Need help with my Lucas

[Crono984]

Hi Im a Ness/Lucas main and im still new to competitive smash. I am starting to win more now i used to get 2stocked all the time. I was just wondering if someone could watch these two matches from earlier today and could see if there is anything i could start doing that would help me improve and stuff i need to stop doing.

 

[PKBeam]

Spoiler: Match 1

0:04 - Don't FH Zair, use Fair or PKF.
0:08 - Don't use Jab, Fsmash will instantly reflect the hydrant, while a vertical attack sends it up to help with stage control.
0:19 - Avoid wasting out your ledge invincibility.
0:22 - Try to always SH PKF, as it's much safer.
0:25 - While you didn't get punished for it, try to avoid bad options like Dsmash - 17% isn't that much, it doesn't kill at that % and it's laggy.
0:41 - That Usmash was pretty smart, but it also would've put you in a really bad position if the Pac-Man airdodged correctly. A pivot grab would eat right through the airdodge and you'd get followups and an edgeguard.
0:46 - That's just a case of guessing wrong, but Nair or even Bair would've been slightly better.
1:03 - Don't approach with falling Nair, the initial hitboxes have barely any hitstun and you could've gotten Usmashed, if not shieldgrabbed. Instead, space a Zair or Fair.
1:31 - Not sure if this was a mistake but when doing a PKT edgeguard always be ready to bring it back into yourself should the opponent get up on the ledge safely.
1:41 - Avoid landing with airdodges, you could double jump or land with Fair/Zair.

Spoiler: Match 2

0:09 - That grab netted you about 15% - 6% from the throw and 9% from sourspot Fair. It also put you in a position to be hit by Nair. You could've started a SH Nair chain (not reliable but lots of damage) or FH Nair comboes (about 30%).
0:30 - This is the reason you do SH PKF :/
0:38 - Try spacing your Dash Attacks as best as you can to avoid stuff like Up-B OoS.
0:49 - Dash grab isn't really the best choice unless you were reading a roll. If you wanted to grab just do a standing grab.
1:29 - That grab was really dangerous at that %.
1:55 - I think a Zair would've gotten the ledge.
2:55 - That was really nice.

I think you have a sound Lucas. Your tech skill has some room to improve but the best thing for you imo is to just get better as a competitive player.

 

[Crono984]

thanks I will try my best to work on all of that. i really need to get used to using zair in general

 

[Step]

The only thing I would advise is to try and be a little safer with your PK:Fire. In the second match you had a few that were a bit dangerous/punishable. Also, I would strongly advise learning to B-stick with Lucas. It makes his retreating B-sticked PK:Fire essentially unpunishable. Here is a video for reference/tutorial: https://youtu.be/Vw1elkJwtDo?t=240

 

[Crono984]

thanks i try that out. is there any high level lucas player i can watch i dont really know of any besides pink fresh and nakat and they dont even really use lucas in tournaments too often either.

 

[JohnnyB]

I don't think Pacman is a good matchup to use as an example. It's one of those weird mus that relies a lot on how much you know about how much about his shenanigans. A few notes:

- Aerials ping with hydrant. You can nair right through the hydrant drop, just don't do it too often or you'll probably eat a BF.

- Whenever pac starts his upb too low for the second bounce to make it to the ledge, he should lose a stock. Take away his third bounce by jumping on the trampoline yourself. Magnet stalling might make this easier.

-If you can catch his bonus fruit he can't get another one. At that point you can pretty much pkfire away until he is forced to approach (generally a loosing situation for pac) and you decide to throw/zdrop it.

-If you do zdrop the fruit you can pick it up again. If you throw it it's gone.

 

[PKBeam]

B-sticking Lucas in Smash 4 comes down to personal choice imo.
Don't do it if you need the instant smashes/tilts.

 

[Lochy]

thanks i try that out. is there any high level lucas player i can watch i dont really know of any besides pink fresh and nakat and they dont even really use lucas in tournaments too often either.

Unfortunately I have these problems too. But don't worry because we have a guide on smashboards for Lucas and many advanced techs and combos for him. Learn all those and you will be the person people go to when they wanna see a good lucas. Also I wouldn't mind sparring with you to help you a bit.
NNID: Lochinator

 

[Crono984]

B-sticking Lucas in Smash 4 comes down to personal choice imo.
Don't do it if you need the instant smashes/tilts.

i tried B-sticking it did help my spacing out a lot but i couldnt get my smashes off fast enough.

Unfortunately I have these problems too. But don't worry because we have a guide on smashboards for Lucas and many advanced techs and combos for him. Learn all those and you will be the person people go to when they wanna see a good lucas. Also I wouldn't mind sparring with you to help you a bit.
NNID: Lochinator

im down to spar anytime just message me when you want to my NNID is AshonYusef

 

[Step]

i tried B-sticking it did help my spacing out a lot but i couldnt get my smashes off fast enough.

Ah, I can see how that could be an issue. Personally, I've never made use of the C-stick for anything, so B-sticking gave it a purpose for me ^_^

 

[Crono984]

Ah, I can see how that could be an issue. Personally, I've never made use of the C-stick for anything, so B-sticking gave it a purpose for me ^_^

i like it but it hurts my playstyle more than it helps. im going to try and learn the other way to wavebounce

 

[MrWhYYZ]

i like it but it hurts my playstyle more than it helps. im going to try and learn the other way to wavebounce

Learn to smash using A+B. Being able to consistantly wavebounce your PK-fire is way to important.
I throw around the 40 to 50 wavebounced PK-fire a match and honestly doing it the legit way is way to tiresome. The only downside is that with the C-stick 0 to death combo's are easier.

 

[Crono984]

Learn to smash using A+B. Being able to consistantly wavebounce your PK-fire is way to important.
I throw around the 40 to 50 wavebounced PK-fire a match and honestly doing it the legit way is way to tiresome. The only downside is that with the C-stick 0 to death combo's are easier.

alright i will try that out tonight. what 0 to death combos does lucas have? i dont use the c-stick at all for ness's 0 to death combos. i only use the c-stick for quick smashes

 

[MrWhYYZ]

Ness doesn't have 0-death combo's, people need to sdi out of PK-fire but for some reason they don't.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qwzh2sYERxA

It's hard and nails and I've only gotten it once before I switched to B-stick. Now, I usually do 1 rep around 30%.