Shockbound
Smash Apprentice
DISCLAIMER: This bug is not related to Project M's debug mode and does not require it to be reproduced. It is simply a recommendation for those who wish to reproduce the bug without putting too much effort into learning the nuances of how to achieve a max-angled Up-B in real time.
Title of the bug: Mr. G&W's Up-B behaves incorrectly when angled
Brief description of the bug: Mr. G&W's Up-B misaligns certain character elements when angled to go rightwards. These elements include his ledgegrab box, collision points, TopN, and damaging hitbox. This occurs for both the aerial and grounded version as well as with any stage, alternate skin, and controller port.
Expected behavior: It is expected that the rightward version of any move* will be no more than a mirrored version of its leftward counterpart.
* It should be noted that it is expected behavior for certain taunts to have different lengths depending on leftward-rightward orientation. Mr. G&W's Side-B is another exception to this, as the numbers must be normally readable from the camera's point of view regardless of which direction the move is used in.
Repro steps:
[1] Launch an unmodified version of Project M 3.5.
[2] From the main menu, select "VERSUS."
[3] Select "RULES."
[4] Change the setting on the "RULES" tab to "TIME." This is to enable single-player matches.
[5] Back out the to previous menu and select "FIGHT!"
[5] Using a Gamecube controller in any port, select "MR. GAME & WATCH" as the playable character.
[6] Input [START/PAUSE] or hover over the "READY TO FIGHT!" banner and input [A], then proceed to load any stage.
[7] Input [L], [R], and [D-Pad: Down] simultaneously to enable debug mode.
[8] Input [R] and [D-Pad: Right] simultaneously to enable visual representation of hitboxes.
[9] Input [Y] and [D-Pad: Left] simultaneously to enable visual representations of collision points and TopN.
[10] Input [Y] and [D-Pad: Right] simultaneously to enable visual representations of ledgegrab boxes.
[11] Move the character so that he is standing on the ground (which can be flat or angled) while facing in any direction.
[12] Input [START/PAUSE] to enable frame advance.
[12] Hold the inputs [Joystick: Up] and [ʙ], then input [Z] to advance the frame and initiate Mr. Game & Watch's up-special move.
[13] Observe the current position of the hitbox and its position relative to TopN.
[14] Hold the input [Joystick: Left], then input [Z] to achieve the maximum angle.
[15] Observe the new position of the hitbox and its position relative to TopN.
[16] Use [Z] and advance 30 frames to observe a tilted ledgegrab box.
[17] Input [START/PAUSE] to disable frame advance.
[18] Repeat steps 11 through 17, but replace step 14's joystick input to [Joystick: Right] to observe what happens to the hitbox displacement and ledgegrab box tilt in steps 14 and 16 when the maximum angle is made to the right.
[19] Compare observations from the leftward variation of up-special to the rightward variation. If everything was done correctly, the hitbox displacements and ledgegrab box tilts should appear to be completely identical regardless of the direction that the angle was made towards.
Version found in: [3.5: Hackless: Full set] and [3.5: SSBB Project M Full_RSBEPM_R-sav]
Hardware Device: [Wii] and [Dolphin 4.0-6554]
Loading Method: [2GB SD] and [ISO]
Details: Mr. G&W's Up-B can be angled during startup to send him at different trajectories. His entire body is always tilted counterclockwise (regardless of the direction he chooses to travel in) on the moment that he selects an angle. If he chooses to travel left he will turn towards that direction and then lean his body forward, but if he chooses to travel right he will turn to face that direction and then lean backwards.
The fact that the ledgegrab box is tilted in the scenario outlined in the repro steps is not the main issue here, but it is an issue nonetheless. Testing has been done to show that Mr. G&W cannot grab ledges from quite as far away if he's traveling rightwards compared to if he travels leftwards, but the difference is quite small and rather difficult to measure accurately. The tilting is likely related to an issue with debug mode since the tilted ledgegrab box does not appear to accurately reflect Mr. G&W's actual ability to grab the ledge.
However, this does not seem to be related to the known issue of angled surfaces resulting in skewed hitbox placements for many moves. The hitbox displacement in this case has been confirmed to accurately reflect the hitbox's ability to inflict damage in the visually represented area, so it was made clear in the repro steps that angled surfaces should not impact the observations made.
The most important thing that this bug affects is the placement of TopN after the realignment of the hitbox. There is a clear distinction between going left and right with Up-B when G&W hits an opponent, which becomes an important factor when it comes to sending them at the mirrored angle (the "reverse" hit of all moves that sends an opponent backwards when the TopN's of both parties are aligned in a particular way). If Mr. G&W Up-B's to the right with the most extreme angle from under his opponent then he will get the reverse hit more often than not, but he will almost always get the regular hit when he Up-B's to the left with the most extreme angle. As a result, leftward-rightward orientation has a significant impact on his combos; it is expected that one's leftward-rightward orientation (relative to the stage, not the opponent) should not have any impact on an element of gameplay.
The reverse hit is a very big factor in determining whether Mr. G&W gets a followup after connecting with Up-B. It is almost always landed from below an opponent during a combo, so this situation occurs frequently.
Attachments: Image gallery depicting the differences between non-angled and max-angled Up-B's of both leftward and rightward orientations. This gallery also shows that the position of TopN remains in the exact same place relative to the hitbox for the entire duration of the move.
Custom Content: None
Title of the bug: Mr. G&W's Up-B behaves incorrectly when angled
Brief description of the bug: Mr. G&W's Up-B misaligns certain character elements when angled to go rightwards. These elements include his ledgegrab box, collision points, TopN, and damaging hitbox. This occurs for both the aerial and grounded version as well as with any stage, alternate skin, and controller port.
Expected behavior: It is expected that the rightward version of any move* will be no more than a mirrored version of its leftward counterpart.
Note 1: It may also be possible that the expected behavior in this scenario is for the hitbox to not shift whatsoever.
* It should be noted that it is expected behavior for certain taunts to have different lengths depending on leftward-rightward orientation. Mr. G&W's Side-B is another exception to this, as the numbers must be normally readable from the camera's point of view regardless of which direction the move is used in.
Repro steps:
[1] Launch an unmodified version of Project M 3.5.
[2] From the main menu, select "VERSUS."
[3] Select "RULES."
[4] Change the setting on the "RULES" tab to "TIME." This is to enable single-player matches.
[5] Back out the to previous menu and select "FIGHT!"
[5] Using a Gamecube controller in any port, select "MR. GAME & WATCH" as the playable character.
[6] Input [START/PAUSE] or hover over the "READY TO FIGHT!" banner and input [A], then proceed to load any stage.
[7] Input [L], [R], and [D-Pad: Down] simultaneously to enable debug mode.
[8] Input [R] and [D-Pad: Right] simultaneously to enable visual representation of hitboxes.
[9] Input [Y] and [D-Pad: Left] simultaneously to enable visual representations of collision points and TopN.
[10] Input [Y] and [D-Pad: Right] simultaneously to enable visual representations of ledgegrab boxes.
[11] Move the character so that he is standing on the ground (which can be flat or angled) while facing in any direction.
[12] Input [START/PAUSE] to enable frame advance.
[12] Hold the inputs [Joystick: Up] and [ʙ], then input [Z] to advance the frame and initiate Mr. Game & Watch's up-special move.
[13] Observe the current position of the hitbox and its position relative to TopN.
[14] Hold the input [Joystick: Left], then input [Z] to achieve the maximum angle.
[15] Observe the new position of the hitbox and its position relative to TopN.
[16] Use [Z] and advance 30 frames to observe a tilted ledgegrab box.
[17] Input [START/PAUSE] to disable frame advance.
[18] Repeat steps 11 through 17, but replace step 14's joystick input to [Joystick: Right] to observe what happens to the hitbox displacement and ledgegrab box tilt in steps 14 and 16 when the maximum angle is made to the right.
[19] Compare observations from the leftward variation of up-special to the rightward variation. If everything was done correctly, the hitbox displacements and ledgegrab box tilts should appear to be completely identical regardless of the direction that the angle was made towards.
Version found in: [3.5: Hackless: Full set] and [3.5: SSBB Project M Full_RSBEPM_R-sav]
Hardware Device: [Wii] and [Dolphin 4.0-6554]
Loading Method: [2GB SD] and [ISO]
Details: Mr. G&W's Up-B can be angled during startup to send him at different trajectories. His entire body is always tilted counterclockwise (regardless of the direction he chooses to travel in) on the moment that he selects an angle. If he chooses to travel left he will turn towards that direction and then lean his body forward, but if he chooses to travel right he will turn to face that direction and then lean backwards.
The fact that the ledgegrab box is tilted in the scenario outlined in the repro steps is not the main issue here, but it is an issue nonetheless. Testing has been done to show that Mr. G&W cannot grab ledges from quite as far away if he's traveling rightwards compared to if he travels leftwards, but the difference is quite small and rather difficult to measure accurately. The tilting is likely related to an issue with debug mode since the tilted ledgegrab box does not appear to accurately reflect Mr. G&W's actual ability to grab the ledge.
However, this does not seem to be related to the known issue of angled surfaces resulting in skewed hitbox placements for many moves. The hitbox displacement in this case has been confirmed to accurately reflect the hitbox's ability to inflict damage in the visually represented area, so it was made clear in the repro steps that angled surfaces should not impact the observations made.
The most important thing that this bug affects is the placement of TopN after the realignment of the hitbox. There is a clear distinction between going left and right with Up-B when G&W hits an opponent, which becomes an important factor when it comes to sending them at the mirrored angle (the "reverse" hit of all moves that sends an opponent backwards when the TopN's of both parties are aligned in a particular way). If Mr. G&W Up-B's to the right with the most extreme angle from under his opponent then he will get the reverse hit more often than not, but he will almost always get the regular hit when he Up-B's to the left with the most extreme angle. As a result, leftward-rightward orientation has a significant impact on his combos; it is expected that one's leftward-rightward orientation (relative to the stage, not the opponent) should not have any impact on an element of gameplay.
The reverse hit is a very big factor in determining whether Mr. G&W gets a followup after connecting with Up-B. It is almost always landed from below an opponent during a combo, so this situation occurs frequently.
Attachments: Image gallery depicting the differences between non-angled and max-angled Up-B's of both leftward and rightward orientations. This gallery also shows that the position of TopN remains in the exact same place relative to the hitbox for the entire duration of the move.
Custom Content: None
Last edited: