not need to only have approved brackets. I'd like to see all of my approved brackets as well as the ones currently awaiting approval. That would be super helpful to me <3

 

[JimmyTheCaterpillar]

I personally feel it would be nice to incorporate an option to submit Doubles tournaments, as a lot of people are really passionate about them, and it's too bad they cannot be shown against other teams in their own ranking system.

Although it would probably take a lot of work to implement, I think a lot of people would appreciate it.

Yep, although it might not need to only have approved brackets. I'd like to see all of my approved brackets as well as the ones currently awaiting approval. That would be super helpful to me <3

I second this.

 

[Daftatt]

Would you care to offer some feedback in the suggestion thread then? I have one thing I've finished setting up that I plan to implement later, but to hear what you want would be most helpful in improving the system.

Honestly my biggest problem isn't a direct fault of the system, it's just getting people from my tournaments to freaking get on smashboards and make their claims. If people don't make their claims I'm basically just giving imaginary points to imaginary people.

I tried one weekly to manually get everyone to log on and claim, then a bunch of people went back and started claiming everything, people change tags a lot at my weekly so it quickly turned into a mess of misrepresentation. My inbox also got filled with conversations about claims but they were kind of pointless since everyone at my weekly was making a new account to use for their points and I couldn't actually verify who was who.

Eventually everyone stopped taking interest in the rankings system because they didn't care where they stood amongst everyone else in the system, only the people they played with. I (don't know if it's possible) couldn't figure out how to organize player's scores into an isolated group so we could compete amongst our scene. A lot of players didn't want to join smashboards at all (no clue why), but ultimately if they did our scene is so alias-fluid that they may as well not have claimed anything.

For a smaller scene like ours, the rankings just seem pointless and more of a hassle than they are worth. With almost all coordination and discussion for our scene going on the facebook group it's just not easy to get people to start using smashboards. Dunno if there is any sort of facebook integration that you could use for the ranking system but that would be a godsend.

because we use facebook to run the smash scene in our town, tags don't really matter much and people use real names almost always. People don't take tags seriously or stick to them, and the concept of committing to an alias on smashboards turned people off when they don't think of the smash community (too localized) that way.

That was a while back and a lot of smashers that come to our weekly have gotten a lot more serious about the game, so I'm going to give the bracket submission another go and try to get people to start engaging with the metagame discussion on smashboards.

 

[Neo Zero]

I personally feel it would be nice to incorporate an option to submit Doubles tournaments, as a lot of people are really passionate about them, and it's too bad they cannot be shown against other teams in their own ranking system.

Although it would probably take a lot of work to implement, I think a lot of people would appreciate it.



I second this.

Doubles is something I can't say would be a huge priority, given how user name claiming works presently. It's something I'd like to look into though.

Yep, although it might not need to only have approved brackets. I'd like to see all of my approved brackets as well as the ones currently awaiting approval. That would be super helpful to me <3

This in theory shouldn't be too hard to implement. Currently I'm working on having a dev sub domain set up so we can have a place we can safely edit the code without blowing anything up, so once that's all set up for us I'd like to see if we can do that relatively quickly

Honestly my biggest problem isn't a direct fault of the system, it's just getting people from my tournaments to freaking get on smashboards and make their claims. If people don't make their claims I'm basically just giving imaginary points to imaginary people.

I tried one weekly to manually get everyone to log on and claim, then a bunch of people went back and started claiming everything, people change tags a lot at my weekly so it quickly turned into a mess of misrepresentation. My inbox also got filled with conversations about claims but they were kind of pointless since everyone at my weekly was making a new account to use for their points and I couldn't actually verify who was who.

Eventually everyone stopped taking interest in the rankings system because they didn't care where they stood amongst everyone else in the system, only the people they played with. I (don't know if it's possible) couldn't figure out how to organize player's scores into an isolated group so we could compete amongst our scene. A lot of players didn't want to join smashboards at all (no clue why), but ultimately if they did our scene is so alias-fluid that they may as well not have claimed anything.

For a smaller scene like ours, the rankings just seem pointless and more of a hassle than they are worth. With almost all coordination and discussion for our scene going on the facebook group it's just not easy to get people to start using smashboards. Dunno if there is any sort of facebook integration that you could use for the ranking system but that would be a godsend.

because we use facebook to run the smash scene in our town, tags don't really matter much and people use real names almost always. People don't take tags seriously or stick to them, and the concept of committing to an alias on smashboards turned people off when they don't think of the smash community (too localized) that way.

That was a while back and a lot of smashers that come to our weekly have gotten a lot more serious about the game, so I'm going to give the bracket submission another go and try to get people to start engaging with the metagame discussion on smashboards.

Moved your post to the suggestions thread just to make it easier to catalogue. First off you make a ton of good points. Not having claims is one of the reasons our ranking queue even got so high as it is, because like you said, it'd be giving imaginary points to imaginary people.

One thing I mentioned before we were made admins that I really really wanted to work hard to do was allow better Facebook intergration somehow, though I'm still figuring out the best way to go about implementing something where what you do on Smashboards instantly goes to your FB. What maybe I can work on is a way to not only claim as a Smashboards user, but also be able to tie claims to Facebook accounts. That way even if you're not registered to the site, the points go somewhere that you can keep track of.

I can't exactly offer a better method of being notified of claims at this time. At best, the only idea I have is maybe have claims only go into one PM for a given event, but I'm not sure how viable that is at this time. As TO's though, I'd recommend listing players as a static name in the brackets. That way it's far easier to keep track of.

In terms of region based rankings, this I can say is a good idea, because let's face it, a lot of players simply aren't going to care to much because it's physically impossible for them to even make the Top 10, let alone Top 100, simply because they can't travel, or don't want to, or w/e. However, making a ranking for every region out there likely isn't viable. I thought of perhaps using sub leagues to simulate that, but then I'd need to make 5-7 different leagues for a region for each game, and that would turn into a cluttered mess. Still, I'd certainly like to look into perhaps being able to display rankings by region only so it shows you how you stack up compared to the people who are around you.

Ideally, ya, we want people to be on Smashboards, but we want them to want them to be here, and this site offers a ton of good for players of any skill level. Still we know that's difficult but we greatly appreciate what you and other TO's do in trying to get people here so we can have one giant united community.

TO's in New England don't really bother uploading these and won't due to laziness/Facebook. If we could get past the Challonge API restrictions with the option of a batch text dumping, that would encourage me to add them for the TO's instead. So for instance, if I copy paste this...

Supreme Champion:     LingLing
Worthy Adversary:     Dissent
Maybe Next Time:     Jakamu
4th place:     6:00AM
5th place tie:     Steinway
Murdabito
7th place tie:     Ant
Keezer
9th place tie:     NAViBOY
Twizy
I Can't Win
Inferno
13th place tie:     N64
Axel
Iron
Tsori
17th place tie:     Enker
Garrek
ZDPastaMan
Lilium
Nboss
Riney
Luis
Slips
25th place tie:     Prina
VG | Markis
WPI | Natendo
Ian
Jobin
Deku
NFOH
Thram
33rd place tie:     NickB
Nikku
Player-2
Nuggets
DoctorProf#
SOLI
Ber
TopSquid
215 God

...it would add them in order with their respective rankings.

Also, some TO's don't finish off their bracket in GF's, so being able to paste and adjust from the in-progress Standings page would be great.

On your first point, Warchamp said something in another forum a while back on the whole API system

Yes, Challonge recently fixed the API so you can view any event via the API. There's nothing secret about an event that required it to be restricted as it was

Also fixes the issue where an event hosted by a Challonge Organization could only be submitted by the actual user that made the event as the Organization

So provided you have your own API, in theory you SHOULD be able to upload brackets yourself using your own. I've never actually personally tested this though, so if you can give it a try and then let me know if it can happen or not?

 

[Captain Faceroll]

Another thing I think that'd be worthwhile to add is to give the TOs a notification when the brackets are approved. I generally get a message from one of the moderators saying something, but I think just in case it'd be a nice addition.

 

[Malachi Allen]

Also for double stage tournaments we should be able to make it known there were more players entered than it says. I have a tournament where it says there are only 16 people when in reality about 33 people came out and played, we just had pools.

 

[Malachi Allen]

Also for double stage tournaments we should be able to make it known there were more players entered than it says. I have a tournament where it says there are only 16 people when in reality about 33 people came out and played, we just had pools.

Also it would help for locals to better balance the weight. If a local gets 100 entrants but only has a top 32 bracket it doesn't make any sense not to reward those players more points.

 

[Vestboy_Myst]

Also it would help for locals to better balance the weight. If a local gets 100 entrants but only has a top 32 bracket it doesn't make any sense not to reward those players more points.

this is a current limitation of scaling, which we implemented for those massive locals that were 'large locals' before. right now locals NEED to submit full results, otherwise if a top32 is uploaded it will treat it as a 32person local, and so on.

are you using 2-stage challonge for these small tournaments (~30 people to top16), and is it only showing up as a 'topX'' person local in the rankings? link the one in question

until we find a workaround for this it's up to the uploader whether or not those points are added to the system for their players, so we encourage uploading full results whenever possible. regional and higher events do not have this problem due to static point values. we're looking into ways to specify total entrants in a custom field, but it adds a bunch of moderation issues (people falsifying totals to boost scores, confirming total entrants if pools aren't uploaded, etc)

 

[Malachi Allen]

this is a current limitation of scaling, which we implemented for those massive locals that were 'large locals' before. right now locals NEED to submit full results, otherwise if a top32 is uploaded it will treat it as a 32person local, and so on.

are you using 2-stage challonge for these small tournaments (~30 people to top16), and is it only showing up as a 'topX'' person local in the rankings? link the one in question

until we find a workaround for this it's up to the uploader whether or not those points are added to the system for their players, so we encourage uploading full results whenever possible. regional and higher events do not have this problem due to static point values. we're looking into ways to specify total entrants in a custom field, but it adds a bunch of moderation issues (people falsifying totals to boost scores, confirming total entrants if pools aren't uploaded, etc)

It's not that, it's just that some tournaments do pools on sheets (like press start was one of them) or have bracket pools that use multiple challonge brackets that aren't uploaded.

Also yeah I used a 2-stage challonge and it only listed as top 16 even though there was a two stage tournament 33 entrants total. http://smashboards.com/rankings/slo-v-s-sb.8325/event

 

[Vestboy_Myst]

It's not that, it's just that some tournaments do pools on sheets (like press start was one of them) or have bracket pools that use multiple challonge brackets that aren't uploaded.

Also yeah I used a 2-stage challonge and it only listed as top 16 even though there was a two stage tournament 33 entrants total. http://smashboards.com/rankings/slo-v-s-sb.8325/event

pools aren't ranked or necessary to upload, so no need to hunt them down and add them individually.

if you look at your rankings it already says '33 players' and you are awarded the full 330pts for them (1st place = 100% of the event's value), so your event is not wrong, and it seems 2stage challonge is not an issue

 

[Malachi Allen]

pools aren't ranked or necessary to upload, so no need to hunt them down and add them individually.

if you look at your rankings it already says '33 players' and you are awarded the full 330pts for them (1st place = 100% of the event's value), so your event is not wrong, and it seems 2stage challonge is not an issue

That's because I manually put in every single persons name, the two stage challonge does not work I'm telling you, haha

 

[Vestboy_Myst]

That's because I manually put in every single persons name, the two stage challonge does not work I'm telling you, haha

ahhh i see now. alright thanks for letting us know, my bad.

 

[JmanJ]

The option to manually hide players in a subleague would be very helpful. This is especially useful for removing OoS players from statewide rankings. Needs to happen IMO!

 

[Vestboy_Myst]

The option to manually hide players in a subleague would be very helpful. This is especially useful for removing OoS players from statewide rankings. Needs to happen IMO!

i agree this would be a great feature, will pass it along

 

[Captain Faceroll]

Can you add the ability to delete our own brackets? Sometimes I upload a bracket and get an error while it's uploading and then the bracket is incomplete. I have to wait for a mod to delete it which seems unnecessary when I could just delete it myself.

There is an option to "delete bracket" but it says I don't have sufficient permissions to do so.

 

[Locuan]

Can you add the ability to delete our own brackets? Sometimes I upload a bracket and get an error while it's uploading and then the bracket is incomplete. I have to wait for a mod to delete it which seems unnecessary when I could just delete it myself.

There is an option to "delete bracket" but it says I don't have sufficient permissions to do so.

For now you could let us know by tagging us. However, it's something worth looking into.