Ch0zen0ne
Smash Lord
how did this topic already die... should we [the ROB community] look at each matchup individuallly and rate them +/-/= so something constructive actually gets done...
-
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R.O.B.'s best & worst match ups.
- Thread starter mossdog
- Start date
JCaesar
Smash Hero
Sounds good to me. A topic for each matchup would be excessive but a thread devoted to matchups (sorta like this one) would be good, with the first post having a chart and maybe a paragraph or 2 devoted to each matchup. If someone could do that and keep it updated regularly that'd be awesome, and sticky worthy.
Ch0zen0ne
Smash Lord
I mean.. I STRONGLY feel that this should be the discussion thread, and that once the final matchups are all posted and set, we can then do a tactics discussion under the matchups.. making this thread for adv/disadv/eql
and the other for how/who/what.. and ofcourse listing the matchups themselves lol...
For now though i think that after the first few pages of discussion we can agree...
MK: -
Marth: =
Samus: +
Link: +
Falco: +
Bowser: +
DiddyKong: +
G&W: -
Ganon: +
Ike: +
Wolf: +
ROB: =
..
First im going to challenge anyone to tell me that any of these matchups are incorrect.. and if they are then let us discuss them [since Mr. Swarm, and myself both agree on all of these].
and the other for how/who/what.. and ofcourse listing the matchups themselves lol...
For now though i think that after the first few pages of discussion we can agree...
MK: -
Marth: =
Samus: +
Link: +
Falco: +
Bowser: +
DiddyKong: +
G&W: -
Ganon: +
Ike: +
Wolf: +
ROB: =
..
First im going to challenge anyone to tell me that any of these matchups are incorrect.. and if they are then let us discuss them [since Mr. Swarm, and myself both agree on all of these].
Sudai
Stuff here
Take these as you will. Figured we should get some more ratings in to try to help get some actual discussion going.
Bowser
+
Captain Falcon
+
Diddy Kong
+
Donkey Kong
+
Falco
+
Fox
=
Game & Watch
-
Ganondorf
++++
Ice Climbers
+
Ike
+
Jigglypuff
=
King Dedede
+
Kirby
=
Link
+
Lucario
?
Lucas
+
Luigi
?
Mario
+
Marth
+
Meta Knight
--------------
Ness
+
Peach
+
Pikachu
=
Pikmin & Olimar
+
Pit
+++++
Pokémon Trainer
Squirtle: =
Ivy: +
Charizard: +++
R.O.B.
--------------------- [For lulz.. >>; ]
Samus
+
Sheik
=
Snake
+
Sonic
+
Toon Link
=
Wario
+
Wolf
+
Yoshi
+
Zelda
-
Zero Suit Samus
?
I'll provide reasoning if asked. No time to do any right now though. Bell rings in 5 minutes~
Bowser
+
Captain Falcon
+
Diddy Kong
+
Donkey Kong
+
Falco
+
Fox
=
Game & Watch
-
Ganondorf
++++
Ice Climbers
+
Ike
+
Jigglypuff
=
King Dedede
+
Kirby
=
Link
+
Lucario
?
Lucas
+
Luigi
?
Mario
+
Marth
+
Meta Knight
--------------
Ness
+
Peach
+
Pikachu
=
Pikmin & Olimar
+
Pit
+++++
Pokémon Trainer
Squirtle: =
Ivy: +
Charizard: +++
R.O.B.
--------------------- [For lulz.. >>; ]
Samus
+
Sheik
=
Snake
+
Sonic
+
Toon Link
=
Wario
+
Wolf
+
Yoshi
+
Zelda
-
Zero Suit Samus
?
I'll provide reasoning if asked. No time to do any right now though. Bell rings in 5 minutes~
Ch0zen0ne
Smash Lord
So really for the aforementioned in my post the only one you disagree w/ is Marth.. did you read the debate on the previous pages lol.. and actually after playing a Far Superior Marth than the one i am used to, it seems the fight might be more even than i once thought... but still slightly in ROB's favor... but like WE said earilier ROB does have advantage yes, however its not enough to grant a "+" instead of a "=".
Syde7
The Sultan of Smut
Well, I play mostly online. And more recently my lag has alleviated itself. So, all of these impressions are my own from online play. Keep in mind that there is a limited number of chars I've consistently encountered- and its only those that I'll offer my ratings for.
Bowser
+: Bowser's size just makes him an easy target for ROB, and a gyro sitting idle is just a bear trap waiting to be sprung. Plus, with his weight and size, I've caught my fair share of Bowsers between a gyro and f-til, D-tilt.
Captain Falcon
+: Who *DOES* captain falcon have an advantage against?
Diddy Kong
?
Donkey Kong
?
Falco
- His projectile-esque reflector keeps *me* at bay a lot of the times. If anyone's found a way around it, feel free to help me out.
Fox
=: I'm leaning to the + side, but not enough to give ROB a +. The foxes I've played against haven't been anything remarkable... but I've had a relatively easy time with them. Can't name any specifics.
Game & Watch
-
Ganondorf
++++
Ice Climbers
+
Ike
+: Gyro stops his 'Grand Viper' (pff... what a name) approach. Slowness makes him ripe for lasers and gyros. Lag makes up for the range advantage.
Jigglypuff
?
King Dedede
+: Gyro stops his expendable minions pretty well. Refer to Bowser. The only real thing I see that D3 has is the ability to cg ROB
Kirby
?
Link
+: I can't really name any specifics-- it just seems that ROB is just *better*
Lucario
?
Lucas
?
Luigi
?
Mario
+: Again.... can't put my finger on it-- just seems better. Better Range. Ability to negate Mario's 'anti-edgeguarding' cape with his B-air. Turn it around, Mario still gets hit.
Marth
?: Im *still* undecided. I'd say slightly in ROB's favor, but not enough to warrant a +
Meta Knight
--------------
Ness
?
Peach
?
Pikachu
=
Pikmin & Olimar
+: You can almost stand in one place with a gyro in front of you. It "eats pikmin souls" as Chozen said. Mix in a few F-tilts to kill the ones that get through. Force Olimar to approach with laser spam, and then punish when he comes close. The best way I've found is to stake a piece of stage as your own (preferably near the edge to avoid getting flanked), and sit down for a long fight. That's how I've played it thus far with success.
Pit:
?: *I* just seem to have a hard time with him. Any helps appreciated.
Pokémon Trainer
Squirtle: ?
Ivy: ?
Charizard:?
R.O.B.
&: yes... an ampersand.
Samus
+
Sheik
=
Snake
+
Sonic
?
Toon Link
=
Wario
+
Wolf
?: I say ? mark, because despite Overswarms handling of Yay, I tend to have trouble against them.
Yoshi
+
Zelda
-
Zero Suit Samus
?
Bowser
+: Bowser's size just makes him an easy target for ROB, and a gyro sitting idle is just a bear trap waiting to be sprung. Plus, with his weight and size, I've caught my fair share of Bowsers between a gyro and f-til, D-tilt.
Captain Falcon
+: Who *DOES* captain falcon have an advantage against?
Diddy Kong
?
Donkey Kong
?
Falco
- His projectile-esque reflector keeps *me* at bay a lot of the times. If anyone's found a way around it, feel free to help me out.
Fox
=: I'm leaning to the + side, but not enough to give ROB a +. The foxes I've played against haven't been anything remarkable... but I've had a relatively easy time with them. Can't name any specifics.
Game & Watch
-
Ganondorf
++++
Ice Climbers
+
Ike
+: Gyro stops his 'Grand Viper' (pff... what a name) approach. Slowness makes him ripe for lasers and gyros. Lag makes up for the range advantage.
Jigglypuff
?
King Dedede
+: Gyro stops his expendable minions pretty well. Refer to Bowser. The only real thing I see that D3 has is the ability to cg ROB
Kirby
?
Link
+: I can't really name any specifics-- it just seems that ROB is just *better*
Lucario
?
Lucas
?
Luigi
?
Mario
+: Again.... can't put my finger on it-- just seems better. Better Range. Ability to negate Mario's 'anti-edgeguarding' cape with his B-air. Turn it around, Mario still gets hit.
Marth
?: Im *still* undecided. I'd say slightly in ROB's favor, but not enough to warrant a +
Meta Knight
--------------
Ness
?
Peach
?
Pikachu
=
Pikmin & Olimar
+: You can almost stand in one place with a gyro in front of you. It "eats pikmin souls" as Chozen said. Mix in a few F-tilts to kill the ones that get through. Force Olimar to approach with laser spam, and then punish when he comes close. The best way I've found is to stake a piece of stage as your own (preferably near the edge to avoid getting flanked), and sit down for a long fight. That's how I've played it thus far with success.
Pit:
?: *I* just seem to have a hard time with him. Any helps appreciated.
Pokémon Trainer
Squirtle: ?
Ivy: ?
Charizard:?
R.O.B.
&: yes... an ampersand.
Samus
+
Sheik
=
Snake
+
Sonic
?
Toon Link
=
Wario
+
Wolf
?: I say ? mark, because despite Overswarms handling of Yay, I tend to have trouble against them.
Yoshi
+
Zelda
-
Zero Suit Samus
?
Why don't we all just list our top 5 most unfavorable matchups, discuss and evaluate, then work our way down from there.
For me:
Ike
Snake
Marth
Metaknight
Pit
Of course, I can destroy most people playing these characters, but the really good players always seem to play these characters and I have a difficult time with them. DSF's Snake, t1mmy & Eggz's Metaknight, Tudios' Ike, Nezumi's Pit, and Mike Haze's Marth are all crazy good. Anyone else and I'll probably tear you apart X^D
For me:
Ike
Snake
Marth
Metaknight
Pit
Of course, I can destroy most people playing these characters, but the really good players always seem to play these characters and I have a difficult time with them. DSF's Snake, t1mmy & Eggz's Metaknight, Tudios' Ike, Nezumi's Pit, and Mike Haze's Marth are all crazy good. Anyone else and I'll probably tear you apart X^D
Sudai
Stuff here
I read through all the debates on the Marth fight, but I've yet to find a marth that could consistently beat me. There's a lot of Marths in the Baton Rouge area and maybe that's why I find this fight a bit easier? Marth's moves are just generally easy to predict (save for Dancing Blades since it comes out so ****ed fast). I don't find dolphin Slash out of shield to be too bad since you can avoid the killing part with good spacing. Most of his ground moves are easily punished. Sure you can't gimp as well. Just means you can't relly on the easy kills. I'm not aiming to re-open the debate on Marth as I know it's already gone on and you guys have decided for the most part, but meh. Figured I'd defend my point since you brought it up.
Syde7
The Sultan of Smut
In response to the toughest matchups for each person:
Ness
Pikachu
G&W
MK
Pit
Wolf
I know that some of these matchups are considered in ROBs favor, but like I said- they are just tought for *me*. There's plenty of chars that have - by them that I seem to handle on a regular basis. So, constructive advice only plz?
Edit: A few of these, namely Ness I haven't had much experience playing against- so I understand that that can be a huge underlying factor of WHY I have problems playing against them.
Ness
Pikachu
G&W
MK
Pit
Wolf
I know that some of these matchups are considered in ROBs favor, but like I said- they are just tought for *me*. There's plenty of chars that have - by them that I seem to handle on a regular basis. So, constructive advice only plz?
Edit: A few of these, namely Ness I haven't had much experience playing against- so I understand that that can be a huge underlying factor of WHY I have problems playing against them.
masterbraz
Smash Apprentice
chosen or overswarm can u explain why rob is better than wolf? I generally feel that they are =. I've played a lot of wolfs, and a good wolf player can give me a pretty rough time.
Overswarm
is laughing at you
- Joined
- May 4, 2005
- Messages
- 21,181
read my advice thread and look at the wifiwars matches of me vs. yayuhzz
Ch0zen0ne
Smash Lord
Perhaps it would be best for us to move slowly down our lists instead of posting lists in their entirety..
We [OS and Chozen] know that ...
MK: -
Marth: =
Samus: +
Link: +
Falco: +
Bowser: +
DiddyKong: +
G&W: -
Ganon: +
Ike: +
Wolf: +
ROB: =
and i'll even throw Zamus an "=" [mostly b/c you have to get her off the stage first]...
But perhaps we continue discussion on Kirby, Fox, and Luigi..
Basically for Kirby you agree in saying that he was easy to edgeguard, but that he had options which made ROB have to overextend inorder to play him... elaborate plz.
For Fox most for your argument was based upon the ability to gay him very easily...
Luigi.. same as Fox... get him off the stage, and keep him there... and spam lazers to make him approach.
But you are forgetting something VERY important...
It is quite easy to get grabs on players on a non-pro level of play, but we need to consider "advanced" play when coming to our matchup conclusions. I am well aware that much of all of what we do here is speculation since the game has just really started to come into its own, but... characters like Mario, Wario, Luigi, Fox, and Kirby can all combo ROB, but Kirby is the only one that actually can't continue past 50%. Mario can't kill so he's in the same boat as Sonic, and Wario just has his Uair/Fsmash.. Luigi and Fox DO HOWEVER have Usmash, and UpB... two of the best kill moves in the game.. and Fox's aerial speeds can go toe to toe w/ ROB.. and his ground **** is also > ROB's due to his insane priority >_> Luigi [like i stated in an eariler post] can still combo the crap out of ROB, and does it from below so ROB can't really escape
he can also KO ROB @ 50% in a reliable manner... that is rediculous. Luigi=Gay.
We [OS and Chozen] know that ...
MK: -
Marth: =
Samus: +
Link: +
Falco: +
Bowser: +
DiddyKong: +
G&W: -
Ganon: +
Ike: +
Wolf: +
ROB: =
and i'll even throw Zamus an "=" [mostly b/c you have to get her off the stage first]...
But perhaps we continue discussion on Kirby, Fox, and Luigi..
Basically for Kirby you agree in saying that he was easy to edgeguard, but that he had options which made ROB have to overextend inorder to play him... elaborate plz.
For Fox most for your argument was based upon the ability to gay him very easily...
Luigi.. same as Fox... get him off the stage, and keep him there... and spam lazers to make him approach.
But you are forgetting something VERY important...
It is quite easy to get grabs on players on a non-pro level of play, but we need to consider "advanced" play when coming to our matchup conclusions. I am well aware that much of all of what we do here is speculation since the game has just really started to come into its own, but... characters like Mario, Wario, Luigi, Fox, and Kirby can all combo ROB, but Kirby is the only one that actually can't continue past 50%. Mario can't kill so he's in the same boat as Sonic, and Wario just has his Uair/Fsmash.. Luigi and Fox DO HOWEVER have Usmash, and UpB... two of the best kill moves in the game.. and Fox's aerial speeds can go toe to toe w/ ROB.. and his ground **** is also > ROB's due to his insane priority >_> Luigi [like i stated in an eariler post] can still combo the crap out of ROB, and does it from below so ROB can't really escape
he can also KO ROB @ 50% in a reliable manner... that is rediculous. Luigi=Gay.
Overswarm
is laughing at you
- Joined
- May 4, 2005
- Messages
- 21,181
Kirby has enough options against ROB to where the matchup is determined by the player, not the character.
Fox is great, but he doesn't have any defensive options against ROB. Since ROB has better gimping options, ROB inevitably comes out on top. It's a muscle game, and ROB just has bigger muscles.
A mindless ROB or one that tries to attack Fox in the center of the stage all the time would lose for sure against a smart Fox, but a smart ROB can force Fox off the stage and it's done from taht point on. Plus, you can actually kill with nair from ground level.
Luigi is just a stronger version of the annoyance in Melee. He has no real approach other than "slowly float towards them whilst throwing out moves". This doens't work because we can just laser, gyro, or roll out of the way. There's no reason to ever fight Luigi. Playing Tink's Luigi was terrifying the first time I played it, and once I realized "I don't have to short hop fair Luigi. Ever.", I did alright.
As for reliable KOs against ROB... I have not seen this from Luigi. I will have to see if it can be DI'd out of.
Fox is great, but he doesn't have any defensive options against ROB. Since ROB has better gimping options, ROB inevitably comes out on top. It's a muscle game, and ROB just has bigger muscles.
A mindless ROB or one that tries to attack Fox in the center of the stage all the time would lose for sure against a smart Fox, but a smart ROB can force Fox off the stage and it's done from taht point on. Plus, you can actually kill with nair from ground level.
Luigi is just a stronger version of the annoyance in Melee. He has no real approach other than "slowly float towards them whilst throwing out moves". This doens't work because we can just laser, gyro, or roll out of the way. There's no reason to ever fight Luigi. Playing Tink's Luigi was terrifying the first time I played it, and once I realized "I don't have to short hop fair Luigi. Ever.", I did alright.
As for reliable KOs against ROB... I have not seen this from Luigi. I will have to see if it can be DI'd out of.
Overswarm
is laughing at you
- Joined
- May 4, 2005
- Messages
- 21,181
Ch0zen0ne
Smash Lord
Tommy- the so-called "crap" i just posted was a continuation of an earlier part of this thread... read please.
Mr Swarm- You say each Kirby is player dependent.. but you know as well as i do, that this is skewed logic.. any character can be played in any fashion by any given player.. however EVERYONE is restricted to a characters moveset.. and that limits options.
As for the Fox matchup.. you say that he has no defensive options, but then I AM a very aggressive player.. perhaps i shall try camping and watch where it takes me.. but you know what they say... "the best defense is a good offense"...
Basically you say to camp Luigi.. lol @ midwesterners ;p I shall try this too my good sir, and get back to you on the results...
Mr Swarm- You say each Kirby is player dependent.. but you know as well as i do, that this is skewed logic.. any character can be played in any fashion by any given player.. however EVERYONE is restricted to a characters moveset.. and that limits options.
As for the Fox matchup.. you say that he has no defensive options, but then I AM a very aggressive player.. perhaps i shall try camping and watch where it takes me.. but you know what they say... "the best defense is a good offense"...
Basically you say to camp Luigi.. lol @ midwesterners ;p I shall try this too my good sir, and get back to you on the results...
Ch0zen0ne
Smash Lord
Does that rhyme...
Bowser +
Captain Falcon
= (ish)
Diddy Kong
NEGATIVE!
Donkey Kong
+
Falco
= he takes away alot of rob's options but it's still a good match
Fox
+ eh...
Game & Watch
-
Ganondorf
++++
Ice Climbers
+
Ike
+
Jigglypuff
WOPing isn't too effective against rob
King Dedede
-
Kirby
+
Link
+++ link sucks
Lucario
=
Lucas
=
Luigi
just by comparing movesets & not the terrifying luigis I've seen +
Mario
=
Marth
+! not by much but rob has what it takes to punish
Meta Knight
negatory
Ness
+
Peach
+
Pikachu
=
Pikmin & Olimar
one of olimars bad match ups... +
Pit:
-
Pokémon Trainer
(cough)
R.O.B.
when I'm playing -
Samus
+
Sheik
=
Snake
=
Sonic
+
Toon Link
-
Wario
=
Wolf
=
Yoshi
+
Zelda
-
Zero Suit Samus
= my friend som & I have some epic battles
also... when comparing characters try not to compare the users involved so much as the movesets. metagame will change but the characters will still be using the samething they started out with.
Captain Falcon
= (ish)
Diddy Kong
NEGATIVE!
Donkey Kong
+
Falco
= he takes away alot of rob's options but it's still a good match
Fox
+ eh...
Game & Watch
-
Ganondorf
++++
Ice Climbers
+
Ike
+
Jigglypuff
WOPing isn't too effective against rob
King Dedede
-
Kirby
+
Link
+++ link sucks
Lucario
=
Lucas
=
Luigi
just by comparing movesets & not the terrifying luigis I've seen +
Mario
=
Marth
+! not by much but rob has what it takes to punish
Meta Knight
negatory
Ness
+
Peach
+
Pikachu
=
Pikmin & Olimar
one of olimars bad match ups... +
Pit:
-
Pokémon Trainer
(cough)
R.O.B.
when I'm playing -
Samus
+
Sheik
=
Snake
=
Sonic
+
Toon Link
-
Wario
=
Wolf
=
Yoshi
+
Zelda
-
Zero Suit Samus
= my friend som & I have some epic battles
also... when comparing characters try not to compare the users involved so much as the movesets. metagame will change but the characters will still be using the samething they started out with.
Ch0zen0ne
Smash Lord
Stop double posting.
Learn to edit your posts.
Your matchup list is wack.
edit- post your reasoning, or don't spam a list... myself, and Mr. Swarm did this to get discussion going.. now it is time to take matchups one at a time.
Is anyone down to discuss the Olimar/Pikmen shindig?
Learn to edit your posts.
Your matchup list is wack.
edit- post your reasoning, or don't spam a list... myself, and Mr. Swarm did this to get discussion going.. now it is time to take matchups one at a time.
Is anyone down to discuss the Olimar/Pikmen shindig?
Sudai
Stuff here
I'll discuss Pikmin/Olimar.
Find him easier than most of the smaller characters. I started as an Oli main so I don't really have the problem that most of the people I play with do. That being the "WTF is he doing?!" problem. A quick FTilt kills pikmen when he tries to latch them to you. Lasers and gyros knock them out of the air as well. In fact, a well placed Gyro will keep most pikmen tosses at bay.
His recovery is too easy to gimp.
It's rather hard for him to combo you, but I have problems approaching Olimar for some reason. It's just a waiting game for me and ROB definitely has better camping options that Oli.
Discuss more later. Bell ringing to go home.
Find him easier than most of the smaller characters. I started as an Oli main so I don't really have the problem that most of the people I play with do. That being the "WTF is he doing?!" problem. A quick FTilt kills pikmen when he tries to latch them to you. Lasers and gyros knock them out of the air as well. In fact, a well placed Gyro will keep most pikmen tosses at bay.
His recovery is too easy to gimp.
It's rather hard for him to combo you, but I have problems approaching Olimar for some reason. It's just a waiting game for me and ROB definitely has better camping options that Oli.
Discuss more later. Bell ringing to go home.
apmpnmdslkbk
Smash Journeyman
Olimer is only hard if yur against a good player. sometimes I fight using R.O.B. and I completely destroy an olimer user but others just pwn me. when against the pros i find myself being blindsided by his arials and when I try to play away from him he just barages me with pikmin. not to mention that all of my attempts at recovery against a good player are easily gimpd.
Ch0zen0ne
Smash Lord
Generally Olimar isn't too difficult as long as you know how to space, and gay his recovery... he gets ALOT of free damage whilst fuxing w/ his Pikman throw, but Fair-->Fair-->ect is basically **** here. Lazers gimp his recovery like no other, and all Oli really has on you is his Nair [which you shouldn't be caught in if you can space worth a ****] and his Usmash out of shield.. i [personally] find that it is VERY difficult for Olimar to KO ROB aswell as do any sort of large damage quantities.
I personally am not a big fan of Nair/Bair b/c the startup lag is enough to get Fair/Bair smacked across the face w/ a Pikman, and falling Uair-->Utilt doesn't really work here either due to his INSANELY ranged Usmash, and his exquisite Nair. But then again.. getting VERY low KO's is the name of ROB's game.. so a non-diminished Nair/Bair at around 80% should either..
A- Kill Him off the top
or
B- Knock Him far enough away that you can gimp his recovery
IMO if the Olimar plays gay, and just spams Pikman it's hard to do much other than chase him down, and get in his face.. but w/ a recovery that is so EASY to gay, you can't really give him too much credit in this matchup... ie ROB>Olimar. His spike is also quite useless against ROB too.. lol
Good Day Sirs.
I personally am not a big fan of Nair/Bair b/c the startup lag is enough to get Fair/Bair smacked across the face w/ a Pikman, and falling Uair-->Utilt doesn't really work here either due to his INSANELY ranged Usmash, and his exquisite Nair. But then again.. getting VERY low KO's is the name of ROB's game.. so a non-diminished Nair/Bair at around 80% should either..
A- Kill Him off the top
or
B- Knock Him far enough away that you can gimp his recovery
IMO if the Olimar plays gay, and just spams Pikman it's hard to do much other than chase him down, and get in his face.. but w/ a recovery that is so EASY to gay, you can't really give him too much credit in this matchup... ie ROB>Olimar. His spike is also quite useless against ROB too.. lol
Good Day Sirs.
Sudai
Stuff here
I don't think this fight is a problem even when Oli is being gay and pikmen tossing. As said before, the toss is easy to null if you sit back and FTilt the pikmen. It's also really easy to get him off the edge..fully charged laser then follow in with FAirs. So even a campy Oli isn't that hard...Why are we even discussing Oli? The match is too easy. lol
Ch0zen0ne
Smash Lord
Word .
Uhh.. i say we fux w/ some Snake... this seems to be quite the debatable topic.. any takers?
Uhh.. i say we fux w/ some Snake... this seems to be quite the debatable topic.. any takers?
Sudai
Stuff here
This is an odd matchup for me. Snake has a better projectile game (I haven't played a 'nade spamming Snake, but I assume it might be a bit much for ROB to avoid them and retaliate at a range), but ROB has Snake utterly destroyed in the air. It's hard to approach him too because of his A Combo and his FTilt. I'm really not too sure overall though. The match feels like a + to me, but I don't really know how to explain any specifics because every snake I've played has been so different.
I do know one thing though. ROB vs Snake + Corneria = Snake's game.
I do know one thing though. ROB vs Snake + Corneria = Snake's game.
Syde7
The Sultan of Smut
I would say the Snake/ROB match is a slight + for ROB, though its = at worst. Hitting Snake's Nikita w/ the laser/gyro causes it to stall and sometimes redirect or explode, which can prevent it from hawkin' you down. Also, both laser and gyro cause the D-smash mine to explode, as well as grenades.
Whenever I play a snake, and am on the defensive, I save my gyro, or use it to debug the traps the Snake player laid to thwart my recovery. Of course against a really, really crafty and wily Snake, you may not have the chance to- so someone whose played better Snake's than I will have to comment on the aforementioned strategies effectiveness.
Again, ROB owns snake in the air, IMO.
As far as approaches, when everything is pretty neutral (meaning Snake hasn't got the entire stage bugged), keeping a gyro on the floor with negate the mortar slide, to the best of my knowledge. A lot of the Snake's I played against actually used the slide as an approach, so if you mess it up, you can sneak in during the hit.
The important thing in my estimation is not to feel that you have to rush in blindly and try to avoid the traps. Doing so will result in you getting bombarded with everything AND the kitchen sink. I tend to play a defensive ROB against Snake, debug the traps the best I can, and play a bit of a waiting game while trading projectile damage back and forth before actually comitting.
Just my 2 cents.
Whenever I play a snake, and am on the defensive, I save my gyro, or use it to debug the traps the Snake player laid to thwart my recovery. Of course against a really, really crafty and wily Snake, you may not have the chance to- so someone whose played better Snake's than I will have to comment on the aforementioned strategies effectiveness.
Again, ROB owns snake in the air, IMO.
As far as approaches, when everything is pretty neutral (meaning Snake hasn't got the entire stage bugged), keeping a gyro on the floor with negate the mortar slide, to the best of my knowledge. A lot of the Snake's I played against actually used the slide as an approach, so if you mess it up, you can sneak in during the hit.
The important thing in my estimation is not to feel that you have to rush in blindly and try to avoid the traps. Doing so will result in you getting bombarded with everything AND the kitchen sink. I tend to play a defensive ROB against Snake, debug the traps the best I can, and play a bit of a waiting game while trading projectile damage back and forth before actually comitting.
Just my 2 cents.
Sudai
Stuff here
I've been thinking of a good counter for snake + corneria...and I just can't think of one. That ****ed stage is Snake paradise and I can't help but feel Sakurai did it on purpose...because...lol...snakes on a plane and all. The match-up on that stage is just ********. Unless you're on the same side of the fin as them, they just plop a C4 on the tip of the fin and toss 'nades / nikita around the fin. You approach and get C4 blown up in your face followed by a mortar. I mean, it is winnable, but the match just takes forever and it sucks so bad.. :/ It's all that stupid C4's fault. I've actually started banning that stage against snakes as it's the only stage that I feel is heavily in snake's favor.
Ch0zen0ne
Smash Lord
I must say my good sirs... that this matchup is not as straight forward as one might think...
Yes, you can make his nades blow up in his face.. and yes you CAN combo him in the air.. but THE ground is where he has the most advantage... he's the most mobile toon on the ground atm, and though his aerials aren't quick.. some of them come out fast enough to Fux w/ ROB's comboing.
IMO.. IF THE ROB CAN COMBO THE SNAKE [via Utilts-->Uairs-->ect/Fairs] it's the ROB's game.. and really if the Snake is off the stage, he's dead. Snake cannot recover from an ROB that can press down on the Cstick when they're in the air, and your gyro also knocks him out of this gayass UpB.
The only real difficulty i see w/ this matchup, is getting into Snake and STARTING a combo.. or not getting killed around 120% [which as we all know is quite low for ROB to die].. also... mortar sliding is gay, but your gyro stops that too.... and your lazer stops his nades... so YOU win the spamming contest.
Before i say what i think about this particular matchup, ima let Mr. Swarm give his 2 cents...
Yes, you can make his nades blow up in his face.. and yes you CAN combo him in the air.. but THE ground is where he has the most advantage... he's the most mobile toon on the ground atm, and though his aerials aren't quick.. some of them come out fast enough to Fux w/ ROB's comboing.
IMO.. IF THE ROB CAN COMBO THE SNAKE [via Utilts-->Uairs-->ect/Fairs] it's the ROB's game.. and really if the Snake is off the stage, he's dead. Snake cannot recover from an ROB that can press down on the Cstick when they're in the air, and your gyro also knocks him out of this gayass UpB.
The only real difficulty i see w/ this matchup, is getting into Snake and STARTING a combo.. or not getting killed around 120% [which as we all know is quite low for ROB to die].. also... mortar sliding is gay, but your gyro stops that too.... and your lazer stops his nades... so YOU win the spamming contest.
Before i say what i think about this particular matchup, ima let Mr. Swarm give his 2 cents...
boss8
Smash Hero
ROB sucks GTFO
Ch0zen0ne
Smash Lord
<--- WORST ROB EVER
Sudai
Stuff here
I forgot nades blow up on impact. Woo woo laser. Though basically you were agreeing with me aside from the camping part. Hard to approach, but once we get in and knock him into the air, ROB wins. Saddly, OS seems to be missing from the ROB boards for a bit as I haven't seen him post anything recently??
As for playing ROB. I'd definitely say an offensive match. Not necissarily an "In your face" kind of offence, but not defensive. Staying right out of range with lasers / brick walling FAirs/NAirs followed by DTilts. Patient offensive maybe? Honnestly, that's how all characters should be played though. Not defensively but not a full offensive either. Just watch vids of OS and Chozen if you wanna see what I mean. I'd say look at mine, but I don't have any up as I refuse to use a crappy digital camera to put up vids of my Sub-par ROB.
As for playing ROB. I'd definitely say an offensive match. Not necissarily an "In your face" kind of offence, but not defensive. Staying right out of range with lasers / brick walling FAirs/NAirs followed by DTilts. Patient offensive maybe? Honnestly, that's how all characters should be played though. Not defensively but not a full offensive either. Just watch vids of OS and Chozen if you wanna see what I mean. I'd say look at mine, but I don't have any up as I refuse to use a crappy digital camera to put up vids of my Sub-par ROB.
Overswarm
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Give me a day or so and you'll be getting some new tournament vids, including me playing a Snake with a pretty awesome gimp.
Sudai
Stuff here
No doubt you can get some sexy gimps on Snake. If someone with a recording device wants to record a replay of this snake gimp I got a few weeks ago, I'll trade wii codes so they can do it. I think it was FTilt off the stage, but the off stage was FAir > FAir >FAir > wait for Cypher > DAir kill.
DRaGZ
Smash Champion
I found that you cannot get above a Snake, or most characters with R.O.B., but ESPECIALLY Snake and his nation-destroying u-tilt. R.O.B. has sort of a blind spot right below him because his d-air just has that really predictable pause, which is perfect for a super-high Snake kick.
Like everyone here has already been saying, Snake has the ground covered with his Snakedashes, grenade spam, and mines, but the air is his weaker point, so getting him off the stage and going for the gimp is the best thing to do.
If the Snake knows what the crap he's doin' though, this is gonna be a difficult match-up.
Like everyone here has already been saying, Snake has the ground covered with his Snakedashes, grenade spam, and mines, but the air is his weaker point, so getting him off the stage and going for the gimp is the best thing to do.
If the Snake knows what the crap he's doin' though, this is gonna be a difficult match-up.
Overswarm
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I am, more and more, believing that ROB has an extreme advantage in this matchup. My first matches agaisnt Snake made me believe it was equal... but I've figured him out, I think, and I still have more to learn. I just have more options.
JCaesar
Smash Hero
Care to elaborate?
Overswarm
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