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Petition against certain chants

TaFoKiNtS

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 21, 2005
Messages
1,027
So I'll be "that guy".

Discussions were thrown around about a certain chant that refers to the male genitalia. I thought about it for a little bit and wondered if these chants should be thrown around at Evo.

I understand "freedom of speech... blah blah...", but should this be representative of our community on the big stage or not?

Discuss
 

LivewiresXe

Smash Hero
Joined
Oct 5, 2008
Messages
6,365
Location
Ottawa, Ontario
I'm just gonna say that you can't really stop what, 1800 people, more from chanting things if they want to. I mean, at EVO last year during the KOF top 8, people were chanting "culero" which apparently is a derogatory term in Spanish.
 

Falconv1.0

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 15, 2008
Messages
3,511
Location
Talking **** in Cali
Yea, agreed, but we can easily as a community shut it out fast.
He just said you can't really stop 1800 people and your answer is "agreed, but we can easily as a community shut it out fast".

Um....then you don't agree to his point at all.

Also culero means "***hole iirc. Could be wrong.

Anyway honestly suck that **** really is a ****in juvenile chant, and that's coming from me. Hope that doesn't get too loud.
 

Taj278

TIME TO GET PAID!
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Messages
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MT. OLYMPUS, Arizona
You can be that guy. It's our little chant for our AZ players and it's pretty much an inside joke. We won't be doing the chant at EVO, and a petition wouldn't really stop us (me) if you made one anyway. Yeah, most of you guys don't understand what it means. You can hate on our entire state, you can have players yelling out that someone sucks or booing because they don't like their playstyle. Keep talking about how so many players are lame because they play a certain way, call someone janky because they aren't playing a top 7 character.

We've always been rooted against, and we're only welcome when we're not winning. We're playing a damn children's party game, and yeah our chant is ****ing stupid, that's the point. We're largely silly people, we have to be to play this game with this much dedication. You want to shake your head and say that's gay, childish, stupid, etc.

Perfect. Feel uncomfortable about it, that's what it's supposed to do. We're the away team.

You know how many words and phrases have lost their original connotation because of gaming? Half the words we use to describe common events in a positively manner derive from words describing sensitive subjects. AZ as a region is horrible at **** talking. Forward is the only one good at it. The main reason we're so bad at it, is because we don't really do it. We cheer on our players in our own stupid little way and sometimes people misconstrue it. Every region has always directly talked **** to our players every time we visit. If it ever gets to the point that we're negatively and tastelessly berating a player and someone tells us to stop, we do it. I just ask for the same when certain groups pull up next to players and try to make it personal.

In short, our chant is raunchy, corny, and an inside joke. Yes, I understand you think it makes the community look bad. We already look bad. We have no need to do it on a main stage at EVO because we'll have a largely neutral audience. So don't worry about it. OK BYE.
 

Engo

Smash Ace
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Feb 18, 2007
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865
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the dog,the dog he's at it again!
Jeez people go to EVO and have a good time and stop worrying about how to act, what lingo to use, what deodorant is preferable by FGC standards etc.

Worry more about showing up to EVO because from what I've heard the pre reg list is pretty lame as of now LOL
 

Ryobeat

Smash Ace
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Jan 22, 2012
Messages
800
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Fairview, NJ
LOLOLOL. This is looking like a pretty one sided petition. All of West Coast would just sign it and get nothing done. Get over it.
 

Shikenshu

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 5, 2010
Messages
72
Location
Montreal, QC
Well, FGC is about that kind of stuff, get R.Kelly'd is basically a reference to the fact that he had sex with a minor, and that he peed on her (Double P)
 

Wobbles

Desert ******
BRoomer
Joined
Oct 9, 2006
Messages
2,881
Location
Gilbert, AZ
Right now FGC is like the cool older brother and Smash is his annoying little brother that keeps trying to impress him, but just comes off as a pestering try-hard. Eventually Smashers will realize that developing self-confidence and creating a self-congruent image is more important. Ever since SSBM was on the table for Evo, Smash scene has constantly been like "well what would the fighting game community think," not realizing that this insecure try-to-please behavior is inherently unattractive in its own right.

Before WC says, 'yeah but "suck that ****" is objectively immature' or something, remember:

--your primary expression of dislike is "gay"
--your best player's combo videos are named "****"
--your favorite characters are space-dog, space-bird and racer-man
--one of your most hyped players has ballz in his name (and, for that matter, one of our nation's top 3 is named Doctor PeePee)
--your most hyped video involves two guys flipping out and yelling about how hard they are.

I think we have a lot of low-hanging fruit to trim from the tree of immaturity before we can pretend we're a bunch of sophisticated adults. And even if you do, you're still playing "childhood nostalgia, Nintendo's cash-cow party game." Please get some perspective.
 

foshio

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 10, 2010
Messages
293
Location
Tokyo
Lol i think the suck that **** chant is hilarious. I think its up to TO's to say what kind of language they allow at events and enforce the rules.
 

ycz12

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 7, 2005
Messages
734
Location
San Francisco, CA
If "get your **** sucked" bothers you, then "get *****" should bother you even more. Both are sexual and immature, but only one of them is combative, malicious, and dismissive of an actual social issue.

I guess this not exactly an answer to "If we do this during Evo, will it reflect poorly on the community?", but given that you basically have a choice between "Be morally consistent and guarantee Evo will respect you" and "Be a jerk and Evo might not respect you," I think the answer is pretty clear.
 

TaFoKiNtS

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 21, 2005
Messages
1,027
To be fair, I refrain from doing both and alotta people from norcal have refrained from using "****"

I don't think it's mutually exclusive between the two chants. Just because I'm protesting only the STD chant doesn't mean I approve of the "get *****" chant. In fact, many people already show their displeasure of using the word "****", so I felt no need to express a petition against a "get *****" chant when many people are organically expressing their sentiments against it (as yourself ycz6 and others who liked your post)

I would also disagree with Wobble's sentiment of "Well, the community does many other things wrong, so I'm not going to try to curb any behavior at all" I think that's a rather silly argument

I would like to address the AZ players here. It seems like you guys are extra salty. If east coast or even Norcal were to be the perpetrators of the STD chant, I would actively express my disapproval of it. Taj and Wobbles, I'm not expressing disapproval of the chant on the basis that its from AZ.
 

Wobbles

Desert ******
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Tafokints: My sentiment isn't "I'm not going to curb any behavior at all." My sentiment is "why is this the only thing people have chosen to look at considering all the other goofy puerile behaviors?" Dunno where you got "let's do nothing" from. I certainly didn't say it. Me and Taj already agreed that we don't care/aren't going to bother with chanting it @ Evo, since we won't really need to. We're fine with just using basic name chants to root for our buddies.

Also, you're saying that you don't have anything against AZ. That's nice. But the discussion didn't actually start with you, it started because a bunch of WC players didn't like us chanting it at their tourneys and shouting them down. It makes them uncomfortable and it's weird. Sorry, let's talk instead about how hard we are because Captain Falcon got a knee and how gay it is to play Young Link. Why isn't there dialogue on these other behaviors that share similar childish connotations? Heck, I guess there is. We're having it right now apparently.

If we want to present this mature and intelligent collective persona at Evo by not doing anything that would reflect poorly on us, we should start defining the behaviors we want to change. What sort of things reflect poorly? What stuff are players willing to change, and how are we agreeing to behave? No more johns? No more calling things we don't like "gay?" No more of this nonsense where regions actively try and ruthlessly disparage other players to make them feel bad and play badly? I've gone out of state only to get told I'm **** and I should go the **** home; a lot of people seem content to say that builds hype and it's totally fine, but I've never been a fan of it myself.

Let's brainstorm. I think we can come up with more.
 

TaFoKiNtS

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 21, 2005
Messages
1,027
Tafokints: My sentiment isn't "I'm not going to curb any behavior at all." My sentiment is "why is this the only thing people have chosen to look at considering all the other goofy puerile behaviors?" Dunno where you got "let's do nothing" from. I certainly didn't say it. Me and Taj already agreed that we don't care/aren't going to bother with chanting it @ Evo, since we won't really need to. We're fine with just using basic name chants to root for our buddies.

Also, you're saying that you don't have anything against AZ. That's nice. But the discussion didn't actually start with you, it started because a bunch of WC players didn't like us chanting it at their tourneys and shouting them down. It makes them uncomfortable and it's weird. Sorry, let's talk instead about how hard we are because Captain Falcon got a knee and how gay it is to play Young Link. Why isn't there dialogue on these other behaviors that share similar childish connotations? Heck, I guess there is. We're having it right now apparently.

If we want to present this mature and intelligent collective persona at Evo by not doing anything that would reflect poorly on us, we should start defining the behaviors we want to change. What sort of things reflect poorly? What stuff are players willing to change, and how are we agreeing to behave? No more johns? No more calling things we don't like "gay?" No more of this nonsense where regions actively try and ruthlessly disparage other players to make them feel bad and play badly? I've gone out of state only to get told I'm **** and I should go the **** home; a lot of people seem content to say that builds hype and it's totally fine, but I've never been a fan of it myself.

Let's brainstorm. I think we can come up with more.
Some very valid points!

Although, we are far from perfect now, I could cite examples of how we've improved as a community

1. Commentary
At genesis 2, HMW and the commentators booed and complained about Hbox/Armada and other matches. As a result of quality control, I believe Alex Strife picked out commentators who would be suitable for these longer attrition matches.

The only recent case in fault of something like this was KoC2 when Mango/Lovage commentated on Axe's Young Link. People have complained about this commentary specifically on many accounts. Fwiw, anyone should be able to play whatever character they want. Don't let a few bad apples ruin this perception

2. Wombo Combo
I highly doubt in 2013 that the same word choice would be used as shown in the video. Although the video has high sentimental value, many of the people would probably not say the things they said in this video.

3. The use of "gay" and *****
Watch the live video of Silentspectre vs Armada @ p4. Everyone says "get *****". This would probably not happen as frivolously today. The use of "gay" has toned down considerably over the past 3 years. Although it is still used a decent amount, I could safely say that many people have thrown out these phrases out of their vocabulary and progress has been made.

As for region disparity, that's a difficult issue because behavior differs at regional tourneys and nationals. I would love to hear more thoughts from you on this. My perception is that at nationals there aren't really as much regional hate and AZ actually has fans! However, regionals tend to garner for rivalry (which could be healthy in moderation).
 

Pizzaman

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jul 14, 2012
Messages
70
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The Mitten
I'm not very active in the scene, but I think that people should stop acting all butthurt and whatnot. This is a "community" that is based around a children's party game. People do chants, etc to malke their experiences more enjoyable. If we limit what people can say, people will enjoy themselves less, and isn't enjoyment what this is all about?
 

Zankoku

Never Knows Best
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If a particular chant, community slang, etc. isn't universally enjoyed, I can't agree that you're strictly decreasing enjoyment as a whole among the people involved by restricting such.
 

Armada

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 28, 2010
Messages
1,366
I do think if anything the smash community should be more worried about bad sportmanship then a ****ing chant but maybe that's just me :p
 

trash?

witty/pretty
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It's... odd that this is the first issue to be argued, certainly. This coming from a dude who sometimes like to do it with other dudes, I'd rip out the "so gay" stuff first, mostly because there's actual offense to be taken from that, whereas if I'm understanding the context of "suck that ****", it's actually not even offensive in the slightest and is mostly making fun of someone trying to say a homophobic insult and messing up, which is infinitely funnier to me.

Slightly related: why the hell is **** censored but not ****? That seems a bit backwards.
 

KP17

Banned via Administration
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Jul 6, 2012
Messages
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Atlanta, GA
I agree completely with all of the posts above. The question is, how does the community actually implement some sort of change to the way we act?
 

bertbusdriver

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 8, 2007
Messages
883
Location
Norcal
"Get your **** sucked" is an awesome chant about an awesome activity.

We live in a ****ed up country where people get killed on TV all the time, but show one ****ing female nipple and all of a sudden you're the devil.
 

BTmoney

a l l b e c o m e $
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Messages
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Right now FGC is like the cool older brother and Smash is his annoying little brother that keeps trying to impress him, but just comes off as a pestering try-hard. Eventually Smashers will realize that developing self-confidence and creating a self-congruent image is more important. Ever since SSBM was on the table for Evo, Smash scene has constantly been like "well what would the fighting game community think," not realizing that this insecure try-to-please behavior is inherently unattractive in its own right.

Before WC says, 'yeah but "suck that ****" is objectively immature' or something, remember:

--your primary expression of dislike is "gay"
--your best player's combo videos are named "****"
--your favorite characters are space-dog, space-bird and racer-man
--one of your most hyped players has ballz in his name (and, for that matter, one of our nation's top 3 is named Doctor PeePee)
--your most hyped video involves two guys flipping out and yelling about how hard they are.

I think we have a lot of low-hanging fruit to trim from the tree of immaturity before we can pretend we're a bunch of sophisticated adults. And even if you do, you're still playing "childhood nostalgia, Nintendo's cash-cow party game." Please get some perspective.
You are definitely in that god-Kirbykaze tier of facetious and backhanded funniness. So many things were good about this post.
 

Bones0

Smash Legend
Joined
Aug 31, 2005
Messages
11,153
Location
Jarrettsville, MD
AZ is getting their **** sucked so hard in this thread.

Haters gonna hate.

Is there any documentation of this allegedly legendary Forward ****-talking?
 

LordWalkman

Smash Rookie
Joined
May 28, 2013
Messages
1
Not to mention, NCR Marvel featured a "You're a ******" chant.

hey someone posted about this thread on twitter and I want to say I'm glad you guys want to get hype, and you can do it by being vulgar, as long as you aren't being offensive.

The thing I want to say though is as one of the people who was behind the chant, we did not say "You're a ******" what we said was Super Dragon like at this indie wrestling match. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMmTFt45eyI

We were just trying to be cheeky and fun, but people definitely took it the wrong way. Thanks again guys.
 

prog

Priest of the Temple of Syrinx
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hey someone posted about this thread on twitter and I want to say I'm glad you guys want to get hype, and you can do it by being vulgar, as long as you aren't being offensive.

The thing I want to say though is as one of the people who was behind the chant, we did not say "You're a ******" what we said was Super Dragon like at this indie wrestling match. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMmTFt45eyI

We were just trying to be cheeky and fun, but people definitely took it the wrong way. Thanks again guys.
Alright, thanks for clarifying. Perhaps the way it came through the stream distorted things, but if that's what was said (or the original intent), it's a lot better than what most people heard.
 

Yung Mei

Where all da hot anime moms at
Joined
Jul 20, 2009
Messages
5,341
wait, so whats the origin of "suck that ****"

ive always wanted to know and whenever i asked, nobody had any idea
 

Medz!

Smash Journeyman
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it all started with kiraflax, it was in tournament and he beat some dude and idk who, but when he beat him he got up and yelled UHHHHH GET YO **** SUCKED!!
 

BlakDragon

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I really don't think this will be a problem, mostly because I anticipate the crowd opting for the "STOOP KID'S AFRAID TO LEAVE HIS STOOP" chant instead.

It's funny to more people AND offensive to nobody (except Mew2King, maybe :p)!
 

Yung Mei

Where all da hot anime moms at
Joined
Jul 20, 2009
Messages
5,341
it all started with kiraflax, it was in tournament and he beat some dude and idk who, but when he beat him he got up and yelled UHHHHH GET YO **** SUCKED!!
oh sweet jesus are you ****ing serious

jesus christ lmao
 

Medz!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 24, 2011
Messages
290
Location
Mesa,AZ
yep lol I think he beat rich brown but don't quote on me that cuz I'm not sure, but yeah kiraflax is the founder of the STD chant
 
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