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Pikmin Throw Latch Position

hedgehog9597

Smash Rookie
Joined
Apr 18, 2011
Messages
13
You know how pikmin can latch onto different parts of characters(face, front, back, etc)? Well I was playing against my friend(Ganondorf), and I managed to latch a white pikmin onto his face. He couldn't get it off until it fell off by itself, so I got a nice 40% damage. So my question is, are there spots on characters where they can't hit off a pikmin, or can only hit it off with a really laggy move? I will test this on the weekend, but until then, has anybody else done any research on it? It would really improve olimar's camping game if he could aim pikmin such that the opponent couldn't shake them off, or could only do it in a way very open to punishing.
 

DtJ Hilt

Little Lizard
Joined
Feb 28, 2008
Messages
8,531
Location
Minnow Brook
There are some positions on characters where it's harder to et them off, but these are very few in number. I think DanGR made a thread on the topic a long while back, with locations on every character that a pikmin can land on. You should try digging it up. Renth.
 

hedgehog9597

Smash Rookie
Joined
Apr 18, 2011
Messages
13
too bad the thread never got finished.
I will test ganondorf, toon link, ike, diddy kong, and link. Those are my friend's chars, I want to infuriate them even more.

Once I do my research, should I post it? If so, where should I post it?
 

DtJ Hilt

Little Lizard
Joined
Feb 28, 2008
Messages
8,531
Location
Minnow Brook
Oh man, I remember Dr. Hyde. Old age kickin in. Renth. And yeah that'd be cool, Hedge. If you wanna post it in here that would work.
 

Dnyce

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,049
Location
Allen, TX
I will test ganondorf, toon link, ike, diddy kong, and link. Those are my friend's chars, I want to infuriate them even more.

Once I do my research, should I post it? If so, where should I post it?
If you're going to be taking on this project, at least do it right. Ideally you would want to begin by using the method below to graphically display rounded-cube hurt-boxes of characters and then shade areas Pikmin can latch. Make sure to get multiple pictures at different angles such that you cover the character 3 dimensionally.

Things and Stuff said:
Here's the short form of what I know:
  • Hurtboxes are typically found in a character file closely following their last subaction and/or article. They take the form of seven floats and a set of flags; in Tabuu they show up as "UnknownT".
  • The floats are these:
    • 1: X-Offset
    • 2: Y-Offset
    • 3: Z-Offset
    • 4: X-Stretch
    • 5: Y-Stretch
    • 6: Z-Stretch
    • 7: Radius
  • The flags are these:
    • Bits 1-9: Attached bone.
    • Bits 10-13: Unknown but certainly related to what part of a character's body it is:
      • Bodies, torsos, and upper arms are usually 0001.
      • Heads and facial features are usually 0010.
      • Lower arms are usually 0101.
      • Legs and feet are usually 1100.
    • It's probably a given that these bits determine whether a character should play a DamageHi, DamageN, or DamageLw animation, but it's unclear how this works.
    • Bit 16: Unknown; looks to be always 1. Possibly whether the hurtbox is active (for debugging purposes, it would be easier then removing it and changing the file size).
    • Warning: Tabuu displays these flags wrong. For example, if it displays "890A", it actually means "0A890000". To get the correct value, right-click each hurtbox and open the hex view.
  • As posted above, an example hurtbox drawing (not a hack) would look like this:
 

Dnyce

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,049
Location
Allen, TX
It's relevant because I have the information you're interested in? Realistically, I don't have to tell you anything... but proving to be incapable of stating who you are doesn't assist your appeal in demanding my help.
 

AMKalmar

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
887
Location
Hamilton ON CA
You don't need to know any general or personal information about me to answer a simple smash related question. I don't understand what your initial thought was in asking who I am or why you continue to demand an answer. I didn't demand help, I just asked a question. This is strage... I honestly don't get why you didn't just give me a link or something.
 

Dnyce

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,049
Location
Allen, TX
You don't need to know any general or personal information about me to answer a simple smash related question. I don't understand what your initial thought was in asking who I am or why you continue to demand an answer. I didn't demand help, I just asked a question. This is strage... I honestly don't get why you didn't just give me a link or something.
Lemme know when you can view this link: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=300786

But no really, I just ask who people just for my own ****s and giggles. It's not like there's such thing as private information, that would be absurd. Go to the BBR and ask them questions, or links to their information, lmao. This is strange, I would've been more than willing to help if you were capable of applying common sense.

tl;dr - less douche, more respect kthnxbai
 

AMKalmar

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
887
Location
Hamilton ON CA
Okay, you could have just said the thread is in the BBR. No need to be rude about it. I actually think it is absurd that this information is restricted access to be honest.
 

Dnyce

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,049
Location
Allen, TX
It's not in the BBR... I was using that as an example.

See the title under my cyan name... does not say BBR memeber, lol.
 

Dnyce

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,049
Location
Allen, TX
Oh cool. See, now I know who you are. Unfortunately, and I hate to be the bearer of bad news, you're wasting your time.
 

AMKalmar

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
887
Location
Hamilton ON CA
I'm not wasting my time, but I probably wasted it. It's been a long time since anyone has worked on those. I assume you mean the smash lab is working on something related to this then?

Now you know why I asked, not who I am. "Why do you ask" would have been a relevant question. "Who are you" struck me as odd is all.
 

Dnyce

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,049
Location
Allen, TX
Now you know why I asked, not who I am. "Why do you ask" would have been a relevant question.
Oh, I could care less on why you asked, lol. In terms of smash-lab work, we have several projects going on right now. This is more or less what we intend to accomplish with every char.

muh-muh-muh-Maaaaaario said:
THE HIDDEN BLOCK
MARIO'S HITBOX REPOSITORY

CURRENT COINAGE: 100

DISCLAIMER
(read this you Goombas)

The following is a combination of definite facts and approximate drawings. While the data is certain and the frames are almost certain, BrawlBox is a pain and some rotations are a tricky little piece of crap, so take the bubbles with a grain of salt.

INTRODUCTION
(text text text)

What's a hitbox repository, you ask? It's a place where you put hitbox-related data. Therefore, you'll see informative stuff here.

Note that this is manual drawing, not hacks. Any old sap nowadays can display hitboxes in-game, but they can only show position and size, and you can't see the character's body through them. I'm including some other info here. Not only can you see at a glance which hitbox is the sweetspot (thanks to the alongside numbers), but how big any disjoint is (transparency is cool yo) and an obvious yet unintrisuve angle indicator.

While you may be thinking "beh, this'll be approximate at best", you're not completely right. I lay out these images with up to eight decimal places of precision; usually the hardest part is measuring how big to draw things, which often makes errors obvious.

LEGEND
(the interpreter)

I don't exactly do things by the book all the time. Here's the legend of stuff to look for:

Angle: The angle of a hitbox is displayed as a line. Usually, the angle is given assuming the target is to the right of the attacker; the exception is for if the hitboxes are completely behind the attacker, for which the angle will be shown as reversed. The Sakurai angle is displayed as a star shape; other special angles may have other symbols.
Clang: Most hitboxes have a solid border. Those that do not - that is, they have a dashed border - are transcendent.
Type/Effect: The colour of a hitbox and its angle indicator/border show its type and effect - usually this is only important in the Subspace Emissary, but it's also important if you want to know which hitboxes set things on fire and such. If there's demand I'll put a legend in, but it's mostly just there for a splash of colour.
Damage/Knockback: The numbers displayed for each hitbox are its damage, base knockback, and knockback scaling (in that order).
Layering: You can tell by the images that some hitboxes are "on top" of others. These are the hitboxes that "win out" if the target is hit by more than one of the attack's hitboxes at once.

THE REPOSITORY
(here-a we go)

Mario's Hurtboxes


Hurtbox 1: Waist
Hurtbox 2: Head
Hurtbox 3: Right upper arm
Hurtbox 4: Left upper arm
Hurtbox 5: Right lower arm
Hurtbox 6: Left lower arm
Hurtbox 7: Right upper leg
Hurtbox 8: Left upper leg
Hurtbox 9: Right lower leg
Hurtbox 10: Left lower leg

I'll have you know this up front: Mario's hurtbox is, for whatever reason, asymmetrical. His belly is 0.45 units off-center (for comparision, it's 5.3 units wide in this image), and his lower arms have a 0.4-unit difference in the Y-direction (that is, when he's in the T-pose, his right lower arm is higher than his left). The arms are probably a coding error (it'd be fixed by removing a minus sign), while the belly may be to compensate for his sideways standing animation or something.

The hurtbox colours represent a set of four bits that every hurtbox has. I don't know 100% what the bits mean, but it looks pretty clear that they have something to do with body zones (i.e. how the game knows if you got hit in the head/midsection/leg etc for high/middle/low damage animations).

Jab

Hit 1


Hitbox 0: 3% damage, angle of *, 15/100 fixed knockback, attached to left upper arm, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 1: 3% damage, angle of *, 10/100 fixed knockback, attached to chest, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 2: 3% damage, angle of 80, 15/100 fixed knockback, attached to left lower arm, Hand/Normal

Mario's jab 1 is generally unremarkable, although it has a surprising amount of depth. Unlike most other attacks, it's the middle hitbox that wins out in a tie. The body segment does slightly less knockback than the other two. The fist hitbox hits at an 80 degree angle instead of the Sakurai angle, so opponents at a distance will be lifted off the ground a bit, similar to Luigi's jab; however it's the lowest in the stack and therefore will not hit in close range.

Hit 2


Hitbox 0: 2% damage, angle of *, 18/100 fixed knockback, attached to right upper arm, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 1: 2% damage, angle of *, 15/100 fixed knockback, attached to chest, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 2: 2% damage, angle of 80, 25/100 fixed knockback, attached to right lower arm, Hand/Normal

Jab 2 is a bit more diverse than jab 1. The knockback is still fixed but rather varied; foes that are farther away will get sent a touch farther (nothing significant, but may be useful to know). The middle hitbox is still top of the stack here, making it most likely to hit in close range. Again, the fist sends opponents vertically instead of horizontally, and its range is pretty good.

Hit 3



Hitbox 0: 4% damage, angle of *, 30/95 knockback, attached to right lower leg, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 4% damage, angle of *, 30/95 knockback, attached to right lower leg, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 2: 4% damage, angle of *, 30/95 knockback, attached to right lower leg, Foot/Normal

Part-wise, none of the bubbles are unique; they all deal the same damage and knockback. That said, the far hitbox shrinks in size as Mario's foot does (it's size 5 for two frames and size 3.6 for two frames); from what I can tell this is actually somewhat unique.

F-Tilt

Angled up

Angled side

Angled down

Hitbox 0: 8% damage, angle of *, 8/100 knockback (13/100 when angled down), attached to right lower leg, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 8% damage, angle of *, 8/100 knockback (13/100 when angled down), attached to right upper leg, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 2: 8% damage, angle of *, 8/100 knockback (13/100 when angled down), attached to hip, Foot/Normal

To be honest there's not much I can say about the f-tilt, since all the hitboxes are the same. However, it is interesting to note it does minimally more knockback when angled down - seriously, what's the point of that. I suppose at higher percentages it can change things.

U-Tilt




Hitbox 0: 7% damage, angle of 96, 28/130 knockback, attached to neck, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 1: 7% damage, angle of 96, 28/130 knockback, attached to right lower arm, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 2: 7% damage, angle of 96, 28/130 knockback, attached to right lower arm, Hand/Normal

Not much to say here either, except that it has more base knockback and almost as much knockback scaling as Luigi's f-smash. It only does half the damage though, so don't expect big things from it.

D-Tilt



Hitbox 0: 5% damage, angle of 80, 20/80 knockback, attached to right toes, Foot/Normal, 40% trip chance
Hitbox 1: 7% damage, angle of 80, 20/80 knockback, attached to right lower leg, Foot/Normal, 40% trip chance
Hitbox 2: 7% damage, angle of 80, 20/80 knockback, attached to hip, Foot/Normal, 40% trip chance

The d-tilt's sourspot is highest in the stack, so it'll hit in a tie. This explains why it can be a pain sometimes to get the 7% damage out of it, despite the fact it has twice the hitboxes. This does not explain why d-tilt sucks.

Dash

Clean

Hitbox 0: 9% damage (+1 on shield), angle of 110, 70/50 knockback, attached to Mario's movement, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 9% damage (+1 on shield), angle of 80, 70/50, knockback, attached to Mario's movement, Foot/Normal

When I first made this image, I thought "well this explains a bit". The large hitbox almost completely eclipses the smaller one, making it a crapshoot should you actually connect with it, sending the enemy in the opposite direction. It's really too bad the window is so tiny; it would be great for mindgames if you could actually control (via timing) which one hits.

Late

Hitbox 0: 7% damage (+1 on shield), angle of 120, 45/30 knockback, attached to Mario's movement, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 7% damage (+1 on shield), angle of 70, 45/30 knockback, attached to Mario's movement, Foot/Normal

As for the late hit...um, what the heck? Why would you put in a hitbox that is guarenteed to never hit anything? This may be a case of "it's the late hit, just make it smaller and lower the damage" without actually seeing the result.

U-Smash




Hitbox 0: 14% damage (19.6% fully charged), angle of 83, 32/90 knockback, attached to head, Head/Normal
Hitbox 1: 14% damage (19.6% fully charged), angle of 83, 32/90 knockback, attached to chest, Head/Normal

U-smash is pretty normal as far as important things go; both hitboxes are identical. Because of the animation, the move will hit faster if you're facing away from the opponent; note that I also reversed the angle indicators for that particular image for clarity, since it's pretty dang hard to hit someone standing in front of you on those frames. Mario's head is intangible for the same frames that the hitboxes exist.

D-Smash

Hit 1

Hitbox 0: 15% damage (21% fully charged), angle of *, 40/73 knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 15% damage (21% fully charged), angle of *, 40/73 knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal

Hit 2

Hitbox 0: 12% damage (16.8% fully charged), angle of *, 35/75 knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 12% damage (16.8% fully charged), angle of *, 35/75 knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal

There's nothing notable to say about this one.

F-Smash

Angled up

Hitbox 0: 15% damage (21% fully charged), angle of *, 25/100 knockback, attached to left lower arm, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 1: 15% damage (21% fully charged), angle of *, 25/100 knockback, attached to right shoulder, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 2: 18% damage (25.2% fully charged), angle of *, 25/90 knockback, attached to left wrist, Hand/Flame, transcendent

Angled side

Hitbox 0: 14% damage (19.6% fully charged), angle of *, 25/100 knockback, attached to left lower arm, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 1: 14% damage (19.6% fully charged), angle of *, 25/100 knockback, attached to right shoulder, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 2: 17% damage (23.8% fully charged), angle of *, 25/90 knockback, attached to left wrist, Hand/Flame, transcendent

Angled down

Hitbox 0: 13% damage (18.2% fully charged), angle of *, 25/100 knockback, attached to left lower arm, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 1: 13% damage (18.2% fully charged), angle of *, 25/100 knockback, attached to right shoulder, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 2: 16% damage (22.4% fully charged), angle of *, 25/90 knockback, attached to left wrist, Hand/Flame, transcendent

First off, the middle hitbox is at the top of the stack, while the sweetspot is at the bottom. While this means the sourspot takes precedence if both parts connect, the size of the sweetspot (just over twice the radius of the middle hitbox) makes it easy to hit with when spaced correctly. Flat characters can crouch under an f-smash that's angled up, but otherwise doing so has no drawback, and should probably always be done. (Side note: The hitboxes look strangely spaced out. It's not like anything will avoid being hit if they squeeze inside, but...)

Nair

Clean

Hitbox 0: 10% damage, angle of *, 20/100 knockback, attached to right lower leg, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 10% damage, angle of *, 20/100 knockback, attached to left lower leg, Foot/Normal

Late

Hitbox 0: 5% damage, angle of *, 13/90 knockback, attached to right lower leg, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 5% damage, angle of *, 13/90 knockback, attached to left upper leg, Foot/Normal

First off, let me say that it's dang hard to do these images for sex kicks; it's near impossible to tell what frame it is. Other than that, it's pretty clear how much the nair's range changes between the two stages; if you don't know the clean hit lasts 4 frames.

Fair

Early

Hitbox 0: 12% damage, angle of *, 30/80 knockback, attached to right lower arm, Hand/Normal

Clean

Hitbox 0: 13% damage, angle of 280 (that is, -80), 20/75 knockback, attached to right upper arm, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 1: 13% damage, angle of 280 (that is, -80), 20/75 knockback, attached to right lower arm, Hand/Normal

Late

Hitbox 0: 10% damage, angle of *, 20/80 knockback, attached to right upper arm, Hand/Normal
Hitbox 1: 10% damage, angle of *, 20/80 knockback, attached to right lower arm, Hand/Normal

Fair is a pretty cool guy, eh KOs peeps and doesn't afraid of anything.

Bair

Clean

Hitbox 0: 12% damage, angle of *, 10/95 knockback, attached to right lower leg, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 12% damage, angle of *, 10/95 knockback, attached to right upper leg, Foot/Normal

Late

Hitbox 0: 7% damage, angle of *, 7/90 knockback, attached to right lower leg, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 7% damage, angle of *, 7/90 knockback, attached to right upper leg, Foot/Normal

Bair ain't very interesting hitbox-wise, but only doing this for interesting attacks would leave out half a character's moveset.

Uair




Hitbox 0: 11% damage, angle of 45, 9/100 knockback, attached to right upper leg, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 11% damage, angle of 45, 9/100 knockback, attached to right lower leg, Foot/Normal

Because the hitboxes don't change size or position relative to the bones as the animation goes on, the ending segment doesn't perfectly match up with the visuals (the hitboxes are designed to mesh with the max extension on most of these kinds of attacks).

Dair

Hits 1-5 (I ain't doin' 5 individiual indistinct images here)

Hitbox 0: 1% damage, angle of 94, 10/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Spin/Normal, 1.5x SDI ability
Hitbox 1: 1% damage, angle of 94, 10/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Spin/Normal, 1.5x SDI ability
Hitbox 2: 1% damage, angle of 94, 10/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Spin/Normal, 1.5x SDI ability

Hit 6

Hitbox 0: 7% damage, angle of 75, 80/80 knockback, attached to nothing, Spin/Normal

Landing hit

Hitbox 0: 2% damage, angle of *, 60/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 2% damage, angle of *, 60/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal

Dair's repeated hits have pretty cool range bottom-side. (No, there's no way that's an error; the hitbox's center is actually placed below Mario's baseline.) The last hit is also kind of big. While you probably don't care, it's kind of weird how the landing hit is considered a Foot attack.

Shield



Okay so it's not a hitbox. It's still a bubble with a size.

Grabs

Standing


Running


Pivot


Not much to say here.

Pummel


Hitbox 0: 3% damage, angle of *, 30/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Head/Normal, transcendent, always knocks forwards

Can't say much about this that isn't obvious.

F-Throw


Throw: 9% damage, angle of 45, 60/65 knockback, Normal

I don't particulary care if throws aren't hitboxes; I'm still doing this thing for them.

B-Throw

Collision

Hitbox 0: 8% damage, angle of *, 20/100 knockback, attached to victim, Throwing/Normal, transcendent

Throw

Throw: 12% damage, angle of 45, 70/63 knockback, Normal

As far as I can tell, the swing collision hitbox is the same size no matter who the target is.

U-Throw


Throw: 8% damage, angle of 90, 70/72 knockback, Normal

The highest knockback scaling of Mario's throws.

D-Throw


Throw: 6% damage, angle of 80, 75/50 knockback, Normal

Eh, I got nothing.

Floor (back)

Hit 1

Hitbox 0: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 80/50 knockback, attached to right ankle, Foot/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 1: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 80/50 knockback, attached to left ankle, Foot/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 2: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 80/50 knockback, attached to right lower leg, Foot/Normal, transcendent

Hit 2

Hitbox 0: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 80/50 knockback, attached to right ankle, Foot/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 1: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 80/50 knockback, attached to left ankle, Foot/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 2: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 80/50 knockback, attached to right lower leg, Foot/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 3: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 80/50 knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal, transcendent

What a big cluster. Floor attacks in general aren't very impressive.

Floor (front)

Hit 1

Hitbox 0: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 80/50 knockback, attached to nothing, Hand/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 1: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 80/50 knockback, attached to nothing, Hand/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 2: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 80/50 knockback, attached to nothing, Hand/Normal, transcendent

Hit 2

Hitbox 0: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 80/50 knockback, attached to nothing, Hand/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 1: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 80/50 knockback, attached to nothing, Hand/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 2: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 80/50 knockback, attached to nothing, Hand/Normal, transcendent

The shorter-ranged of Mario's two floor attacks.

Floor (trip)

Hit 1

Hitbox 0: 5% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 60/50 knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 5% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 60/50 knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 2: 5% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 60/50 knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal

Hit 2

Hitbox 0: 5% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 60/50 knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 1: 5% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 60/50 knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal
Hitbox 2: 5% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 60/50 knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal

Nothing to say here, other than the usual "why is sitting down considered worse than lying down" tripe.

Edge (fast)


Hitbox 0: 8% damage (+1 on shield), angle of 45, 110/100 fixed knockback, attached to right ankle, Foot/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 1: 8% damage (+1 on shield), angle of 45, 110/100 fixed knockback, attached to left ankle, Foot/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 2: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of 45, 110/100 fixed knockback, attached to head, Foot/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 3: 6% damage (+1 on shield), angle of 45, 110/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal, transcendent

Not really sure what the fourth (bottom-most) hitbox is doing there, but otherwise this is pretty expected.

Edge (slow)


Hitbox 0: 10% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 110/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 1: 10% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 110/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 2: 10% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 110/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal, transcendent
Hitbox 3: 10% damage (+1 on shield), angle of *, 110/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Foot/Normal, transcendent

Nothing to say about this one. Both edge attacks appear to have about the same range.

Fireball


Hitbox 0: 5% damage, angle of *, 30/25 knockback, attached to fireball's center, Typeless/Flame, 0.3x freeze frames, absorbable, reflectable, always knocks forwards

Hitbox 0: 5% damage, angle of *, 22/20 knockback, attached to fireball's center, Typeless/Flame, 0.3x freeze frames, absorbable, reflectable, always knocks forwards

Hitbox 0: 5% damage, angle of *, 11/15 knockback, attached to fireball's center, Typeless/Flame, 0.3x freeze frames, absorbable, reflectable, always knocks forwards

That's right, the fireball does more knockback at the start of its life. It's strong for 6 frames, then middling for 11 frames, and then weak after that. The difference is minor but I'm sure you've seen it. The fireball also gets a bit smaller at the same time - its size goes from 2.4 to 2.2 and then 2.

Cape


Hitbox 0: 8% damage (+4 on shield), angle of 110, 0/0 knockback, attached to nothing, Weapon/Reverse, transcendent, 30% trip chance
Hitbox 1: 8% damage (+4 on shield), angle of 110, 0/0 knockback, attached to nothing, Weapon/Reverse, transcendent, 30% trip chance

Hitbox 0: 6% damage (+4 on shield), angle of 110, 0/0 knockback, attached to nothing, Weapon/Reverse, transcendent, 30% trip chance
Hitbox 1: 6% damage (+4 on shield), angle of 110, 0/0 knockback, attached to nothing, Weapon/Reverse, transcendent, 30% trip chance

Yup, the aerial version has a bigger hitbox. It can also reflect for 3 frames longer. Speaking of reflection, it may not be based on the hitboxes - the hitboxes are only out for 3 frames, but the move's defensive collision events are 25 (grounded) or 28 (aerial) frames apart. Also, I don't see the point in giving the move an angle if it does no knockback.

Super Jump Punch


Hitbox 0: 5% damage, angle of 70, 130/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Arm/Coin
Hitbox 1: 5% damage, angle of 90, 140/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Arm/Coin

Hitbox 0: 1% damage, angle of 74, 150/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Arm/Coin
Hitbox 1: 1% damage, angle of 90, 150/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Arm/Coin

Hitbox 0: 1% damage, angle of -, 90/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Arm/Coin
Hitbox 1: 1% damage, angle of -, 120/100 fixed knockback, attached to nothing, Arm/Coin

Hitbox 0: 3% damage, angle of 60, 52/145 knockback, attached to nothing, Arm/Coin
Hitbox 1: 3% damage, angle of 60, 52/145 knockback, attached to nothing, Arm/Coin

The angle of "-" I don't know much about. I think it means "make the angle follow whatever direction the attacker is moving". (For tech guys: The angle is encoded as 365, if you know more than I do let me know.) Other than that HOLY DOOLEY DISJOINT!

F.L.U.D.D.


Hitbox 0: 0% damage, angle of 55, 32/100 knockback, attached to each bit of water, Weapon/Water, reflectable, always knocks forwards

This is a Water-effect attack, so its knockback changes a bit when used on PT's Pokémon. But it's not a Water-type attack (it's Weapon), so Water stickers won't have any effect. (I think that's how it works...) Charging the move increases the knockback; I think a fully-charged FLUDD does approximately 1.9x knockback. Using the move, regardless of charge, produces exactly 12 blobs of water.

Mario Finale


Hitbox 0: 3% damage, angle of 32, 40/100 knockback, attached to bigger fireball, Typeless/Flame, transcendent, 0.7x SDI ability, 0.2x freeze frames, rehit rate of 7, unshieldable, always knocks forwards
Hitbox 1: 2% damage, angle of 32, 40/100 knockback, attached to smaller fireball, Typeless/Flame, transcendent, 0.7x SDI ability, 0.2x freeze frames, rehit rate of 7, unshieldable, always knocks forwards

EAT IT, PENGUINFACE
We'll finish eventually.
 

AMKalmar

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
887
Location
Hamilton ON CA
Who are you?
See, now I know who you are.
^ Said in response to finding the reason why I asked, not who I am.

Oh, I could care less on why you asked, lol.
Right.

That looks great but images have their limitations. For one thing, it takes several images to give a good idea of the coverage of moves that sweep across the x-y plane, such as sword slashes. I think making PSAs available to players would be very useful when trying to learn a new character. They could also be useful in testing spacing with specific characters.
 

Dnyce

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
3,049
Location
Allen, TX
^ Said in response to finding the reason why I asked, not who I am.

Right.

That looks great but images have their limitations. For one thing, it takes several images to give a good idea of the coverage of moves that sweep across the x-y plane, such as sword slashes. I think making PSAs available to players would be very useful when trying to learn a new character. They could also be useful in testing spacing with specific characters.
I actually haven't heard why you asked, but clicking on that link let me see you're someone who works in gathering PSA data. Keep pushing the issue, and I'll have a joy-ride on hitting the red button on your posts :)


I could just as easily say PSA has its limitations as well by pointing fingers at only being able to use in-game measurements like super-scope balls (hardly accurate at all). TBH, this discussion is completely off-topic at this point. Feel free to move this to PM
 

hedgehog9597

Smash Rookie
Joined
Apr 18, 2011
Messages
13
Oh wow look, 29 replies not about this topic! :)

Anyways, I did some testing on ganon, and it would be pointless to gather this data as it is nearly impossible to aim in the heat of battle while adjusting for the fact that different colors have different trajectories.
 
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