Possible Moveset Changes

[DtJ Hilt]

So first of all, hey everyone! I'm Hilt, I'll be your moderator from here on out. Glad to see everyone's excited to see Pikmin & Olimar's reveal today.

So the first thing I noticed that made me do a double take out of the announcement today was this picture:

Based on Olimar's stance, that's definitely a Down Smash, but the Red Pikmin's moving a completely different way. It almost looks as if he's... running? Not only that, but the hitbox (based on the fire that's hitting Link) seems to be much larger. Although that could be difficult to judge, based on the angle.

After looking at the other attacks (bair, fsmash, etc) that we saw in the pictures, those moves look relatively the same, although video will be much easier to judge than pictures.

What do other people think might be different about Olimar's moveset in the upcoming smash game?
Let's try to keep ridiculous speculation to a minimum.
Base things off of what have seen, not what we haven't seen yet.

 

[Xigger]

I wouldn't look too far in using a still picture to determine hitboxes. Link's damage varies how fast he is pushed away, making it impossible to determine hitbox size, as we cannot tell the exact moment of impact.
For the running Pikmin, the down smash always had Pikmin run. The only difference is that they are not running head-first.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

I always considered Brawl Olimar's Dsmash more of a slide for the Pikmin than a run. You're definitely right that looking too far into still pictures to determine hitboxes isn't reliable. I still think it's interesting to note, though.

 

[mimgrim]

I'm curious of the pictures that show the Pikmin without Olimar myself. They seem to have more emotion to them then in Brawl. But that's not exactly moveset related... lol

I am curious about this picture though;

It seems like the Yellow furthest from Olimar is attacking bowser, maybe it was thrown?

 

[BlitznBurst]

I think it was just grabbing onto him and got thrown off. Or maybe Bowser just hit it.

 

[mimgrim]

I think it was just grabbing onto him and got thrown off. Or maybe Bowser just hit it.

Hrmmm, that might imply Yellows are a bit tougher now. o.o

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

Sorry Hilt, I don't think we can really gleam any changes from these pictures; I think the dsmash is just finishing in that picture (you can tell that the shorter range purple has already turned around and begun to come back). In a sense, that's big news itself; no changes on Olimar were big enough to warrant inclusion alongside a reveal, and we saw that the basic framework of the character is in-tact. Olimar was really strong on a basic level in Brawl so this should probably come as good news for Olimar fans. The rest of us who found your character ever so difficult to deal with aren't so lucky, but hey, we've already seen that Leaf Shield can eat other projectiles and keep going so hopefully it will be able to eat walls of pikmin, hit Olimar, and set him up for a nice Mega Mean dair spike exploiting our favorite tether recovery. Either that or the Villager can go troll mode and abduct your pikmin; even if he's not changed much directly, Olimar may play out very differently in a new game.

 

[BlitznBurst]

idk, I've never really observed the Pikmin's mechanics beyond red burns things, white poisons, yellow goes farther, purple is a fat little bugger, etc. I wouldn't really know.

I hope they replace his down B though. As far as I know it's pretty much useless except for the suepr armour

 

[DtJ Hilt]

It's one of his best moves (if not his best) because of its super armor. I'm actually worried that, if he does have it in the next game, that they may take the armor off.

Edit: Long time no see, AA. You bring up a good point regarding the Dsmash probably ending, based on the purple. I still think it looks like the Red Pikmin is running rather than sliding, I don't know why it would be moving away from Olimar. In Brawl, when the Pikmin finishes the main part of Dsmash it quickly turns around and begins running back towards Olimar. Wild speculation, but what if one end of the Dsmash ended before the other? Crazy and unsupported theory, I know, but just something to throw out there. Another could be that maybe the Purple isn't in Olimar's control zone, and only the Red was registered for the attack, while the Purple is still traveling to him from a previous attack.

 

[mimgrim]

idk, I've never really observed the Pikmin's mechanics beyond red burns things, white poisons, yellow goes farther, purple is a fat little bugger, etc. I wouldn't really know.

I hope they replace his down B though. As far as I know it's pretty much useless except for the suepr armour

Uhm... No they need to keep that... It helps order your Pikmin and call them back and is useful for changing direction while the air and Whistile Bouncing to make recovering easier.

 

[extremechiton]

T

Either that or the Villager can go troll mode and abduct your pikmin; even if he's not changed much directly, Olimar may play out very differently in a new game.

That would be interesting to see the villager collect a pikmin and throw it back.
Kinda like how kirby throws pikmin when he has olimars power.

 

[Xigger]

T

That would be interesting to see the villager collect a pikmin and throw it back.
Kinda like how kirby throws pikmin when he has olimars power.

Kirby copies Villager stealing Pikmin from Olimar...
Remember when people were thinking what if Villager had an inventory? Imagine Villager holding all of Olimar's pikmin in his pockets...

 

[extremechiton]

If villagers netral b is collect.

VILLAGER KIRBY IS GONA BE FREAKIN AWESOME

 

[greenluigiman2]

What... does this have to do with Olimar?

 

[Sky Pirate]

It's straying a bit, yes. Let's keep it on-topic. ^^;

Whistle's most basic function is to retrieve scattered pikmin. That'll never be completely useless.
I doubt they'd replace it even if it WAS useless, as it's a major part of gameplay in the games. It'd be like removing Yoshi's Neutral B or something.
The worst they can do is nerf it by removing its super armor or reducing its range to something less than "everywhere".

 

[BlitznBurst]

I really don't want them to change his recovery. The whole appeal of his characters is that he can't really do much without the Pikmin. Changing his up-B to make it just a standard recovery kind of lessens that effect. Give him attacks that use multiple Pikmin to make him stronger the more you have. His grab will make all the Pikmin he has out rush the opponent at once, with more pikmin meaning higher knockback. They could balance it out by making it harder to keep them alive or making him pluck them slower, I just kind of thought this was a missed opportunity in Brawl.

Maybe I'm just stupid and have no idea what I'm talking about, though

 

[mimgrim]

Theres not much that can be a change to his recovery involving Pikmin. My best thought is that if they incorporate flying Pikmin into his Pikmin line-up that his recovery changes if he has a Flying one plucked. But at the very least give the Pikmin Chain a better boost to it.

 

[extremechiton]

I say keep the pikmin chain but if a flying pikmin is pulled
It keeps the chain extended so if you miss the edge you can still grab it if the flying pikmin tug on the rest of the pikmin and nudge them closser to the edge

 

[Sky Pirate]

Theres not much that can be a change to his recovery involving Pikmin. My best thought is that if they incorporate flying Pikmin into his Pikmin line-up that his recovery changes if he has a Flying one plucked. But at the very least give the Pikmin Chain a better boost to it.

This'd be a cool idea. Maybe having a line of 6 fliers could make the height of his hop comparable to that of Samus' Screw attack or something.
Maybe give flying pikmin weaker-than-normal attacks to balance it and force you to manage around them (since you can't just fire them off like whites if you want to keep them for the boost, but you wouldn't want to use them over other pikmin in smashes).
You'd have to find balance and choose whether to sacrifice recovery for power. It might be neat!

 

[mimgrim]

This'd be a cool idea. Maybe having a line of 6 fliers could make the height of his hop comparable to that of Samus' Screw attack or something.
Maybe give flying pikmin weaker-than-normal attacks to balance it and force you to manage around them (since you can't just fire them off like whites if you want to keep them for the boost, but you wouldn't want to use them over other pikmin in smashes).
You'd have to find balance and choose whether to sacrifice recovery for power. It might be neat!

Yea Flying Pikmin being the weakest should be a definite thing, however they need a bit more then just help give a better recovery. Which is why I think that in terms of power and knock back for attacks and special are weak, they have the best throw of the Pikmin but also the worst grabs so as to not overshine the Blues to much. This way it is risky grabbing with them and are the easiest to break out of grabs but if you get succesful with one then it could lead to a devasting throw. That way it gives them 2 good options to be used as the other Pikmin have more then one good option in which to be used.

 

[Toxicroaker]

My idea for a recovery using pikmin is a move where he grabs on to all of the pikmin in the formation of the pikmin chain only horizontally and then he spins really fast. the purple (and possibly rock) will not boost the height much but they will deal much more damage and the white (and possibly flying) pikmin won't do as much damage but they will give his recovery more height.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Today's picture confirms his forward smash is returning if none before did.

 

[DtJ Hilt]

Now all we need to see is that grab

 

[Mizuxe]

I really hope that they didn't change his moveset too much. I really liked it in Brawl. It just had a certain appeal to it for me. Kinda had the Pikmin feel, yknow? Nonetheless, it can't really stray away too much at all from the Pikmin game functions of Olimar considering Nintendo's point is to make character moves relating to the character and their game(s) similar.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

With The Hocate ship being an item I wonder if the Final Smash will change...

 

[Sky Pirate]

I know we've all joked about Olimar's recovery being buffed by having it knock the opponent off the ledge AND grab onto it...
But with Sakurai revealing that he's changing the rules for ledgegrabs, WHAT IF THAT ACTUALLY HAPPENS?