Puzzle League/Panel De Pon General (Former SSB4 Lip Support Thread)

[Rukifellth]

I think Lip has potentiall considering I love the Tetris Attack/Panel de Pon games. If Sega can make 50 billion Pyuo games then Nintendo can have Lip in Smash Bros. :S

 

[Big-Cat]

That site had been on up since 1995 or 1996 and a had even a small community on the bulletin board.

The site being taken down does not inspire confidence to me for the future of the Panel de Pon series. Though there is a small chance they took it down because it looked a bit dated (like I said it started back in 1996, I think), or they are planning a major new Panel de Pon release and making a modern website for that.

However, I think its more likely that they decided to just take it down because nothing is being done with the series. The last Panel de Pon game was release in 2007 (though a stipped down port of that game was released for the DSi in 2009).

Given the economy, it's not surprising to see them focusing more on their bigger games since they're most likely to turn in a profit. I doubt Kid Icarus Uprising would've been as successful if not for Pit's appearance in Brawl.

As for the website, it's quite likely that either there's a new game on the way out or that they simply didn't feel the need to keep it up anymore. Then again, I recall the Japanese Mischief Makers website was still up back in 2007.

@Young Horsetail
Dat Kumatora cameo.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

I think Lip has potentiall considering I love the Tetris Attack/Panel de Pon games. If Sega can make 50 billion Pyuo games then Nintendo can have Lip in Smash Bros. :S

Puyo's much more popular than PdP anyway though, and doesn't suffer from crazy presentation conflicts or issues when localized (at least anymore since Minna De Puyo Puyo/Puyo Puyo GBA and Puyo Puyo Fever)
Besides I think that's the main inspiration for the series to appear during the whole Puzzle Boom of 90's, look at Taisen Puzzle Dama from Konami as well.

If Intelligent Systems and Nintendo somehow got to fix the problem with the presentation that pleases both audiences, than maybe we can see more of Panel De Pon, I think a name reboot is needed: name it Panel Pop as it should always have been instead of it carrying the moniker from dolled-up Pokemon-installment from 64.

We'd get all the characters who've appeared in the series, maybe with a new art style. This includes Lip and her fairy friends introduced in this series, Yoshi and his pals, and Pokemon. Avatars can be turned off too, incase someone gets turned off by the cutesy presentation.

Most of the great modes introduced in the series would also be included, like Endless, VS up to 4 players, 3D Mode, Daily Play, Score Attack, Time Attack, Story Mode and so on. Online play against the worldwide players would really strenghten the lifespa of the game as well.

Some ideas, yeah.

Kuma: Yeah, it took a while to get her right with sis but she looks sweet.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Went back to check the site again and it has been seemingly brought back. Dunno what this means exactly but I guess not all gloom and doom.

 

[N. Onymous]

It's been back up for a while now. Don't know what exactly happened, but it's made me smile. (Probably has little to no bearing on Lip in Sm4sh, though.)

Regarding the supposed lack of PdP in recent years, it's not quite as bad as some of you have made it out to be since the 3DS, being backwards-compatible, can play Planet Puzzle League just as easily as its predecessor. From a console gaming perspective... since the WiiU can't play GameCube games, yeah, it's pretty dire.

 

[ChronoBound]

The 3DS can also play Puzzle League Express through the 3DS Eshop.

Anyway, its good to hear that the Panel de Pon website is back up. It shows that IS still cares a little bit about the cult following that game has built up. I am still not optimistic about that series's future.

I think Lip has a good shot at being an Assist Trophy this time around though.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

*Bumps up*

 

[FlareHabanero]

I would not be surprised if very few people here actually played Panel de Pon. Not referring to Tetris Attack, but the version with the original characters like Lip, Elias, Thiana, Flare, Sherbet, Cordelia, etc.

There is also the pseudo-sequel to the game I've wanted to try on Nintendo Puzzle Collection, but never got around to get the game.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

I might try my hands on that sometime. But it is pretty much true that not many people have gotten to play the original.

I still think that due the representation difficulties between both US and Japan, PdP's under hiatus as I.S has much easier products and franchises to distribute around. But I still wish they could try fixing it up. It's time to move on about banning Lip from US.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Well if you've ever played Tetris Attack, you can jump into Panel de Pon very easily. However, one gameplay difference is that in Panel de Pon the AI is slightly easier. Emphasis on "slightly", since the AI can still be brutal on higher difficulties. Aside from that, everything should be familiar. The game is obviously in Japanese, but navigating menus is not a problem.

I still recommend the game for those that haven't played it yet, because it's a pretty addicting puzzle game.

 

[ChronoBound]

Tetris Attack is one of my favorite puzzle games ever (though nothing will ever touch Wario's Woods for me). It has a beautiful soundtrack (possibly the best one in a puzzle game ever), to the point I think the series deserves a stage in Smash 4. I think Lip would be an excellent choice for an Assist Trophy in Smash 4. She could summon junk blocks by twirling her flower baton which hits opponents.

I don't think Lip is going to happen for Smash 4 as a playable character. I think even for Smash 5 that she will only get noticed by Sakurai if she manages to make a slew of appearances/cameos in the run-up to Smash 5, especially if IS were to make another Panel de Pon that revisits the fairy theme.

I still think its disconcerting that the Panel de Pon/Puzzle League series has been on hiatus for over six years (though basically the same could be said for almost every other C-list Nintendo series).

I think Lip would have the potential to become the "Takamaru" for Smash 5 if she follows a similar blueprint that Takmaru did in the interim between Brawl and Smash 4. I think though in Lip's case all she would need is an Assist Trophy appearance and a new Panel de Pon game featuring her.

The 20th-anniversary for the original game will happen in under three years, so I am curious whether IS will do something special for it (though IS did nothing for when the series had its 15-year anniversary).

 

[FlareHabanero]

I don't see how being on hiatus influences anything considering Pit alone **** all over that logic. Don't even dare bring up the whole "retro" double standard bull ether, because a hiatus is still a haitus regardless of what is spitted out.

 

[FalKoopa]

The middle position is obviously the more dangerous one. If too old, you get the "retro" trump card, and if new, you get points for "recency".

Nothing going for those stuck in the ugly middle position.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Well both labels are really flawed in their own way, and people that use them as their trump card are the worse.

Anyway, found this image on Pixiv one bored afternoon.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Holy smokes, it's Doctor Warui's art! (-lAl-)!!!

He's this super-huge Captain Rainbow-fanartist... dang, I love his art. I managed to speak few things with him time to time, but that's long time ago.

Waluigi you perv don't look at her skirt

Chrono: Lip isn't though completely forgotten by the company though during these years though, since she still was kept referred at Brawl and even then made an appearance in Captain Rainbow. So I feel bit positive that she'll be included in SSB4 in some bigger form than in Brawl (Assist Trophy would suffice just fine for me, and even better if she's nothing horrendous like Starfy was. But of course it'd be even better if she was playable.)

 

[Frostwraith]

Could Lip be considered the main character of Panel de Pon? Or is she simply the most known and popular?

Could be a nice idea for a new character, but I see her as unlikely. (Though I could be wrong...)

 

[FalKoopa]

Could Lip be considered the main character of Panel de Pon? Or is she simply the most known and popular?

She is the main character of the Super Famicom version, was replaced by Yoshi in the western release.

The N64 had Pikachu, btw.

 

[Frostwraith]

She is the main character of the Super Famicom version, was replaced by Yoshi in the western release.

The N64 had Pikachu, btw.

Well, that explains her being the most likely candidate as a Panel de Pon rep.
Funnily enough, Kirby's Stone attack may transform him into a Panel de Pon block.

 

[ChronoBound]

I don't see how being on hiatus influences anything considering Pit alone **** all over that logic. Don't even dare bring up the whole "retro" double standard bull ether, because a hiatus is still a haitus regardless of what is spitted out.

I know you are being snarky and bitter, but I am going to humor you and give a serious response

Reasons for each retro:

Ice Climbers: Sakurai wanted a character that represented the early Famicom/NES titles, and thought Ice Climbers were the best choice overall.

Pit: Mentioned that he was a popular choice for a newcomer in both Japan and the United States.

Mr. Game & Watch: A way to honor the fore-runner to the Game Boy line, the Game & Watch series in general (as well as the Game & Watch Gallery series), and Gunpei Yokoi.

ROB: I dunno, probably played Mario Kart DS a little too much? Though like Mr. Game & Watch, ROB was designed by Gunpei Yokoi (who was a toy designer before Nintendo went into video games, so ROB might also be a way of honoring Nintendo's pre-video game history, while also having a character that has made some game appearances).

Of all four of these retro characters, only one of them was a popular choice by the fanbase to bring back. Takamaru is a bit of that too, though Sakurai has gone on the record to say that if Takamaru starred in another game that he would add him in a future Smash Bros. game (whether Samurai Warriors 3 and/or Nintendo Land count as "new games" for Takamaru remains to be determined). I am personally expecting Takamaru to be confirmed in about two months time.

Lip was a popular choice for Smash Bros. during pre-Melee amongst the Japanese fanbase. There was still some Japanese fans asking for her during pre-Brawl as well. However, since Brawl's release, requests for Lip are a rarity amongst the Japanese fanbase.

Its possible Sakurai could add Lip on the grounds of "I want a character that would represent Nintenod's puzzle legacy", however, I am not seeing Lip being promoted to a playable character this time.

Chrono: Lip isn't though completely forgotten by the company though during these years though, since she still was kept referred at Brawl and even then made an appearance in Captain Rainbow. So I feel bit positive that she'll be included in SSB4 in some bigger form than in Brawl (Assist Trophy would suffice just fine for me, and even better if she's nothing horrendous like Starfy was. But of course it'd be even better if she was playable.)

I know that Lip (and elements to the classic Panel de Pon) still get references (though the last reference was back in 2008 with Captain Rainboe). I believe I even brought up that there was a significant contingent of Japanese fans that did not like that Planet Puzzle League (Panel de Pon DS) having a generic theme, and wanted the fairies back.

I do think Lip has decent chances of showing up as an Assist Trophy, especially considering how little animation would be involved for a Lip Assist Trophy (all the animation that would be needed would be Lip moving her arm in a circular fashion, and garbage blocks of various sizes falling down all over the stage).

I do think a new appearance in a future Panel de Pon will be what helps her more than anything. The combination of a new Panel de Pon game starring Lip and an Assist Trophy appearance in Smash 4 will rejuventate Japanese interest in her, and basically get her on a Takamaru-styled road to Smash 5.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Frost: In Japan she is considered the main character, in outerseas she's pretty much non-existent. But since SSB or any other Yoshi/PKMN-related media never refers to PdP in later games, it's safe to say Yoshi and Pikachu (or any other character aside from Lip) aren't the main characters.

Chrono: Pretty much. It got me out of guard when some reviewers was giving flak to the character-less presentation. I think I.S went with that direction though to ensure a non-dolled-up-installment-filled localization like in last games.

 

[ChronoBound]

Chrono: Pretty much. It got me out of guard when some reviewers was giving flak to the character-less presentation. I think I.S went with that direction though to ensure a non-dolled-up-installment-filled localization like in last games.

I think an alternative explanation could be that they went with a generic style so as to market the game more towards non-gamers. At least in the West, Planet Puzzle League was part of the "Touch Generations" line (basically a line of non-games/casual games for the DS).

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

I think an alternative explanation could be that they went with a generic style so as to market the game more towards non-gamers. At least in the West, Planet Puzzle League was part of the "Touch Generations" line (basically a line of non-games/casual games for the DS).

Must have worked since if I remember correctly, Planet Puzzle League sold fairly wel overall. Still, I'm still waiting for NOA to move on with keeping fairies banned from US and thus rest of the outerseas. It's 2013 now... And I'm still waiting for a new installment... (-l^l-)

 

[ChronoBound]

Must have worked since if I remember correctly, Planet Puzzle League sold fairly wel overall. Still, I'm still waiting for NOA to move on with keeping fairies banned from US and thus rest of the outerseas. It's 2013 now... And I'm still waiting for a new installment... (-l^l-)

Yeah, Panel De Pon DS sold better than the previous two Panel de Pon games before it (Nintendo Puzzle Collection, and Dr Mario & Panel De Pon).

As for the future for Panel de Pon, I think the 3DS is likely the last console in which a retail release for a new Panel de Pon would be possible. I think its more likely though that the next Panel de Pon game will be a 3DSware title.

Puzzle League Express was released for the DSiWare, but it was just a stripped down port of Planet Puzzle League, and has no multiplayer in it (and some single player features taken out).

I think a formal downloadable version of Panel de Pon will eventually happen for the 3DS, especially considering how much success Intelligent Systems has had with Pushmo/Crashmo for it.

 

[Curious Villager]

Still, I'm still waiting for NOA to move on with keeping fairies banned from US and thus rest of the outerseas. It's 2013 now... And I'm still waiting for a new installment... (-l^l-)

Why would they keep them banned anyway? Like you said it's 2013. This whole "Only boiz play gamez" mentality has died down years ago.

Maybe their just afraid that the whole "fairy" aspect will alienate male gamers but I honestly wouldn't mind playing Panel de Pon with Lip and her friends in it. In fact I'm hoping to play the Japanese version with Lip in it someday. :/

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Yeah, Panel De Pon DS sold better than the previous two Panel de Pon games before it (Nintendo Puzzle Collection, and Dr Mario & Panel De Pon).

As for the future for Panel de Pon, I think the 3DS is likely the last console in which a retail release for a new Panel de Pon would be possible. I think its more likely though that the next Panel de Pon game will be a 3DSware title.

Puzzle League Express was released for the DSiWare, but it was just a stripped down port of Planet Puzzle League, and has no multiplayer in it (and some single player features taken out).

I think a formal downloadable version of Panel de Pon will eventually happen for the 3DS, especially considering how much success Intelligent Systems has had with Pushmo/Crashmo for it.

Well I think they could really use improving the formula. We got some of those items in Planet Puzzle League, but the 3D-mode was absent (it was pretty good IMO).

They could polish those things top-notch and then give the aesthetics some great work too. Humorous tone inside the cutesy puzzle game like they do for Paper Mario-series and so on?? I think it'd be whimsical thing to watch (because I seriously loved Puyo Puyo Sun's cutscenes, they were so hilarious.)

 

[FlareHabanero]

Why would they keep them banned anyway? Like you said it's 2013. This whole "Only boiz play gamez" mentality has died down years ago.

Maybe their just afraid that the whole "fairy" aspect will alienate male gamers but I honestly wouldn't mind playing Panel de Pon with Lip and her friends in it. In fact I'm hoping to play the Japanese version with Lip in it someday. :/

Well, the bishojo style is mainly why it wouldn't fly in an American audience due to the whole emphasis on toughness. Cute = poor sales. Reminds me of the situation with Fire Emblem, where it wasn't introduced to the west until the 7th game due to the series being "too obtuse".

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Well, the bishojo style is mainly why it wouldn't fly in an American audience due to the whole emphasis on toughness. Cute = poor sales. Reminds me of the situation with Fire Emblem, where it wasn't introduced to the west until the 7th game due to the series being "too obtuse".

Times have moved on though, I mean now anime-based art sells pretty well nowadays. I can't see why it wouldn't now go through just fine today.
Ironic too BTW because this puzzle series is beyond hardcore and hard to master.
(-l^l-);

Kiwi: Exactly. Unless it's because they still wish to make loads of money with the game (like they did with Tetris Attack), which IMO won't work well nowadays because PdP jas pretty much fallen to obscurity at this point. And people have moved on doing dolling-up localization.

 

[Curious Villager]

Well, the bishojo style is mainly why it wouldn't fly in an American audience due to the whole emphasis on toughness. Cute = poor sales. Reminds me of the situation with Fire Emblem, where it wasn't introduced to the west until the 7th game due to the series being "too obtuse".

Then do what Kirby did. Make her look angry in the cover. I think they actually did that in the Japanese cover.

Sort of... I think it may also have to do with the "too girly" factor. Which is probably why Metroid did do well since back then you couldn't tell that Samus was a woman until you beat the game... :/

Kiwi: Exactly. Unless it's because they still wish to make loads of money with the game (like they did with Tetris Attack), which IMO won't work well nowadays because PdP jas pretty much fallen to obscurity at this point. And people have moved on doing dolling-up localization.

Then I suppose Lip's only hope of appearing in the west is if she actually becomes playable in smash. Then I guess the audience would be more familiar with her and more comfortable to buy the puzzle league/ tetris attack games with her in it...

 

[Curious Villager]

Whoops, sorry double post. =.=;

 

[ChronoBound]

I think the best hope for the fairies returning for the next Panel de Pon is if the next Panel de Pon is if the next game in the series is a 3DSWare game (which will bypass the whole marketing and advertising problem). Also, a 3DSWare game would have a much smaller budget than a retail game (which means a much better return on investment), and would be much cheaper for Puzzle League/Panel de Pon fans to purchase (it probably would not exceed $20).

 

[FlareHabanero]

A new Panel de Pon game on the 3DS would be a pretty good thing, but hopefully it's more fancy then Planet Puzzle League. Compared to the others, that felt too generic.

Also on a slightly unrelated topic, but attacks based around flower petals would be one ideal thing. In particular moves that are reminiscent to moves Leaf Kirby uses in Kirby's Return to Dream, like Leaf Rain, Leaf Swirl, and Leaf Uppercut.

 

[ChronoBound]

A new Panel de Pon game on the 3DS would be a pretty good thing, but hopefully it's more fancy then Planet Puzzle League. Compared to the others, that felt too generic.
.

I think a 3DSWare Panel de Pon is the best hope for the fairies to return. The Pushmo/Crashmo games show that IS no longer has misgivings about putting a cutesy theme for a puzzle game for an international audience. I think the generic theme for Panel de Pon DS was it trying to appeal more to non-gamers (part of Touch Generation), as for the reason why in Dr. Mario/Panel de Pon there was also a generic theme for Panel de Pon, the Panel de Pon version of the game was nearly a direct port of the Game Boy Advance link-up version that you get of Panel de Pon from Nintendo Puzzle Collection (same for Dr. Mario I think).

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Holy smokes, it's Doctor Warui's art! (-lAl-)!!!

He's this super-huge Captain Rainbow-fanartist... dang, I love his art. I managed to speak few things with him time to time, but that's long time ago.

Waluigi you perv don't look at her skirt

Chrono: Lip isn't though completely forgotten by the company though during these years though, since she still was kept referred at Brawl and even then made an appearance in Captain Rainbow. So I feel bit positive that she'll be included in SSB4 in some bigger form than in Brawl (Assist Trophy would suffice just fine for me, and even better if she's nothing horrendous like Starfy was. But of course it'd be even better if she was playable.)

I was wonder who did that art on Pixiv. They might as well go for it since they have her wand as an item and her theme on Brawl's Pictochat. Assist or playable would give her an even bigger role is Sm4sh. After all, she's one of the few Nintendo puzzle characters than Dr. Mario.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Well I just like the idea of Lip because it's a nice compliment to Takamaru and Little Mac, and because it would introduce a style of fighting akin to something along the lines of a magical girl.

I know this odd coming from Monsieur Grump himself, but I like adorable things.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Well I just like the idea of Lip because it's a nice compliment to Takamaru and Little Mac, and because it would introduce a style of fighting akin to something along the lines of a magical girl.

I know this odd coming from Monsieur Grump himself, but I like adorable things.

How's this for ya?

I don't think Lip will get in unless we get another Panel de Pon. Until then, no thank you.

 

[Frostwraith]

I know this odd coming from Monsieur Grump himself, but I like adorable things.

You'd have to be a monster to not like adorable things.
Then again...

43. The more beautiful and pure a thing is, the more satisfying it is to corrupt it.

Anyway, I like both badass, menacing things and cute, adorable things at the same time.

I don't really support Lip, but wouldn't mind her. (Well, that applies to almost, if not all, characters I don't support, actually.)
I do think that her chances would be greatly improved if a new Panel de Pon game was launched throughout the world.

 

[Tetra's Tracker]

Could Lip be considered the main character of Panel de Pon? Or is she simply the most known and popular?

I like to see Lip as the mascot of the series. The original entry into the series centred around her and she's the only character that fits the bill.

When you think of notable Nintendo franchises that haven't yet got a playable character in Smash the obvious ones that spring to mind are Wars, Golden Sun, Punch-Out, the 'Mii' games and Animal Crossing. However the Puzzle League series is definitely another one. It's a popular and highly rated series that continues to get releases (there's currently 9 games in the series with it appearing on every Nintendo console and handheld since the Super Famicom with the exception of the Wii). It's is only slightly behind Dr. Mario as Nintendo's premier puzzle series. For that reason she gets my support.

She'd also be the perfect way to represent Nintendo's great puzzle game legacy (a far much more interesting choice than Dr. Mario who could just be an alt. costume for Mario).

 

[FlareHabanero]

Apparently according to Chrono, Lip used to have a lot of support during pre-Melee in Japan, which became stagnated over the years with each passing release. It seems to be a case of disappointment killing off a fanbase, though it's interesting because the game Panel de Pon has a cult status and there are a handful of people that want the return of the bishojo/fairy theme.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Apparently according to Chrono, Lip used to have a lot of support during pre-Melee in Japan, which became stagnated over the years with each passing release. It seems to be a case of disappointment killing off a fanbase, though it's interesting because the game Panel de Pon has a cult status and there are a handful of people that want the return of the bishojo/fairy theme.

Interesting. So I guess there's still people yearning for Lip during all these years?

Geez, what a shame for them... All I can hope is her on-screen debut on Smash Bros which MIGHT spark all the interest back on her and her series in general. Because if she had that of a fanbase (and one during Pre-Brawl too), then who knows if there's more positivereception than "who is this girl?" if Lip's unveiled as playable (or Assist Trophy).

Though that's some wishful thinking...

 

[Kapus]

That was a very nice read, Horsetail! I'm extremely happy to see people supporting Lip as much as I do.

I really like the detailed moveset you had thought up for her. Very thorough! Looks like you spent a lot of time on it!
I had sketched out a B moveset of my own last week. It's not as detailed as yours, but they do share a few similarities! I also added some conceptual palette swaps.

Spoiler